Ethics and morals

PunkAben

The war in Ukraine is terrible and it is difficult to help the poor people who are suffering under the invasion of Russia.
Many countries, companies and steaming services have imposed sanctions on Russia, despite the fact that it also costs them money.
What is Zenimax's relationship to the common front, human rights and war crimes?
Do earnings outweigh the human condition, so Zenimax has also imposed sanctions and blocked Russia from their server or is the power of money higher than the human aspect?

Arunei

This is just going to end up locked or deleted, as real-world politics aren't allowed. Besides that, what response do you expect them to give? This is a forum for the game, man.

Commandment

PunkAben wrote: »

The war in Ukraine is terrible and it is difficult to help the poor people who are suffering under the invasion of Russia.
Many countries, companies and steaming services have imposed sanctions on Russia, despite the fact that it also costs them money.
What is Zenimax's relationship to the common front, human rights and war crimes?
Do earnings outweigh the human condition, so Zenimax has also imposed sanctions and blocked Russia from their server or is the power of money higher than the human aspect?

What's Ukraine and Russia? I don't see it in Tamriels Map

Bat

This is something I've been thinking about too in a more general sense, why we didn't see any news about the gaming industry imposing temporary bans on sales to Russia and similar measures that other global businesses have taken to.
As long as the goods are taxed in Russia, the money will inevitably end up in the budget for Russia's war efforts.

They can delete this thread as much as they like, the fact of the matter remains; it will be a hypocrisy to do charity for Ukraine while also allowing money to flow into Putin's military complex from sales.

Arunei

Not really, though. I doubt the gaming industry makes nearly as much for Putin as things like their crude oil or the major sanctions being imposed on a lot of the upper class. Not everything making money would be going to the war. Besides, I would assume the gaming industry isn't doing sanctions of their own or pulling sales from Russia because online games, at least, may be one of the only ways a lot of people have of accessing information outside of Russia. You have to remember that the Russian people are suffering too, just in a different way.

SammyKhajit

Bat wrote: »

This is something I've been thinking about too in a more general sense, why we didn't see any news about the gaming industry imposing temporary bans on sales to Russia and similar measures that other global businesses have taken to.
As long as the goods are taxed in Russia, the money will inevitably end up in the budget for Russia's war efforts.

They can delete this thread as much as they like, the fact of the matter remains; it will be a hypocrisy to do charity for Ukraine while also allowing money to flow into Putin's military complex from sales.

That is a very good point. One thing to do fundraising but the other question is whether the Russian government is receiving any profit due to taxes and sales.

BlossomDead

I've seen a similar thread before that got removed quickly. Needless to say I quite agree in sentiment.

Spotting people spamming 'Hail Russia' in today's streaming made me want to vomit. Got out of the streaming event immediately.

saar

Russians are blocked from purchasing the game on steam and Microsoft blocked ESO+ sub sales in Russia. so at the moment they are already being affected, to the point where some are leaving the game. What more do you want?

Umbro100

PunkAben wrote: »

The war in Ukraine is terrible and it is difficult to help the poor people who are suffering under the invasion of Russia.
Many countries, companies and steaming services have imposed sanctions on Russia, despite the fact that it also costs them money.
What is Zenimax's relationship to the common front, human rights and war crimes?
Do earnings outweigh the human condition, so Zenimax has also imposed sanctions and blocked Russia from their server or is the power of money higher than the human aspect?

Aren't any people who's country being invaded or bombed or sanctioned or exploited - poor ? Will economic sanction hurt the people in power that are making millions from anything - peace, war ? Makes no difference to them. They are taking money left and right from the people, any people and the only ones suffering are the working man, women and their children. I guess picking one side, calling a whole country an aggressor is neat and safe and makes us feel just and right.When your country, or Nato, our USA is bombing someone, that is ok, because those are the bad people.The scared families sitting in shelters, while their leaders are sipping champagne in their foreign palaces, making some new deals. All over the world someone is being bombed and exploited for cheaper oil, cheaper resources, cheap labor ...so naive and dishonest to cry about it here,and only in this situation. So to answer your question, yes, money is higher than human aspect, for everyone in power, everywhere.

seldomseenkd

My wife made me Beef Stroganoff for dinner the other night. Obviously I threw the plate in the street and have started divorce proceedings. I, of course, uploaded the whole thing to my TikTok so everyone would know I was one of the good guys.

I too would like to know if ZOS is as committed to opposing Putin's war as I am?

PunkAben

Umbro100 wrote: »

PunkAben wrote: »

The war in Ukraine is terrible and it is difficult to help the poor people who are suffering under the invasion of Russia.
Many countries, companies and steaming services have imposed sanctions on Russia, despite the fact that it also costs them money.
What is Zenimax's relationship to the common front, human rights and war crimes?
Do earnings outweigh the human condition, so Zenimax has also imposed sanctions and blocked Russia from their server or is the power of money higher than the human aspect?

Aren't any people who's country being invaded or bombed or sanctioned or exploited - poor ? Will economic sanction hurt the people in power that are making millions from anything - peace, war ? Makes no difference to them. They are taking money left and right from the people, any people and the only ones suffering are the working man, women and their children. I guess picking one side, calling a whole country an aggressor is neat and safe and makes us feel just and right.When your country, or Nato, our USA is bombing someone, that is ok, because those are the bad people.The scared families sitting in shelters, while their leaders are sipping champagne in their foreign palaces, making some new deals. All over the world someone is being bombed and exploited for cheaper oil, cheaper resources, cheap labor ...so naive and dishonest to cry about it here,and only in this situation. So to answer your question, yes, money is higher than human aspect, for everyone in power, everywhere.

I think you to read what i write one more time and I will go into a little more detail.
We haven't seen war crime like this since world war 2.
The Russian army does not spare the civilian population, but targets the civilian targets, which is a crime.
That was not the question I asked, so no need to run it out on a siding.
It has nothing to do with the United States or other nations committing similar acts of war and if it had there were no modern countries that could compete with Russia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_war_crimes
The question is whether Zenimax gives the highest weight to earnings or people and will help to stop the inhuman acts.

RedFireDisco

Why do some people need to inject politics into everywhere?

Zenimax is a game developer. Why should Russian people not be able to play a game.

What are your thoughts on China?

Have you stopped buying made-in-China products as a countenance to the Uyghur genocide?

Sponsored any world vision children lately?

ceiron

Weirdly the whole eso live stuff last night was bssed on a fund raiser for ukraine. Yet we cannot discuss it on here.

PunkAben

RedFireDisco wrote: »

Why do some people need to inject politics into everywhere?

Zenimax is a game developer. Why should Russian people not be able to play a game.

What are your thoughts on China?

Have you stopped buying made-in-China products as a countenance to the Uyghur genocide?

Sponsored any world vision children lately?

I give money to hospitals [snip] the help children with a better day at hospitals in Denmark, make som fun for the kids.
I am members of:
- https://amnesty.org/en/
- https://bornsvilkar.dk/?gclid=Cj0KCQjwr-SSBhC9ARIsANhzu14VIXhifb49ZlTSA92PiTum43pV9n0w2fFvvo6bCdjK_82KIbjwwl4aAsYfEALw_wcB

I donate money to:
- https://kirkenskorshaer.dk/genbrug?gclid=Cj0KCQjwr-SSBhC9ARIsANhzu1769nX9nBbWYm98vSJ54qvUfW6apvVm1OOb-Q6Sr7jQcYd4ApgHftUaAhm4EALw_wcB
- https://icrc.org/en/who-we-are/movement

If you want to make the world a better place, you need to start with your self!
Politics or entertainment. I think it is fully justified to raise the issue when so many other companies have already made clear what they want to do in this case.

[edited for baiting]

Synaptic

PunkAben wrote: »

RedFireDisco wrote: »

Why do some people need to inject politics into everywhere?

Zenimax is a game developer. Why should Russian people not be able to play a game.

What are your thoughts on China?

Have you stopped buying made-in-China products as a countenance to the Uyghur genocide?

Sponsored any world vision children lately?

I give money to hospitals [snip] the help children with a better day at hospitals in Denmark, make som fun for the kids.
I am members of:
- https://amnesty.org/en/
- https://bornsvilkar.dk/?gclid=Cj0KCQjwr-SSBhC9ARIsANhzu14VIXhifb49ZlTSA92PiTum43pV9n0w2fFvvo6bCdjK_82KIbjwwl4aAsYfEALw_wcB

I donate money to:
- https://kirkenskorshaer.dk/genbrug?gclid=Cj0KCQjwr-SSBhC9ARIsANhzu1769nX9nBbWYm98vSJ54qvUfW6apvVm1OOb-Q6Sr7jQcYd4ApgHftUaAhm4EALw_wcB
- https://icrc.org/en/who-we-are/movement

If you want to make the world a better place, you need to start with your self!

Glad you made this thread to let everyone know.

[edited to remove quote]

PunkAben

I didn't need to make the thread or write about it here at the forum.
I would think a journalist would be able to ask better and more fulfilling questions about the extent to which the gaming industry is passive in a world where we can all help and make a difference.
It might also look better when your parents, friends and acquaintances ask if it is not the game you are playing and how it can be you just look passively and seem indifferent.

SammyKhajit

@PunkAben this one wouldn’t bother with games forums, you’ll just get inundated with trolls and people who sleep walk through life (aka the “Don’t wanna be politically” cohort, which is itself ironic, since that is also a political statement).

This one donates to Red Cross and others. Write emails to local politicians and sign petitions. Join peaceful marches and vigils. About Ukraine and other matters. No doubt there are others who read the forum who share the same compassion and desire for justice and world peace, focus on those people, not the negative drains.

alberichtano

PunkAben wrote: »

The war in Ukraine is terrible and it is difficult to help the poor people who are suffering under the invasion of Russia.
Many countries, companies and steaming services have imposed sanctions on Russia, despite the fact that it also costs them money.
What is Zenimax's relationship to the common front, human rights and war crimes?
Do earnings outweigh the human condition, so Zenimax has also imposed sanctions and blocked Russia from their server or is the power of money higher than the human aspect?

I am not sure how making russian gamers not able to play something they paid for help anyone, except perhaps Putin, who will get more support as normal citizens grow increasingly pissed at blockades hitting them, not the moscow leadership.

But yes, as someone said, this thread will get locked and removed.

Synaptic

alberichtano wrote: »

PunkAben wrote: »

The war in Ukraine is terrible and it is difficult to help the poor people who are suffering under the invasion of Russia.
Many countries, companies and steaming services have imposed sanctions on Russia, despite the fact that it also costs them money.
What is Zenimax's relationship to the common front, human rights and war crimes?
Do earnings outweigh the human condition, so Zenimax has also imposed sanctions and blocked Russia from their server or is the power of money higher than the human aspect?

I am not sure how making russian gamers not able to play something they paid for help anyone, except perhaps Putin, who will get more support as normal citizens grow increasingly pissed at blockades hitting them, not the moscow leadership.

But yes, as someone said, this thread will get locked and removed.

Exactly.

Companies should remain impartial.

Lots of people are affected by what's happening, I'm sure all the russian McDonald's workers (and other companies that left russia) who had nothing to do with what's going on and are now jobless are just thrilled that the company they worked for decided to submit to public pressure and pack up and leave.

Also, this thread is pretty ridiculous.

alberichtano

RedFireDisco wrote: »

Why do some people need to inject politics into everywhere?

Zenimax is a game developer. Why should Russian people not be able to play a game.

What are your thoughts on China?

Have you stopped buying made-in-China products as a countenance to the Uyghur genocide?

Sponsored any world vision children lately?

Do not forget saudi oil. What they are doing to Yemen...

(Damn, I am gonna get banned again, won't I?)

FluffyBird

Just before some people open their mouth they could check a bit of facts: due to ZOS being under M$, Russian players currently cannot purchase crowns, or the chapter, or ESO+ in Steam or on the website. We also have no official communication on the matter, we (and all the Russian-speaking players outside Russia, btw) have no RU recap of the last ESO stream which wouldn't directly fund anything, but who cares, hating Russians indiscriminately is so hot right now.

So ZOS isn't funding war by paying taxes anymore, you can sleep peacefully once again and go on with hating people for where they we born.

alberichtano

karthrag_inak wrote: »

saar wrote: »

Russians are blocked from purchasing the game on steam and Microsoft blocked ESO+ sub sales in Russia. so at the moment they are already being affected, to the point where some are leaving the game. What more do you want?

[snip]

Yeaaah... that doesn't even work well in democracies, let alone in mock-democracies or outright dictatorships. Do you have any idea how big Russia is?

[edited to remove quote]

Sjestenka

thread not locked yet? Guess it's okay to post then. I'm rissian, i live in Russia. Don't know if it's Microsoft thing or visa-mastercard thing but true, i can't buy ESO+, expansions, crowns.. Still wanna play though. Preferably not through vpn.
In addition, i have friends in Ukraine. Lots of russians do. Lots have relatives there. Dont know if your mass media talk about it folks, but these two nations were very close before 2014. Also, героям слава

LalMirchi

The real life is the real life. I do not think online games are that, but rather an escape from the real life. Please let us keep our fantasy environments far away from the real life.

Somewhere somehow there must be a change but it is mosdef not happening in a fantastical game.

Wolfchild07

The people at the top are all part of the same group, doing their secret handshakes. Don't hate the citizens. We are all "the vile multitude" to them, "vulgar and profane". They don't care about about their own civilians/soldiers, let alone another country's. If you want to know what I'm talking about, message me.

bmnoble

PunkAben wrote: »

Umbro100 wrote: »

PunkAben wrote: »

The war in Ukraine is terrible and it is difficult to help the poor people who are suffering under the invasion of Russia.
Many countries, companies and steaming services have imposed sanctions on Russia, despite the fact that it also costs them money.
What is Zenimax's relationship to the common front, human rights and war crimes?
Do earnings outweigh the human condition, so Zenimax has also imposed sanctions and blocked Russia from their server or is the power of money higher than the human aspect?

Aren't any people who's country being invaded or bombed or sanctioned or exploited - poor ? Will economic sanction hurt the people in power that are making millions from anything - peace, war ? Makes no difference to them. They are taking money left and right from the people, any people and the only ones suffering are the working man, women and their children. I guess picking one side, calling a whole country an aggressor is neat and safe and makes us feel just and right.When your country, or Nato, our USA is bombing someone, that is ok, because those are the bad people.The scared families sitting in shelters, while their leaders are sipping champagne in their foreign palaces, making some new deals. All over the world someone is being bombed and exploited for cheaper oil, cheaper resources, cheap labor ...so naive and dishonest to cry about it here,and only in this situation. So to answer your question, yes, money is higher than human aspect, for everyone in power, everywhere.

I think you to read what i write one more time and I will go into a little more detail.
We haven't seen war crime like this since world war 2.
The Russian army does not spare the civilian population, but targets the civilian targets, which is a crime.
That was not the question I asked, so no need to run it out on a siding.
It has nothing to do with the United States or other nations committing similar acts of war and if it had there were no modern countries that could compete with Russia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_war_crimes
The question is whether Zenimax gives the highest weight to earnings or people and will help to stop the inhuman acts.

While I don't condone what Russia has done, all through this war the media and social media have been reporting on the civilians fighting back, ambushing Russian troops, armored convoys, that ship that got hit with a missile etc.. not going to knock people from defending their homeland and it has worked they Russians have taken heavy casualties but it has worked too well.

When I saw all that happening first thing that came to mind was eventually the Russians soldiers are going to get to the point where they are so paranoid of ambush, that they will attack first rather than risk their necks confirming if they are civilians or resistance fighters or in the worst cases carry out reprisals.


Zenimax is a game company they have already stopped sales on the game and ESO+ subs there is not much more they can do not that cutting off Russian civilians from a game will do anything.

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

As this thread has derailed with baiting and insulting commentary, we've decided to close it down. Please be sure to keep our Community Rules in mind when posting on our forums.

Thank you for your understanding.