Do most people not care about new dungeon stories?

hcbigdogdoghc

Not talking about people rushing in FG1 in 2021.

Every time when a new dungeon dlc came out, I always queue for them day 1

100% of the time people just pick up quest and started running, didn't even read dialogue. This is on day 1 mind you, dungeon literally just came out and people are already skipping dialogues.

Dalsinthus

hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »

Every time when a new dungeon dlc came out, I always queue for them day 1

This is the cause of your issue. Group up with friends with similar goals and go through them at your own pace. With the queue, you'll have players with different motivations all lumped together.

I really enjoy figuring out the story and lore behind each dungeon (dialogue, lore books, exploration, etc.). I'm still discovering things from some of the base game dungeons.

jaws343

I personally go in for the completion. And the background story conversation. The in menu dialogue is usually too much of a hassle to read in a PUG run. I can either read that online or mostly get the gist of a dungeon story through multiple runs of the dungeon and the background dialogue.

OutLaw_Nynx

Don’t really care much.

colossalvoids

On a release date I just go solo / duo for a quest and then do pugging for the day and with the group later, on obviously don't need to do the quest the second time this same day. Some just doesn't care but they're getting most of the story anyway without extensive read of every line or a book.

whitecrow

There are a lot of players who don't read any dialogue at all. It's quite strange.

hcbigdogdoghc

Dalsinthus wrote: »

hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »

Every time when a new dungeon dlc came out, I always queue for them day 1

This is the cause of your issue. Group up with friends with similar goals and go through them at your own pace. With the queue, you'll have players with different motivations all lumped together.

I really enjoy figuring out the story and lore behind each dungeon (dialogue, lore books, exploration, etc.). I'm still discovering things from some of the base game dungeons.

Ye that's the point.

People are skipping the story day 1 when the dungeon literally just came out, no one wants to do the story content that they paid for.

Do the mass majority of people actually don't care about the story?

Chilly-McFreeze

hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »

Dalsinthus wrote: »

hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »

Every time when a new dungeon dlc came out, I always queue for them day 1

This is the cause of your issue. Group up with friends with similar goals and go through them at your own pace. With the queue, you'll have players with different motivations all lumped together.

I really enjoy figuring out the story and lore behind each dungeon (dialogue, lore books, exploration, etc.). I'm still discovering things from some of the base game dungeons.

Ye that's the point.

People are skipping the story day 1 when the dungeon literally just came out, no one wants to do the story content that they paid for.

Do the mass majority of people actually don't care about the story?

Partly that, partly because the new over-the-top items are locked behind a dungeon grind.

And to add to that, many of the menu conversations are rather long and sometimes obviously written as if the reader is some kind of stupid. Can't bring myself to read through them anymore.

belial5221_ESO

It's cause they are used to the other boring quests they seen in other MMOs,so think ESO is same.They don't realized there's good lore and stories built over decades.That's how you know difference between people who played previous ES titles,and people jsut finding a new MMO to play.

redspecter23

For me personally, the story means basically nothing. I might choose to run it as a duo on day 1, one time, to hear the story. After that, I am there for the dungeon, not the story.

I have absolutely zero expectations that a group formed from the queue on day one will have any interest in the story at all. It would be nice if they slowed down a bit for the story, but they are complete randoms. Why would I have any expectations of them or expect anything, even common courtesy in return. They are there for a reason and it is highly unlikely to be the story as that is a one time experience (if you even care at all), while dungeon farming will be done repeatedly, perhaps 50+ times per dungeon or more.

That's the issue. Even in an ideal situation, you experience the story once and then you generally know what's going on, but dungeons are also designed to be run repeatedly, over and over. There is a design mismatch between the story and the other purpose of the dungeon.

With that current design philosophy, you have a few choices. Ask your pug group politely to slow down and play to your expectations or change your expectations. Alternatively, you can find other people (not complete unknowns) to play that dungeon with to experience it the way you prefer.

Yes, hitting one button and hopping into the dungeon can be convenient, but you've already mentioned it's not working for this purpose. Stop trying to fit a square peg in a round hole and just find that round peg. Find a group of like minded players to run the story and you'll have a much better time. Expecting the queue system to fill up with 3 random players that all play the dungeon the way you do will almost always end in disappointment.

Kadraeus

This is why I wish the dungeon stories worked like in Trials. That way you don't have to interact with npcs since the story unravels around you like an amusement park ride until the very end.

Vevvev

The stories just don't feel substantial enough for me to care as they feel like contrived plots to get you fighting epic boss fights, and you can completely skip every line of dialog and still get a summary of what's going on from the fights themselves due to all the NPC's banter.

hcbigdogdoghc

redspecter23 wrote: »

For me personally, the story means basically nothing. I might choose to run it as a duo on day 1, one time, to hear the story. After that, I am there for the dungeon, not the story.

I have absolutely zero expectations that a group formed from the queue on day one will have any interest in the story at all. It would be nice if they slowed down a bit for the story, but they are complete randoms. Why would I have any expectations of them or expect anything, even common courtesy in return. They are there for a reason and it is highly unlikely to be the story as that is a one time experience (if you even care at all), while dungeon farming will be done repeatedly, perhaps 50+ times per dungeon or more.

That's the issue. Even in an ideal situation, you experience the story once and then you generally know what's going on, but dungeons are also designed to be run repeatedly, over and over. There is a design mismatch between the story and the other purpose of the dungeon.

With that current design philosophy, you have a few choices. Ask your pug group politely to slow down and play to your expectations or change your expectations. Alternatively, you can find other people (not complete unknowns) to play that dungeon with to experience it the way you prefer.

Yes, hitting one button and hopping into the dungeon can be convenient, but you've already mentioned it's not working for this purpose. Stop trying to fit a square peg in a round hole and just find that round peg. Find a group of like minded players to run the story and you'll have a much better time. Expecting the queue system to fill up with 3 random players that all play the dungeon the way you do will almost always end in disappointment.

The thing is it seems like people jump to the "dungeon farming" stage immediately.

There's seems to be almost no interest in the one time story experience.

Danikat

hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »

Dalsinthus wrote: »

hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »

Every time when a new dungeon dlc came out, I always queue for them day 1

This is the cause of your issue. Group up with friends with similar goals and go through them at your own pace. With the queue, you'll have players with different motivations all lumped together.

I really enjoy figuring out the story and lore behind each dungeon (dialogue, lore books, exploration, etc.). I'm still discovering things from some of the base game dungeons.

Ye that's the point.

People are skipping the story day 1 when the dungeon literally just came out, no one wants to do the story content that they paid for.

Do the mass majority of people actually don't care about the story?

The majority of people doing dungeons with a PUG group either do not care about the dungeon story or are not attempting to follow it in that run. That is not representative of the majority of ESO players in all content at all times.

Even those same people may do the dungeon either solo or with their guild or friends and take their time to read/listen to the dialogue and do other things like fully exploring the dungeon and opening all the containers. But they don't try to do that in a random group because the expectation is that random groups are for fast runs and nothing else.

It's a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy because if you get 1-2 speed runners in a random group everyone else has to rush to keep up or risk missing out on things, including the dungeon boss and the story if the dungeon is finished before they get there, so then they rush through it as well and it reinforces the idea for everyone in that group that a PUG group means rushing.

But assuming that means they do the same in all dungeon runs or all content is like seeing someone at a busy dolmen who is spamming AoEs and assuming they play all content at all times by spamming AoEs. It's what works in that specific situation, not necessarily the only thing they want or know how to do.

As for why you're seeing it on the first day the two most likely explanations are that those specific individuals do not care about the dungeon story, or that they're doing it to see the mechanics and maybe get some drops and achievements while waiting for their regular group to get online so they can do a slow run together.

jaws343

belial5221_ESO wrote: »

It's cause they are used to the other boring quests they seen in other MMOs,so think ESO is same.They don't realized there's good lore and stories built over decades.That's how you know difference between people who played previous ES titles,and people jsut finding a new MMO to play.

Eh, it's not really that. It's more that I can read the subtitles faster than the NPC can speak. So there really is no point waiting for them to finish talking because I have already read what they are going to say. So I can skip through the dialogue fast and not have to spend 10 minutes waiting for it to finish. And if I do miss anything, the dialogue throughout the dungeon and the actions of the characters in the dungeon usually contextualizes the story. After multiple play throughs, you get the basic idea at a minimum.

vingarmo

Using group finder for quests is the best way to ruin your impression about them. I always do them solo on normal first and it’s actually one of the best pve experience this game provides. This is also a good way to learn mechanics of boss fights at your own pace without stress and prepare for vet. The annoying part is zos started to “lock” half of the dungeons behind bonus areas that only accessible to groups so that part of experience lost for both solo players and pugs who don’t know/care to do them.

colossalvoids

vingarmo wrote: »

The annoying part is zos started to “lock” half of the dungeons behind bonus areas that only accessible to groups so that part of experience lost for both solo players and pugs who don’t know/care to do them.

That's so annoying. I get their intentions but the best way to experience the story is still solo or duo if needed unpin/pressure plate, and now you need 4 for full ride which is not needed in normal for sure.

Araneae6537

I like to go through the story of the dungeon the first time and ideal is to go with a group of fellow first-timers and figure out everything together, but as long as we’ve all agreed to allow everyone as much time as they need for dialogue, reading for notes, etc., that works for me.

This used to not be how I would experience new dungeons and I’d feel obligated to click through any dialogue and not delay the group and only later do a “slow dungeon” run with a group on a character who hadn’t yet gone through it because of course you can’t do the quest twice. Now I insist on experiencing dungeons fully the first time through so I haven’t queued for a random dungeon in AGES although I used to do so most days because I have a backlog of dungeons I won’t do until I can coordinate a “slow dungeon” run with my group.

For this I do wish there was a story mode (could have less or even no rewards) for those who want to go through the story but cannot find or coordinate with a group of people who want to do the same. Yes, those of you who are uber DPS can solo dungeons but most of us can’t.

VaranisArano

No, I don't really care about the dungeon stories and, to be honest, I think adding the dungeons into the year long storyline was a bad idea for a number of reasons.

When I do new PVE group content for the first time, I'm far more concerned with learning the new mechanics and tanking for the group. It's not exactly conducive to enjoying the story. I usually get the gist of the story, but if I want more, I need to go with a pre-made group or just watch a Youtuber's run where they do the dialogue. Or look it up on UESP later.

The year-long storyline dungeons are particularly egregious in that the Q1 Dungeons can't be completed until level 45 by new players. Moreover, since ZOS doesn't want to make the stories in the dungeons necessary to understand what's going on, the first quest of Greymoor and Blackwood ended up ridiculously extended in order to shove in as much exposition as possible to cover that same ground. If you've done the Prologue Quests, you really don't miss anything story-wise from not doing the dungeons or not paying attention to every line of dialogue.

Practically speaking, when I buy new PVE group content, it's for the combat, new bosses, and new gear. The stories are reasonably well done, but since there isn't a "Story Mode", I'm afraid that's not why I would buy Dungeon DLC.

cyberjanet

Please don't even ask me to do a dungeon with you if you aren't prepared to wait for the story.

Amottica

I would suggest most people who are truly interested in the dungeon stories and exploring the dungeons that first time through are not seeking a random group via the GF. It seems to be a better path to form a group with like-minded players. Heck, I doubt most dungeon runners are queueing solo for any dungeon most of the time as a run with guildmates and friends will always be smoother.

Adding here. And since running with people we know and enjoy playing the game with that run with guildmates and friends will more often than not be more fun and rewarding. If not, find a new guild and friends.

hcbigdogdoghc

Amottica wrote: »

I would suggest most people who are truly interested in the dungeon stories and exploring the dungeons that first time through are not seeking a random group via the GF. It seems to be a better path to form a group with like-minded players. Heck, I doubt most dungeon runners are queueing solo for any dungeon most of the time as a run with guildmates and friends will always be smoother.

Adding here. And since running with people we know and enjoy playing the game with that run with guildmates and friends will more often than not be more fun and rewarding. If not, find a new guild and friends.

Too bad none of my friends are interested in stories smh. Most of them rather try new dungeon hm/trifecta blind than do the story.

Thank the divines for tank Mirri and healer Bastian.

Now if only they can stand on pressure plates and solve extra boss puzzles.....

Got the Dread Cellar trifecta, but still unable to hear the dread cellar ghost lady npc dialogue to this day.

WhyMustItBe

I'd love to experience the dungeon stories, old and new alike. The problem is the modern MMO community seems to have lost an 'M.' I find that people don't WANT to group together, they do it because they have to. People don't WANT to make friends. They want to get the dopamine hit from earning a reward and then show off their virtual status and compare themselves to others.

It is a byproduct of the over-monetization of the industry. The end result of a decade of predatory marketing pandering to addiction: Surprise surprise, the MMO industry has become much like addicts constantly chasing that next hit of "good feels" that comes from "winning," only winning has been redefined as mostly "selfish acquisition" in this market rather than actual accomplishment you work together for.

This is why China recently banned the sale of ALL new video games due to what they perceived the "crisis" of online addiction.



The predatory tactics of this industry have changed who we are fundamentally as people and as a community.

People saying "just run them with friends" don't seem to grasp that people don't really make friends in these games anymore. Mostly people are just totally selfish, fake tanks/healers, rushing through everything, in it for themselves only, rushing for that next dopamine/adrenaline release. I am in 5 guilds and it can take hours to round up enough people willing to run a veteran dungeon, and these are not small guilds (close to 500 player cap and average 100 online).

That nostalgia people have been chasing isn't just for some nebulous halcyon days of gaming. It is in the sense that we remember what it was like for MMO companies not to be drug pushers. But more it is that PEOPLE have changed, and these tactics are mainly the reason.

Amottica

hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

I would suggest most people who are truly interested in the dungeon stories and exploring the dungeons that first time through are not seeking a random group via the GF. It seems to be a better path to form a group with like-minded players. Heck, I doubt most dungeon runners are queueing solo for any dungeon most of the time as a run with guildmates and friends will always be smoother.

Adding here. And since running with people we know and enjoy playing the game with that run with guildmates and friends will more often than not be more fun and rewarding. If not, find a new guild and friends.

Too bad none of my friends are interested in stories smh. Most of them rather try new dungeon hm/trifecta blind than do the story.

Thank the divines for tank Mirri and healer Bastian.

Now if only they can stand on pressure plates and solve extra boss puzzles.....

Got the Dread Cellar trifecta, but still unable to hear the dread cellar ghost lady npc dialogue to this day.

Sounds like you could use a good guild, not suggesting replacing friends. I know players that are interested in the trifecta achievements but they still are interested in the story. It only takes on run to enjoy the story and I doubt anyone is getting a speed run on their first clear.

NylAR

hcbigdogdoghc wrote: »

Not talking about people rushing in FG1 in 2021.

Every time when a new dungeon dlc came out, I always queue for them day 1

100% of the time people just pick up quest and started running, didn't even read dialogue. This is on day 1 mind you, dungeon literally just came out and people are already skipping dialogues.

The day I'll care will be the day ZOS introduces solo mode for dungeons. Which is never.

You basically described the reason why I can't enjoy dungeons. And please don't tell me that I should find a guild of like minded people. I've been in the game since launch and believe me I tried. I so tried.

I know I can already solo bunch of stuff with good gear on normal. But it's still a mess and some bosses ruin the whole experience cause of requiring multiple players.

Maybe if companions actually did something and worked as a standard player replacement...

WhyMustItBe

A couple things ZOS could do:

• Tell the story through "floating head" dialogue where the NPC's talking follow you as you move through the dungeon in order to finish their lines without slowing you down. Much like WoW does with world quests.
• Add a couple checkboxes to the dungeon finder: "Include DLC Dungeons" and "Run as Story Mode." When queued for story mode automatically kick skippers with a 30min re-queue penalty for ANY dungeon finder mode.
• Create a new interface panel that lets you go through the dialogue of dungeon quests (and possibly others) that you have completed at any time, at your own pace, including playing NPC voiceovers and possibly rendering their characters in the window.

Indigogo

I've never paid attention to a single quest in a dungeon. Ever.
I can't exit the dialogue windows fast enough.

Araneae6537

WhyMustItBe wrote: »

I'd love to experience the dungeon stories, old and new alike. The problem is the modern MMO community seems to have lost an 'M.' I find that people don't WANT to group together, they do it because they have to. People don't WANT to make friends. They want to get the dopamine hit from earning a reward and then show off their virtual status and compare themselves to others.

It is a byproduct of the over-monetization of the industry. The end result of a decade of predatory marketing pandering to addiction: Surprise surprise, the MMO industry has become much like addicts constantly chasing that next hit of "good feels" that comes from "winning," only winning has been redefined as mostly "selfish acquisition" in this market rather than actual accomplishment you work together for.

This is why China recently banned the sale of ALL new video games due to what they perceived the "crisis" of online addiction.

The predatory tactics of this industry have changed who we are fundamentally as people and as a community.

People saying "just run them with friends" don't seem to grasp that people don't really make friends in these games anymore. Mostly people are just totally selfish, fake tanks/healers, rushing through everything, in it for themselves only, rushing for that next dopamine/adrenaline release. I am in 5 guilds and it can take hours to round up enough people willing to run a veteran dungeon, and these are not small guilds (close to 500 player cap and average 100 online).

That nostalgia people have been chasing isn't just for some nebulous halcyon days of gaming. It is in the sense that we remember what it was like for MMO companies not to be drug pushers. But more it is that PEOPLE have changed, and these tactics are mainly the reason.

Wow, no. Yes, there are selfish people, but there are also many who will go out of their way to help a stranger. I have PUGged many dungeons and had FAR more good experience than bad. Sure, some people rush ahead no matter what, but many people wait if someone needs to do something for a quest or something in rl comes up. I have never asked for a random group to wait while I go through dialogue or read books because I feel it would be rude of me to ask.

People definitely make friends in the game and I’ve joined guilds and added people to friends list to group with again for dungeon runs, Cyrodiil or BGs. I enjoy overcoming challenges with people — that gives me a “dopamine hit,” as does helping people. That is part of why I like playing a healer and I had a great experience completing Cauldron on vet with an experienced DPS and a newer tank and the second DPS who ended up joining us (other DPS had wanted to kick the tank even though they were doing their job but were a bit squishy but that I saw as my job — anyway, the one DPS and I were united in supporting our tank as long as they were trying and they certainly were and I think we all pushed ourselves to do better!).

THAT is why I would appreciate a storymode, because I want to fully explore the dungeon and its story but I do care about the experience of my teammates and no matter how many say “no rush” etc., I would not be able to enjoy taking my time if others were waiting for me. It has to be a group formed for the purpose. So yes, that’s what I do, but it can be difficult to coordinate schedules, etc. and hence my backlog of dungeons!

WhyMustItBe

Araneae6537 wrote: »

...snippy...

I fear thou art a rock in a turbulent tide my dear.

AzuraFan

It's been said already, but join a guild. Many run dungeon events for players who want to experience the story.

Having said that, I know not everyone wants to be in a guild. For that reason, I think a story mode for dungeons would be great. That way players can do the story mode solo, and also run the dungeon with a pug as usual.

Franchise408

I am on record of saying that group dungeons / trials should not have storylines.

Group content is not the place for story content that is going to artificially stop and slow down gameplay. When I am playing with friends - any game, really - I want to keep playing. Not listen to stories.

I have little to no interest in the stories in the dungeons and trials, and honestly, I'm not sure that I can tell you the story for literally any of them.

If it matters: I am a TES fan, fan of the lore, and in the single player games, take my time to listen to every single piece of dialogue I play through and don't skip even a merchant's dialogue when I interact with them to shop.