Sorcs In High MMR BGs

BASIClyGOD

I don't know exactly what changes need to be made but over the last week the amount of sorc spam in BGs has become unbearable.

The recent changes to stat stacking and builds are a great move but they also make the problems with sorc even more noticeable. The reduced stat pools mean breakfree/roll dodge and using mag abilities are even more costly and force stamina toons to run even higher regen to compensate for the lack of any real stam burst heals and defensive abilities. I main stam dk and with the complete dumpster tier changes to wings in the previous patches I have no way to protect myself from them.

They summon a whole zoo of pets then drop mines and wait for you to close the distance while bursting you down. If you do manage to close the distance they streak through you, cc'ing you right under their summons and then start over leaving you with half your resource pools gone and your buffs about to drop. I think making all pets/summons in the game untarget-able is a reasonable enough change that doesn't make the magsorcs lose any of the dps that gives it the characteristic magsorc "feel". No seasoned pvp player is trying to kill pets anyways so all it does is give sorcs another layer of shields to hide behind and is consistent with the changes to WW pets. This may also help combat lag as the game will no longer need to track pet health resources thought this is probably just optimistism.

Either way, this *** is getting ridiculous, my last 2 BGs had more pets than players.

tonyblack

Sorcs are everywhere because it's the only ranged mag class that is somewhat competitive with stamina after proc set nerfs.

BASIClyGOD

tonyblack wrote: »

Sorcs are everywhere because it's the only ranged mag class that is somewhat competitive with stamina after proc set nerfs.

You are forgetting magcro.

Competitiveness aside, the problem I'm trying to get addressed is the pets. Like I said in the post, pets/summons being target-able does nothing except give them a permanent wall to LoS behind. Removing this only changes the ability of other classes to actually target the player. I don't think they need a damage nerf or any sort of stat nerf. Just a modification to pets/summons in the game as a whole. Alternatively, just make tab-targeting work with gap-closers. The increasing spam of pets/summons is getting out of hand.

Waffennacht

Zoo was far more popular last year.

PhoenixGrey

And yet, sorc is still worse than basically any stam class

Draevik

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

And yet, sorc is still worse than basically any stam class

I always see Mag sorcs wiping the floor with stam toons, doesn't matter the class. There is no way that all the stam toons in these matches that I see them dominating are terrible.

Streak is one of the most broken abilities in this game, and I am a stam sorc. I hate using it because it feels really cheesy to use. It does too many things too well. Crystal frag free cast spam can wipe out people

Ward stacking, pets, tons of CC options aside from streak.

Sorcs are incredibly powerful.

Xargas13

I wouldn't stop with sorc pets, I think all pets shouldn't be targetable, including proc pets, and I am magcro who is hiding behind blastbones (usually from sorcs mind you)

Marcus_Aurelius

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

And yet, sorc is still worse than basically any stam class

An half competent group of sorcs in BGs can obliterate any stamina group.

NordSwordnBoard

Xargas13 wrote: »

I wouldn't stop with sorc pets, I think all pets shouldn't be targetable, including proc pets, and I am magcro who is hiding behind blastbones (usually from sorcs mind you)

LoS with objects you spawn is a very pungent cheese. Engine Guardian has disrupted/stopped me from executing enough times I just hate it lol. Streak, Cloak, Roll, Mist, Shade, whatever - none of that frustrates me the way pets do.

Tessitura

Xargas13 wrote: »

I wouldn't stop with sorc pets, I think all pets shouldn't be targetable, including proc pets, and I am magcro who is hiding behind blastbones (usually from sorcs mind you)

I have a unpopular opinion about that but I actually think necro is the only class that should have targetable pets. Its a class with no mobility and the area control isn't as good as sorc's which has massive mobility. Having temp pets to hid behind is very in fantasy for a necromancer and makes more sense for something with no mobility skills.

divnyi

Magsorcs were dominating noproc cyro. ZOS weakened the procs. People play magsorcs in BGs.

Like, what else did you expect?

Although if that's truly high MMR and premades, you should have no troubles dealing with them, as they are single target.

WrathOfInnos

As a sorc, I’m down for making pets untargetable and invincible. This was changed for dungeons and trials years ago and worked well there, why not extend it to all content? Sure the pets don’t take hits for you, but not having to protect them or resummon when they stand in red is worth it.

Waffennacht

Tbf, an untargetable and invincible clannfear would make for an extremely, if not impossible to kill health sorc

PhoenixGrey

Marcus_Aurelius wrote: »

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

And yet, sorc is still worse than basically any stam class

An half competent group of sorcs in BGs can obliterate any stamina group.

I myself obliterate groups of average mag sorcs in BG's even in high MMR games. In fact I end up exclusively farming mag sorcs in bg's as the class is squishy af

Every other stam class runs too much health for me to even bother with. High MMR stamdens and stamcros are still unkillable.

Xargas13

Tessitura wrote: »

Xargas13 wrote: »

I wouldn't stop with sorc pets, I think all pets shouldn't be targetable, including proc pets, and I am magcro who is hiding behind blastbones (usually from sorcs mind you)

I have a unpopular opinion about that but I actually think necro is the only class that should have targetable sorcs. Its a class with no mobility and the area control isn't as good as sorc's which has massive mobility. Having temp pets to hid behind is very in fantasy for a necromancer and makes more sense for something with no mobility skills.

That is actually makes sense, what doesn't make sense at the moment, that sorc with high mobility has all pets targetable, while our skeleton and spirit is not. Kind of makes you think on ZOS philosophy, or maybe they want sorcs so powerful, because they play them themselves

DontWorryAboutit

tonyblack wrote: »

Sorcs are everywhere because it's the only ranged mag class that is somewhat competitive with stamina after proc set nerfs.

Nope! Every pvp content mag sorc is struggling because of server performance, range casting is always negatively effected by this atrocious lag we endure.

KingKayanto

Sorc is the best! Hit em hard with the zipps!

master_vanargand

Pets, mines, 28m kill steal skill.
When fighting Sorc, it's hell whether you're near or far.
If the enemy team is 4 Sorc, you will want to destroy your PC.

Hotdog_23

No pet should not be permanent.

Magsorc is the best class for BG as they have everything in their toolkit except a purge skill. You don't even need to be a good player just half decent to make a dent in the other teams plans. Run across a good Magsorc and you are in trouble which can really be said for any class but for some reason, but it seems more people plays Magsorcs vs. the other original classes.

Stay safe and enjoy the journey 😊

PS. ZOS stop the micromanagement of the green tree 🥺

slimwaffle

This game is heavy melee focused. Everything good thats ranged gets hit with the nerfs over and over.
Not everyone wants to play melee.
When it comes to battlegrounds there are only 2 classes that are even worth playing. The rest will get destroyed.
That is nightblade ganker or high damage Sorc.
The nightblade takes advantage of stealth. They will always have an advantage because they can pick when and who they fight.

Now the only other viable option the sorc. These guys take full advantage over the terrible target system this game uses.
All a good sorc needs to do is keep shields up and keep his movement around his pets.
This way you will accidentally hit the pets majority of the time and when you do finally hit them they have shields up.

The fact they are 1 of 2 viable ranged classes and they can consistently break your targeting is why people play them.

But the problem isn't the players. Its ZOS the developers. People have been asking for a better target system for 7 years.

gariondavey

There are a lot of magcros in high mmr bgs on pc na as well, other than the mag and stam sorcs, stam nbs and magplars

Nick_Balza

The problem is not in sorcs. Problem is in bugs of skills which have to counter sorc's toolkit. Especially streak. I was trying the following to counter:
- Phantasmal Escape isn't working
- Essence of Immovability isn't working
- Acceleration isn't working
- Unstoppable isn't working
- Momentum isn't working

If any of those will start working - sorcs will not be an issue. But game is broken and I understand people who abuse their advantage. Because if they will not - someone will do it for sure.

Brander12

The problem is:
Stun from a stike, can't be blocked, dodged, works without target with insane range.
Stupid setup of armor, when heavy gives you resists, but if weakness from mage attacks.

MrMazurski

Nick_Balza wrote: »

The problem is not in sorcs. Problem is in bugs of skills which have to counter sorc's toolkit. Especially streak. I was trying the following to counter:
- Phantasmal Escape isn't working
- Essence of Immovability isn't working
- Acceleration isn't working
- Unstoppable isn't working
- Momentum isn't working

If any of those will start working - sorcs will not be an issue. But game is broken and I understand people who abuse their advantage. Because if they will not - someone will do it for sure.

Streak are stun, mostly examples what you give do not protect against stun. Most of the hardy CCs are simply unable to block. You just cant deal with it. Streak are faster than your reaction for it, mostly.