I don't know whether I've ever seen a single set as mechanically toxic as Dark Convergence

taugrim

moosegod wrote: »

I came to the forum to start a thread like this one..

Cheers!

moosegod wrote: »

On some maps the ring is unavoidable unless you want to jump in lava or off the map entirely. Does ZOS consider this level of disruption to be fun? I remember sorc's cage that was once an unavoidable stun, I remember being pulled/stunned just for dealing damage to a player. All of these were later changed IIRC.

To make matters worse, players drop their AOE in lava, so you end up not just getting pulled into the lava with DC, then stunned & snared, you also take massive fire ticks from the lava, and if by some miracle you last several seconds you then get blown up by the DC AOE.

taugrim

MEBengalsFan2001 wrote: »

taugrim wrote: »

For perspective, I make that statement in the subject line after 15 years of playing MMORPGs and PVP in particular. And it's a long list of games.

Anyone who has played more than a handful of BGs the past several weeks can attest to what a bad experience it is playing with DCs procs going off regularly throughout a BG.

The problem with DC is it's faceroll easy to be effective with it, because it creates a 3-4 second window where
1. the affected players get pulled, which is disruptive in itself. Plus they get stunned and snared
2. the affected players have to stop whatever they're doing to get out of it, due to the proc's damage and other incoming enemy damage
3. the allies of the caster can free DPS on the affected targets or have a significant window to recover

Abilities or procs that AOE pull multiple targets are powerful in and of themselves. But to throw on any meaningful damage on top of that is simply unneeded. Back in WAR, the Magus / Engineer mirror class had an AOE pull. But it did no meaningful damage in itself, because that wasn't needed.

I just logged off after 2 consecutive BGs where a premade (from my guild) was using DC and wiping opposing teams, despite facing PUGs they would have easily beat. I was solo queued, and I watched multiple players in both games leave the BGs. I don't blame them. I don't blame my guild, either, since they don't control the game content. There is only 1 entity that is capable of fixing the problem, but it's taking way too long IMO.

I struggle to understand why it has not been patched yet. This is such a bad time to have such a frustrating PVP experience, especially when players are wondering whether the grass is greener in the other new game that has a combat style that is most similar to ESO, relative to other MMORPGs. I have been a diehard loyalist and advocate of ESO (and up until this morning was not meaningfully considering trying out the other option), but even I have my limits.

P.S. I absolutely love ESO's combat and build system. I just despise mechanically toxic sets. And it's immensely frustrating to watch this persist for 6 weeks.

IMO, it's not the set that is the issue it is how CC immunity is applied and how some CC effects simply don't get avoided when a player has CC immunity.

I've been doubled stunned, than knocked down followed up by another stun all within 6 seconds. All hard effects that apparently don't follow the CC immunity rules. Add to this any pulls, snares, etc... Welcome to PVP... by the time I finished trying to break free, I died from being out of stamina.

Please stay on topic.

If you think a/the problem is CC immunity not working, start your own thread on that topic.

P.S. CC immunity works from the hundreds of hours I've spent in BGs in terms of hard CC (stun, KD, etc). I've reviewed recordings of dozens of my BGs, as I record them to review post-facto to learn from.

Giraffon

I despise this set. It should never have been put in the game. I absolutely will judge you for using it.

Jameson18

Giraffon wrote: »

I despise this set. It should never have been put in the game. I absolutely will judge you for using it.

This.

DracoSaggitaExSole

I have an idea...

Have separate battle ground, cyrodill campaign, perhaps even a separate megaserver for those players who want to play with the broken, badly designed, over powered set which set basicaly play the game for them, like DC. And one for players who want to win games based on their own merits, skill execution, timing, positioning, and stratigical distribution of stats.

I love the no proc cyro, it gives me the feeling that i play the game, and not the set that i wear.

MEBengalsFan2001

taugrim wrote: »

MEBengalsFan2001 wrote: »

taugrim wrote: »

For perspective, I make that statement in the subject line after 15 years of playing MMORPGs and PVP in particular. And it's a long list of games.

Anyone who has played more than a handful of BGs the past several weeks can attest to what a bad experience it is playing with DCs procs going off regularly throughout a BG.

The problem with DC is it's faceroll easy to be effective with it, because it creates a 3-4 second window where
1. the affected players get pulled, which is disruptive in itself. Plus they get stunned and snared
2. the affected players have to stop whatever they're doing to get out of it, due to the proc's damage and other incoming enemy damage
3. the allies of the caster can free DPS on the affected targets or have a significant window to recover

Abilities or procs that AOE pull multiple targets are powerful in and of themselves. But to throw on any meaningful damage on top of that is simply unneeded. Back in WAR, the Magus / Engineer mirror class had an AOE pull. But it did no meaningful damage in itself, because that wasn't needed.

I just logged off after 2 consecutive BGs where a premade (from my guild) was using DC and wiping opposing teams, despite facing PUGs they would have easily beat. I was solo queued, and I watched multiple players in both games leave the BGs. I don't blame them. I don't blame my guild, either, since they don't control the game content. There is only 1 entity that is capable of fixing the problem, but it's taking way too long IMO.

I struggle to understand why it has not been patched yet. This is such a bad time to have such a frustrating PVP experience, especially when players are wondering whether the grass is greener in the other new game that has a combat style that is most similar to ESO, relative to other MMORPGs. I have been a diehard loyalist and advocate of ESO (and up until this morning was not meaningfully considering trying out the other option), but even I have my limits.

P.S. I absolutely love ESO's combat and build system. I just despise mechanically toxic sets. And it's immensely frustrating to watch this persist for 6 weeks.

IMO, it's not the set that is the issue it is how CC immunity is applied and how some CC effects simply don't get avoided when a player has CC immunity.

I've been doubled stunned, than knocked down followed up by another stun all within 6 seconds. All hard effects that apparently don't follow the CC immunity rules. Add to this any pulls, snares, etc... Welcome to PVP... by the time I finished trying to break free, I died from being out of stamina.

Please stay on topic.

If you think a/the problem is CC immunity not working, start your own thread on that topic.

P.S. CC immunity works from the hundreds of hours I've spent in BGs in terms of hard CC (stun, KD, etc). I've reviewed recordings of dozens of my BGs, as I record them to review post-facto to learn from.

I already did started my own thread.

I don't think DC damage is the problem. I've been killed by other things way more than DC in PVP, in fact I die about once maybe twice a week from DC and I rarely go into PVE content now.

As someone that see DC used regularly, my issue isn't the damage its the fact it pulls, it stuns and it immobilizes. That's an issue with CC effects and CC immunity IMO.

DrSlaughtr

I got solo necro DC bombed 3 times today. Solo. Doesn't seem to be doing what it's supposedly built for when a handful of necros spam graveyards all around one person. Personally I don't care about dying but I do care about the fact no one in development could foresee that Dark Convergence would be used for the exact opposite purpose of what they claimed to want, especially when there was plenty of PTS feedback warning them.

MEBengalsFan2001

TheEndBringer wrote: »

I got solo necro DC bombed 3 times today. Solo. Doesn't seem to be doing what it's supposedly built for when a handful of necros spam graveyards all around one person. Personally I don't care about dying but I do care about the fact no one in development could foresee that Dark Convergence would be used for the exact opposite purpose of what they claimed to want, especially when there was plenty of PTS feedback warning them.

As other have said sets won't fix the issue of ball or zerg groups steam rolling areas.

I would make buffs and heals only be applied to the group and limit group size to four players; like a dungeon. This may improve not only PVP experience but also the system performance.

DrSlaughtr

I'd rather deal with a ball group than a rule that further punishes people for wanting to play with friends.

Jokesonyou

This set is absolutely busted.. it's nearly impossible to play a mag character in pvp anymore because they just don't have the stamina needed to constantly break free, block, and roll dodge out. It's not being used as intended because the ball groups and zergs are using it too, and they stack. My death recap has had DC damage from 4 different people before.

My eso play has gone from 75% pvp to about 10% pvp since dark convergence came out.. pvp just isn't fun right now

Jameson18

Its easy. I've figured out the counter.

Just play immortal tank characters.

I now have 4.

I don't do anything but heal and block and cc people. But hey, I can literally AFK during BG's and Cyro battles.

The other day, I legit mist formed on an IC node and watched from the window as I had a smoke out on the porch.

Took the node, watched the 3 people beating on me give up and leave.

Enjoy.

MashmalloMan

Gilvoth wrote: »

this thread has a toxic taste that is unfair and just plain not the truth of how the majority of eso pvp players feel.
reading the comments and the thread title gives the impression that anyone using the set needs to be ashamed and feel bad, but that is just not the truth seen in pvp and pvp zone chat as well as the guilds im a member of.
theres nothing wrong with using this set in both pvp and pve.
the set was made because we asked for help to stop zergs and hoards of people blobbing together, the set works good and doing its job.
the set was made to stop zergs and huge groups that are cause massive lagg, high ping, and destroying the pvp in cryodiil.
the set needs buffed, not nerfed.
it needs to stay.

Absolute Best design ever made, Especially for an mmo that has horrible ball zerg groups like eso.
its perfect for fighting the zergs here in eso.

the dark convergence set needs to be buffed in damage as well as Grab ability to zergs to be stronger as we can see that many zergs are escaping it. they simply run through its grab somehow and that needs to be buffed to make sure it keeps working as was intended and spoken about it the patch notes.

is it possible that the only people angry about this set are the ones in zergs and large groups that it is intended for?
i dont know, but i can assure you that it does what we asked for when it works as it should.


and again my comments and feedback here is only just that, my feedback, not intended to anger anyone.

Wow.. Sheesh, OP is speaking to the state of BG's mainly, they're not a part of a zerg... It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see what has become of BG's and the pvp community as a whole in there. Constant complaints about the set, quitters, discord and forum threads, as well as actual nerfs from ZOS on the PTS and comments about the set show you're in the minority here.

wazzz56

@MashmalloMan yeah I don't see any other calls for buffing the worst thing ever introduced to pvp

Minalan

It’s bad enough when you cannot move at all, or move slowly. But at least you are in control of our own character.

There is nothing more mechanically toxic than being moved against your will. When the dev team stupidly remove control over your own character, you aren’t actually playing a game at all. Other people are playing it for you. The current design team forgot many of these lessons learned, to the detriment of their dying game.

MashmalloMan

Minalan wrote: »

It’s bad enough when you cannot move at all, or move slowly. But at least you are in control of our own character.

There is nothing more mechanically toxic than being moved against your will. When the dev team stupidly remove control over your own character, you aren’t actually playing a game at all. Other people are playing it for you. The current design team forgot many of these lessons learned, to the detriment of their dying game.

Not only that, DC and Rushing Agony completely avoid the ruleset they created for the core of the combat in ESO.

Pulls should automatically apply CC immunity to prevent being ping ponged as well as the fact that the pull itself should count as using up a stun since it repositions your target, but instead, these sets allow you to pull someone AND stun them.

7 years into the life cycle of the game, yet we now have 2 sets in the same patch that completely ignore this mechanic. If you're not stunned after the pull, you can be pulled again.. and again... and again... and again.. Imagine what that feels like when 20 people are using these sets at the same time..

AdamLAD

Why does one set do more damage than abilities, and is an aoe ,snares, stuns, and pulls. It plays the game for you. It needs to not have a pull. The pull is the most toxic thing in the game to ever exist. It should of never got passed the drawing board. Do they play there own game. Its not fun. Mid dodge roll and you get pulled in is an absolute joke

finehair

Gilvoth wrote: »

wazzz56 wrote: »

Gilvoth wrote: »

this thread has a toxic taste that is unfair and just plain not the truth of how the majority of eso pvp players feel.
reading the comments and the thread title gives the impression that anyone using the set needs to be ashamed and feel bad, but that is just not the truth seen in pvp and pvp zone chat as well as the guilds im a member of.
theres nothing wrong with using this set in both pvp and pve.
the set was made because we asked for help to stop zergs and hoards of people blobbing together, the set works good and doing its job.
the set was made to stop zergs and huge groups that are cause massive lagg, high ping, and destroying the pvp in cryodiil.
the set needs buffed, not nerfed.
it needs to stay.

Absolute Best design ever made, Especially for an mmo that has horrible ball zerg groups like eso.
its perfect for fighting the zergs here in eso.

the dark convergence set needs to be buffed in damage as well as Grab ability to zergs to be stronger as we can see that many zergs are escaping it. they simply run through its grab somehow and that needs to be buffed to make sure it keeps working as was intended and spoken about it the patch notes.

is it possible that the only people angry about this set are the ones in zergs and large groups that it is intended for?
i dont know, but i can assure you that it does what we asked for when it works as it should.


and again my comments and feedback here is only just that, my feedback, not intended to anger anyone.

Is this a satirical comment? There has been a lot of horrible ideas released in eso, and this is the worse ever set forth onto live servers...the set is a crutch, a one button carry that though it may be effective against zergs, it is also employed by zergs to chase and group down solo and small groups with the simplicity of one click each.....want to make fighting faction stacks and ball groups easier? bring back no out of group healing and limit group sizes even further.....or just keep on introducing sets that are game breakers and cause an already dwindling population of pvpers to leave the game.....I will end by saying it is ok if you want to use the set, it is your game play as you will.....but to ignore the reality of what that set is and to actually call for it to be buffed is pretty wild.....

its not satire, its not a sarcasm, its not funny, infact it is very embarrassing that new people come to eso and find massive groups destroying the pvp and game.
we asked for help in stopping the zergs, we got help with this set "dark convergence"
However, they leaders of these groups has found a way around the set and the set is no longer stoping them, they just run right through it and are not being effected by the set now.

the. set. needs. its radius increased and the damage increased to help stop the zergs. thats not a joke, its not satire.
its just plain honest truth and honest feedback.

So let me ask a question. Government decides to give everyone a semi auto rifle. And says tonight's the purge night with said semi autos.
Who would benefit more? Bunch of civilians who don't know each other so can't co operate? Or the government and it's army who is already planned how to effectively use these weapons as a group on bunch of randoms?

Also your argument is; semi autos are not doing its job correctly, we need full autos and grenades.

ZAMOLXIS

i play this game from beggining, but with this set just cant. For now, Ill leave BG-unplayable, (loved BG). Next week if once I see this set in action, quit the game...there's many others and good ones. It becamed UNPLAYABLE. Gl Guyz!

Danse_Mayhem

This set is ridiculous.
Very good points about the ball groups using basically anything like this more effectively to decimate small group / solo play.
I’ve no idea how anyone can think this set is remotely balanced (even with the nerf coming) or god forbid think it needs a buff.

PvP completely revolves around this set now - A no brainer proc that outperforms most ultimates and can be spammed without aiming every 15 seconds.

Some time ago, there was a patch that basically stopped DKs leaping up to keep walls + being able to chain enemies off, and warden bungle skill to not target at different levels etc so that keep siege was protected.
Dark convergence can snatch a whole team of defenders off a wall - Away from their earned lancers and into what will very likely be more dark convergence.

How will that be fixed? Stop letting players cast AOE’s on different elevations? That would suck. But also since the set procs at the centre of the AOE it’s likely going to be a lasting problem.

ZOS just delete it. Listen to your player base (The ones who have actually thought this through) and just remove it or completely rework it before you lose more people.

GrahamJoyce

HowellQagan wrote: »

I'm waiting for the next feature update when they nerf it, ain't gonna PvP until then.

Agreed - I still pve often but I quit PvP entirely because of this set.
At first I was just frustrated by the lag and poor server connection but this set being added was the final straw for me.
I refuse to even attempt pvp again until this set is either nerfed (more so than it has been with the new patch), or removed from the game. It's way too overpowered.

Mayrael

Vevvev wrote: »

Gilvoth wrote: »

wazzz56 wrote: »

Gilvoth wrote: »

this thread has a toxic taste that is unfair and just plain not the truth of how the majority of eso pvp players feel.
reading the comments and the thread title gives the impression that anyone using the set needs to be ashamed and feel bad, but that is just not the truth seen in pvp and pvp zone chat as well as the guilds im a member of.
theres nothing wrong with using this set in both pvp and pve.
the set was made because we asked for help to stop zergs and hoards of people blobbing together, the set works good and doing its job.
the set was made to stop zergs and huge groups that are cause massive lagg, high ping, and destroying the pvp in cryodiil.
the set needs buffed, not nerfed.
it needs to stay.

Absolute Best design ever made, Especially for an mmo that has horrible ball zerg groups like eso.
its perfect for fighting the zergs here in eso.

the dark convergence set needs to be buffed in damage as well as Grab ability to zergs to be stronger as we can see that many zergs are escaping it. they simply run through its grab somehow and that needs to be buffed to make sure it keeps working as was intended and spoken about it the patch notes.

is it possible that the only people angry about this set are the ones in zergs and large groups that it is intended for?
i dont know, but i can assure you that it does what we asked for when it works as it should.


and again my comments and feedback here is only just that, my feedback, not intended to anger anyone.

Is this a satirical comment? There has been a lot of horrible ideas released in eso, and this is the worse ever set forth onto live servers...the set is a crutch, a one button carry that though it may be effective against zergs, it is also employed by zergs to chase and group down solo and small groups with the simplicity of one click each.....want to make fighting faction stacks and ball groups easier? bring back no out of group healing and limit group sizes even further.....or just keep on introducing sets that are game breakers and cause an already dwindling population of pvpers to leave the game.....I will end by saying it is ok if you want to use the set, it is your game play as you will.....but to ignore the reality of what that set is and to actually call for it to be buffed is pretty wild.....

its not satire, its not a sarcasm, its not funny, infact it is very embarrassing that new people come to eso and find massive groups destroying the pvp and game.
we asked for help in stopping the zergs, we got help with this set "dark convergence"
However, they leaders of these groups has found a way around the set and the set is no longer stoping them, they just run right through it and are not being effected by the set now.

the. set. needs. its radius increased and the damage increased to help stop the zergs. thats not a joke, its not satire.
its just plain honest truth and honest feedback.

I'm sorry but whatever you're given, whatever things are buffed, a ball group will be able to use 12 times more effectively due to numbers. And the day it is no longer profitable to group up for whatever reason the ball groups won't give a [snip]. They'll just continue coordinating in voice chat and stay together like they always do. Numbers and coordination mean everything in this game, and sets like Dark Convergence have only made the situation worse for the people the devs designed the set for.

Take away their purge spam and cross heals and watch the Rome falls.

neferpitou73

Mayrael wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

Gilvoth wrote: »

wazzz56 wrote: »

Gilvoth wrote: »

this thread has a toxic taste that is unfair and just plain not the truth of how the majority of eso pvp players feel.
reading the comments and the thread title gives the impression that anyone using the set needs to be ashamed and feel bad, but that is just not the truth seen in pvp and pvp zone chat as well as the guilds im a member of.
theres nothing wrong with using this set in both pvp and pve.
the set was made because we asked for help to stop zergs and hoards of people blobbing together, the set works good and doing its job.
the set was made to stop zergs and huge groups that are cause massive lagg, high ping, and destroying the pvp in cryodiil.
the set needs buffed, not nerfed.
it needs to stay.

Absolute Best design ever made, Especially for an mmo that has horrible ball zerg groups like eso.
its perfect for fighting the zergs here in eso.

the dark convergence set needs to be buffed in damage as well as Grab ability to zergs to be stronger as we can see that many zergs are escaping it. they simply run through its grab somehow and that needs to be buffed to make sure it keeps working as was intended and spoken about it the patch notes.

is it possible that the only people angry about this set are the ones in zergs and large groups that it is intended for?
i dont know, but i can assure you that it does what we asked for when it works as it should.


and again my comments and feedback here is only just that, my feedback, not intended to anger anyone.

Is this a satirical comment? There has been a lot of horrible ideas released in eso, and this is the worse ever set forth onto live servers...the set is a crutch, a one button carry that though it may be effective against zergs, it is also employed by zergs to chase and group down solo and small groups with the simplicity of one click each.....want to make fighting faction stacks and ball groups easier? bring back no out of group healing and limit group sizes even further.....or just keep on introducing sets that are game breakers and cause an already dwindling population of pvpers to leave the game.....I will end by saying it is ok if you want to use the set, it is your game play as you will.....but to ignore the reality of what that set is and to actually call for it to be buffed is pretty wild.....

its not satire, its not a sarcasm, its not funny, infact it is very embarrassing that new people come to eso and find massive groups destroying the pvp and game.
we asked for help in stopping the zergs, we got help with this set "dark convergence"
However, they leaders of these groups has found a way around the set and the set is no longer stoping them, they just run right through it and are not being effected by the set now.

the. set. needs. its radius increased and the damage increased to help stop the zergs. thats not a joke, its not satire.
its just plain honest truth and honest feedback.

I'm sorry but whatever you're given, whatever things are buffed, a ball group will be able to use 12 times more effectively due to numbers. And the day it is no longer profitable to group up for whatever reason the ball groups won't give a [snip]. They'll just continue coordinating in voice chat and stay together like they always do. Numbers and coordination mean everything in this game, and sets like Dark Convergence have only made the situation worse for the people the devs designed the set for.

Take away their purge spam and cross heals and watch the Rome falls.

Uh they took away purges in CP campaign. How's that working out?

techyeshic

neferpitou73 wrote: »

Mayrael wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

Gilvoth wrote: »

wazzz56 wrote: »

Gilvoth wrote: »

this thread has a toxic taste that is unfair and just plain not the truth of how the majority of eso pvp players feel.
reading the comments and the thread title gives the impression that anyone using the set needs to be ashamed and feel bad, but that is just not the truth seen in pvp and pvp zone chat as well as the guilds im a member of.
theres nothing wrong with using this set in both pvp and pve.
the set was made because we asked for help to stop zergs and hoards of people blobbing together, the set works good and doing its job.
the set was made to stop zergs and huge groups that are cause massive lagg, high ping, and destroying the pvp in cryodiil.
the set needs buffed, not nerfed.
it needs to stay.

Absolute Best design ever made, Especially for an mmo that has horrible ball zerg groups like eso.
its perfect for fighting the zergs here in eso.

the dark convergence set needs to be buffed in damage as well as Grab ability to zergs to be stronger as we can see that many zergs are escaping it. they simply run through its grab somehow and that needs to be buffed to make sure it keeps working as was intended and spoken about it the patch notes.

is it possible that the only people angry about this set are the ones in zergs and large groups that it is intended for?
i dont know, but i can assure you that it does what we asked for when it works as it should.


and again my comments and feedback here is only just that, my feedback, not intended to anger anyone.

Is this a satirical comment? There has been a lot of horrible ideas released in eso, and this is the worse ever set forth onto live servers...the set is a crutch, a one button carry that though it may be effective against zergs, it is also employed by zergs to chase and group down solo and small groups with the simplicity of one click each.....want to make fighting faction stacks and ball groups easier? bring back no out of group healing and limit group sizes even further.....or just keep on introducing sets that are game breakers and cause an already dwindling population of pvpers to leave the game.....I will end by saying it is ok if you want to use the set, it is your game play as you will.....but to ignore the reality of what that set is and to actually call for it to be buffed is pretty wild.....

its not satire, its not a sarcasm, its not funny, infact it is very embarrassing that new people come to eso and find massive groups destroying the pvp and game.
we asked for help in stopping the zergs, we got help with this set "dark convergence"
However, they leaders of these groups has found a way around the set and the set is no longer stoping them, they just run right through it and are not being effected by the set now.

the. set. needs. its radius increased and the damage increased to help stop the zergs. thats not a joke, its not satire.
its just plain honest truth and honest feedback.

I'm sorry but whatever you're given, whatever things are buffed, a ball group will be able to use 12 times more effectively due to numbers. And the day it is no longer profitable to group up for whatever reason the ball groups won't give a [snip]. They'll just continue coordinating in voice chat and stay together like they always do. Numbers and coordination mean everything in this game, and sets like Dark Convergence have only made the situation worse for the people the devs designed the set for.

Take away their purge spam and cross heals and watch the Rome falls.

Uh they took away purges in CP campaign. How's that working out?

Really screws with classes that strength come from their own purge that don't have someone else spamming heals on them. That's just dandy. I see sooo many stamplars out there

PancakeHead

I don't mind zergs or understand the reasoning of wanting to get rid of them. They seem like the natural outcome of a competitive environment. I've been accused on some YouTube videos during streams of being a zerg person because the few times in IC they've come across me I've been in a group of seven or eight I think. This isn't a conscious effort on my part or the group that is in front of them. It's what has evolved over the last hour or two.

For example, I log into IC, I run around for a while annoyed at all the NPC's, I come across someone, they're good but maybe I get lucky and win, about ten minutes later I come across them and maybe two people, they kill me, I come across two on my own, as it gets later in the evening more people log on, and before you know it there's huge groups patrolling. It's not that everyone in those groups suck. They don't. On the PS4 NA server at 8pm in IC the people in these groups aren't trash players hiding for the most part. They're good players who have had to adjust to the environment instead of getting killed .

The impression I get from some people is they think they should be able to be gods and blow through multiple people or groups of people. This just isn't the reality for the most part. If I'm on anything other than a nightblade or sorc where I can be invisible or zip away, I fully expect to die if I come across even two people I recognize unless I'm built like a tank or maybe on a dk.

My overall point is I don't think trying to break up large groups in general in a good idea. If people only want to do 1v1, then maybe they can design an area only for that, like queuing for a dungeon, but if you're going to have group PVP you're going to have people band together and others do the same. Creating a set like dark convergence doesn't really break up large groups or kill tanks as far as I ever see. What I see is large groups all using it to try to kill another large group or a few people. This happens constantly in IC and Cyrodil where they will hide behind a rock and then all come rushing out with dark convergence. I have never seen one or two people with dark convergence break up a bigger group.

I think dark convergence should be deleted from the game or nerfed so much it's useless. It's not really fair to people who have golded out sets and put a lot of time into it, but there seems to be a large consensus across platforms and servers it's not good for the game. Yeah, it sucks to be alone and killed by a huge group, especially if someone starts tea bagging you, but this isn't the answer.

McTaterskins

PancakeHead wrote: »

I don't mind zergs or understand the reasoning of wanting to get rid of them. They seem like the natural outcome of a competitive environment. I've been accused on some YouTube videos during streams of being a zerg person because the few times in IC they've come across me I've been in a group of seven or eight I think. This isn't a conscious effort on my part or the group that is in front of them. It's what has evolved over the last hour or two.

For example, I log into IC, I run around for a while annoyed at all the NPC's, I come across someone, they're good but maybe I get lucky and win, about ten minutes later I come across them and maybe two people, they kill me, I come across two on my own, as it gets later in the evening more people log on, and before you know it there's huge groups patrolling. It's not that everyone in those groups suck. They don't. On the PS4 NA server at 8pm in IC the people in these groups aren't trash players hiding for the most part. They're good players who have had to adjust to the environment instead of getting killed .

The impression I get from some people is they think they should be able to be gods and blow through multiple people or groups of people. This just isn't the reality for the most part. If I'm on anything other than a nightblade or sorc where I can be invisible or zip away, I fully expect to die if I come across even two people I recognize unless I'm built like a tank or maybe on a dk.

My overall point is I don't think trying to break up large groups in general in a good idea. If people only want to do 1v1, then maybe they can design an area only for that, like queuing for a dungeon, but if you're going to have group PVP you're going to have people band together and others do the same. Creating a set like dark convergence doesn't really break up large groups or kill tanks as far as I ever see. What I see is large groups all using it to try to kill another large group or a few people. This happens constantly in IC and Cyrodil where they will hide behind a rock and then all come rushing out with dark convergence. I have never seen one or two people with dark convergence break up a bigger group.

I think dark convergence should be deleted from the game or nerfed so much it's useless. It's not really fair to people who have golded out sets and put a lot of time into it, but there seems to be a large consensus across platforms and servers it's not good for the game. Yeah, it sucks to be alone and killed by a huge group, especially if someone starts tea bagging you, but this isn't the answer.

Quoted for truth.

alberichtano

Is Dark Convergence annoying? Yep. Is it gamebreaking? Nope.

It is, to me as a mediocre PvP-er (at best), really no different from any other set or skill that can easily one shot me or a group of people. It is no worse than bombers, for example.

Could it be improved? Sure. I would perhaps lower it's range somewhat, so that people who actually break free and roll-dodge don't end up still stuck in it, with no stamina left to escape. Perhaps lower the tick-damage a bit and increase the end-damage instead. This would give people a better chance to escape, but hit harder on those that fail to get out, or ignore the risk.

Ironically I haven't seen many use it against balls and zergs (playing AD on PC EU), seems to be few on AD side using it. Not sure why.

alberichtano

MEBengalsFan2001 wrote: »

TheEndBringer wrote: »

I got solo necro DC bombed 3 times today. Solo. Doesn't seem to be doing what it's supposedly built for when a handful of necros spam graveyards all around one person. Personally I don't care about dying but I do care about the fact no one in development could foresee that Dark Convergence would be used for the exact opposite purpose of what they claimed to want, especially when there was plenty of PTS feedback warning them.

As other have said sets won't fix the issue of ball or zerg groups steam rolling areas.

I would make buffs and heals only be applied to the group and limit group size to four players; like a dungeon. This may improve not only PVP experience but also the system performance.

How would this help though? Even if healing only works in groups, well, so what? Balls and zergs are hardly a bunch of randoms who just happen to be in the same place. On the contrary, these are often a group or a couple of groups that can easily heal within the group(s). The defenders, however, are more often non-grouped people, who would therefor be punished by your suggestion, being unable to heal each other.

wotevah

Gilvoth wrote: »

this thread has a toxic taste that is unfair and just plain not the truth of how the majority of eso pvp players feel.
reading the comments and the thread title gives the impression that anyone using the set needs to be ashamed and feel bad, but that is just not the truth seen in pvp and pvp zone chat as well as the guilds im a member of.
theres nothing wrong with using this set in both pvp and pve.
the set was made because we asked for help to stop zergs and hoards of people blobbing together, the set works good and doing its job.
the set was made to stop zergs and huge groups that are cause massive lagg, high ping, and destroying the pvp in cryodiil.
the set needs buffed, not nerfed.
it needs to stay.

Absolute Best design ever made, Especially for an mmo that has horrible ball zerg groups like eso.
its perfect for fighting the zergs here in eso.

the dark convergence set needs to be buffed in damage as well as Grab ability to zergs to be stronger as we can see that many zergs are escaping it. they simply run through its grab somehow and that needs to be buffed to make sure it keeps working as was intended and spoken about it the patch notes.

is it possible that the only people angry about this set are the ones in zergs and large groups that it is intended for?
i dont know, but i can assure you that it does what we asked for when it works as it should.


and again my comments and feedback here is only just that, my feedback, not intended to anger anyone.

Matey, really struggling to understand this view point. The word "zerg" seems to have a different meaning depending on who is using it. I am going to assume you mean any group of 12 players. Whether on mic and with coordinated builds or not. A 12 man pug made up of random people spamming "LFG" in zone chat will be vulnerable to DC, but that will down to the fact most players in such groups a bad pvp'rs. DC is next to worthless against well composed groups on mic with lots of heals and probably wearing snow treaders. But it will be a very potent set in said coordinated group's hands especially when the ulti-dump and use a harmony bomber. When Small scaling...snow treaders being a lot less viable...DC is a massive pain in the ass...read above about the endless pinball and lack of control of position. This set does too much, is way way too disruptive and needs to be nerfed into the ground.

kuschlwuschl116

yes, by removing the pull completely. This set single handedly ruined PvP.