Fake healers and a suggestion to stop them

PullaStormy

I'm so tired of people queueing as a fake healer, I want a full party of appropriate roles as I don't want to repeat the bosses a million times when all the DDs die (I most often tank). It's also useful to have a healer if there are low level/CP players, as they will die more likely without a healer than someone on the 1000s.

And my suggestion to stop this is:

Add a role lock, just like there's and alliance lock for Cyro. Players would have to lock into one role for a month, preventing inconsiderate hotpants from ruining the fun for people who want to play by the rules. I'm tired of having to kick fake healers time and time again, so this would be for the best.

Varana

Then DDs will just queue as healers for a month. They're doing it anyway, so it wouldn't change anything.

Choosing the role in the UI is only really relevant for the group finder. And if they'd choose healer for the group finder anyway, your suggestion won't matter to them.

PullaStormy

Then make it permanent unless you refund all your skill points, attributes and champion points. Or, make healer only available as a role if you have restoration staff opened and equipped, as well as light armor. Same goes for tank, heavy armor and 1h + shield and/or ice staff equipped.

Eso101rus

PullaStormy wrote: »

I'm so tired of people queueing as a fake healer, I want a full party of appropriate roles as I don't want to repeat the bosses a million times when all the DDs die (I most often tank). It's also useful to have a healer if there are low level/CP players, as they will die more likely without a healer than someone on the 1000s.

And my suggestion to stop this is:

Add a role lock, just like there's and alliance lock for Cyro. Players would have to lock into one role for a month, preventing inconsiderate hotpants from ruining the fun for people who want to play by the rules. I'm tired of having to kick fake healers time and time again, so this would be for the best.

Whilst it’s frustrating the only way to run a group the way you want is through friends and guilds. The group finder is random for a reason.🤷🏼‍♂️

zvavi

PullaStormy wrote: »

Then make it permanent unless you refund all your skill points, attributes and champion points. Or, make healer only available as a role if you have restoration staff opened and equipped, as well as light armor. Same goes for tank, heavy armor and 1h + shield and/or ice staff equipped.

Add a 30k dps check to dds and we have a deal

VaranisArano

PullaStormy wrote: »

Then make it permanent unless you refund all your skill points, attributes and champion points. Or, make healer only available as a role if you have restoration staff opened and equipped, as well as light armor. Same goes for tank, heavy armor and 1h + shield and/or ice staff equipped.

Just because you forced someone to equip it to queue doesn't mean it stays equipped when they enter the dungeon. Or that they use it.

Or, for that matter, that they need it. My pet-MagSorc tanks random normals no problem...with Inner Fire and Light Armor. And have you never had a tank swap to a damage dealer set for untauntable bosses like the Engine Guardian?

It's really easy to turn your preconceived notions about "real tanks" into overly restrictive prescriptions.

bmnoble

zvavi wrote: »

PullaStormy wrote: »

Then make it permanent unless you refund all your skill points, attributes and champion points. Or, make healer only available as a role if you have restoration staff opened and equipped, as well as light armor. Same goes for tank, heavy armor and 1h + shield and/or ice staff equipped.

Add a 30k dps check to dds and we have a deal

I would settle for 20K from each damage dealer, if they guaranteed that, tanks and healers would be more willing to queue randoms more often without finding their own groups.

VaranisArano

bmnoble wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

PullaStormy wrote: »

Then make it permanent unless you refund all your skill points, attributes and champion points. Or, make healer only available as a role if you have restoration staff opened and equipped, as well as light armor. Same goes for tank, heavy armor and 1h + shield and/or ice staff equipped.

Add a 30k dps check to dds and we have a deal

I would settle for 20K from each damage dealer, if they guaranteed that, tanks and healers would be more willing to queue randoms more often without finding their own groups.

For Vet dungeons, I assume?

Normals, ah...if I get 10k per DD, everything below DLC level is pretty simple. Fights might take longer, but we're not going to fail the dungeon.

Greystag

A role lock? No. Just no. Many people such as myself play and queue up as all roles.

Fake roles are really hard to fix in this game. If you're tired of them just join a guild instead of trying to restrict the playstyle of others, honestly.

Parasaurolophus

You probably know that even the most difficult dungeons can be completed without a healer. Finder is used by many people to get 600 wpd / spd and experience / geode. By introducing any restrictions on the role, you will strike at experienced players who can play without a healer.

Sarannah

Actually, it is those who do not intend to do the role they signed up for, which should find their own groups. ZOS should enforce roles, even if it hinders builddiversity somewhat. This fake-role abuse has to stop!

Pelirockjo

Absolutly awful idea

BlueRaven

Just make tanks and healers as fun to play as a dd. Then the dungeon queues issues will solve themselves.

Tanks and healers qol keeps getting gutted, so there is no wonder there is a shortage.

jle30303

BUT... the thing that mostly makes tanks and healers unfun to play in group content is "other players".

Be nicer to your tanks and healers and more people will play them.

PigofSteel

I mean for Normals no but for Veteran there should be penalty for fake Tanks and Healers and DD should have some sort of minimum requirements.

oddbasket

Restrictions almost never works and more often punishes players, incentives sometimes do. The reason players are doing this is quite simply for the pledges and daily rewards.

Since the game is capable of measuring damage taken, healing and dps, they can make is so that each pledge rewards double the transmutes and keys if you hit the minimum target set for each role. This also needs to apply to daily random reward to encourage players to stick to their roles.

Tanks will want to taunt bosses and maybe even adds to get a certain amount of damage taken/blocked, healers will want to do enough healing and DDs have to meet some dps standard to earn those rewards.

ZOS don't even have to double the rewards, they can halve it instead and you earn the full rewards by fulfilling your roles.

Edit: Just to add on, don't think of this as punishing newer players who can't meet the targets for the bonus rewards. It just means they are not yet at that level or experience. This also fulfills the purpose of gauging where players themselves stand and encourage them to improve to a certain standard for a smooth dungeon run which itself is a complaint by many for years where players have no idea where they stand or no motivation to improve.

BlueRaven

jle30303 wrote: »

BUT... the thing that mostly makes tanks and healers unfun to play in group content is "other players".

Be nicer to your tanks and healers and more people will play them.

You can say other players make dungeons unfun to play, regardless of role.

Specifically I was referring to the dps of tanks and healers make them unfun, because after the dungeon is over those roles still have to get stuff done.

Please do not say they can regear or whatever when doing overland content. Because they still won’t do as much damage as a dd AND regearing your character is a hassle that dedicated dds don’t need to do.

LettuceBrain

I think at this point the only thing that could stop fake roles is to have the tank and healer roles have DPS penalties (only in group content), but nobody wants that.

Starlight_Whisper

bmnoble wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

PullaStormy wrote: »

Then make it permanent unless you refund all your skill points, attributes and champion points. Or, make healer only available as a role if you have restoration staff opened and equipped, as well as light armor. Same goes for tank, heavy armor and 1h + shield and/or ice staff equipped.

Add a 30k dps check to dds and we have a deal

I would settle for 20K from each damage dealer, if they guaranteed that, tanks and healers would be more willing to queue randoms more often without finding their own groups.

Hell I would settle with 15k dps. That's fair if you are just trying.

Starlight_Whisper

LettuceBrain wrote: »

I think at this point the only thing that could stop fake roles is to have the tank and healer roles have DPS penalties (only in group content), but nobody wants that.

I accept that.

Scale Healer sets to Magicka Regain too so lost with spell damage

LettuceBrain

Starlight_Whisper wrote: »

LettuceBrain wrote: »

I think at this point the only thing that could stop fake roles is to have the tank and healer roles have DPS penalties (only in group content), but nobody wants that.

I accept that.

Scale Healer sets to Magicka Regain too so lost with spell damage

I got the idea from another game, SWTOR. Picking the tank spec of your class causes you to get a damage penalty, but you get more defense or something. The only problem is that to my knowledge healing scales off of spell damage in this game, so the healing role would have to lower your spell damage or whatever but also raise healing specifically.

Starlight_Whisper

LettuceBrain wrote: »

Starlight_Whisper wrote: »

LettuceBrain wrote: »

I think at this point the only thing that could stop fake roles is to have the tank and healer roles have DPS penalties (only in group content), but nobody wants that.

I accept that.

Scale Healer sets to Magicka Regain too so lost with spell damage

I got the idea from another game, SWTOR. Picking the tank spec of your class causes you to get a damage penalty, but you get more defense or something. The only problem is that to my knowledge healing scales off of spell damage in this game, so the healing role would have to lower your spell damage or whatever but also raise healing specifically.

Guess role lock is best plan. Just lock it for a month like alliance.

LettuceBrain

Starlight_Whisper wrote: »

LettuceBrain wrote: »

Starlight_Whisper wrote: »

LettuceBrain wrote: »

I think at this point the only thing that could stop fake roles is to have the tank and healer roles have DPS penalties (only in group content), but nobody wants that.

I accept that.

Scale Healer sets to Magicka Regain too so lost with spell damage

I got the idea from another game, SWTOR. Picking the tank spec of your class causes you to get a damage penalty, but you get more defense or something. The only problem is that to my knowledge healing scales off of spell damage in this game, so the healing role would have to lower your spell damage or whatever but also raise healing specifically.

Guess role lock is best plan. Just lock it for a month like alliance.

The only issue I see with that is that it just seems like faster queues for fake roles for a month.

iksde

Starlight_Whisper wrote: »

bmnoble wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

PullaStormy wrote: »

Then make it permanent unless you refund all your skill points, attributes and champion points. Or, make healer only available as a role if you have restoration staff opened and equipped, as well as light armor. Same goes for tank, heavy armor and 1h + shield and/or ice staff equipped.

Add a 30k dps check to dds and we have a deal

I would settle for 20K from each damage dealer, if they guaranteed that, tanks and healers would be more willing to queue randoms more often without finding their own groups.

Hell I would settle with 15k dps. That's fair if you are just trying.

then it will need to be individual for normals, vets and dlc dungs as just "trying" while having problem progress this wont be enough on dlc

not forgetting also to "rework" dungs/content then to make healers more viable as it is very good know for more exp players healers are just useless anywhere if they cant buff so great like in trials good premades

svendf

Easy to fix. If you use public group finder rules apply for roles. Form your own grroup you have no rules - same as in a Craglorn PUG, trials and dungeons.

Arnoldthehawk

I would introduce a quota system.

Every player could report each other in the group anonimously as fake role. Now if this player get, say 10 reports on a single day he/she would be locked out of the LFG system for a week.

The system could be abusable, but won't. Why? People often don't even use kick option, which is also a very much abusable mechanic.

If too much abuse of this quota system gets reported, ZoS could simply adjust the needed number of report for initiate the lockout.

ClawOfTheTwoMoons

If you see someone faking a role, and things aren't going so well just vote kick. If someone's gonna fake tank or heal they should atleast be pulling good dps.

Agenericname

Starlight_Whisper wrote: »

LettuceBrain wrote: »

Starlight_Whisper wrote: »

LettuceBrain wrote: »

I think at this point the only thing that could stop fake roles is to have the tank and healer roles have DPS penalties (only in group content), but nobody wants that.

I accept that.

Scale Healer sets to Magicka Regain too so lost with spell damage

I got the idea from another game, SWTOR. Picking the tank spec of your class causes you to get a damage penalty, but you get more defense or something. The only problem is that to my knowledge healing scales off of spell damage in this game, so the healing role would have to lower your spell damage or whatever but also raise healing specifically.

Guess role lock is best plan. Just lock it for a month like alliance.

It wouldnt make it better, at all. All but one of my characters can and often do tank. They have gear and they have the abilities. What this proposal does is force me to choose and by doing so remove 6 of the 8 tanks, real tanks who have zero issues tanking vet DLCs, by locking them into a role.

This proposal punishes people playing real support roles for something that DDs do. Thats not going to get more in the queue, probably fewer.

LettuceBrain

I just came up with an idea that is probably utter garbage. How about each role has to meet a certain requirement or they can't queue as that role until, I don't know, 30 minutes later or something? For example, healer has to get 300k HPS (I don't know what the number should actually be, this is just an example) and if they don't meet that standard in their first dungeon they cannot queue as healer for another 30 minutes (again, that number is just an example). For tanks it would be aggro time or a certain number of taunts (or something else if anyone has better ideas for tank requirements).

Starlight_Whisper

Arnoldthehawk wrote: »

I would introduce a quota system.

Every player could report each other in the group anonimously as fake role. Now if this player get, say 10 reports on a single day he/she would be locked out of the LFG system for a week.

The system could be abusable, but won't. Why? People often don't even use kick option, which is also a very much abusable mechanic.

If too much abuse of this quota system gets reported, ZoS could simply adjust the needed number of report for initiate the lockout.

Class discrimination would is still a problem.

Starlight_Whisper

LettuceBrain wrote: »

I just came up with an idea that is probably utter garbage. How about each role has to meet a certain requirement or they can't queue as that role until, I don't know, 30 minutes later or something? For example, healer has to get 300k HPS (I don't know what the number should actually be, this is just an example) and if they don't meet that standard in their first dungeon they cannot queue as healer for another 30 minutes (again, that number is just an example). For tanks it would be aggro time or a certain number of taunts (or something else if anyone has better ideas for tank requirements).

Actually speaking of problems. The hps requirements in dungeons is just depressing. Like looking at logs some don't even get 1k. Dungeons should do more damage over time