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ZOS Low Pop Bonus Bug/Exploit throws Grayhost/NA campaign outcome with just over a day left
-
TechMaybeHic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭BlakMarket wrote: »I've seen ALL of the factions get an unfair "low pop" bonus and get more points then they should have this campaign. Its how EP pulled a win. It is not only AD and we are not sitting at our gate trying to exploit it.... lol. Most of the time when I play, not only are the low pop bonuses seemingly buggy, but so are the population bars. It will tell me we are 2 bars and tell someone else we are one bar. Meanwhile I am running around the map frantically trying to figure out why I see only 8 other players PvPing. The population and ques have been broken awhile. The low pop bonus has been bugged awhile. And I do find it kind of funny there is so much finger pointing at AD, when everyone has had the bonus, and we all have seen the bugged population bars. The uneven population on non primetime hours makes the game boring. Having a bugged system for said population unbalances makes it even worse. Then we have these folks screaming random accusations about us exploiting at the gate, which is funny since we are constantly at our tri keeps trying to def against 2 other factions who refuse to fight each other.
I pvp almost daily, and only really see Ad with low pop. Also the only reason Ad gets gated and camped nearing end of camp is because both factions know you guys will get low pop and pull ahead in points. I agree with pop bugs, but I also hear a rumor of an exploit from someone on Ad.
Playing for maybe 8-10hrs of the last 24hrs of the most recent camp PC/NA, I watched Ad get low pop 4-5 times - once literally when they were the highest pop.
There is no one exploiting the population bonus. Everyone is mystified by it. I've been around since the beginning and I'd think I would've heard about an exploit if there was one. Some of you really have some crazy conspiracy theories. Makes me wonder what theories you have in every day life.
There is an explanation outside these forums. Could probably be found if one searches. Ironically; shortly after I saw the explanation; EP then suddenly had some huge ticks. I'm sure it's coincidence though.1 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭AgentZenish wrote: »The idea that AD has the coordination to mass port people in to delves/cheesemongers at the same time is hilarious as we can barely coordinate people to one pvp objective. The AD Faction is just as confused as everyone else.
This is clearly some kind of bug.
I was fighting AD for 3 days straight for the most part, since EP was almost nowhere to be found, the final fight I had yesterday was very common. We were taking the resources around Blackboot to add a few more points in case a AD low pop bonus kicked in again (we wanted to make sure it wouldn't put us in last place)... and about 40 AD stormed the resource to kill us. Every decent fight we had was with 30-50 AD, most of which came from 2 main guilds. So saying AD doesn't work together is not accurate, there were the same 2-3 guilds I saw in almost large every fight.
Not accusing them, just saying there are definitely enough folks who can coordinate in voice chat easily enough if it was being done on purpose, and it probably doesn't even take that many due to the low pop caps anyways. Heck, maybe they all went to get a delve buff every 30 min and that caused it for all we know.
Kwoung, for the record, I have played this "game" since beta, albeit I haven't been nearly as active on the forums as some.
However, in all the years I have played, not once have I seen the type of complaints and accusations about another faction receiving low pop bonus, at least not to the level of what I've recently read. I have seen questionable low pop bonus given to all factions over the years, but we just joke about it in zone and move on.
However, as I said, I haven't been very active on the forums, so I quite possibly missed a post. Apologies if so.
As @Kiira very well pointed out, "The low pop bonus has been bugged awhile. And I do find it kind of funny there is so much finger pointing at AD, when everyone has had the bonus, and we all have seen the bugged population bars." I am sorry you and some others feel the need to accuse AD of something that has obviously been a benefit to all three factions from time to time over the years.
Since you brought it up and say "30-50" AD "stormed" a resource to kill your small group. If the numbers, as you say, are accurate, I would like to point out that it's likely that they were only there in mass to defend or retake a keep. As I've often seen from DC and EP as well. I only wish we had this "30-50" AD with so much time on their hands they were able to defend resources and keeps from the double faction stacks.
However, again, if the numbers were accurate, this might make sense due to the last few nights. As you I'm sure are aware (per your statement about fighting AD for "3 days straight") AD has been pushed to their gates practically nightly over the last few days. It is highly likely that as there would be very few places for AD to go, that might attribute to the attention (as you say you saw) to those resources.
Now, what I have seen is DC and EP gate AD (during the time you specified), especially the last few days. I have seen DC pop a tent right outside our gates, killing off any AD attempts to retake tri keeps. Obviously things change, but years ago, some players and leads refrained from doing this as it entirely killed morale and caused that faction to just log. It also shows poor sportsmanship and lack of maturity. Which I'm going out on a limb here, hopefully that's not what you want correct?
As far as low pop, if there is anything going on, which again, as some have tried to convince us of, there would be huge communications zone wide to try and coordinate anything like that. It's just not that deep. If anyone is doing it, they've also done it on EP and DC. That could be why many of us on AD were laughing about it over the years when it was handed out to the other factions seemingly under questionable circumstances. Again, I just move on and play.
Now, do people in this game exploit? Sure they do. Yes, feel free to call it out when you see something. But, I have to say, since 2014, I have yet to see or hear of any attempts at manipulating this low pop bonus from AD side. And definitely not to the zone wide scale that is being accused here. That does not mean it never happened. But, I find it difficult to believe that in all the various time slots/days/hours/months/years, I would have not even heard a whispering of it.
If that were the case, and we really had the "30-50" AD to coordinate, all stack a resource, and waste their time to come out to kill you, trust me, you would see AD win campaign after campaign and never be gated to the blatant and gross display that it has been. Watching EP take DC's scroll and yet AD still be gated? That would not happen if what is being accused were the case. I'd love to see 30-50 AD have that many players and that much organization to be able to and have so much time on their hands to take resources and concoct such a diabolical plan lol.
At that point, there would be no question.
At that point, you would not have to scratch your head wondering what was going on.
There is no naming allowed here, but we were pretty much fighting the same 2 guilds Fri-Sun. And yes, I was involved in chasing AD to their gate Friday night and staying there fighting them to keep them from easily following the scroll and re-taking it. It was a huge fight that lasted quite a while actually, but no one was at their other gate until much later when we attempted their other scroll, so no gate camping involved, they had an entire free gate to get out from had they so chosen.
Anyhow, as I stated, for all we know it was some bug caused by some inadvertent action, like clearing debuffs or getting a delve buff. And yup, been happening in game for a long time if someone does searches, but this past weekend, AD had 2x AP going probably a good 50% of the time, even while they were winning the campaign on Friday, so something is up. Had the bonus not dropped off just before the score ticks every time, they would have been thousands of points ahead of everyone, so obviously they were not as lucky as EP, who managed to have the bonus hit them 2 evals in a row and throw them from last to first place with a 700 point jump.
Quite honestly, AD could have easily won the campaign had they not been hitting DC every time and focused on EP instead every so often. But every time we tried to push EP, AD would light up 2-3 of our back keeps, causing us to come back. Yeah its virtual war, and I don't think any of the factions are working together, but us hammering AD was more out of protecting ourselves (and being more than a bit miffed at them having the AP bonus all weekend) than anything else.2 -
Jaimeh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It was happening almost hourly during Saturday and Sunday while both AD and EP were pop locked for hours. Of course what took the cake was the fact that although AD abused this shamelessly on almost every eval and counted on it to try and win, on Sunday evening 58 seconds before one eval (I was watching the board so I saw it happen in real time) EP while being poplocked for hours, went from ~100 something points to 340, abusing the pop bonus exploit, and passed to the first place-- if it wasn't so disgusting, it'be comical. DC was outnumbered against them most of the time, and not once did the exploit regardless of players being absolutely fed up in chat seeing the enemy's score being doubled again and again on every eval while they were pop-locked (and most definitely on inter-faction comms to coordinate their attacks). We wanted to win on our own merits, and we would have if the other factions didn't cheat and actually played fairly. And then they cry when we say DC is special, well this last week of the campaign spoke volumes.2 -
Delphinia✭✭✭✭✭AgentZenish wrote: »The idea that AD has the coordination to mass port people in to delves/cheesemongers at the same time is hilarious as we can barely coordinate people to one pvp objective. The AD Faction is just as confused as everyone else.
This is clearly some kind of bug.
I was fighting AD for 3 days straight for the most part, since EP was almost nowhere to be found, the final fight I had yesterday was very common. We were taking the resources around Blackboot to add a few more points in case a AD low pop bonus kicked in again (we wanted to make sure it wouldn't put us in last place)... and about 40 AD stormed the resource to kill us. Every decent fight we had was with 30-50 AD, most of which came from 2 main guilds. So saying AD doesn't work together is not accurate, there were the same 2-3 guilds I saw in almost large every fight.
Not accusing them, just saying there are definitely enough folks who can coordinate in voice chat easily enough if it was being done on purpose, and it probably doesn't even take that many due to the low pop caps anyways. Heck, maybe they all went to get a delve buff every 30 min and that caused it for all we know.
Kwoung, for the record, I have played this "game" since beta, albeit I haven't been nearly as active on the forums as some.
However, in all the years I have played, not once have I seen the type of complaints and accusations about another faction receiving low pop bonus, at least not to the level of what I've recently read. I have seen questionable low pop bonus given to all factions over the years, but we just joke about it in zone and move on.
However, as I said, I haven't been very active on the forums, so I quite possibly missed a post. Apologies if so.
As @Kiira very well pointed out, "The low pop bonus has been bugged awhile. And I do find it kind of funny there is so much finger pointing at AD, when everyone has had the bonus, and we all have seen the bugged population bars." I am sorry you and some others feel the need to accuse AD of something that has obviously been a benefit to all three factions from time to time over the years.
Since you brought it up and say "30-50" AD "stormed" a resource to kill your small group. If the numbers, as you say, are accurate, I would like to point out that it's likely that they were only there in mass to defend or retake a keep. As I've often seen from DC and EP as well. I only wish we had this "30-50" AD with so much time on their hands they were able to defend resources and keeps from the double faction stacks.
However, again, if the numbers were accurate, this might make sense due to the last few nights. As you I'm sure are aware (per your statement about fighting AD for "3 days straight") AD has been pushed to their gates practically nightly over the last few days. It is highly likely that as there would be very few places for AD to go, that might attribute to the attention (as you say you saw) to those resources.
Now, what I have seen is DC and EP gate AD (during the time you specified), especially the last few days. I have seen DC pop a tent right outside our gates, killing off any AD attempts to retake tri keeps. Obviously things change, but years ago, some players and leads refrained from doing this as it entirely killed morale and caused that faction to just log. It also shows poor sportsmanship and lack of maturity. Which I'm going out on a limb here, hopefully that's not what you want correct?
As far as low pop, if there is anything going on, which again, as some have tried to convince us of, there would be huge communications zone wide to try and coordinate anything like that. It's just not that deep. If anyone is doing it, they've also done it on EP and DC. That could be why many of us on AD were laughing about it over the years when it was handed out to the other factions seemingly under questionable circumstances. Again, I just move on and play.
Now, do people in this game exploit? Sure they do. Yes, feel free to call it out when you see something. But, I have to say, since 2014, I have yet to see or hear of any attempts at manipulating this low pop bonus from AD side. And definitely not to the zone wide scale that is being accused here. That does not mean it never happened. But, I find it difficult to believe that in all the various time slots/days/hours/months/years, I would have not even heard a whispering of it.
If that were the case, and we really had the "30-50" AD to coordinate, all stack a resource, and waste their time to come out to kill you, trust me, you would see AD win campaign after campaign and never be gated to the blatant and gross display that it has been. Watching EP take DC's scroll and yet AD still be gated? That would not happen if what is being accused were the case. I'd love to see 30-50 AD have that many players and that much organization to be able to and have so much time on their hands to take resources and concoct such a diabolical plan lol.
At that point, there would be no question.
At that point, you would not have to scratch your head wondering what was going on.
There is no naming allowed here, but we were pretty much fighting the same 2 guilds Fri-Sun. And yes, I was involved in chasing AD to their gate Friday night and staying there fighting them to keep them from easily following the scroll and re-taking it. It was a huge fight that lasted quite a while actually, but no one was at their other gate until much later when we attempted their other scroll, so no gate camping involved, they had an entire free gate to get out from had they so chosen.
Anyhow, as I stated, for all we know it was some bug caused by some inadvertent action, like clearing debuffs or getting a delve buff. And yup, been happening in game for a long time if someone does searches, but this past weekend, AD had 2x AP going probably a good 50% of the time, even while they were winning the campaign on Friday, so something is up. Had the bonus not dropped off just before the score ticks every time, they would have been thousands of points ahead of everyone, so obviously they were not as lucky as EP, who managed to have the bonus hit them 2 evals in a row and throw them from last to first place with a 700 point jump.
Quite honestly, AD could have easily won the campaign had they not been hitting DC every time and focused on EP instead every so often. But every time we tried to push EP, AD would light up 2-3 of our back keeps, causing us to come back. Yeah its virtual war, and I don't think any of the factions are working together, but us hammering AD was more out of protecting ourselves (and being more than a bit miffed at them having the AP bonus all weekend) than anything else.
I'm sorry you have this perception of AD. I can't speak for the entire faction, and won't try. All I can offer is that per my own personal experiences throughout years of play and observations, having a large enough percentage of one faction to make that much of a difference and organize, communicate, and commit to an exploit, is doubtful and hasn't been one I've ever witnessed. If there is one, it's definitely never worked in AD's favor.6 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭AgentZenish wrote: »The idea that AD has the coordination to mass port people in to delves/cheesemongers at the same time is hilarious as we can barely coordinate people to one pvp objective. The AD Faction is just as confused as everyone else.
This is clearly some kind of bug.
I was fighting AD for 3 days straight for the most part, since EP was almost nowhere to be found, the final fight I had yesterday was very common. We were taking the resources around Blackboot to add a few more points in case a AD low pop bonus kicked in again (we wanted to make sure it wouldn't put us in last place)... and about 40 AD stormed the resource to kill us. Every decent fight we had was with 30-50 AD, most of which came from 2 main guilds. So saying AD doesn't work together is not accurate, there were the same 2-3 guilds I saw in almost large every fight.
Not accusing them, just saying there are definitely enough folks who can coordinate in voice chat easily enough if it was being done on purpose, and it probably doesn't even take that many due to the low pop caps anyways. Heck, maybe they all went to get a delve buff every 30 min and that caused it for all we know.
Kwoung, for the record, I have played this "game" since beta, albeit I haven't been nearly as active on the forums as some.
However, in all the years I have played, not once have I seen the type of complaints and accusations about another faction receiving low pop bonus, at least not to the level of what I've recently read. I have seen questionable low pop bonus given to all factions over the years, but we just joke about it in zone and move on.
However, as I said, I haven't been very active on the forums, so I quite possibly missed a post. Apologies if so.
As @Kiira very well pointed out, "The low pop bonus has been bugged awhile. And I do find it kind of funny there is so much finger pointing at AD, when everyone has had the bonus, and we all have seen the bugged population bars." I am sorry you and some others feel the need to accuse AD of something that has obviously been a benefit to all three factions from time to time over the years.
Since you brought it up and say "30-50" AD "stormed" a resource to kill your small group. If the numbers, as you say, are accurate, I would like to point out that it's likely that they were only there in mass to defend or retake a keep. As I've often seen from DC and EP as well. I only wish we had this "30-50" AD with so much time on their hands they were able to defend resources and keeps from the double faction stacks.
However, again, if the numbers were accurate, this might make sense due to the last few nights. As you I'm sure are aware (per your statement about fighting AD for "3 days straight") AD has been pushed to their gates practically nightly over the last few days. It is highly likely that as there would be very few places for AD to go, that might attribute to the attention (as you say you saw) to those resources.
Now, what I have seen is DC and EP gate AD (during the time you specified), especially the last few days. I have seen DC pop a tent right outside our gates, killing off any AD attempts to retake tri keeps. Obviously things change, but years ago, some players and leads refrained from doing this as it entirely killed morale and caused that faction to just log. It also shows poor sportsmanship and lack of maturity. Which I'm going out on a limb here, hopefully that's not what you want correct?
As far as low pop, if there is anything going on, which again, as some have tried to convince us of, there would be huge communications zone wide to try and coordinate anything like that. It's just not that deep. If anyone is doing it, they've also done it on EP and DC. That could be why many of us on AD were laughing about it over the years when it was handed out to the other factions seemingly under questionable circumstances. Again, I just move on and play.
Now, do people in this game exploit? Sure they do. Yes, feel free to call it out when you see something. But, I have to say, since 2014, I have yet to see or hear of any attempts at manipulating this low pop bonus from AD side. And definitely not to the zone wide scale that is being accused here. That does not mean it never happened. But, I find it difficult to believe that in all the various time slots/days/hours/months/years, I would have not even heard a whispering of it.
If that were the case, and we really had the "30-50" AD to coordinate, all stack a resource, and waste their time to come out to kill you, trust me, you would see AD win campaign after campaign and never be gated to the blatant and gross display that it has been. Watching EP take DC's scroll and yet AD still be gated? That would not happen if what is being accused were the case. I'd love to see 30-50 AD have that many players and that much organization to be able to and have so much time on their hands to take resources and concoct such a diabolical plan lol.
At that point, there would be no question.
At that point, you would not have to scratch your head wondering what was going on.
There is no naming allowed here, but we were pretty much fighting the same 2 guilds Fri-Sun. And yes, I was involved in chasing AD to their gate Friday night and staying there fighting them to keep them from easily following the scroll and re-taking it. It was a huge fight that lasted quite a while actually, but no one was at their other gate until much later when we attempted their other scroll, so no gate camping involved, they had an entire free gate to get out from had they so chosen.
Anyhow, as I stated, for all we know it was some bug caused by some inadvertent action, like clearing debuffs or getting a delve buff. And yup, been happening in game for a long time if someone does searches, but this past weekend, AD had 2x AP going probably a good 50% of the time, even while they were winning the campaign on Friday, so something is up. Had the bonus not dropped off just before the score ticks every time, they would have been thousands of points ahead of everyone, so obviously they were not as lucky as EP, who managed to have the bonus hit them 2 evals in a row and throw them from last to first place with a 700 point jump.
Quite honestly, AD could have easily won the campaign had they not been hitting DC every time and focused on EP instead every so often. But every time we tried to push EP, AD would light up 2-3 of our back keeps, causing us to come back. Yeah its virtual war, and I don't think any of the factions are working together, but us hammering AD was more out of protecting ourselves (and being more than a bit miffed at them having the AP bonus all weekend) than anything else.
I'm sorry you have this perception of AD. I can't speak for the entire faction, and won't try. All I can offer is that per my own personal experiences throughout years of play and observations, having a large enough percentage of one faction to make that much of a difference and organize, communicate, and commit to an exploit, is doubtful and hasn't been one I've ever witnessed. If there is one, it's definitely never worked in AD's favor.
Once again, I am not saying they were exploiting, it could be just some normal action they are in the habit of doing that kicks it in, or even a flat out bug that requires no action at all and just benefits AD most of the time. As for a large enough percentage though, with a pop cap of only around 75 players now, it would take barely over a group getting a buff to invoke the low pop code. If 2 groups go for a buff, that's 25-30% of the whole faction! I have no idea what causes it, some claim its Cheesemongers, some say delves, it could be anything or nothing, but it is happening and was more than incredibly obvious over the past 3 days and ZOS needs to first acknowledge it is happening, then fix it.
And BTW, if it was DC benefiting from it, I would be just as adamant about it getting fixed. Call me whatever, but I like to earn things for myself and I feel cheated when handed stuff I didn't earn... as do many AD players who have complained about this as well in other threads apparently.Edited by Kwoung on February 15, 2022 2:38AM2 -
EdmondDontes✭✭✭✭✭
✭I can confirm EP won the last campaign because about 5 hours before the end of the campaign they got a huge, very obviously unearned low pop bonus. All factions had been pop locked for 5 hours yesterday before the end of the campaign. Anyone who was getting low pop bonus was either exploiting or the lucky beneficiary of a totally broken system.
What I saw yesterday was the first time I thought this might be happening due to an exploit rather than a buggy system, although there are no doubts the low pop system is very buggy.
My question is how could any faction get low pop bonus when all factions had been pop locked for at least the 5 hours prior to the "bonus" being allotted? This was the last day of the campaign and was on a Sunday. All factions were pop locked for about 12 hours yesterday for the last day of the campaign, yet the low pop bonus was still dropping here and there occasionally. An unearned low pop eval for EP is what put them from last to first just a few hours before the campaign ended.
They should at least remove the low pop bonus system until they can figure out what is causing this nonsense.5 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »And BTW, if it was DC benefiting from it, I would be just as adamant about it getting fixed. Call me whatever, but I like to earn things for myself and I feel cheated when handed stuff I didn't earn... as do many AD players who have complained about this as well in other threads apparently.
This is from a closed thread from August 2020. The same accusations made toward the DC faction.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/542509/can-we-talk-about-dc-exploiting-the-low-pop-bonus/p1Edited by maxjapank on February 15, 2022 3:30AM5 -
aetherial_heavenn✭✭✭✭✭
yes please.EdmondDontes wrote: »(snipped)
They should at least remove the low pop bonus system until they can figure out what is causing this nonsense.
Whichever faction benefits from the buggy or exploitable system in any given situation, the bottom line is, it doesn't prevent 'night-capping' : ie eastern hemisphere players playing their peak time taking the map.
It doesn't work to do the job it was made for. It works so peculiarly that accusations of exploiting and tainted campaign wins just adds to toxicity.
Please ZoS, either tell us how it works so rorting it is transparent to all players
or get rid of it so rorting it is not possible. Obviously the latter is preferable. Edited by aetherial_heavenn on February 15, 2022 3:43AMQuoted for truth
"In my experience, the elite ones have not been very toxic, and the toxic ones not very elite." WrathOfInnos0 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »And BTW, if it was DC benefiting from it, I would be just as adamant about it getting fixed. Call me whatever, but I like to earn things for myself and I feel cheated when handed stuff I didn't earn... as do many AD players who have complained about this as well in other threads apparently.
This is from a closed thread from August 2020. The same accusations made toward the DC faction.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/542509/can-we-talk-about-dc-exploiting-the-low-pop-bonus/p1
And what is your point? My main takeaway from that thread was, that ZOS has known about this bug or whatever it is since August 2020 and has done nothing, since they had to read the thread before they locked it. Since I wasn't involved, part of, or benefited from that, I have no comment on it.
BTW, you messed up the quote, I am the one who said that, not TechMaybe.Edited by Kwoung on February 15, 2022 4:57AM0 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »And BTW, if it was DC benefiting from it, I would be just as adamant about it getting fixed. Call me whatever, but I like to earn things for myself and I feel cheated when handed stuff I didn't earn... as do many AD players who have complained about this as well in other threads apparently.
This is from a closed thread from August 2020. The same accusations made toward the DC faction.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/542509/can-we-talk-about-dc-exploiting-the-low-pop-bonus/p1
And what is your point? My main takeaway from that thread was, that ZOS has known about this bug or whatever it is since August 2020 and has done nothing, since they had to read the thread before they locked it. Since I wasn't involved, part of, or benefited from that, I have no comment on it.
BTW, you messed up the quote, I am the one who said that, not TechMaybe.
My point is that everyone's been accusing the others sides of taking advantage of low population. No one actually is. I don't care if I messed up the quote. And you have been plenty accusing of people exploiting. Give it a rest. You've said your peace. The Devs will or will not do something about it if something can be done.8 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Score/rewards are so meaningless, it's gotten to the point where the only time I even look at it is to determine if it is worth my time going for 100k ap and rank 3 for the month on my alts or just doing 25k for rank 1 and moving on to the next alt.1 -
TechMaybeHic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »And BTW, if it was DC benefiting from it, I would be just as adamant about it getting fixed. Call me whatever, but I like to earn things for myself and I feel cheated when handed stuff I didn't earn... as do many AD players who have complained about this as well in other threads apparently.
This is from a closed thread from August 2020. The same accusations made toward the DC faction.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/542509/can-we-talk-about-dc-exploiting-the-low-pop-bonus/p1
Not my quote but I remember 2020. DC at the time was actually the last to pop lock in prime time. Sometimes not lock at all then. It was the norm for DC to log in every day gated at prime with 1-2 bars and no scroll against 2 pop locked factions, up until a bunch of EP decided enough was enough and went DC.
What's going on now is definitely different.Edited by TechMaybeHic on February 15, 2022 11:05AM1 -
Jaimeh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭EdmondDontes wrote: »
They should at least remove the low pop bonus system until they can figure out what is causing this nonsense.
Agreed,and although low pop calculations have been wonky for ever, in this campaign there were systematic, orcherstrated and calculated efforts to abuse it tp boost the score (it has been demonstrated here in the forums how they go about it) , more often from AD, more cleverly by EP, and it's what won them the campaign.0 -
TechMaybeHic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭FWIW; I hear it happened for DC as well overnight and it's still unacceptable. Doesn't matter if it's a bug or not. Needs to be addressed1 -
Kwoung✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »And BTW, if it was DC benefiting from it, I would be just as adamant about it getting fixed. Call me whatever, but I like to earn things for myself and I feel cheated when handed stuff I didn't earn... as do many AD players who have complained about this as well in other threads apparently.
This is from a closed thread from August 2020. The same accusations made toward the DC faction.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/542509/can-we-talk-about-dc-exploiting-the-low-pop-bonus/p1
And what is your point? My main takeaway from that thread was, that ZOS has known about this bug or whatever it is since August 2020 and has done nothing, since they had to read the thread before they locked it. Since I wasn't involved, part of, or benefited from that, I have no comment on it.
BTW, you messed up the quote, I am the one who said that, not TechMaybe.
My point is that everyone's been accusing the others sides of taking advantage of low population. No one actually is. I don't care if I messed up the quote. And you have been plenty accusing of people exploiting. Give it a rest. You've said your peace. The Devs will or will not do something about it if something can be done.
That is so interesting you say that, since the part of my post you chose to not include in my quote literally said: "Once again, I am not saying they were exploiting" but whatever. I will give it a rest when ZOS acknowledges there is an issue and says what they intend to do about it.0 -
xylena_lazarow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭If all 3 factions have mastered Low Pop manipulation, why weren't they all able to do it on the final day? If they were, why did AD's bonuses keep dropping off before the tick, while EP got the lucky one that pushed them into 1st? I have zero doubt that players have tried to manipulate Low Pop, but I still see no conclusive proof any were successful. I was online for the 350 EP tick, we were all shocked and counting our blessings.
And as EP, I won't hesitate to admit that DC got screwed this past campaign. Of course, those complaining conveniently don't mention the one 3mo ago where high pop EP dominated but lost to Low Pop on the final day when DC stole the win. Then there was that one where DC won the reroll lottery and sat on a 10k+ lead for 3 weeks, where was Low Pop that month? There's also supposed to be a Low Score bonus when you fall 6k (?) down, but that never triggered at all.
The system is either not working properly, or sorta was but needs its design updated for ESO in 2022. The Underdog System has been around a while, long enough to where the pop caps back then were likely much higher and the server populations far less volatile. Really hope this is on the radar for ZOS, they owe us an explanation.PC/NA || CP/Cyro || RIP soft caps4 -
Minnesinger✭✭✭✭✭
✭xylena_lazarow wrote: »If all 3 factions have mastered Low Pop manipulation, why weren't they all able to do it on the final day? If they were, why did AD's bonuses keep dropping off before the tick, while EP got the lucky one that pushed them into 1st? I have zero doubt that players have tried to manipulate Low Pop, but I still see no conclusive proof any were successful. I was online for the 350 EP tick, we were all shocked and counting our blessings.
And as EP, I won't hesitate to admit that DC got screwed this past campaign. Of course, those complaining conveniently don't mention the one 3mo ago where high pop EP dominated but lost to Low Pop on the final day when DC stole the win. Then there was that one where DC won the reroll lottery and sat on a 10k+ lead for 3 weeks, where was Low Pop that month? There's also supposed to be a Low Score bonus when you fall 6k (?) down, but that never triggered at all.
The system is either not working properly, or sorta was but needs its design updated for ESO in 2022. The Underdog System has been around a while, long enough to where the pop caps back then were likely much higher and the server populations far less volatile. Really hope this is on the radar for ZOS, they owe us an explanation.
One might think it was karma that decided the fate
The wind is cold where I live,
The blizzard is my home,
Snow and ice and loaded dice, the Wizard lives alone.0 -
Delphinia✭✭✭✭✭I never really cared enough to scrutinize this, or give it much more than a glance. But after coming back to the game and poking my head into the forums after a long absence, and seeing the amount of confusion and frustration (including some accusations), I happened to look and decided to screenshot the score today around 5am est. I was watching the very last few seconds count down right up until the 00s.
I wanted to check and see if the points (including low pop) that had been displayed all the way up to and including the very moment at 00s would be the actual points recorded. I checked in a little later around 5:30am est and noted they had not been, per what the final tally seemed to record.
Now, as I mentioned, I never really gave it too much scrutiny, as I didn’t give it that much time or effort to care. I just more or less trusted that their system displayed points accurately. I’ve always known the population tally was not quite accurate of course.
For whatever it’s worth, it appears DC actually had more points added, while EP and AD both received less.
And (this part might make a few on here happy to know), the the low pop bonus AD had been reported with up to the very last moment 00s, was in fact, not added at all.
It’s quite possible there are other "behind the scene" calculations. As was pointed out in another post, there should probably be more transparency. So, there’s obvious confusion. But, on the surface, the numbers that are being displayed, quite literally don’t add up.
5 -
EdmondDontes✭✭✭✭✭
✭The low pop bonus is still dropping after all factions have been pop locked for over 10 hours during the MYM event.
The system is totally Borked. Admit it and remove the system please ZOS. Don't try to fix it, just remove it for now and at some point maybe try to implement a better system.2 -
Feaky✭✭✭I've been in GH for the past 7 hours. The low pop bonus is going crazy. Someone has it every 15 min. EP had it once today, DC probably 3 times and AD 20+ despite all factions being pop locked with queues.
Disable this feature please. Campaign scoring is a joke. Right now the leader is the alliance that has the low pop bonus when campaign scoring ticks. Its totally broken.4 -
EdmondDontes✭✭✭✭✭
✭Low pop bonus is totally Borked.
Leaving a scoring handicap system in place that is so obviously broken when ZOS so obviously is aware it's broken and could so easily fix or remove the system is revealing in the extreme.
It makes it seem like ZOS is trying to make cyrodiil as toxic and unenjoyable as possible. When you look at the actions taken and not take in total, it really does look like ZOS is trying to make cyrodiil a horrible experience for some reason.1 -
Yasha✭✭✭✭EdmondDontes wrote: »Low pop bonus is totally Borked.
Leaving a scoring handicap system in place that is so obviously broken when ZOS so obviously is aware it's broken and could so easily fix or remove the system is revealing in the extreme.
It makes it seem like ZOS is trying to make cyrodiil as toxic and unenjoyable as possible. When you look at the actions taken and not take in total, it really does look like ZOS is trying to make cyrodiil a horrible experience for some reason.
Well, we have all seen the video showing what the devs really think of pvp in this game so that shouldn't be surprising.1