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A system to avoid or explain logical inconsistencies/plot holes

Tesman85
Tesman85
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I've been playing ESO seriously for half a year now, and love it. Generally speaking, the writing quality in quest lines is very good and as a (mostly) quester that makes me very happy. However, the sheer amount of plotlines, the dividing of some of the said plotlines into different alliances and the fact that all one player's characters share a bank and thus must exist in the same "time-space" do create quite a few narrative problems for anyone who cares about such things. Unfortunately, I do care to a point. So, there has to be a way to explain how it is possible that different characters can do the same plotlines. Some of the ways could be (listed in the order of seriousness):

1. How can different characters complete the same questlines, even though they logically obviously could not (because only one of them would be able to)? Of course, one could just complete one questline woth only one character, but that would create its own problems. E.g. it would be a major plot hole if with one character cleared Velyn Harbor, but with another one who comes there later it would be in the hands of the invaders still (and remained so, because the later visitor didn't clear the town).

The solution: It could be thought that the first character to complete a quest was the only one "really" doing it. For the later ones could be argued that they are hearing the events from the first completer, and are putting themselves in that character's place in their thoughts. This is neat in my opinion, since the questlines rarely seem to feature choices that have very visible consequences. Most of them are of the sort that making a different choice with a later character could be construed as that character saying when hearing the tale: "Oh, you did that? Well, in your place I would have..."

Another solution is that later characters only do the quests which have the most visible consequences. For instance, I personally plan to play the alliance questlines through by every member character of the respective alliances because they alter things quite a bit. Another example of this are the quests where a whole town must be liberated in order to it become "usable", which I'll do even with a member of an opposing alliance if they have been cleared by a member of that alliance before.

2. Why do all these characters share a bank and so, obviously also space-time? The solution: My personal solution to this is that they all know each other at least indirectly. As an old habit, I make some kind of backstories for all my characters, so this is easy for me. For instance, my earliest four characters are members of a now defunct mercenary company, who originally made a contract to establish a common bank account with certain conditions. The rest have either met all or some of them earlier, or are friends to those who know the quartet. Anyway, the latecomers have joined the contract later via earlier members. Lately they also have decided to employ a shady Dunmer banker as a convenient go-between.

3. How can Nuzhimeh and Tythis always be there when you need them, even though they can have just a moment ago been seen by another character the whole continent away? The solution: This one's easy. Either they are secretly also mages able to use teleport magic (and an alert system for customers in need), or disguised Daedra. This is more of a question if the player characters would want to know...

4. Of course, all of the above could be explained away by a dragon break or some other freaky time metaphysics stuff in which the Elder Scrolls lore seems to find delight. Or, if we are to be really boring, by "duh, it's just how the devs decided the game mechanics should be!". But where would be the fun in that?

Any other potential logical holes anyone has spotted? It would be interesting to hear how others think of these.

  • redspecter23
    redspecter23
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    Magic/time travel/alternate universes/etc.

    Some things are the way they are because they mechanically have to be that way to account for multiple players in the same world that are essentially the same person. You can explain it away any way you want to. I choose to go with one of the above in situations that are just too muddled to make standard logical sense. My character is not all knowing. I assume there are things going on that I have no knowledge of and just go about my business.
  • Amottica
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    To the first point, it is quite simple. It is normal and common in MMORPGs that the character is the hero saving the day even though pretty much everyone's character does the same thing. The perspective is that only that character did it because it is their world, period, end of the story. Every other character is just a normal person in the world your character just saved. No changes are needed.

    2. We share a bank because it is an account bank. It allows us to share items across characters to make it easier to play the game. Again, something that other MMORPGs have though not all of them. Geat feature.

    I do not think a dragon break is needed for any of this.
  • Tesman85
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    Amottica wrote: »
    To the first point, it is quite simple. It is normal and common in MMORPGs that the character is the hero saving the day even though pretty much everyone's character does the same thing. The perspective is that only that character did it because it is their world, period, end of the story. Every other character is just a normal person in the world your character just saved. No changes are needed.

    2. We share a bank because it is an account bank. It allows us to share items across characters to make it easier to play the game. Again, something that other MMORPGs have though not all of them. Geat feature.

    I do not think a dragon break is needed for any of this.

    Oh, but I was thinking explanations that would make sense in-game. I'm fully aware that these things are common mechanics in MMORPGs.

    This is more a sort of brain-game for me, since logic holes in fiction annoy me. So, they should have an in-world explanation.
  • WiseSky
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    I found a trick to summon Ebazi the Banker. If you find a Fishing Spot and get catch a fish.

    He will always find me and we usually only trade then, in exchange for his services I let him have the fish.
    I beat the Loot Box System,
    I got an Apex Mount from a Free Drop Crate.
  • VaranisArano
    VaranisArano
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    I find that most of the storylines make more sense when ESO is played in chronological order of release, i.e. according to the internal logic of its stories. For example, the splitting off into other alliances IS explained...you just have to complete the Main Quest to get the lore explanation for why you can do all three.

    Beyond that, when it comes to Alts and other MMO shenanigans...

    Roleplay a solution. Your solution may not be the same as mine. For that reason, I don't want ZOS to dictate how Alts work in game or how my characters do or don't know each other. We really can't have a set in-game explanation that isn't going to trample over someone's roleplaying.
  • Tesman85
    Tesman85
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    I find that most of the storylines make more sense when ESO is played in chronological order of release, i.e. according to the internal logic of its stories. For example, the splitting off into other alliances IS explained...you just have to complete the Main Quest to get the lore explanation for why you can do all three.

    Beyond that, when it comes to Alts and other MMO shenanigans...

    Roleplay a solution. Your solution may not be the same as mine. For that reason, I don't want ZOS to dictate how Alts work in game or how my characters do or don't know each other. We really can't have a set in-game explanation that isn't going to trample over someone's roleplaying.

    Well, I already made the mistake of playing some chapters first with a few characters and only after that delving into the main and alliance quest lines. Fortunately the latter are at least internally consistent. I plan only to do the pertaining alliance quests with the characters that belong to those alliances, and leave Cadwell's silver and gold alone. And I still have some alts who haven't been used in anything other than daily writs or things like the Thieves Guild which is so separate from the other questlines that it doesn't matter when it is completed. I think I'll take one of them and play the questlines in the order you suggested, to experience the flow of the story as it "should" be.

    I agree with you in that there shouldn't be a "canonical" solution to timeline problems with alts. Anything that ZOS could invent couldn't satisfy every player. Thus, the thoughts in my first post are only my personal takes, not requests for ZOS to force anything like that on anybody.
  • aipex8_ESO
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    I often will headcanon that two or even three of my characters are friendly enough that they quest together. When they do the same quest line they are actually doing it together.

    The main thing that helps me with headcanon though, is thinkiing of everything in game as an approximation of what actually happened. Like this is what would be written down in history books by people who weren't actually there. That explains time and space compression, how I can travel so fast, and why my character never seems to know anything, just asks stupid questions and has to be told to do everything (except lead in a fight). My headcanon conversations are much different, lol.
  • SpaceElf
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    All of my characters are the same 'person' (me, lol, sort of, I am the placeholder) but are different reincarnations of each other within different timelines. This is to explore various outcomes of the decisions I make.
  • BulletMagnetX
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    My solution is: Dragon Break.

    Yes, I know. The devs say it's not actually a Dragon Break. But are they experts in Dragon Breaks? I think not.

    Am I an expert in Dragon Breaks?

    ...

    I think I might be exactly that.

    So we'll be going by my word on such issues from now on.
    Molag's balls!
  • Athan1
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    Have one character, problem solved ;)
    Athan Atticus Imperial Templar of Shezarr
  • RaddlemanNumber7
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    Judging the rightness or wrongness of empirical reality in the TES universe based on real-world expectations does have its faults. The worlds are not the same.

    The TES universe is a dream. Anu is the Dreamer. Ultimately, things in the Aurbis are the way they are because that is the Dreamer's experience of reality.

    If my expectations don't match with empirical reality I know it is my expectations that are wrong and need changing.

    But, I may not be capable of understanding why things are as they are. Why should I be able to understand the experiences of a god i.e. the Dreamer?

    TLDR: it's due to divine ineffability.

    So, I accept my ignorance and lack of understanding. Empirical reality in the game is what it is.

    I let it go. No worries. Problem solved :)
    PC EU
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