one more cyrodiil test?

Anyron

there were all sorts of tests already but one still remains which i think can heavily improve cyrodiil performance

another test should be to make purge, regen and vigor self only. it will mostly influence zergs and ballgroups which are, i think, biggest sources of lag

red_emu

Anyron wrote: »

there were all sorts of tests already but one still remains which i think can heavily improve cyrodiil performance

another test should be to make purge, regen and vigor self only. it will mostly influence zergs and ballgroups which are, i think, biggest sources of lag

This test was kind of done but basically limiting those to groups only. It improved things a lot but players hated it so ZOS didn't go with that idea.

Greasytengu

No more tests please. Zos needs to stop fobbing blame for the lag onto players.

Gilvoth

we need a test "remove animation canceling" test
yes im being serious
animation canceling is the Biggest contributor on lagg and high ping in eso, the sooner people admit it and have it tested for proof the sooner we will have a lagg free pvp experience.

irswat

Calculations which were moved server side to counter cheaters is the problem. Devise proper anticheat and then move calculations back client side.

kargen27

I don't think we can blame ball groups. I was all alone fighting an NPC to finish a daily and resorted to light attacks only because nothing else was reliable. Two nights in Gray Host there was no queue when I went in and the lag was so bad just doing the daily task was nothing but frustration. The night there was a queue I joined in a couple of large fights at keeps and while there was lag the game was playable. I did get a disconnect once while riding from one keep to another.

Ball groups might be a part of the problem but I don't think they are the main problem.

Anyron

Most of time i have combat bug or lag depends on presence of ballgroups.. And every time i shoot player from ballgroup and leave not to be farmed im stuck in combat until ball dies or i use kill potion.. They are usually present in lag and they are making it worse for everyone. Sometimes you can feel ballgroup coming even before you see them because of lag

Crash427

Gilvoth wrote: »

we need a test "remove animation canceling" test
yes im being serious
animation canceling is the Biggest contributor on lagg and high ping in eso, the sooner people admit it and have it tested for proof the sooner we will have a lagg free pvp experience.

If this were true PVE would be way laggier. Also Cyro lag got noticeably worse after, I think it was U25? Whichever patch was right before Stadia. Did everyone just start animation cancelling after that patch?

Amottica

irswat wrote: »

Calculations which were moved server side to counter cheaters is the problem. Devise proper anticheat and then move calculations back client side.

This makes more sense as to the issue than purge or animation canceling.

Further, the suggestion this thread makes would seem to make PvE more challenging at it removes some group skills healers would use. How many classes have a group cleans?

Alucardo

Gilvoth wrote: »

we need a test "remove animation canceling" test
yes im being serious
animation canceling is the Biggest contributor on lagg and high ping in eso, the sooner people admit it and have it tested for proof the sooner we will have a lagg free pvp experience.

Come on man. Not this again. A few skills have been beaten down by the animation cancelling hammer like Dawnbreaker and now it just feels horrible. One of the biggest things that made me stick around ESO for so long was its fast paced combat, so let's not turn it into another "wait for animation to play out fully" MMOs. It was the one thing that really made this game unique and feel great imho.

Anyron

red_emu wrote: »

Anyron wrote: »

there were all sorts of tests already but one still remains which i think can heavily improve cyrodiil performance

another test should be to make purge, regen and vigor self only. it will mostly influence zergs and ballgroups which are, i think, biggest sources of lag

This test was kind of done but basically limiting those to groups only. It improved things a lot but players hated it so ZOS didn't go with that idea.

@red_emu
but thats the problem. they made it to target group only which means it could still be used in zerg or ballgroup .
what they need to do this time is to make it solo only

Anyron

kargen27 wrote: »

I don't think we can blame ball groups. I was all alone fighting an NPC to finish a daily and resorted to light attacks only because nothing else was reliable. Two nights in Gray Host there was no queue when I went in and the lag was so bad just doing the daily task was nothing but frustration. The night there was a queue I joined in a couple of large fights at keeps and while there was lag the game was playable. I did get a disconnect once while riding from one keep to another.

Ball groups might be a part of the problem but I don't think they are the main problem.

@kargen27
it doesnt matter where you are. i was charging my thrassians near kingscrest cavern and there was huge 1v2 faction battle at glademist. i was still unable to use any skill, literaly across whole map.

i know for certain there were at least 3 ballgroups there

everyone who plays cyrodiil every day can see lag gets exponentially worse when you are near ballgroup. thats not coincidense. they keep spamming purge, hots , buffs and thousand more things at one small place. i am not surprised crappy server cannot handle it.
but one way how to prove its because of ballgroups is to make these 3 skills on cooldown or make them solo only so we can see it

there still wasnt any test like this. they made global cooldowns, but it was on everything and it made game unplayable. they made heals to be solo only but there still was purge and thousands of buffs.

Amottica

Anyron wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

I don't think we can blame ball groups. I was all alone fighting an NPC to finish a daily and resorted to light attacks only because nothing else was reliable. Two nights in Gray Host there was no queue when I went in and the lag was so bad just doing the daily task was nothing but frustration. The night there was a queue I joined in a couple of large fights at keeps and while there was lag the game was playable. I did get a disconnect once while riding from one keep to another.

Ball groups might be a part of the problem but I don't think they are the main problem.

@kargen27
it doesnt matter where you are. i was charging my thrassians near kingscrest cavern and there was huge 1v2 faction battle at glademist. i was still unable to use any skill, literaly across whole map.

i know for certain there were at least 3 ballgroups there

everyone who plays cyrodiil every day can see lag gets exponentially worse when you are near ballgroup. thats not coincidense. they keep spamming purge, hots , buffs and thousand more things at one small place. i am not surprised crappy server cannot handle it.
but one way how to prove its because of ballgroups is to make these 3 skills on cooldown or make them solo only so we can see it

there still wasnt any test like this. they made global cooldowns, but it was on everything and it made game unplayable. they made heals to be solo only but there still was purge and thousands of buffs.

Again, Zenimax cannot make group heals (and the only group cleans available to everyone) solo unless they truly want to completely eliminate the healer in PvE.

Anyron

Amottica wrote: »

Anyron wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

I don't think we can blame ball groups. I was all alone fighting an NPC to finish a daily and resorted to light attacks only because nothing else was reliable. Two nights in Gray Host there was no queue when I went in and the lag was so bad just doing the daily task was nothing but frustration. The night there was a queue I joined in a couple of large fights at keeps and while there was lag the game was playable. I did get a disconnect once while riding from one keep to another.

Ball groups might be a part of the problem but I don't think they are the main problem.

@kargen27
it doesnt matter where you are. i was charging my thrassians near kingscrest cavern and there was huge 1v2 faction battle at glademist. i was still unable to use any skill, literaly across whole map.

i know for certain there were at least 3 ballgroups there

everyone who plays cyrodiil every day can see lag gets exponentially worse when you are near ballgroup. thats not coincidense. they keep spamming purge, hots , buffs and thousand more things at one small place. i am not surprised crappy server cannot handle it.
but one way how to prove its because of ballgroups is to make these 3 skills on cooldown or make them solo only so we can see it

there still wasnt any test like this. they made global cooldowns, but it was on everything and it made game unplayable. they made heals to be solo only but there still was purge and thousands of buffs.

Again, Zenimax cannot make group heals (and the only group cleans available to everyone) solo unless they truly want to completely eliminate the healer in PvE.

yes, but we are not talking about pve right?

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo

Disable cross healing outside of groups - Yes, I agree - Like that had in one of those tests.
It could possibly make players be more self aware of their 'squishiness' and make them rethink their builds and gameplay and perhaps, I said..perhaps...they'll learn that zerging isn't the only way


(PC EU fort captures above..POV - Oiler position)

kargen27

Youyouz06 wrote: »

Disable cross healing outside of groups - Yes, I agree - Like that had in one of those tests.
It could possibly make players be more self aware of their 'squishiness' and make them rethink their builds and gameplay and perhaps, I said..perhaps...they'll learn that zerging isn't the only way


(PC EU fort captures above..POV - Oiler position)

That was a horrible idea when it was tried and is still horrible now. Cyrodiil is faction vs faction. If my healer is at a keep and that keep is under attack I should be able to help my allies whether I am grouped with them or not. Even when a healer is in a group they can become separated from the group. Not being able to heal around them until they get back to group makes healers almost useless.
Group size is now limited to twelve people so finding a group has become harder than it used to be. Pick up groups tend to be scattered a lot of the time. All this limits a healers effectiveness to help the faction control the map.

When healing was disallowed outside of groups keep fights were basically players in a group doing all the sieging and everybody not in a group hiding as there was nothing they could do to help the fight. It was either hide or spam self heals until dead. There was no way a person not in a group could get on a siege weapon. Good sense prevailed on ending that atrocity of an experiment.

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo

kargen27 wrote: »

Youyouz06 wrote: »

Disable cross healing outside of groups - Yes, I agree - Like that had in one of those tests.
It could possibly make players be more self aware of their 'squishiness' and make them rethink their builds and gameplay and perhaps, I said..perhaps...they'll learn that zerging isn't the only way


(PC EU fort captures above..POV - Oiler position)

That was a horrible idea when it was tried and is still horrible now. Cyrodiil is faction vs faction. If my healer is at a keep and that keep is under attack I should be able to help my allies whether I am grouped with them or not. Even when a healer is in a group they can become separated from the group. Not being able to heal around them until they get back to group makes healers almost useless.
Group size is now limited to twelve people so finding a group has become harder than it used to be. Pick up groups tend to be scattered a lot of the time. All this limits a healers effectiveness to help the faction control the map.

When healing was disallowed outside of groups keep fights were basically players in a group doing all the sieging and everybody not in a group hiding as there was nothing they could do to help the fight. It was either hide or spam self heals until dead. There was no way a person not in a group could get on a siege weapon. Good sense prevailed on ending that atrocity of an experiment.

I just re-thought the idea of no cross healing outside of groups - It would actually make it worse and you'd see even more LFG groups....the problem is no matter what you put into the game, people will choose an easier route. Why spend time theory crafting when I can go online and take 'whoever's build' which doesn't really represent solo game play in PvP, IC or BG's...most of the builds I come across are sometimes 5 light for magicka characters (not sorcs nor nightblades), so....even their builds are pushing more towards 'following the herd'...Mixed thoughts... a bit of everything is nice, but at the moment I think we are seeing a bit too many of these types.

I do agree though for you as a healer class (you spent time and money on your build), to not be able to heal others is a bummer for you..it's a hard task to address and find a solid balance. You take away from people, they bunch up...you give more to people..they bunch up...hmm

Remember when you could be tanky, but also do damage through certain procs sets/classes and kiting...and remember all those folks chasing that one person for countless minutes in hopes of killing him..sometimes up to 20 people hard trying and dying because of their weird builds and lack of gameplay awareness (not buffing, hotting...just spamming keys)...well they are still around...the tanks aren't

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Gilvoth wrote: »

we need a test "remove animation canceling" test
yes im being serious
animation canceling is the Biggest contributor on lagg and high ping in eso, the sooner people admit it and have it tested for proof the sooner we will have a lagg free pvp experience.

I fully support testing with the removal of all animation canceling. After 24 hours, even the biggest potatoes in ESO would realize just how crucial AC is to make combat in this game function smoothly. Just let me know when the test will be, because personally, I have zero interest in experiencing that for myself.

Ironically, the closest simulation we have for no AC is PVP when the lag is high, but not game breaking.

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Gilvoth wrote: »

we need a test "remove animation canceling" test
yes im being serious
animation canceling is the Biggest contributor on lagg and high ping in eso, the sooner people admit it and have it tested for proof the sooner we will have a lagg free pvp experience.

I fully support testing with the removal of all animation canceling. After 24 hours, even the biggest potatoes in ESO would realize just how crucial AC is to make combat in this game function smoothly. Just let me know when the test will be, because personally, I have zero interest in experiencing that for myself.

Ironically, the closest simulation we have for no AC is PVP when the lag is high, but not game breaking.

Rolldodge cast

EmEm_Oh

Anyron wrote: »

there were all sorts of tests already but one still remains which i think can heavily improve cyrodiil performance

another test should be to make purge, regen and vigor self only. it will mostly influence zergs and ballgroups which are, i think, biggest sources of lag

The biggest source of lag is not the skills, it's the server capabilities to handle them. It makes no sense to penalize players. That's butt-backwards of an idea to reduce skills and inject cooldowns.

An MMO that wants to expand its presence and become an enjoyable online community gaming refuge needs to invest in the best equipment FIRST, not invest in the best marketing. These two aspects can exist mutually, but I'm pretty sure equipment has been put on the back burner for years. If it hasn't, then I'd like to know the equipment specs and number of actual players.

Elo106

irswat wrote: »

Calculations which were moved server side to counter cheaters is the problem. Devise proper anticheat and then move calculations back client side.

This is the only "test" that would help and not drive away players again.

The tests we had drove people away from cyro or the game in hoards, test on the public test server, reward people for testing their if need be. Dont force paying customers to endure game changing tests like we had before.

driosketch

Gilvoth wrote: »

we need a test "remove animation canceling" test
yes im being serious
animation canceling is the Biggest contributor on lagg and high ping in eso, the sooner people admit it and have it tested for proof the sooner we will have a lagg free pvp experience.

They ran a test with cool downs, at least for AoE skills.

waterfairy

crazy suggestion but what if they remove every npc from cyrodil and turn it into a pure pvp experience? Overland is pure pve, IC is a blend of both so naturally cyro should be the pure pvp zone.
I bet getting rid of the annyoing resource guards who spam you with bubbles and BS will help performance

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Vigarr wrote: »

crazy suggestion but what if they remove every npc from cyrodil and turn it into a pure pvp experience? Overland is pure pve, IC is a blend of both so naturally cyro should be the pure pvp zone.
I bet getting rid of the annyoing resource guards who spam you with bubbles and BS will help performance

Honestly, I would support all NPC removal from Cyrodiil until they have performance sorted out. There is nothing more infuriating than trying to solo a resource with crippling lag. It's bad enough to fight another player that is presumably lagging as bad as you are, but when I can't get attacks to fire on an NPC, it just makes me want to uninstall.

waterfairy

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Vigarr wrote: »

crazy suggestion but what if they remove every npc from cyrodil and turn it into a pure pvp experience? Overland is pure pve, IC is a blend of both so naturally cyro should be the pure pvp zone.
I bet getting rid of the annyoing resource guards who spam you with bubbles and BS will help performance

Honestly, I would support all NPC removal from Cyrodiil until they have performance sorted out. There is nothing more infuriating than trying to solo a resource with crippling lag. It's bad enough to fight another player that is presumably lagging as bad as you are, but when I can't get attacks to fire on an NPC, it just makes me want to uninstall.

I know that frustration all too well during MM this week. Honestly they should start with removing resource npc's to see how it goes..not only do the guards spam flashy spells, there's random npc's walking around hogging memory for no reason. They could just make it to where it takes longer to flip flags or perhaps give the flag a high health bar that you have to dps down before taking it

ZOS_GregoryV

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