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Stale new Meta
karekiz
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How is everyone liking everyone regardless of setup running the exact same Bah/Kinra now? Seems like Diversity in classes and specs are Dead now
Edited by karekiz on November 3, 2021 2:39PM 9
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N3CR01✭✭✭✭I'm not using anything meta right now.
My only DD toon thats fully setup is my MagDK running BSW-Silks-2x Skoria Monster.
Leveled a StamBlade and MagPlar during Witches event but they still naked as I duno what to do with them yet lol.3 -
hcbigdogdoghc✭✭✭✭✭Nope, I am running:
Rele/Deadly
BSW/Elf's Bane
Rele/Grisly
EC/FB
MS/WM
Post is about meta not meme sets.
Kinras bahsei is objectively the current best setup for all classes and specs, using anything else means gimping yourself. So much for diversity.Edited by hcbigdogdoghc on November 3, 2021 2:53PM24 -
Vevvev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
I wouldn't call the BSW/Elf Bane a meme set combo as it works great on a magDK flame spec. Also means getting more use out of Burning Talons which combined with the new buffs to Flame Lash is pretty nice.Edited by Vevvev on November 3, 2021 2:58PMPC NA - Ceyanna Ashton - Breton Vampire MagDK9 -
hcbigdogdoghc✭✭✭✭✭hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
I wouldn't call the BSW/Elf Bane a meme set combo as it works great on a magDK flame spec. Also means getting more use out of Burning Talons which combined with the new buffs to Flame Lash is pretty nice.
Elf bane is a meh set at best all around
It's 2021 not 2019.....Edited by hcbigdogdoghc on November 3, 2021 3:02PM8 -
Gaebriel0410✭✭✭✭✭hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
Alas, 'meme' doesn't mean 'something I dislike'.
Playing meta already throws diversity out of the window, as having a single best mathematical (theoretical) setup is already objectively, unequivocally what meta is. It's a sacrifice you choose to make to achieve the holy CHIM of dps bragging rights.
You're gimping your own enjoyment by adhering to what others calculate and dictate.
See what I did there?
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Vevvev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
I wouldn't call the BSW/Elf Bane a meme set combo as it works great on a magDK flame spec. Also means getting more use out of Burning Talons which combined with the new buffs to Flame Lash is pretty nice.
Elf bane is a meh set at best all around
It's 2021 not 2019.....
And DK got buffed so what is meh before might not be meh now. Keep in mind the DK flame damage passive effects all flame damage abilities instead of just flame area of effect attacks. The class hits harder and has better sustain than it used to.PC NA - Ceyanna Ashton - Breton Vampire MagDK8 -
hcbigdogdoghc✭✭✭✭✭Gaebriel0410 wrote: »hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
Alas, 'meme' doesn't mean 'something I dislike'.
Playing meta already throws diversity out of the window, as having a single best mathematical (theoretical) setup is already objectively, unequivocally what meta is. It's a sacrifice you choose to make to achieve the holy CHIM of dps bragging rights.
You're gimping your own enjoyment by adhering to what others calculate and dictate.
See what I did there?
Seem pretty selfish holding back the entire group, making things harder for everyone for merely "personal enjoyment"
Imagine if tank use leeching plate and sweet roll set because fun.Edited by hcbigdogdoghc on November 3, 2021 3:08PM3 -
Katlefiya✭✭✭✭✭hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »Gaebriel0410 wrote: »hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
Alas, 'meme' doesn't mean 'something I dislike'.
Playing meta already throws diversity out of the window, as having a single best mathematical (theoretical) setup is already objectively, unequivocally what meta is. It's a sacrifice you choose to make to achieve the holy CHIM of dps bragging rights.
You're gimping your own enjoyment by adhering to what others calculate and dictate.
See what I did there?
Seem pretty selfish holding back the entire group, making things harder for everyone for merely "personal enjoyment"
Imagine if tank use leeching plate and sweet roll set because fun.
Aren't games for "personal enjoyment"?42 -
Franchise408✭✭✭✭✭
✭How is everyone liking everyone regardless of setup running the exact same Bah/Kinra now? Seems like Diversity in classes and specs are Dead now
Dead, now? There's never been diversity in classes. The classes are designed in a way to all play the same within whatever role is selected. The class you pick is just a flavor. The actual class is your role. And all tanks, stam DPS, mag DPS, and healers play identical to the rest.
Also, everyone running Bah / Kinra now is no different than previous metas where everyone was running Mother's Sorrow / False God's, or more recently, Medusa.
Meta kills build diversity even further.
That's why I don't play meta. ALL meta is stale. Not just this one. Meta is stale by definition. That's why I will never play meta.26 -
Franchise408✭✭✭✭✭
✭hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »Gaebriel0410 wrote: »hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
Alas, 'meme' doesn't mean 'something I dislike'.
Playing meta already throws diversity out of the window, as having a single best mathematical (theoretical) setup is already objectively, unequivocally what meta is. It's a sacrifice you choose to make to achieve the holy CHIM of dps bragging rights.
You're gimping your own enjoyment by adhering to what others calculate and dictate.
See what I did there?
Seem pretty selfish holding back the entire group, making things harder for everyone for merely "personal enjoyment"
Imagine if tank use leeching plate and sweet roll set because fun.
Absolutely nothing wrong with that. Meta is not needed to clear any content in this game, including vet DLC trials.20 -
AuraStorm43✭✭✭✭✭They are the “best” but other options aren’t far off, you have a huge variety of options you’re just haggling over a small couple % points8
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Ippokrates✭✭✭✭✭hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »Gaebriel0410 wrote: »hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
Alas, 'meme' doesn't mean 'something I dislike'.
Playing meta already throws diversity out of the window, as having a single best mathematical (theoretical) setup is already objectively, unequivocally what meta is. It's a sacrifice you choose to make to achieve the holy CHIM of dps bragging rights.
You're gimping your own enjoyment by adhering to what others calculate and dictate.
See what I did there?
Seem pretty selfish holding back the entire group, making things harder for everyone for merely "personal enjoyment"
Imagine if tank use leeching plate and sweet roll set because fun.
[snip]
This comparison is pointless. The task of tank is to provide taunt, CC & debuff - there is no point in running in medium gourmet. This is a set for support role & yeah, i was running with it on my stamhealer - worked quite well in 4-man content.
Unless you are in leaderbord group, nobody is forcing you to wear meta. The only requirement is your capability to perform selected role. As a Tank, DD or Healer/Support.
PUGS doesn't really care about your equipment, and on vet you need to have achievement or skin. In most guilds the only requirement from DdD is sufficient dps: somewhere around 70-80-90k. But you can achieve these results in many ways, not necessary meta but it would be hard for someone wearing AshenGrip ^^
[edited for Baiting]Edited by ZOS_Lunar on November 3, 2021 3:35PM8 -
Kiralyn2000✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »Gaebriel0410 wrote: »hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
Alas, 'meme' doesn't mean 'something I dislike'.
Playing meta already throws diversity out of the window, as having a single best mathematical (theoretical) setup is already objectively, unequivocally what meta is. It's a sacrifice you choose to make to achieve the holy CHIM of dps bragging rights.
You're gimping your own enjoyment by adhering to what others calculate and dictate.
See what I did there?
Seem pretty selfish holding back the entire group, making things harder for everyone for merely "personal enjoyment"
Unless you're doing absolute top-end leaderboard chasing, there's plenty of things that will not "hold back the group" without being The Only Best.
(i.e, if the content needs 50k dps, and meta gives you 100k... well, there's really no need for meta, is there? And 80k builds are still vastly more than needed.)10 -
IronWooshu✭✭✭✭✭
✭How is everyone liking everyone regardless of setup running the exact same Bah/Kinra now? Seems like Diversity in classes and specs are Dead now
Seems like a problem only the 1% have with leaderboard chasing, my guild you can run whatever you like as long as its functional.Edited by IronWooshu on November 3, 2021 3:36PM14 -
RogueShark✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm in DV, rele and vate daggers on an Imperial stamsorc and I'm hitting over 105k. You really don't have to metachase to do decent DPS. If you're topscore leaderboard chasing then there was always a meta anyway.PC NA
Will heal DPS for memes.6 -
Franchise408✭✭✭✭✭
✭IronWooshu wrote: »
Same here. I'm the trial leader for my vet trial group, and tbh, I couldn't even tell you what sets any of my group wear or what parses they have. We just go in and have fun, learn the mechanics, and work on getting better til we get our clears.11 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
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More relevant pretty sure other sets probably work better in dungeons there you don't have an trial healer so less buffs.Kiralyn2000 wrote: »hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »Gaebriel0410 wrote: »hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
Alas, 'meme' doesn't mean 'something I dislike'.
Playing meta already throws diversity out of the window, as having a single best mathematical (theoretical) setup is already objectively, unequivocally what meta is. It's a sacrifice you choose to make to achieve the holy CHIM of dps bragging rights.
You're gimping your own enjoyment by adhering to what others calculate and dictate.
See what I did there?
Seem pretty selfish holding back the entire group, making things harder for everyone for merely "personal enjoyment"
Unless you're doing absolute top-end leaderboard chasing, there's plenty of things that will not "hold back the group" without being The Only Best.
(i.e, if the content needs 50k dps, and meta gives you 100k... well, there's really no need for meta, is there? And 80k builds are still vastly more than needed.)
Also sets who require very thigh rotations might not work well in dungeons for average players.Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.3 -
NerfSeige✭✭✭✭Damage still high on some classes, lololololAvid reader of wes’-pts-diary[RIP]
NerfAS and Shill ruins everything
Skinny-meta-fake, graded D, and can’t explain the law of diminishing marginal returns.
I won’t post that Wes, I’ll get [snipped] for the last time
Revert this patch - Audens, 20221 -
Grandchamp1989✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭There have literally never been as many viable options as we have now.
PvE is in a much healthier state than before IMO.
PvP I would still prefer proc crit to be disabled through battlespirit.4 -
etchedpixels✭✭✭✭✭
✭If you don't want everyone running Bahsai (and yes it's totally broken the way it works with stamina toons and that needs an urgent nerrf) then wear worms. If we all wear worms the bashai wearers will be out of luck 8)
Too many toons not enough time3 -
Vevvev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭More relevant pretty sure other sets probably work better in dungeons there you don't have an trial healer so less buffs.
Also sets who require very thigh rotations might not work well in dungeons for average players.
Ah, so that's why there are so many people wearing the Dark Passions Regalia despite it having that horrible flap. It's for the the thighs.
Sorry, I couldn't resist!PC NA - Ceyanna Ashton - Breton Vampire MagDK10 -
Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo✭✭✭✭✭
✭hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
Gimping ourselves?
Hmm...interesting.
I think any of those setups linked above can work well, no problem. You don't have to have the latest setup to enjoy raiding, but of course many groups will only abide by it because they read it up somewhere else and won't try to find work arounds.
Most of the time a group is one person saying: 'This group wore this and passed it!' (Been there, done that in high end raiding).
It may be the BIS for the next meta, but it would be interesting for someone to post here the differences between this proposed build (Bashei/Kinras/Kilt) and closest equivalents in terms of damage output and % difference/overall damage.
The downside to Bashei/Kinras/Kilt that no one mentioned here:
- Removes the need for combat prayer from healers (mechanic they need to know and abide by for hot management)
- You have to go farm the Kilt
(Buy Blackwood)
- Bashei requires mana dumping before the boss/engagement (What a prebuff!) (Buy Blackwood)
- Kinras on 8 dd's will make your eyes bleed (Behind flames of Ambition DLC)
So some funnies in there, but also a pinch of truth!4 -
etchedpixels✭✭✭✭✭
✭hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »Seem pretty selfish holding back the entire group, making things harder for everyone for merely "personal enjoyment"
Imagine if tank use leeching plate and sweet roll set because fun.
I frequently tank normal non DLC dungeons in underpants. It's a lot more fun. You just have to know how to actually use your skills, shields and blocking. I did have to put my legs/chest pieces on for the cauldron though 8)
For dungeons I also often wear some light on a tank. It avoids the broken changes to the heavy armour in CP 2.0 and it allows you to stack significant magicka for shield spamming, group buffs and even damage given the healer will probably be a fake and the dps on a pug run is very hit and miss, usually miss.
Selfish sets are also often a big win in four man groups. My warden has 5K health regen and permanent damage shield. That means the healer (on the odd occasion it's not a fake) doesn't have to worry about me at all and I can run with a higher magicka and stamina improving both sustain and ability to buff and heal the group with the warden skills.
Trials are a different kettle of fish, the fights are longer, and very very few skilll buffs scale the way the sets do.
Too many toons not enough time0 -
kojou✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭So we went from one setup to another... There has pretty much always just one best DPS setup + other setups to apply group buffs.
This is nothing new.
Playing since beta...7 -
Fhritz✭✭✭✭✭On stamblade i'm using a setup from a good streamer :
2x Kjalnar's Nightmare (or stormfis but lower dps)
5x Relequen (4 body + 1 jewelry)
1x Kilt
2x any crit line (AY for example) Jewelry
BRP Dagger frontbar (nirn and charged with poison + Flame enchant)
vMA greatsword backbar (infused with WD enchant)
It works pretty well, since proc can crit now monster set are FAR MORE viable. I'm doing almost the same DPS than before (~80/90k) with this setup
I'm a single character man.
Stamblade. Khajiit. Mostly pvp.
And...that's it.1 -
carlos424✭✭✭✭✭hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
There is always going to be a setup that is slightly better than others. It doesn’t mean that other options are bad though. I would argue that there are actually more viable setups, now that some traditional stam setups can be used by magicka characters.2 -
Dragonlord573✭✭✭✭✭hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »
I wouldn't call the BSW/Elf Bane a meme set combo as it works great on a magDK flame spec. Also means getting more use out of Burning Talons which combined with the new buffs to Flame Lash is pretty nice.
Elf bane is a meh set at best all around
It's 2021 not 2019.....
If my dots take longer to run out it I don't have to reapply them as much. Which means I get better sustain. It's only meh is you don't take in every possibility the set offers.Edited by Dragonlord573 on November 3, 2021 5:42PM3 -
SidraWillowsky✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Facefister wrote: »
I'd say that a very small percentage of players actually wanted hybrid to be a thing. Most of us never asked for this.So we went from one setup to another... There has pretty much always just one best DPS setup + other setups to apply group buffs.
This is nothing new.
The difference between then and now is that every single DD has the same meta, be it stam or mag. At least in days gone by we had TWO meta options (one for stam DPS, the other for mag DPS).
Bahsei's is a miserable mini game, and the Kinras' visual makes it extremely difficult to see any other enemy attacks. Thus far, I've only ever had one or two people using Kinras' in a raid group, and even that was absolutely obnoxious. Eight sounds like an absolute nightmare.4
