We need to speak about Nightblade Healer.

TheDreamstride

Long time ESO player here, quite experienced with high end content with many classes. (mainly magicka DPS and healer.)

I'm a huge fan of offensive support classes in general and I remember a time when NB healer was not quite there but kinda there with its 'I can heal my team while dealing damage' playstyle. Let's face it, most healers on ESO use the same gear and more or less same skills (I'm talking about resto abilities here) to provide overall the best support to their team; However, they differ from each other with their unique class buffs. Templar is our priest type with very strong heals, cleanse and minor sorcery. Warden is the buff queen with one very unique buff which can be a total lifesaver at times. Necromancer has a very strong dedicated support ultimate which can be a gamechanger, not even mentioning the empower and major vulnerability buffs. Sorcerer is cool, it's very easy to switch between DPS and healer when needed but nothing too unique about the class buffs since they're provided by the DPS. This is where things begin to fall short;

I believe all base game classes need to be looked at in order them to fulfill their class roles effectively and uniquely. There is absolutely no reason to pick a Nightblade (or DK, poor guys) healer over those I mentioned above and it's a major problem since its been mentioned that devs were focused on fixing this exact problem with class identity which I believe now is forgotten completely.

What does NB Healer provide to the group?

-Major Expedition which is extremely accessible by anyone and has absolutely no effect on the overall group performance whatsoever.
-Minor Savagery, again, very easily accessible due to DPS.
-Major Protection, which is a joke these days.
-Minor vulnerability, which lasts for a short while and requires you to get really upclose and personal which is a disgusting position for a healer. Just not worth the effort.

(I could be missing something, feel free to add.)

These are not some terrible buffs but they're not enough to compensate to the high-risk playstyle of Nightblade Healer. The one dedicated burst heal ability we have, Malevolent Offering, is not only dangerous to use during certain situations, it's just simply not rewarding at all. No self burst heal, no unique buffs other than minor mending which is... Meh. This skill should be looked at, either that OR funnel health should deal more recognizable damage and heal the team effectively if we want to bring NB Heals back to its offensive position.

I'd like to talk about Veil of Blades too. I hate it. It's terrible, stationary, provides a really useless buff and it's just simply an outdated skill which should no longer be here imo. I don't know what exactly should replace it (Maybe something from the illusion school!) but I really wish for an ultimate that's much more rewarding, maybe offensive or something team utility providing; More importantly, something that will reward the player for picking this class and this specific role.

I can survive in veteran hard mode dungeons and stuff, it's certainly much harder to keep the team alive and well compared to the current healer meta classes but we simply have no place in challenging veteran trials due to these reasons since right now we offer nothing to the team composition.

Athan1

You are right about the points you bring up. Every class has a different healing style. What you just described is the NB's healing style. We don't need all siz classes to be bis healers, it's fine for NBs to be low tier healers. It would actually ruin class identity to shoehorn them into effective healers, they are literal assassins.

VaxtinTheWolf

Been waiting for healer/Tank adjustments for base game classes for 3 years. Come have a seat with me.

Zodiarkslayer

My main is a MagBlade, now at least. I am doing all group content as a healer.

While the points you bring up are valid, they only apply because of the current healing META and the way Dungeons and Trials are working. Nightblade healers shine when it comes to raw healing output. 4k to 5k, fully buffed, from Rapid regen is my average, 10k to 12k from a Combat Prayer. Without Crit, ofc. That also goes really well together with Spell Power Cure. Plus, it is really easy to hybrid DPS/Heal in a Dungeon. I find it is the easiest class to do so.
Nightblade just aren't BuffBots. If you manage your expectations, than NB healers are fun.

Just do not blame the devs for nerfing NB Healing, they didn't.
What they did is design a game around the idea of "DPS is king". Blame them for that. I do.

AcadianPaladin

When the NB red twisty bit on the ground that used to heal while damaging got nerfed to choosing heal or damage, the idea of using my magblade as a healer went right off the table. In fact, most changes to healing for most classes push me more and more to dps instead of healing.

exeeter702

I wont indulge in the points mentioned now, but please, malevolent offering is an exceptional burst heal. This is combat and mechanics and you did not specify pvp or pve but there is nothing dangerous about using offering in pve, the cost is negated almost instantly, and even in the worst case scenario in certain hm trials, the hps that a nb healer is producing can EASILY float 6 stacks of the dot on yourself.

In pvp, this is actually the strongest burst heal in the game.

Utiltiy is slightly lacking, but this is not as egregious of an issue as many being up. NB does lack the ability to provide synergy pops for group members regularly, but frankly, the separation of the healers lies moreso in how they achieve viable healing throughput in their play mechanics and not in what exclusive buffs they provide.

The issue with this subject is it always diminishes the actual problem and frames the issues of (in this case magblade healer) around the current meta / balance around what classes and specs are being brought to groups in the tank and dps roles.

If templars were made to be better tanks, they are absolutely able to provide cleanse synergy, dps templars could provide potl, so on and so forth. This extends to the other classes as well.

The core minor buffs that each class brings are a mechanism put in place to encourage class representation in a group, regardless of role. For this reason it's a bit disingenuous to sight things like minor savagery, sorcery, prophecy etc as weak points or strong points for any class in the healer role. These buffs are mainly designed to trigger via general class gameplay interactions.

Your heart is in the right place, but I firmly believe that the core issue is a systemic one, and also amplified by player misinformation and a long running stigma that certain classes are intentionally designed by the devs to be better healers.

Pre morrowind, many high end groups that actually knew the deal, doing vet hm modes, would take a nb healers because of their often superior HPS than templar while contributing dps, while the templar handled general core healing and support, since they had a vice grip / monopoly on stamina resource provision thanks to shards. Zos took issue with this as they clearly didnt want that type of blend of respectable HPS while also having above average dps for being a healer. It's why they gutted funnel health with its initial nerf of only healing 2 targets down from 3. I believe wrobels reasoning was that NBs were "trivializing" 4 man content. Then they further nerfed NBs by removing the dot component from refreshing path and completing neutering funnel health by shifting its values resulting in the same HPS with greatly reduced damage.

The saddest thing here is that this design shift completely screwed non healer, non cloak focused magblades in pvp for which the spec never fully recovered.

Luckylancer

NB ult that gives M protection maybe the worse ult in the game. I have never seen it ever. Can be buffed imo

FrancisCrawford

Since the simultaneous nerf to Funnel Health, Twisting Path and about three other things that I now forget, I've barely played magblade at all.

ESO_Nightingale

Bolstering Darkness is frankly the most hilarious ultimate i have ever seen. It's so incredibly bad at everything it does.

VaxtinTheWolf

Luckylancer wrote: »

NB ult that gives M protection maybe the worse ult in the game. I have never seen it ever. Can be buffed imo

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Bolstering Darkness is frankly the most hilarious ultimate i have ever seen. It's so incredibly bad at everything it does.

Effect: On use, Bolsters your Depression as you sink further into the shadows in embarrassment for activating this 'Ultimate'.

umagon

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Bolstering Darkness is frankly the most hilarious ultimate i have ever seen. It's so incredibly bad at everything it does.

Nightblade tanks have been asking for improvements to bolstering darkness for 4+ years now; I have given up all hope it will be changed to something with useful self/group utility. The devs are unwilling to even lower the cost. There have been so many postings about how useless it is in pve, pvp, groups, and to tankblades, yet they seem to just ignore all of it. But are willing to waste time coding nerfs to darkcloak.

exeeter702

umagon wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Bolstering Darkness is frankly the most hilarious ultimate i have ever seen. It's so incredibly bad at everything it does.

Nightblade tanks have been asking for improvements to bolstering darkness for 4+ years now; I have given up all hope it will be changed to something with useful self/group utility. The devs are unwilling to even lower the cost. There have been so many postings about how useless it is in pve, pvp, groups, and to tankblades, yet they seem to just ignore all of it. But are willing to waste time coding nerfs to darkcloak.

The salt on the wound was that they changed the ultimate slightly for the better by letting the benefit persist even after leaving the aoe, which helped a tiny bit, but then they gutted major protection lol....

Honestly, if they insist on keeping the cost as is, which essentially places the ultimate in the high impact catagory of ultimates then maybe they can do as follows.

Increase the radius substantially, I'm talking like 2.5 or 3 times and keeps the snare and major protection. Duration increased to like 6 seconds.

Veil of blades keeps it damage component and applies MAJOR lifesteal, alongside the snare and major protection. No longer has hidden refresh synergy.

Bolstering on the other hand loses the persistent ground aoe and snare, but all allies in the area (radius equal to what it is on live) upon activation gain major protection and immediately gain invisibility and 70 percent movement speed while remaining in the radius, which is a pbaoe.

Tweak the values if you think this is too much. But the reasoning is this...

Veil becomes a powerful CD for large scale fights, creating an element that needs to be reacted too. It it makes the group sturdy for 6 seconds while being more of a tank like support ability instead of a healer tool. It introduces a potentially attractive utility in the form of major lifesteal. It would force groups to have to reposition or fight at a disadvantage. And in pve, I guess it could be a nice tool to alleviate some of the weight on a healer in certain encounters i suppose.

Bolstering could become a powerful escape CD for allies assuming it's used wisely ie not in the middle of everyone getting blasted with aoe, but rather when an organized group is able to pull back and relocate. And likewise it could be used preemptively to set up a suprise attack. The smaller radius would require coordination with allies as they would have to move with the NB and stay close. This could allow nice setups. And understand that is essential able to be done right now on live, I'm not saying the ult is slept on, but one could easily have a group gather around a corner, pop ultimate and everyone synergizes. It's just cumbersome and too short of a duration. Maybe keep the hidden refresh synergy that they can activate only while hidden to trigger a hot. Wouldnt really have too much use in pve I dont think, outside of skipping mobs lol.

Remember these would be expensive ultimates. And while this is a nb healer related thread, soul siphon, even after the cast time addition, is absolutely still one the best oh *** buttons in the game. On a properly built nb healer that can get it off safely, the healing power of it extreme amd can bring back a whole group from the brink. I think the shadow ultimates are better suited for expensive, high impact group utility.

TheDreamstride

umagon wrote: »

soul siphon, even after the cast time addition, is absolutely still one the best oh *** buttons in the game. On a properly built nb healer that can get it off safely, the healing power of it extreme amd can bring back a whole group from the brink. I think the shadow ultimates are better suited for expensive, high impact group utility.

I'm curious about the player cap of Soul Siphon, any idea on that? Throughout my NB Healer journey I always went with safe choices like horn and barrier and recently started to use Soul Siphon.

YandereGirlfriend

TheDreamstride wrote: »

umagon wrote: »

soul siphon, even after the cast time addition, is absolutely still one the best oh *** buttons in the game. On a properly built nb healer that can get it off safely, the healing power of it extreme amd can bring back a whole group from the brink. I think the shadow ultimates are better suited for expensive, high impact group utility.

I'm curious about the player cap of Soul Siphon, any idea on that? Throughout my NB Healer journey I always went with safe choices like horn and barrier and recently started to use Soul Siphon.

6 targets for the burst heal and Major Vitality and 12 targets for the HoT.

Syrpynt

So on the subject of NB's, I actually find that NB's are great to make tank+healer hybrids, since the self healing is great.

I have a specific theme for my NB tank that is to heal everyone while taking hits. Sadly I had to replace my Almalexia set since it doesn't perform as well as it used to since it scales on max mag/stam now.

1H&Sh front bar,
Restor staff back bar.

It's my favorite support tank out of all the ones I've ever made in the last 5.5 years of playing.