Tanking needs a group pull

heartburnkid

Not sure why this isn’t a thing, but tanking feels kind of useless compared to other mmos. Why don’t tanks have a group pull? I like being in the middle of tons of adds keeping the group protected, but it doesn’t seem possible in this game. Can this be added?

phaneub17_ESO

There's usually no insane damage where mobs and bosses can one-shot (most) players with normal attacks that you need to taunt every single enemy all the time. The game is designed so anyone can handle most trash packs, its those pesky specialty moves and powerful heavy attacks you need to be wary. Games like WoW [snip] where a prot paladin and a ret paladin can be wearing the exact same armor minus a shield, that somehow the prot paladin can shrug off most of the damage whereas the ret paladin loses more than half of their health in one hit because of nonsensical tank status.

[edited for bashing]

VaranisArano

Well, you can kinda use Dark Convergence to gain aggro and group enemies, but it's not a full taunt.

That being said, all the PVE group content has been completed on ESO without using AOE taunts. So no, you don't need a group pull.

ESO is designed so that the tank usually can't taunt 100% of the adds. This means it's intended that the healer and DDs have to be able to defend themselves somewhat while the tank focuses on the hard-hitting adds and the boss. Even the bosses are designed to have attacks that hit someone other than the tank, just to keep players on their toes.

That doesn't mean tanking is useless. There are lots of Vet fights where you need a good tank who can appropriately prioritize the hard-hitting mobs, mechanics, and bosses. Rather it means that the tank has slightly different priorities than in other MMOs. And that DDs and healers need to focus a little more on their own survival.

mzprx

the Vateshran 1H/S has the AoE pull built in it. also Rush of Agony set. hope that helps..

Ratzkifal

VaranisArano wrote: »

Well, you can kinda use Dark Convergence to gain aggro and group enemies, but it's not a full taunt.

That being said, all the PVE group content has been completed on ESO without using AOE taunts. So no, you don't need a group pull.

ESO is designed so that the tank usually can't taunt 100% of the adds. This means it's intended that the healer and DDs have to be able to defend themselves somewhat while the tank focuses on the hard-hitting adds and the boss. Even the bosses are designed to have attacks that hit someone other than the tank, just to keep players on their toes.

That doesn't mean tanking is useless. There are lots of Vet fights where you need a good tank who can appropriately prioritize the hard-hitting mobs, mechanics, and bosses. Rather it means that the tank has slightly different priorities than in other MMOs. And that DDs and healers need to focus a little more on their own survival.

Doesn't Dark Convergence become a full taunt if you pair it with Tormentor? It's a pull, so it should work...

Ksariyu

Kinda funny this is a complaint considering that the most popular strategy is to have the tank pull everything to him to be AoE'd down as fast as possible.

I promise you though. Even if you don't have the attention of EVERY mob, it matters which ones you DO have the attention of. You won't feel useless when you're tanking sledgehammer hits that would one-shot your fellow party members.

Personally, I think the choice to go with only single-target taunts was one of the best design decisions they made. Most other games with AoE taunts make tanks feel like literal lifeless sacks of meat while the rest of the team actually gets to play the game.

redlink1979

There's the Swarm Mother monster set - procs on block, has no costs and no cooldown:
"When you block an attack from an enemy that is between 8 and 22 meters from you, you spin strands of spider silk to pull the enemy to you. This effect can occur once every 1 second."

Sluggy

As a person that exclusively tanked for years in this game: No; It doesn't need it.

Much of the skill of tanking comes from knowing what to prioritize. If you are familiar with a dungeon it becomes a trivial matter most of the time. If you aren't familiar but are a good tank you can often figure it out on the fly. And like others have said, if you really want that ability, there are setups that do it but they sacrifice a good bit and are far from necessary.

Michaelkeir

With all my tanking experience I can safely say an AoE pull or taunt isn’t needed to clear content. So long as you get the attention of those hard hitters your group will be fine.

There are however sets in game that can help with this however.

Tormentor
(2 items) Adds 1206 Max Health
(3 items) Adds 4% Healing Taken
(4 items) Adds 4% Healing Taken
(5 items) When you deal direct damage with a Charge, Leap, Teleport or Pull ability, you gain 3642 Physical and Spell Resistance and taunt the enemy to attack you for 15 seconds.

This coupled with certain skills can taunt groups of mobs. Brutal Pounce from the werewolf skill line and Explosive Charge from the Templar skill line are two skills that come to mind.

Perfected Void Bash
(2 items) When you deal damage with Power Bash, you apply Call of the Void to yourself for 2 seconds. Enemies within 12 meters are immediately pulled to you. After Call of the Void ends, you apply Major Maim to enemies in the area for 10 seconds, reducing their damage done by 10%. This effect can occur once every 13 seconds.

This is another set that helps by pulling groups enemies to you.

I personally use Tormentor on my werewolf tank since they normally don’t have a taunt. I am also using it on my Templar but don’t play him as much.

zelaminator

you havbe 2-4 sets that pull
.

tomofhyrule

Vateshran SnB is seriously one of my favorite things. I run into a group and bash one mob, then the rest all pop together as my group throws down their AoEs. I usually go straight into my DK claws to hold them all there afterwards.

There's something seriously satisfying seeing the whole room just get sucked together. It's so much fun it's not even funny. Of course it doesn't taunt all of them, but the mobs can't really do much if they're rooted down in the groups AoEs.

ZeroDPS

Tanks need group aggro neither then pull

Vevvev

Don't necros have that beaconing armor? All they need is a ranged taunt and everything ranged ends up getting pulled passively.

Ei8htba11

heartburnkid wrote: »

Not sure why this isn’t a thing, but tanking feels kind of useless compared to other mmos. Why don’t tanks have a group pull? I like being in the middle of tons of adds keeping the group protected, but it doesn’t seem possible in this game. Can this be added?

There are several options as stated. Also, if tanking is supposed to be dynamic, like the rest of the roles. One button to rule them all is fun for a bit**, but becomes boring IMO. Smash-block-smash-block-smas... you get the idea. Seems only slightly more exiting than watching Bastion tank

** Templar tank using Tormentor and Rush of Agony/Explosive Charge

Aznarb

heartburnkid wrote: »

Not sure why this isn’t a thing, but tanking feels kind of useless compared to other mmos. Why don’t tanks have a group pull? I like being in the middle of tons of adds keeping the group protected, but it doesn’t seem possible in this game. Can this be added?

Tormentor + dark convergence.
Have fun.

Also we don't have that naturally on ESO because it's useless, tanking is easy enough. Focus the dangerous target ignore the rest.

pklemming

The sets mentioned above are useful, but it also seems the creator of the post needs to understand how soft taunts work too. Whilst I make use of things like the Vate shield in some content, a lot of the time there is just no need.

GuildedLilly

mzprx wrote: »

the Vateshran 1H/S has the AoE pull built in it. also Rush of Agony set. hope that helps..

I didn't know about the Vateshran S&B--thanks for the heads up! Looks like I'll be heading back there when the new update hits with weighted RNG drops.

I like tweaking my different tanks builds, and have experimented a few times with Tormentor WW/Templar, Dark Convergence, Swarm Mothers, and more traditional trial gear setups...tanking can be a very fun and dynamic role in ESO.

Like a lot of other commenters, I agree that an aoe taunt and pull isn't necessary---but it DOES come in handy to help your group melt things faster, it saves resources, and it's hilarious. Perhaps it's just because I'm easily amused, but I still laugh/giggle/snicker every time I aoe pull--then a moment later the mobs go POOF from the team's stacked, combined damage.

mzprx

GuildedLilly wrote: »

mzprx wrote: »

the Vateshran 1H/S has the AoE pull built in it. also Rush of Agony set. hope that helps..

I didn't know about the Vateshran S&B--thanks for the heads up! Looks like I'll be heading back there when the new update hits with weighted RNG drops...

i am using it on my DK dungeon tank. since most of my friends run Stamina build(s) i use the Crimson Oath's Rive on body, Akaviri Dragonguard jewelry and Ice staff (let's spam Warhorns like crazy), Earthgore monster set (currently farming the Magma Incarnate so there will be no need for Yolnahkriin, but that heavy head piece is eluding me somewhat) and the Vateshran 1H/S. i know, DKs have chains, but why chain this guy, then that guy and the other guy over there when i can go in, bang one of them bad guys and they all magically appear next to me (and we must not forget the Major Maim, right?). it's a thing of beauty, trust me. makes AoE pulls sooo much easier for everyone, especially the tank..

Kusto

Vateshran S&B is useless in most situations imo. The 12m range is too small. When you enter a room/area, you gotta taunt melee enemies anyways and they come to you and ranged enemies are usually further than 12m so you need to chain them.

aetherial_heavenn

May I recommend starting here? It covers most aspects of tanking in this game. There are more advanced guides in the website too. I just linked the beginner one because it's bookmarked. The site is run by active players, some of whom stream as well as post tanking vids, so if you are twitch inclined you can join chat, see tank's PoV, and ask questions. Very patient peeps.

https://thetankclub.com/eso-beginner-tank-guide/


Happy Tanking.

(ESO needs more tanks for the hard content. So thanks in advance )

Unfortunately you (ie people) don't get to practice much by pugging most normal dungeons because we are overpowered compared with when the old dungeons were designed so, most mechanics in those can be ignored these days. This is where guilds or static groups of friends who work through dungeons in order of difficulty are invaluable to learn support roles and mechanics.

When you tank vet Dread Cellar for example it will be the time to shine, because even high parse DPSers need a tank and healer in that. Thank the powers! and the devs.
edited for clarity

mzprx

Kusto wrote: »

Vateshran S&B is useless in most situations imo. The 12m range is too small. When you enter a room/area, you gotta taunt melee enemies anyways and they come to you and ranged enemies are usually further than 12m so you need to chain them.

from my own experience this is not true. granted, that build of mine is for dungeons and 4-man arenas only, but i am yet to encounter an area where the Vateshran 1H/S would be useless. quite contrary. i find it extremely useful. chaining enemies one by one can drain one's Magicka pretty quickly and with the Vateshran 1H/S all you have to do is whack one dude. makes my life a lot easier. i have quite a lot fo tanking experience (yet it doesn't mean i am an expert) and i am no longer using the DK's chains for any content what-so-ever. stuff that i use works like a charm and with no issues..

but all this means only that i meself find it great. what works for me doesn't necessarily have to work for everyone. me mentioning the Vateshran 1H/S was only an example of a group pull that is available in the game, is all..

Ippokrates

mzprx wrote: »

Kusto wrote: »

Vateshran S&B is useless in most situations imo. The 12m range is too small. When you enter a room/area, you gotta taunt melee enemies anyways and they come to you and ranged enemies are usually further than 12m so you need to chain them.

from my own experience this is not true. granted, that build of mine is for dungeons and 4-man arenas only, but i am yet to encounter an area where the Vateshran 1H/S would be useless. quite contrary. i find it extremely useful. chaining enemies one by one can drain one's Magicka pretty quickly and with the Vateshran 1H/S all you have to do is whack one dude. makes my life a lot easier. i have quite a lot fo tanking experience (yet it doesn't mean i am an expert) and i am no longer using the DK's chains for any content what-so-ever. stuff that i use works like a charm and with no issues..

but all this means only that i meself find it great. what works for me doesn't necessarily have to work for everyone. me mentioning the Vateshran 1H/S was only an example of a group pull that is available in the game, is all..

Agree with that, Void Bash is very useful, although still i am not sure how it exactly works cause sometimes the range of this skill is somewhat flexible and depend on situation or angle it could swipe a whole room, and sometimes... not ^^

essi2

heartburnkid wrote: »

Not sure why this isn’t a thing, but tanking feels kind of useless compared to other mmos. Why don’t tanks have a group pull? I like being in the middle of tons of adds keeping the group protected, but it doesn’t seem possible in this game. Can this be added?

Rich Lambert on AoE taunt/Tanking

https://clips.twitch.tv/FairPerfectStarlingWTRuck-I5tEU23y_dlUKxng

arun_rajputb16_ESO

essi2 wrote: »

heartburnkid wrote: »

Not sure why this isn’t a thing, but tanking feels kind of useless compared to other mmos. Why don’t tanks have a group pull? I like being in the middle of tons of adds keeping the group protected, but it doesn’t seem possible in this game. Can this be added?

Rich Lambert on AoE taunt/Tanking

https://clips.twitch.tv/FairPerfectStarlingWTRuck-I5tEU23y_dlUKxng

How do I send this to all players? The amount of times I've had someone complain because they had a trash mob's cousin's friend chase them around whilst I'm tanking three or four of the big mobs........

essi2

arun_rajputb16_ESO wrote: »

essi2 wrote: »

heartburnkid wrote: »

Not sure why this isn’t a thing, but tanking feels kind of useless compared to other mmos. Why don’t tanks have a group pull? I like being in the middle of tons of adds keeping the group protected, but it doesn’t seem possible in this game. Can this be added?

Rich Lambert on AoE taunt/Tanking

https://clips.twitch.tv/FairPerfectStarlingWTRuck-I5tEU23y_dlUKxng

How do I send this to all players? The amount of times I've had someone complain because they had a trash mob's cousin's friend chase them around whilst I'm tanking three or four of the big mobs........

I know that pain, had people scream at me for not AoE taunting too.

Vevvev

essi2 wrote: »

arun_rajputb16_ESO wrote: »

essi2 wrote: »

heartburnkid wrote: »

Not sure why this isn’t a thing, but tanking feels kind of useless compared to other mmos. Why don’t tanks have a group pull? I like being in the middle of tons of adds keeping the group protected, but it doesn’t seem possible in this game. Can this be added?

Rich Lambert on AoE taunt/Tanking

https://clips.twitch.tv/FairPerfectStarlingWTRuck-I5tEU23y_dlUKxng

How do I send this to all players? The amount of times I've had someone complain because they had a trash mob's cousin's friend chase them around whilst I'm tanking three or four of the big mobs........

I know that pain, had people scream at me for not AoE taunting too.

That's always annoying when people yell at you. Tbh I feel bad when I don't get everything taunted because the game throws everything at you making it so you can only really grab the big stuff. Typically find myself using Talons to lock the NPCs in place and chain pull the ranged foes to try to keep them mostly contained in the DPS's AoE. Don't spend a whole lot of time taunting in ESO outside boss fights and certain mechanics.

MudcrabAttack

I can understand where the wish for AOE taunt is coming from. When I dps, it doesn’t really matter what is taunted and what isn’t.

However when I jump on my true tank with a group of new dps in a vet dlc, and pull things in and root, more often than not it becomes a tedious process. I even incorporated the new medium pull set with stampede, then use the vateshran sword and board for another pull, then root, then watch as things scatter anyway. After the first half minute+ pull I’ll be swapping out Yolnakrin for tormentor, then tabbing windows to catch up on some IMs.

Eiregirl

A group pull is not needed. Players from level 10 up can solo some of the normal base game dungeons and once a player hits the CP ranks can solo some normal DLC and pretty much all base game vets. It is the Vet DLC dungeons especially hard mode in the more recent dungeons that group dynamics even comes into play and in these the tank only needs to control the most dangerous trash mobs and bosses.

What could be helpful is a tutorial for all new characters that explains the fundamentals of ESO combat that is more in depth than the current one by making it give the basics of tanking, healing and dealing damage.

arun_rajputb16_ESO

A group pull is not needed. Players from level 10 up can solo some of the normal base game dungeons and once a player hits the CP ranks can solo some normal DLC and pretty much all base game vets.

There is always one....

Syrpynt

Ratzkifal wrote: »

Doesn't Dark Convergence become a full taunt if you pair it with Tormentor? It's a pull, so it should work...

You joke, but most times it can't taunt (even with tormentor)...


Because the trash mobs are likely all dead after the first pull. lol

WarriorNinja9

"you come here, and you come here, and you come here, and you..... why cant i block?"