3rd queue option for dungeons for those players who want to focus on the quest

Tornaad

For those, like me, who want a way to enjoy the story of the different dungeons, what if they added a 3rd queue option for the group finder that would let you group up with others who want to do the story? Yes, I know there would still be the possibility of trolls who would be trying to do something other than experience the story, but it would be a lot more possible to do, and could get implemented even faster.
For me, it is not a perfect option, but the fact that they could add it in without having to redo many of the dungeons makes the idea promising.
This idea came after reading the new article talking about one of the new dungeons.
https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/61733
I look forward to hearing your thoughts on this. I decided to make this a pole because I wanted an easy way to make it easy for people to share their opinion without actually having to write a post if they did not want to.
Please avoid posts about why you think this is not needed. This is not a discussion about whether this is needed or not. It is a discussion about how this specific idea will meet a real need the community has. Thank you.

Tornaad

I'm okay with the idea of a quest/story focused group finder. It's not the best, but it would work.

An idea I just had to expand on the 3rd queue option, was that the Random dungeon option would only queue you up for dungeons your character has not completed the quest on.

Heartrage

No, it avoids the real problem

While i think it would be nice for people that want to experience the dungeon story, I think this is a queue that would quickly be ignored. Most people would queue in it once, do the quest and then queue in the normal queue to do the same dungeon. Since the number of people that want to play in this queue will diminish quickly, the queue time will increase too and it will make people queue even less in it.

I would expect it to work for 1 week to a month max before it just get abandoned and removed by the end of the year. Similar queue were added in cyrodiil and for trials that were removed for this reason.

Tornaad

I'm okay with the idea of a quest/story focused group finder. It's not the best, but it would work.

Heartrage wrote: »

While i think it would be nice for people that want to experience the dungeon story, I think this is a queue that would quickly be ignored. Most people would queue in it once, do the quest and then queue in the normal queue to do the same dungeon. Since the number of people that want to play in this queue will diminish quickly, the queue time will increase too and it will make people queue even less in it.

I would expect it to work for 1 week to a month max before it just get abandoned and removed by the end of the year. Similar queue were added in cyrodiil and for trials that were removed for this reason.

You make a fair point. I had not considered that side of things. However, a slight counter to your point is that you would likely see spikes of interest in the third queue every 6 months with the release of new dungeons.

AcadianPaladin

No, it avoids the real problem

I appreciate the problem but my concern is the more queue options there are, the longer each will take. And excess time in queue is already a problem for dps.

Unfortunately, I don't really have a perfect solution. The best I can offer is that the community has the tools it needs. Speak up if you need the quest. If you've done the quest, be patient - perhaps even ask if anyone needs the quest. Be willing to slow down enough to accomodate others and actually allow use of the text chat box. And kick those who won't support or listen to basic, simple requests (like needing the quest).

Tornaad

I'm okay with the idea of a quest/story focused group finder. It's not the best, but it would work.

AcadianPaladin wrote: »

I appreciate the problem but my concern is the more queue options there are, the longer each will take. And excess time in queue is already a problem for dps.

Unfortunately, I don't really have a perfect solution. The best I can offer is that the community has the tools it needs. Speak up if you need the quest. If you've done the quest, be patient - perhaps even ask if anyone needs the quest. Be willing to slow down enough to accomodate others and actually allow use of the text chat box. And kick those who won't support or listen to basic, simple requests (like needing the quest).

Very valid points.

Heartrage

No, it avoids the real problem

@Zuboko
True, but I don’t think those spikes would last more than a week and extend to other dungeons since they would be about those two new dungeons.

It would still be fun for those that want this experience and can play during the week of release but i don’t see the queue fixing the larger problem.

Marronsuisse

No, it avoids the real problem

Even if everyone in the group wants to do the quest I've found it can be hard to follow the story unless you're all perfectly coordinated.

I do dungeons the first time with my friend and we try to follow the story. One of us is always skipping the dialogue forward before the other has finished. We never know which response is going to close out the dialogue for the other person.

Personally I think the solo story mode idea people have talked about at length here in the forums would be the only way for people to fully experience stories in dungeons. I'd rather do the group version AND not miss chunks of dialogue, though... (we're still doing base game dungeons, maybe later dungeons are designed better for this sort of thing.)

PeacefulAnarchy

No, it avoids the real problem

The real problem is that non-repeatable story content requires a time constrained group. This doesn't solve that because
a) if you've completed the quest you're out of luck
b) the number of people in the queue will be tiny, especially since most people would have done some quests so would queue for individual dungeons
c) want to focus on story is still a wide variety of people from "want to read the dialogue but otherwise rush through combat" to "want to explore every nook and cranny"

There should be a story instance that awards no loot or quest completion, but lets you go through all the story beats. It wouldn't require redoing dungeons, just a reduction in enemy health and a handful of changes to not require a group.

Tornaad

I'm okay with the idea of a quest/story focused group finder. It's not the best, but it would work.

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: »

The real problem is that non-repeatable story content requires a time constrained group. This doesn't solve that because
a) if you've completed the quest you're out of luck
b) the number of people in the queue will be tiny, especially since most people would have done some quests so would queue for individual dungeons
c) want to focus on story is still a wide variety of people from "want to read the dialogue but otherwise rush through combat" to "want to explore every nook and cranny"

There should be a story instance that awards no loot or quest completion, but lets you go through all the story beats. It wouldn't require redoing dungeons, just a reduction in enemy health and a handful of changes to not require a group.

For a few dungeons it would require redoing them as there are mechanics that require multiple people. Yes, many of those are simple boss attacks that can just be turned off, but I think there are at least one or two that have environmental effects that require multiple people. I know there are a few trials that have environmental effects that would prevent them from being ran solo.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

I'm okay with the idea of a quest/story focused group finder. It's not the best, but it would work.

You would need to disable gear drops or people gear farming would use it as well. Not trying to make it a punishment, just being realistic.

ShawnLaRock

Any time I run an alt through a dungeon that they haven’t done yet, it pairs me up with at least one other player that also hasn’t done it. I never even have to pick up the quest - it just always gives me the join / accept prompt automatically. Seems fine by me…

S.

moleculardrugs

When I do group content like dungeons, I slow down for the entire group even though I've done the dungeon before. I admit I only do them for transmutation crystals or if I have to farm gear, it is mostly the former. But I don't rush the dungeon or speed ahead. If I do, I slow down and wait for others because it is their dungeon as well as mine.

However, if you queue into a group you should always play as a group.

In terms of triage, IMHO it should work like this for people who want to do group dungeons:

Dungeon's Story > Dungeon's Objective > what the group wants or is okay with doing > common courtesy > common decency > speedrunners

It adds an extra 5 minutes if you slow down for someone who actually wants to do a dungeon. It's not the end of the world and you still get your transmutation crystals and gear at the end. If the dungeon is too easy for someone who speedruns it, they should be queuing for vet dungeons imo.

Araneae6537

No, it avoids the real problem

I’m thinking this wouldn’t help because there’s no way to prevent someone rushing ahead and taking you out of dialogue, removing an NPC you wanted to talk to, pulling you from what you were exploring, etc. In games with cutscenes, you could just state in the group finder the intent to watch all cutscenes and people have to wait until everyone is done (this is how it worked in SWTOR and GW2 anyway). This isn’t to say that I think ESO ought to have cutscenes, but that actions of others in the group can cut short the experience for you and, also unlike SWTOR and GW2, the dungeon story quests cannot be repeated on a character.

This is why I think the best option would be to have a solo story mode that didn’t award gear or set skill points but was purely for exploring and experiencing the story. Of course many can do this now in base game dungeons but not everyone and likely not on your first character. And of course some dungeons cannot be soloed purely because of mechanics.

Tornaad

I'm okay with the idea of a quest/story focused group finder. It's not the best, but it would work.

.

Araneae6537 wrote: »

I’m thinking this wouldn’t help because there’s no way to prevent someone rushing ahead and taking you out of dialogue, removing an NPC you wanted to talk to, pulling you from what you were exploring, etc. In games with cutscenes, you could just state in the group finder the intent to watch all cutscenes and people have to wait until everyone is done (this is how it worked in SWTOR and GW2 anyway). This isn’t to say that I think ESO ought to have cutscenes, but that actions of others in the group can cut short the experience for you and, also unlike SWTOR and GW2, the dungeon story quests cannot be repeated on a character.

This is why I think the best option would be to have a solo story mode that didn’t award gear or set skill points but was purely for exploring and experiencing the story. Of course many can do this now in base game dungeons but not everyone and likely not on your first character. And of course some dungeons cannot be soloed purely because of mechanics.

and because of how the dialog works with groups if someone does that then you miss dialog.

AlnilamE

Just want to see the results

Just so I understand correctly, this queue would only pull other people in the same queue for that specific dungeon?

How long are you willing to wait in that queue?

You would be better off finding people in guild/zone to run the dungeon instead.

As for dialogue, the new dungeons have dialogue at the beginning and at the end, so you can go in ahead of time and talk to the starting NPC until all dialogue options are exhausted if you want a deep dive into the story. And then do the same thing at the end.

Amottica

No, it avoids the real problem

We already have an option for doing the dungeon with a group that intends to focus on the quest. Use it.

KingExecration

Easier option is to just make it auto complete after beating last boss. A lot are like this and then some you have to talk to 50 things

Heartrage

No, it avoids the real problem

@KingExecration
I think the point op was making was that they want to take the time to experience the stories of dungeons instead of having their group rush forward and complete it without listening to the dialogues.

Having quests auto complete when you do the dungeon would be counter to that.

Amottica

No, it avoids the real problem

Heartrage wrote: »

@KingExecration
I think the point op was making was that they want to take the time to experience the stories of dungeons instead of having their group rush forward and complete it without listening to the dialogues.

Having quests auto complete when you do the dungeon would be counter to that.

But we already have this option, to quest a dungeon with a like-minded group.

Hapexamendios

Would only work if it was for people doing the quests only. Wait times might be pretty long.

Dexter411

AcadianPaladin wrote: »

...

... The best I can offer is that the community has the tools it needs. Speak up if you need the quest. If you've done the quest, be patient - perhaps even ask if anyone needs the quest. Be willing to slow down enough to accomodate others and actually allow use of the text chat box. And kick those who won't support or listen to basic, simple requests (like needing the quest).

I think this is the real problem here. People are afraid to speak up or make thier own group. They want to join but almost never they want to gather the group in first place.

While being target of toxic behaviour is not a nice feeling, you have options, leave group, try and kick them from group and then there is Ignore List(which everyone forget about).

People need to realize that majority, the majority of players that que for random normal dungeon either farm Transmute Crystals, because normal gives same rewards as veteran mode and those that want daily does of xp from it.

If you have quest, do not be afraid to speak up in chat. If group won't slow down they are as*holes, if you do not inform your group you have quest and will need to do the requirements to finish it, you are the as*hole.

Now for lore and story runs there are enough of casual guilds out there that do that. Find one You like if not join another. There are no downsides to trying out guild if you do not fit to them or they don't fit to you

Agenericname

Just want to see the results

Im neither for nor against the idea. If ZOS added it, I may even use it.

There are two issues that I see with the proposed idea.

1. It shouldn't be limited to people who have completed the quest. Going that route would cut off people who might otherwise enjoy the story of the content and subsequently increase the queue time.

2. The queue would likely be very long. Ultimately you would have been better off using the tools that exist to find your group. Many that are looking for these types of groups have already found one and dont need a queue for it.

Amottica

No, it avoids the real problem

Agenericname wrote: »

Im neither for nor against the idea. If ZOS added it, I may even use it.

There are two issues that I see with the proposed idea.

1. It shouldn't be limited to people who have completed the quest. Going that route would cut off people who might otherwise enjoy the story of the content and subsequently increase the queue time.

2. The queue would likely be very long. Ultimately you would have been better off using the tools that exist to find your group. Many that are looking for these types of groups have already found one and dont need a queue for it.

Yes, the queue would be longer. It would become longer for everyone and would lead to other "specialized" queues that in the end would be detrimental to the entire queue.

Zenimax already gave us the option to get into groups when we have certain requirements or needs. It is called forming our own group and it is an easy thing to do. People have been doing this successfully for years.

They should not, and likely will not succumb to adding such options in the queue. It is not good for the game.

DreamyLu

No, it avoids the real problem

I tend to believe that players do the story once only. The queue would probably not be populated enough.