Most Popular MMO's do this...

Thealteregoroman

ESO is one of the last popular MMO's to have their original class skills not expanded upon yet via like "awakening" or some other system. We have a LOT of surplus of skyshards to spend endgame-wise... I'm thinking at some point down the line as they see how we actually use companions and their abilities our skill lines are gonna be expanded upon, but I also think we may get WAY HARDER content because of it.

I personally feel like restoring class pride will be the next big thing...then after that spell crafting. This game looks amazing and everyone in the game speaks to you. No need to read what people are saying. To be the first popular MMO to create your own skills would set them apart from all the other MMOs.

I have accepted the nerf game during the years and I am always surprised by ESO's clever way of making the game still fresh after all this time. I primarily play as a healer, I'm not afraid of companions becoming pocket healers because I'm confident in the role I play in the game. The more combinations we have the better. If spell crafting were to come I don't think it would ever be in PVP.

I also would like a loadout for when I need to do dungeons. with one click be able to put on all my healer gear and healer skills on my Hotbar before combat.

What do you guys think ESO will bring in the future? I am really liking the companion aspects and the antiquities system. Most of the systems they've created have been awesome.

Based on the pattern of ESO updates what do you see them bringing future content-wise that's innovative?

tsaescishoeshiner

A new skill line per class, or even class skill-modifying gear, or even third morphs for some class skills, would be awesome. I think ESO's lack of cooldowns and ability to slot only 12 skills of your choice makes it more complicated to do this than in other MMOs, but it's still doable.

And if they do it, we'll be treated to endless "pay-to-win" threads on the forums! Win-win.

Nestor

They have been promising Spell Crafting for so long now. Well, "working on it" for so long now.

They have enough issues balancing skills now, but if they ever split PvP and PvE Skill Sets, then ZOS would actually get more freedom to do fun things.

SirAndy

Thealteregoroman wrote: »

I personally feel like restoring class pride will be the next big thing...

My characters have always been proud of their history and choices.

Iccotak

Nestor wrote: »

They have been promising Spell Crafting for so long now. Well, "working on it" for so long now.

They have enough issues balancing skills now, but if they ever split PvP and PvE Skill Sets, then ZOS would actually get more freedom to do fun things.

They actually have not been promising this feature - they showed it off once, and it's very clear that Ice destruction skills were given to Warden class.

Spell Crafting was an experiment that was clearly shelved

Thealteregoroman

SirAndy wrote: »

Thealteregoroman wrote: »

I personally feel like restoring class pride will be the next big thing...

My characters have always been proud of their history and choices.

I meant..."meta class" I'm not speaking for you, but there is a clear "what class you should play for max damage" meta out.

Thealteregoroman

Iccotak wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

They have been promising Spell Crafting for so long now. Well, "working on it" for so long now.

They have enough issues balancing skills now, but if they ever split PvP and PvE Skill Sets, then ZOS would actually get more freedom to do fun things.

They actually have not been promising this feature - they showed it off once, and it's very clear that Ice destruction skills were given to Warden class.

Spell Crafting was an experiment that was clearly shelved

Like Companions, there were 100's of posts saying it won't ever happen. It's here now and it's a great addition to the game. I'm all about new systems to ESO so the game doesn't get stale. ESO is clearly good at making new systems that require you to explore Tamriel.

until ZOS says it's not coming ever...that's when I'll know it's not a possibility.

Thealteregoroman

tsaescishoeshiner wrote: »

A new skill line per class, or even class skill-modifying gear, or even third morphs for some class skills, would be awesome. I think ESO's lack of cooldowns and ability to slot only 12 skills of your choice makes it more complicated to do this than in other MMOs, but it's still doable.

And if they do it, we'll be treated to endless "pay-to-win" threads on the forums! Win-win.

I can def see this happening at somepoint

Finedaible

I think they trapped themselves by pushing their game design to its limits without leaving room for expanding game mechanics and abilities (weapon types as well) in favor of cosmetics, motifs, and pets and the gamble crates. From what we do know, spell-crafting was likely abandoned in favor of the housing update, and supposedly elements from the crafting systems were repurposed for the Antiquites system so it's not happening anymore. They should have never announced it without being 100% certain it would be implemented... Additionally, they have been struggling to get the game and database performance under control just to release another update, the latest of which only has companions... It's extremely far-fetched that we will ever see a new skill-line in the future, let alone an expansion of all class abilities.

I mean just look at how many new motifs and sets they release with each update. There has to be a tipping point where they exceed what their database can handle before performance is compromised.

Kiralyn2000

"Most popular MMOs" also have ever-increasing level caps, which necessitates having higher-level ranks & types of class skills.

Thealteregoroman wrote: »

but I also think we may get WAY HARDER content because of it.

Eh, good luck with that.

Sanguinor2

Thealteregoroman wrote: »

I personally feel like restoring class pride will be the next big thing

What gives you that idea? Zos has been hard at work to destroy uniqeness of classes for years.

Iccotak

Thealteregoroman wrote: »

Iccotak wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

They have been promising Spell Crafting for so long now. Well, "working on it" for so long now.

They have enough issues balancing skills now, but if they ever split PvP and PvE Skill Sets, then ZOS would actually get more freedom to do fun things.

They actually have not been promising this feature - they showed it off once, and it's very clear that Ice destruction skills were given to Warden class.

Spell Crafting was an experiment that was clearly shelved

Like Companions, there were 100's of posts saying it won't ever happen. It's here now and it's a great addition to the game. I'm all about new systems to ESO so the game doesn't get stale. ESO is clearly good at making new systems that require you to explore Tamriel.

until ZOS says it's not coming ever...that's when I'll know it's not a possibility.

I am not saying it's impossible but it should be clear that they did not promise it. It was experimental feature that they were playing around with that never came to fruition.

Since that time they have made it clear not to show off experimental ideas - only to showcase what is definitely being released.

If Spellcrafting happens it won't be like what they showed off all those years ago.

SirAndy

Thealteregoroman wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

Thealteregoroman wrote: »

I personally feel like restoring class pride will be the next big thing...

My characters have always been proud of their history and choices.

I meant..."meta class" I'm not speaking for you, but there is a clear "what class you should play for max damage" meta out.

Ah yes, i can see how that type of player would be looking for something to be proud of ...

Wolfpaw

Elite Specializations - similar to GW2

Dual Specializations ooc loadouts

spartaxoxo

You're not gonna get much harder content when the hard content we have right now is too difficult for the vast, vast, vast majority of the playerbase. @ me on that when more than like .1% of players can do vet dlc trials.

This game has plenty of hard content and the content that is easy is mostly for newcomers.

Seraphayel

Honestly, we don’t even need more skill lines for classes. Yes, it would be fantastic, but what we really need is more options in weapons, aka Melee Magicka weapon, maybe a Melee healing weapon and another range / mid range weapon. I hate that I’m forced to use Staves as Magicka.

Iccotak

spartaxoxo wrote: »

You're not gonna get much harder content when the hard content we have right now is too difficult for the vast, vast, vast majority of the playerbase. @ me on that when more than like .1% of players can do vet dlc trials.

This game has plenty of hard content and the content that is easy is mostly for newcomers.

Problem is that there is not much of a middle ground between Starter Island level Easy Overland vs Hardcore Endgame

zvavi

Iccotak wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

You're not gonna get much harder content when the hard content we have right now is too difficult for the vast, vast, vast majority of the playerbase. @ me on that when more than like .1% of players can do vet dlc trials.

This game has plenty of hard content and the content that is easy is mostly for newcomers.

Problem is that there is not much of a middle ground between Starter Island level Easy Overland vs Hardcore Endgame

The problem is lack of in-game proper role tutorials and training grounds. You would see a much higher average player strength if people could practice in a non pressure, not judging environment.

TwinLamps

I just wish for #stamwhip.
If spellcrafting is what is needed for us to get that, so be it.

Iccotak

zvavi wrote: »

Iccotak wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

You're not gonna get much harder content when the hard content we have right now is too difficult for the vast, vast, vast majority of the playerbase. @ me on that when more than like .1% of players can do vet dlc trials.

This game has plenty of hard content and the content that is easy is mostly for newcomers.

Problem is that there is not much of a middle ground between Starter Island level Easy Overland vs Hardcore Endgame

The problem is lack of in-game proper role tutorials and training grounds. You would see a much higher average player strength if people could practice in a non pressure, not judging environment.

Introduction Tutorials can only do so much - players are not regularly in scenarios where they need to use the skills that the Tutorial taught them. Like dodging, blocking, & interrupting.

General enemy populace does not provide enough of a threat to make players consider consequences.

Thealteregoroman

Iccotak wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

Iccotak wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

You're not gonna get much harder content when the hard content we have right now is too difficult for the vast, vast, vast majority of the playerbase. @ me on that when more than like .1% of players can do vet dlc trials.

This game has plenty of hard content and the content that is easy is mostly for newcomers.

Problem is that there is not much of a middle ground between Starter Island level Easy Overland vs Hardcore Endgame

The problem is lack of in-game proper role tutorials and training grounds. You would see a much higher average player strength if people could practice in a non pressure, not judging environment.

Introduction Tutorials can only do so much - players are not regularly in scenarios where they need to use the skills that the Tutorial taught them. Like dodging, blocking, & interrupting.

General enemy populace does not provide enough of a threat to make players consider consequences.

You right @Iccotak but those overland bosses for a casual like myself is hard...

Iccotak

Thealteregoroman wrote: »

Iccotak wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

Iccotak wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

You're not gonna get much harder content when the hard content we have right now is too difficult for the vast, vast, vast majority of the playerbase. @ me on that when more than like .1% of players can do vet dlc trials.

This game has plenty of hard content and the content that is easy is mostly for newcomers.

Problem is that there is not much of a middle ground between Starter Island level Easy Overland vs Hardcore Endgame

The problem is lack of in-game proper role tutorials and training grounds. You would see a much higher average player strength if people could practice in a non pressure, not judging environment.

Introduction Tutorials can only do so much - players are not regularly in scenarios where they need to use the skills that the Tutorial taught them. Like dodging, blocking, & interrupting.

General enemy populace does not provide enough of a threat to make players consider consequences.

You right @Iccotak but those overland bosses for a casual like myself is hard...

If you're talking about World Bosses then yeah they are supposed to be taken on by groups. Doesn't say anything about you to not be able to solo it.

What people are talking about are the Quest Bosses. Like for the main storyline.

and generally speaking I am an advocate for separate instances so then both sides get what they want.

Ergele

Thealteregoroman wrote: »

ESO is one of the last popular MMO's to have their original class skills not expanded upon yet via like "awakening" or some other system. We have a LOT of surplus of skyshards to spend endgame-wise... I'm thinking at some point down the line as they see how we actually use companions and their abilities our skill lines are gonna be expanded upon, but I also think we may get WAY HARDER content because of it.

I personally feel like restoring class pride will be the next big thing...then after that spell crafting. This game looks amazing and everyone in the game speaks to you. No need to read what people are saying. To be the first popular MMO to create your own skills would set them apart from all the other MMOs.

I have accepted the nerf game during the years and I am always surprised by ESO's clever way of making the game still fresh after all this time. I primarily play as a healer, I'm not afraid of companions becoming pocket healers because I'm confident in the role I play in the game. The more combinations we have the better. If spell crafting were to come I don't think it would ever be in PVP.

I also would like a loadout for when I need to do dungeons. with one click be able to put on all my healer gear and healer skills on my Hotbar before combat.

What do you guys think ESO will bring in the future? I am really liking the companion aspects and the antiquities system. Most of the systems they've created have been awesome.

Based on the pattern of ESO updates what do you see them bringing future content-wise that's innovative?

I am a huge shill for vet overland. Due to Covid I am out of things to do so I am taking it to the forums. so ofc vet overland would be very cool.

other than that well, spellcrafting was scrapped due to balancing hell. Maybe they can revive it?

Lots of people asked for sword/magic, that would be nice.

GarnetFire17

I had always thought they should do another level of morphs

iksde

tsaescishoeshiner wrote: »

A new skill line per class, or even class skill-modifying gear, or even third morphs for some class skills, would be awesome. I think ESO's lack of cooldowns and ability to slot only 12 skills of your choice makes it more complicated to do this than in other MMOs, but it's still doable.

And if they do it, we'll be treated to endless "pay-to-win" threads on the forums! Win-win.

and it will change literally nothing
already we have p2w warden and necro xD
and people was crying for pets from crownstore giving you 5 slots in per character backpack on account for being also p2w so why to care about this? xD

phaneub17_ESO

I would like to see at the very least they devote an entire year adding 4 morphs per class skill, 2 Magicka and 2 Stamina. Everything else can stay at 2 Morphs since they're very specific tied to a stat.

spartaxoxo

Iccotak wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

You're not gonna get much harder content when the hard content we have right now is too difficult for the vast, vast, vast majority of the playerbase. @ me on that when more than like .1% of players can do vet dlc trials.

This game has plenty of hard content and the content that is easy is mostly for newcomers.

Problem is that there is not much of a middle ground between Starter Island level Easy Overland vs Hardcore Endgame

Yeah there is, in my opinion the content is developed as follows

Beginner
Starter Island Easy Overland
Delves
Most Public Dungeons
Most world bosses
Normal non-dlc dungeons

Normal
Normal dlc dungeons
Most Vet base game dungeons
Normal Crag trials
A few public dungeon bosses and world bosses
Geysers

Intermediate
The rest of the Vet base game dungeons
Most DLC world bosses
Dragons and Harrowstorms
Vet Craglorn trials, non-achievement
The other dlc dungeons achievements
Normal DLC TRIALS

Hard
Vet DLC dungeons, non-achievement
A few DLC world bosses
Some DLC dungeon achievement

Harder
Vet Craglorn achievements
Vet DLC dungeons achievements

Hardest
Vet DLC Trial completes

Nightmare
DLC trial achievements

If you're in the Nightmare bracket, you probably feel like all the other stuff is beginner level. But the rest of the playerbase most certainly doesn't. A lot of the playerbase gets stuck at "Harder" and doesn't make it to the hardest content let alone Nightmare.

On top of that the more casual players that never make it past "Normal" difficulty, also experience just as much of a lack of new content as the Nightmare players. Because ZOS is releasing a lot of the new content to the people in the between.

The normals get basically just the zone stories and the delves. The Nightmare level players basically only get the trials. It's the center that gets most of the content and has most of the playerbase, rather than the two extremes. Also imo there's a lot of people in the intermediate bracket that seem to want to take the content from beginners instead of improving past that bracket. They'd find the challenge they are looking for if they did, but they don't want to for whatever reason.

Iccotak

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Iccotak wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

You're not gonna get much harder content when the hard content we have right now is too difficult for the vast, vast, vast majority of the playerbase. @ me on that when more than like .1% of players can do vet dlc trials.

This game has plenty of hard content and the content that is easy is mostly for newcomers.

Problem is that there is not much of a middle ground between Starter Island level Easy Overland vs Hardcore Endgame

Yeah there is, in my opinion the content is developed as follows

[snip]

If you're in the Nightmare bracket, you probably feel may like all the other stuff is beginner level. But the rest of the playerbase most certainly doesn't. A lot of the playerbase gets stuck at "Harder" and doesn't make it to the hardest content let alone Nightmare.

So Overland - the majority of the content - is in the beginner category, and it is somehow a wonder as to why New, Casual, & Vet players alike have said they find Overland too easy, not engaging, and doesn't prepare the average player for harder content down the road....

It is a decent looking list but that does not change the fact that the content you listed out in "Hard-Nightmare" encompasses a minority of the content. A very small slice. That "middle-ground" is in a very small slice of the game and is also not much of a middle ground as there is a definite spike at Hard-Harder that too many players are not prepared for.

I engage with the "Hard-Harder" category (which I would consider endgame) - however just because there is harder content does not mean that the overland content is Not boring. Nice story but overall not engaging in gameplay. Max skill peaks at lvl 20 - at most.

Overland is a challenge for beginner players, but they are not always going to be beginners - and if over 20 zones (and counting) are for beginner players then it is going to get stale very fast - and it is not a great way to learn how to play the game.

The "harder" content happens in very specific places - meaning that the average player is not going to run into a challenging encounters that pushes them to actually learn how to fight, because just about the whole zone is "beginners"...

spartaxoxo

Iccotak wrote: »

So Overland - the majority of the content - is in the beginner category

How is the majority of content in the first place? It's largely not repeatable content (unless you roll an alt) unlike dungeons and trials. You'll get much less playtime out of it. I guess there's more named quests but they don't really constitute a lot of playtime.

Base game content also came out years ago. Think it's time to stop holding it against their count tbh. Casuals that have been playing at that level a while must be sick of it by now.

The story content and delve a lot of people finish wayyy before they are done with the trials, dungeons and world events which have all been middle and hard focused for about 3 years now.

Iccotak

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Iccotak wrote: »

So Overland - the majority of the content - is in the beginner category

How is the majority of content in the first place? It's largely not repeatable content (unless you roll an alt) unlike dungeons and trials. You'll get much less playtime out of it. I guess there's more named quests but they don't really constitute a lot of playtime.

Base game content also came out years ago. Think it's time to stop holding it against their count tbh. Casuals that have been playing at that level a while must be sick of it by now.

The story content and delve a lot of people finish wayyy before they are done with the trials, dungeons and world events which have all been middle and hard focused for about 3 years now.

You are comparing completing quests to completing dungeon achievements - not exactly a good or accurate comparison. The Questlines for both activities can only be completed once. However, it would make more sense to compare time to complete achievements for both overland & dungeons.

Also we are talking about the majority of the questing content - and yes that means that Overland has many, many, many more hours of questing content than endgame does. it is still the majority of the content. - this is aside from the topic of the OP but to address your original point on why so many people don't try dungeons - maybe consider that the game does not do a good job of encouraging people to leave their comfort zone or even direct them to that content at all.

The zones do very little to acclimate players to getting better because it has a flat skill curve.

EDIT:
to further clarify, I’m of the opinion that it’s so easy that it doesn’t force bad players to get better. That’s how you end up with players lacking skill & relying too much on light attacks in dungeons and trials, or people queuing out of their roles. Because they never had to “git gud” and learn how to play the game

spartaxoxo

Iccotak wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Iccotak wrote: »

So Overland - the majority of the content - is in the beginner category

How is the majority of content in the first place? It's largely not repeatable content (unless you roll an alt) unlike dungeons and trials. You'll get much less playtime out of it. I guess there's more named quests but they don't really constitute a lot of playtime.

Base game content also came out years ago. Think it's time to stop holding it against their count tbh. Casuals that have been playing at that level a while must be sick of it by now.

The story content and delve a lot of people finish wayyy before they are done with the trials, dungeons and world events which have all been middle and hard focused for about 3 years now.

You are comparing completing quests to completing dungeon achievements - not exactly a good or accurate comparison. The Questlines for both activities can only be completed once. However, it would make more sense to compare time to complete achievements for both overland & dungeons.

Also we are talking about the majority of the questing content - and yes that means that Overland has many, many, many more hours of questing content than endgame does. it is still the majority of the content. - this is aside from the topic of the OP but to address your original point on why so many people don't try dungeons - maybe consider that the game does not do a good job of encouraging people to leave their comfort zone or even direct them to that content at all.

The zones do very little to acclimate players to getting better because it has a flat skill curve.

I wasn't comparing dungeons achievements actually, more like how dungeons are typically played. They have stuff in them that people want to farm. Be it keys, gear, or in some cases motifs. They are designed to be done over and over again, and that's largely how people interact with them. Questing isn't designed that way. They are there to tell a story and aren't really designed to be repeated. People may decide to repeat them on an alternative character, of course, but it's not the purpose of their design.

Most people when they do a zone, they listen to the story. And then they start farming dailies (the older repeatables being designed for a lower caliber of players then the ones released the past 3 years) and also running dungeons some more. I think there's actually a ton of people that farm random normal dungeons for example. So often times the story content has a lack of players interacting with it long before the dungeons and trials of that content year do.

I honestly don't think people really get stuck on things to do due to lack of skill until you get to the hard content. Because the transistion between beginner and intermediate is paced very well and appropriately.

And I think a lot of that isn't because just because they don't learn how, but rather the amount of practice they'd need to do makes it unfun.

So a lot of players (mostly the dps but it happens to heals and tanks too) decide to either become a heal or tank so that they can play the harder content and learn while DOING instead of practicing on a target dummy or they decide not to progress any further.