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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/609214/tales-of-tribute-exploit-account-bans#latest

The BG and Dueling Communities Deserve Better...

Aldoss
Aldoss
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Reading this in the patch notes could not have brought me more disdain and contempt for the management team at ZOS:

tSN17zh.jpeg

As a dedicated player who plays virtually daily with my wife and our preferred outlet being BGs for at least the last year and half, this one sentence in the patch notes destroyed all faith that you will do anything of worth for this outlet.

Who would have imagined that a company could spend resources to design the best available reactionary combat system, and rather than bringing it to the spotlight for the masses, they give the first seasonal ranked offering to a pitiful knock off of Dominion.

Please for the love of god tell me that this is another test (we know how ZOS loves those on the live server) and that if it succeeds, then ZOS will be bringing it to their dueling and BG scenes. You know, the communities that have been around for years. Telling me that this is part of the road map towards BG ranked seasons is the only way to get me to play this as it is.

Watching this potential get wasted is so draining. Please give me any hope to keep playing this game @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin.
Edited by ZOS_GregoryV on April 19, 2022 6:13PM
  • Ominer
    Ominer
    ✭✭✭
    PvPers have been asking for actual ranked BGs and Duels (any pvp really) for years. Iirc ZOS considered it but didn't implement it because they thought it'd lead to an increase in toxcicity for some reason. Strange decision with no basis, when the majority of other mmos have ranked arenas.

    Instead they haven't implemented any significant changes to BGs for years and duelling has remained a very niche part of the game when it could be so much more (not that it's very fun right now with the current class balancing).
  • Molydeus
    Molydeus
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    As someone who is not a PvPer, I think ranked arenas and battlegrounds are a GREAT idea! Every other MMO I've ever played has had them, not sure why ESO lacks a ranking system?
  • _adhyffbjjjf12
    _adhyffbjjjf12
    ✭✭✭✭
    Aldoss wrote: »
    Reading this in the patch notes could not have brought me more disdain and contempt for the management team at ZOS:

    tSN17zh.jpeg

    As a dedicated player who plays virtually daily with my wife and our preferred outlet being BGs for at least the last year and half, this one sentence in the patch notes destroyed all faith that you will do anything of worth for this outlet.

    Who would have imagined that a company could spend resources to design the best available reactionary combat system, and rather than bringing it to the spotlight for the masses, they give the first seasonal ranked offering to a pitiful knock off of Dominion.

    Please for the love of god tell me that this is another test (we know how ZOS loves those on the live server) and that if it succeeds, then ZOS will be bringing it to their dueling and BG scenes. You know, the communities that have been around for years. Telling me that this is part of the road map towards BG ranked seasons is the only way to get me to play this as it is.

    Watching this potential get wasted is so draining. Please give me any hope to keep playing this game @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin.

    I agree with your sentiment, but ESO does not have a reactionary combat system, far from it, its a spam skill game, with performance issues that interfere with that. Try games like GW2 and you will understand what a reactionary combat system is (with no perf issues and huge amounts of PVP content) ZOS needs to get the underlying game design issues sorted, and the opportunity cost for that would appear too high.
  • Dem_kitkats1
    Dem_kitkats1
    ✭✭✭
    I agree, ZOS should've capitalized on ranked and unranked BGs when they could have. I really like how games like Dota2 has implemented solo rankings and group rankings, and a system like that would have been very beneficial to ESO. However, I don't think that ZOS intended BGs to be anything more than a side activity to the main attractions, Cyro and IC. It's been clear that their focus is not towards the competitive player.

    The state that the game is in currently cannot support a competitive ranking system. It can't be competitive when skill can greatly be hindered by game performance. It's not fair to anyone that their scoring could be jeopardized by the fact that their skills don't fire, bars don't swap, or they experience lag/desync that makes it impossible to even know what is truly happening.

    I also don't know if the game has the population right now to support one either. Queue times for group can already be horrendous, and then to split the population even more could prove disastrous. Unless, of course, you co-ordinate with guildies, but then how would that be any different than now? Again, population is a good incentive for ZOS to prioritize BGs and make changes, but some people just want to actively turn people away from the game.

    It would be nice for BGs to have a proper ranking system definitely, but performance needs to be main priority.

    Edited by Dem_kitkats1 on April 19, 2022 2:56PM
  • CameraBeardThePirate
    Aldoss wrote: »
    Reading this in the patch notes could not have brought me more disdain and contempt for the management team at ZOS:

    tSN17zh.jpeg

    As a dedicated player who plays virtually daily with my wife and our preferred outlet being BGs for at least the last year and half, this one sentence in the patch notes destroyed all faith that you will do anything of worth for this outlet.

    Who would have imagined that a company could spend resources to design the best available reactionary combat system, and rather than bringing it to the spotlight for the masses, they give the first seasonal ranked offering to a pitiful knock off of Dominion.

    Please for the love of god tell me that this is another test (we know how ZOS loves those on the live server) and that if it succeeds, then ZOS will be bringing it to their dueling and BG scenes. You know, the communities that have been around for years. Telling me that this is part of the road map towards BG ranked seasons is the only way to get me to play this as it is.

    Watching this potential get wasted is so draining. Please give me any hope to keep playing this game @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin.

    I agree with your sentiment, but ESO does not have a reactionary combat system, far from it, its a spam skill game, with performance issues that interfere with that. Try games like GW2 and you will understand what a reactionary combat system is (with no perf issues and huge amounts of PVP content) ZOS needs to get the underlying game design issues sorted, and the opportunity cost for that would appear too high.

    If you're playing this game's PvP as a "spam skill game" you arent going to be very successful.
  • Aldoss
    Aldoss
    ✭✭✭✭
    Aldoss wrote: »
    Reading this in the patch notes could not have brought me more disdain and contempt for the management team at ZOS:

    tSN17zh.jpeg

    As a dedicated player who plays virtually daily with my wife and our preferred outlet being BGs for at least the last year and half, this one sentence in the patch notes destroyed all faith that you will do anything of worth for this outlet.

    Who would have imagined that a company could spend resources to design the best available reactionary combat system, and rather than bringing it to the spotlight for the masses, they give the first seasonal ranked offering to a pitiful knock off of Dominion.

    Please for the love of god tell me that this is another test (we know how ZOS loves those on the live server) and that if it succeeds, then ZOS will be bringing it to their dueling and BG scenes. You know, the communities that have been around for years. Telling me that this is part of the road map towards BG ranked seasons is the only way to get me to play this as it is.

    Watching this potential get wasted is so draining. Please give me any hope to keep playing this game @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin.

    I agree with your sentiment, but ESO does not have a reactionary combat system, far from it, its a spam skill game, with performance issues that interfere with that. Try games like GW2 and you will understand what a reactionary combat system is (with no perf issues and huge amounts of PVP content) ZOS needs to get the underlying game design issues sorted, and the opportunity cost for that would appear too high.

    Yeah, this is a fundamental failure of understanding the combat mechanics of the game.
  • _adhyffbjjjf12
    _adhyffbjjjf12
    ✭✭✭✭
    Aldoss wrote: »
    Reading this in the patch notes could not have brought me more disdain and contempt for the management team at ZOS:

    tSN17zh.jpeg

    As a dedicated player who plays virtually daily with my wife and our preferred outlet being BGs for at least the last year and half, this one sentence in the patch notes destroyed all faith that you will do anything of worth for this outlet.

    Who would have imagined that a company could spend resources to design the best available reactionary combat system, and rather than bringing it to the spotlight for the masses, they give the first seasonal ranked offering to a pitiful knock off of Dominion.

    Please for the love of god tell me that this is another test (we know how ZOS loves those on the live server) and that if it succeeds, then ZOS will be bringing it to their dueling and BG scenes. You know, the communities that have been around for years. Telling me that this is part of the road map towards BG ranked seasons is the only way to get me to play this as it is.

    Watching this potential get wasted is so draining. Please give me any hope to keep playing this game @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin.

    I agree with your sentiment, but ESO does not have a reactionary combat system, far from it, its a spam skill game, with performance issues that interfere with that. Try games like GW2 and you will understand what a reactionary combat system is (with no perf issues and huge amounts of PVP content) ZOS needs to get the underlying game design issues sorted, and the opportunity cost for that would appear too high.

    If you're playing this game's PvP as a "spam skill game" you arent going to be very successful.

    compared to all the other AAA then yes ESO is indeed a spammy mess. Clue - have 2 players with equal skill attack each other with the same build and skills, 1 spams light attack weaves inbetween skills via animation cancelling, 1 doesn't. Spammer wins every time.
    Edited by _adhyffbjjjf12 on April 19, 2022 4:57PM
  • CameraBeardThePirate
    Aldoss wrote: »
    Reading this in the patch notes could not have brought me more disdain and contempt for the management team at ZOS:

    tSN17zh.jpeg

    As a dedicated player who plays virtually daily with my wife and our preferred outlet being BGs for at least the last year and half, this one sentence in the patch notes destroyed all faith that you will do anything of worth for this outlet.

    Who would have imagined that a company could spend resources to design the best available reactionary combat system, and rather than bringing it to the spotlight for the masses, they give the first seasonal ranked offering to a pitiful knock off of Dominion.

    Please for the love of god tell me that this is another test (we know how ZOS loves those on the live server) and that if it succeeds, then ZOS will be bringing it to their dueling and BG scenes. You know, the communities that have been around for years. Telling me that this is part of the road map towards BG ranked seasons is the only way to get me to play this as it is.

    Watching this potential get wasted is so draining. Please give me any hope to keep playing this game @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin.

    I agree with your sentiment, but ESO does not have a reactionary combat system, far from it, its a spam skill game, with performance issues that interfere with that. Try games like GW2 and you will understand what a reactionary combat system is (with no perf issues and huge amounts of PVP content) ZOS needs to get the underlying game design issues sorted, and the opportunity cost for that would appear too high.

    If you're playing this game's PvP as a "spam skill game" you arent going to be very successful.

    compared to all the other AAA then yes ESO is indeed a spammy mess. Clue - have 2 players with equal skill attack each other with the same build and skills, 1 spams light attack weaves inbetween skills via animation cancelling, 1 doesn't. Spammer wins every time.

    So light attack weaving, something ZoS has stated is a mechanic, is "spam" according to you? Because as others stated above, that's just a fundamentally flawed perception of the game's mechanics.
  • NordSwordnBoard
    NordSwordnBoard
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    compared to all the other AAA then yes ESO is indeed a spammy mess. Clue - have 2 players with equal skill attack each other with the same build and skills, 1 spams light attack weaves inbetween skills via animation cancelling, 1 doesn't. Spammer wins every time.

    Wait... you're saying the person with double the combat inputs of their opponent won?
    giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e472khen9jnqcemgqlq8btqr306j534hcngjs69ecru&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g
    Fear is the Mindkiller
  • _adhyffbjjjf12
    _adhyffbjjjf12
    ✭✭✭✭
    Aldoss wrote: »
    Reading this in the patch notes could not have brought me more disdain and contempt for the management team at ZOS:

    tSN17zh.jpeg

    As a dedicated player who plays virtually daily with my wife and our preferred outlet being BGs for at least the last year and half, this one sentence in the patch notes destroyed all faith that you will do anything of worth for this outlet.

    Who would have imagined that a company could spend resources to design the best available reactionary combat system, and rather than bringing it to the spotlight for the masses, they give the first seasonal ranked offering to a pitiful knock off of Dominion.

    Please for the love of god tell me that this is another test (we know how ZOS loves those on the live server) and that if it succeeds, then ZOS will be bringing it to their dueling and BG scenes. You know, the communities that have been around for years. Telling me that this is part of the road map towards BG ranked seasons is the only way to get me to play this as it is.

    Watching this potential get wasted is so draining. Please give me any hope to keep playing this game @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin.

    I agree with your sentiment, but ESO does not have a reactionary combat system, far from it, its a spam skill game, with performance issues that interfere with that. Try games like GW2 and you will understand what a reactionary combat system is (with no perf issues and huge amounts of PVP content) ZOS needs to get the underlying game design issues sorted, and the opportunity cost for that would appear too high.

    If you're playing this game's PvP as a "spam skill game" you arent going to be very successful.

    compared to all the other AAA then yes ESO is indeed a spammy mess. Clue - have 2 players with equal skill attack each other with the same build and skills, 1 spams light attack weaves inbetween skills via animation cancelling, 1 doesn't. Spammer wins every time.

    So light attack weaving, something ZoS has stated is a mechanic, is "spam" according to you? Because as others stated above, that's just a fundamentally flawed perception of the game's mechanics.

    lol you may want to read up on the history of the animation cancelling on this game. I also doubt there is any developer on the planet that would intentionally design a mechanic to allow you to n+1 messages per second. Have a think about the server performance for a start, then gameplay for new players, then just gameplay in general lol. So yes N +1 clicks per second is most certainly spamming at a very high order. I would also add spamming is not skill, and i'm not going to even mention the elephant in the room - macros.
    Edited by _adhyffbjjjf12 on April 19, 2022 5:15PM
  • CameraBeardThePirate
    compared to all the other AAA then yes ESO is indeed a spammy mess. Clue - have 2 players with equal skill attack each other with the same build and skills, 1 spams light attack weaves inbetween skills via animation cancelling, 1 doesn't. Spammer wins every time.

    Wait... you're saying the person with double the combat inputs of their opponent won?
    giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e472khen9jnqcemgqlq8btqr306j534hcngjs69ecru&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g

    What a ridiculous example. "Have two players doing the exact same thing EXCEPT one player is outputting twice the damage that player will win what a broken system".

    Light attack weaving is not spam. Spam is pressing snipe over and over and over again with no sort of combo, which, by the way, will only kill either afk or bad players.

    This game has a lot of issues but being a "spam-fest" is not one of them, prime-time Cyrodiil being the exception
  • _adhyffbjjjf12
    _adhyffbjjjf12
    ✭✭✭✭
    compared to all the other AAA then yes ESO is indeed a spammy mess. Clue - have 2 players with equal skill attack each other with the same build and skills, 1 spams light attack weaves inbetween skills via animation cancelling, 1 doesn't. Spammer wins every time.

    Wait... you're saying the person with double the combat inputs of their opponent won?
    giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e472khen9jnqcemgqlq8btqr306j534hcngjs69ecru&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g

    What a ridiculous example. "Have two players doing the exact same thing EXCEPT one player is outputting twice the damage that player will win what a broken system".

    Light attack weaving is not spam. Spam is pressing snipe over and over and over again with no sort of combo, which, by the way, will only kill either afk or bad players.

    This game has a lot of issues but being a "spam-fest" is not one of them, prime-time Cyrodiil being the exception

    spam means spamming your buttons, if you need click to n+1 per second then obviously your spamming, you can wrap that any way you want but its not skill clicking button 2 every second inbetween your meaningful reactive or offensive skills (or macro)
    Edited by _adhyffbjjjf12 on April 19, 2022 5:23PM
  • Aznox
    Aznox
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Can a moderator please delete messages from [snip] from this thread as they are obviously off-topic and a poorly conceived attempt at driving an (imagined as self-serving) agenda.

    No offense dude, you are probably a very nice person IRL and I'd gladly have a beer with you, but this is getting tiresome.

    We get it, you want light attack weaving - and a few other game mechanics - gone, but a) it won't happen, and b) it wouldn't even make you enjoy the game more.

    Please, mods
    (sry about this post)

    [Edit for Naming and Shaming.]
    Edited by ZOS_GregoryV on April 19, 2022 6:26PM
    Aznox
    PC EU
    Khajiit Orc Bosmer Stamina Sorcerer and Werewolf Stage 3 Vampire
    I live in Battlegrounds
    Theorycrafting enthusiast
    Official Cheese Lord
    CP1500+ club
  • _adhyffbjjjf12
    _adhyffbjjjf12
    ✭✭✭✭
    Aznox wrote: »
    Can a moderator please delete messages from [snip] from this thread as they are obviously off-topic and a poorly conceived attempt at driving an (imagined as self-serving) agenda.

    No offense dude, you are probably a very nice person IRL and I'd gladly have a beer with you, but this is getting tiresome.

    We get it, you want light attack weaving - and a few other game mechanics - gone, but a) it won't happen, and b) it wouldn't even make you enjoy the game more.

    Please, mods
    (sry about this post)

    [Edit for Naming and Shaming.]

    no offense taken. Ask a new player what he thinks about the need to spam a light weave inbetween every skill, its very relevant to why this game has low population and take up and therefore why it doesn't demand more resource - and may well get addressed with the promise rework of the core engine, who knows. btw this was 1 point I raised out of several that someone took offense to, maybe focus on them..
    Edited by ZOS_GregoryV on April 19, 2022 6:25PM
  • ZOS_GregoryV
    Greetings all!

    After review, it would seem this thread has derailed from the initial topic, and therefore, we have decided to close it down. When responding to a discussion, we ask that all posts be kept civil, constructive, on topic, and within the Community Rules. If there may be any questions in regards to the rules, please take a few moments to review them here.

    Thank you for your understanding,
    -Greg-
    Edited by ZOS_GregoryV on April 19, 2022 6:25PM
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