Please reinstate faction locks, or do this instead....

RaikaNA

I don't understand why Greyhost is the only campaign that is faction locked, and not the others (Ravenwatch and Blackreach). Greyhost is nearly impossible to get into as a group when the campaign is lock popped by all three factions most of the time. There was an incident that happens in Blackreach on the NA server not that long ago... 2021-04-16. My guild (AD only) was running 2 groups... we fought hard and well, and after 2 to 3 hours later we help emp'ed the faction (AD) all to find out later that the person that we help emp'ed was NOT on AD to help take the map back, but on EP in the same campaign fighting against us (WHO EMP'ED HIM!!) while he had Emperor ON AD.

How on earth can this kind of practice even happen in this game, and what's worst is that there is nothing that the faction can do about it because ZOS promotes this kind of ridiculous gameplay. There are no consequences for switching factions in the middle of an ongoing campaign. You can be emp on AD and still play on another faction in the same campaign that you're currently emp on.

I would like to make a proposal that can help make the campaign better.

1) Reinstate faction locks to all campaigns.. including sub50. You may switch factions after the campaign ends. (Sounds reasonable).
2) If you elect to switch factions while the campaign is ongoing.. A message should pop up giving you an option to either cancel the swap or accept and agree to forfeit your tier rewards and the points that you currently have on the leaderboard. e.g. If you're first in line for emp on the current faction you're playing on.. you forfeit that spot to switch to the faction that you want to play on.

Ackwalan

People wanted choices. Those that wanted faction lock and those that didn't, each choose the campaign they wanted. Unfortunately, the people that wanted no-cp faction didn't get a choice, but there aren't enough people to keep 4 campaigns populated.

Joy_Division

Have you considered the possibility that they didn't want to be Emperor? Since they were playing, they obviously knew the situation, and chose not to log on their AD. Maybe because AD was pop locked whereas EP only had 2 bars (something that hasn't been uncommon lately on the no CP server) and didn't further demoralize the reds.. Maybe because they've been emperor before and doesn't want to be bothered playing the map trying to defend it. Maybe because they had to get up early. It doesn;t matter. For whatever reason, they opted not to. And I don;t see a problem with that at all.

It's not like your faction's point total was deducted because they weren't there. It's not like you didn't feel a sense of accomplishment steamrolling the other two factions to reach that point. Why does someone else got to be forced to do something they're not up for? They are having fun - obviously not "faction hopping" to the winning side, rather willingly opting to log into the *losing* side and not contributing to faction stacking and gate-keeping - and this is a problem?

There are some campaigns that aren;t faction locked because ZOs decided to compromise and not 100% gear the entire Cyrodiil experience to the preferences of one group of players.

I don;t really have an issue with the idea that someone who logs onto another faction would lose emperor eligibility. That's fine. But I see bigger problems with emperor that have been around for years that ZOs has not even bothered to look into. That one person could just never log out and have a stranglehold on the #1 ranking for an entire month is way worse than what you are describing. Once you lose an emperor, you should be done for that campaign. You had your shot, and your leadership has been found wanting, you were dethroned and delegitimized. You're done!

But forfeiting all rewards is just crazy. PvP is by far the best source of Transmute crystals and One Tamriel concept has existed for years and years, ZOs actively encouraged us to make toons on all factions. If we want transmute stones - and we do since ZOS changes the Meta every 3 months - we get those by playing the very characters ZOS encouraged us to make years ago.

80-90% of all Alliance and Faction oriented complaints by players would be solved if ZOS put any effort into demonstrating they are committed to maintaining a fun and competitive and fair environment. Considering there is not even a dedicated PvP developer and no PvP Game-Master has been seen in Cyrodiil since Summer of 2014, ZOs is showing us it's at the bottom of their priorities. Like rock bottom. That's all that needs to be said in my opinion.

RaikaNA

Joy_Division, I don't think that is the case at all considering the fact that this person had over 7 million AP whereas the second person in line had just 5 million AP. If this person truly didn't want to be Emperor.. why not leave the campaign to allow the second person to jump in the first place? When someone essentially hijacks the emp spot with no true intentions of improving or helping the faction out that is griefing the faction itself. This kind of ruthless behavior can cause distress and disrupt another user’s AvA PvP experience. That is a direct violation of ZOS terms of service.

It's not cool for people to waste other people's time by not following through with their end of the bargain. Our guild spent hours trying to do good for our faction.. to play the game that was meant to be played..

Minyassa

I'm fairly sure that the situation where someone is fighting against their own Emperorhood in the same campaign happens hundreds of times less than the situation where I'm in a campaign by myself with one of my toons in a particular alliance and my friends/guildies jump into that same campaign with toons of a different alliance. All campaigns being locked distresses me and completely disrupts my ability to play if I can't play with friends.

Kartalin

Isn't Blackreach full of small scalers and duelers? And the odd zerg guild apparently...

Better to have good fights than to just zerg down your opponents repeatedly and force them to log. Why call it PVP if you're just PVDooring?

RaikaNA wrote: »

If this person truly didn't want to be Emperor.. why not leave the campaign to allow the second person to jump in the first place?

And lose all those awesome rewards for finishing in the top 2%? Probably doesn't want to lose the transmutes actually.

RaikaNA

Kartalin wrote: »

Isn't Blackreach full of small scalers and duelers? And the odd zerg guild apparently...

Better to have good fights than to just zerg down your opponents repeatedly and force them to log. Why call it PVP if you're just PVDooring?

RaikaNA wrote: »

If this person truly didn't want to be Emperor.. why not leave the campaign to allow the second person to jump in the first place?

And lose all those awesome rewards for finishing in the top 2%? Probably doesn't want to lose the transmutes actually.

So you're not happy because we're not playing exactly how you would want us to play? We play the way it's intended. We take keeps, grab scrolls and try to help our faction to win the campaign by getting as many points as we can possibly can. Some of us use strategy rather than continue getting farmed at a resource.

Kartalin

I'm saying that this is probably how the emperor saw it, although I tend to agree.

And I'm not saying that you shouldn't play how you want, just don't be surprised when others don't agree with you or choose to play against you instead. There's a segment of the population that wants competitive fights, whether through fighting equally or greater skilled individuals/groups or by fighting a greater number of opponents There's others that actually play to win the campaign by any means necessary, including stifling competition by bringing lopsided numbers to the fight.

Lately it seems like too many players on various factions are more interested in fighting guards and sieging keeps when fewer opponents are around to contest them.

genzo528

Made a tread to explain why supporting the cross faction teaming and ruining the game for allot of people is actualy bad although it may seem funny allowing it to be broken and supported with cross factions guilds but it shouldnt be about just laughting at other expense, eso need to learn from world of warcraft where you choose one team account wide

redspecter23

genzo528 wrote: »

Made a tread to explain why supporting the cross faction teaming and ruining the game for allot of people is actualy bad although it may seem funny allowing it to be broken and supported with cross factions guilds but it shouldnt be about just laughting at other expense, eso need to learn from world of warcraft where you choose one team account wide

Wow's system is perfect. There couldn't possibly be any realms that are completely dominated by one faction, right?

Kwoung

Ackwalan wrote: »

People wanted choices. Those that wanted faction lock and those that didn't, each choose the campaign they wanted. Unfortunately, the people that wanted no-cp faction didn't get a choice, but there aren't enough people to keep 4 campaigns populated.

When I have a 1-2 hour queue for Greyhost and Blackreach is one bar across the board, you have to wonder why it is even there and they don't spin up another faction locked campaign.

As for other posts above... I used to play BR, and its all about PVDing, not PVPing at all. The streamers love it too, because they can generally 1vX or small scale the PVDers pretty easily... and it makes them look good for their streamers. Honestly, if GH didn't have huge queue times on many occasions, there would be even less folks playing on BR. So while yes, you are technically winning the campaign by doing all the things that earn points for your faction... it generally isn't PVP.

Faded

Some players want fights more than they want single-color maps and campaign wins. Maybe your emperor is one of them - hard to say with only half the story. But no, not all the campaigns need to be locked and/or people stripped of rewards they've earned because you were disappointed.

Greyhost exists. Maybe your guild should play there.

RaikaNA

Kartalin wrote: »

Lately it seems like too many players on various factions are more interested in fighting guards and sieging keeps when fewer opponents are around to contest them.

The intention of being in an AvA campaign is to take keeps. Your primary objective is to recruit as many people that you can fit into a group, and start invading enemy keeps. If the keep is not being well guarded by other players.. that is the fault of the faction for not properly guarding their keeps, and they deserve to lose their keeps for being so careless and neglectful. Why is it a bad thing to use intellectual strategy to put a faction in a weakened position by taking keeps beneath their noses?

CooloutAC

I literally quit a blackreach ep guild on NA. and stopped even asking for a group on ad there. They actually get on discord together and coordinate against the 3rd place dc team. or trade ap. I doubt thats what the developers intended and I consider it cheating. A week ago I saw AD was pop locked and had every single keep on the map, the other two factions had only 1 bar and probably not even that. It was atrocious. Its basically a dead campaign. Alot of the real competitive pvp'ers have now gone to dc.

People will literally join the other campaign like Raika said, just to spy, troll and sabotage. Try to steal scrolls and drop them in water. Troll the chat. Try to convince players to use bad strategy. Follow players and tell their home faction where they are and what they are planning. Making sure to do nothing to help the faction win the map. There is absolutely a good reason why grayhost is always the most populated by a huge amount and usually the most evenly matched most times of day.

No cp has the same issues, its more popular then blackreach cause alot of people don't want to play with cp. But its still a problem. I mean not playing the map is as bad as BG players who treat every game mode like a dm out of spite basically undermining the whole mmr system.

I don't like to pve much at all, so cyrodil IS my pve. When i want more instant pvp action, i go do a bg. For those who just want to duel and don't even like to play maps in bg, hang out in wayrest lol. But why try to exploit or ruin the game for others?

Joy_Division

RaikaNA wrote: »

Joy_Division, I don't think that is the case at all considering the fact that this person had over 7 million AP whereas the second person in line had just 5 million AP. If this person truly didn't want to be Emperor.. why not leave the campaign to allow the second person to jump in the first place? When someone essentially hijacks the emp spot with no true intentions of improving or helping the faction out that is griefing the faction itself. This kind of ruthless behavior can cause distress and disrupt another user’s AvA PvP experience. That is a direct violation of ZOS terms of service.

It's not cool for people to waste other people's time by not following through with their end of the bargain. Our guild spent hours trying to do good for our faction.. to play the game that was meant to be played..

If you feel this strongly about AvAvA, you are playing the wrong game and are only going to stress yourself out.

Your own passion is causing you to project this person's behavior as ruthless and intentionally griefing other players when you have no evidence of this and you did not even seek out or ask the player for their own explanation. I've been in guilds and teamspeaks where players have indicated they'd rather not be emperors for various reasons. It's not common, but happens enough that I am not at all surprised, especially on an "off" campaign that has population imbalances.

As far as how the game was meant to be played, that is 100% in the eye of the beholder. Not to mention the game along with its mechanics and baseline assumptions have changed dramatically since 2014 such that any such pretensions of how ESO was meant to be played are both debatable and dubious. The fact of the matter is your guild still helped the faction, the player's actions did not deprive the alliance of a single point. OK, maybe the person could be faulted for failing to predict despite spending time on another faction that nobody on AD would be able to overtake them and that some people who take it as a terms of service violation that they would not disrupt their own plans to log back into their AD character and proceed to paint the map yellow. But I don;t think it's fair at all to assume malicious intent when it very easily have been they just didn;t think about it and only wanted Tel Var.

It is ZOS's responsibility to set up, maintain, and reform Cyrodiil such that the campaign settings are fair, competitive, fun with rules/expectations clearly laid out and options existing to accommodate the various and multifaceted goals players have. Period. That they do not even have a full time PvP developer or have bothered to institute any reforms or in the reward system for many years is all that needs to be said how seriously ZOS takes Cyrodiil PvP and why again if you are so passionate about AvAvA, you are going to continue to be profoundly disappointed.

Kwoung

1:30 am EST last night.. BR 1 bar all factions, GH 3 bars all factions, was all pop locked 30 min prior. We need another CP faction locked campaign and if they don't have enough servers to handle it, repurpose the least used and most abused one... Blackreach. I expect queue times in the 1.5+ hour range tonight on Greyhost as usual, while Blackreach sits with 2 empty Alliances and one capped and PVDing the whole map.

RaikaNA

Joy_Division,
No, I strongly disagree with you. ZOS created this kind of platform specifically for this kind of gameplay that I've described. As for the emp griefer.. When you're no longer wanting to get emp, but still first place in the leaderboard by a couple of million AP... It's just common sense for you to drop from the campaign so that you can allow someone else, who does want emp, and willing to help the faction by giving that player a chance to thrive. It's called being a good sport. I don't know what kind of evidence you want me to provide to validate my statement... It's not my responsibility to ask the griefer an explanation, however, I did send him a civilized whisper: "Our guild worked hard to get you emp, and what did you do in return? Fight against us on EP. We will never emp you again" His reply is was rather hostile.. instead of apologizing for wasting my guild and I time by emping him.. he essentially told me that this was a game, and to grow up.

You can't have your cake and eat it too... You either keep your scoring and your tier rewards by sticking it through until the campaign ends or you lose it by switching factions while the campaign on ongoing. We have to pay a butt load of AP (over 100k AP) to switch home campaigns while the campaign is ongoing.. Becoming a faction flipper during an ongoing campaign should also have consequences too.

Joy_Division

Go ahead and disagree with me all you want. You asked questions like why some campaigns aren;t faction locked and how can the situation could have happened. I provided you with factually based answer as far as the campaign locks and offered possibilities that have happened numerous times before why someone might not want to be an emp.

It wasnt my decision to have some campaigns locked and some not locked. That was ZOS's. Go ahead and disagree with me, but it was ZOs who created these campaign conditions in the first place. If you feel the person was in violation of the terms of service agreement, then you are well within your rights to report this person and the reasoning you feel they violated the T.O.S. Go on right ahead. I don;t really care one way or the other. That's ZOS's call. If they agree with you, then they will take the disciplinary action they feel is warranted.

ResidentContrarian

Disagree.

Players should be able to play how and when they want. Why do others feel the need to control where players play and what they do?

If a player is strong and you want them on your side then instead of trying to FORCE them to do what you want, maybe you should make them want to not leave your faction instead.

Faction locks don't contribute anything positive to the game in the first place. There is still scroll trolling, toxicity, failure to act in unison when necessary, etc. and that is because the biggest advocates for lock or restrictions think players really care or want to follow them when it's the opposite. Faction locks actually seem to encourage toxicity in PvP from what I've seen.

Players that lead groups have their own group, so they can rule over their group and let others do whatever they want in the game. It's a game, not a job, and faction-lock lovers are not the supervisors of players in any given campaign and other players are not your pawns on a chess table.

Even if there were a lock, said player could have simply logged off and/or refused to enter the campaign or go troll. The end result would have still been the same: you and those who made them emperor would not get what you wanted.

In an unlocked campaign, most players that swap do so because the campaign is lopsided. And here, the player swapped to the losing and outnumbered side and this is the case for faction locking the campaign?

Also, calling them a griefer is beyond silly.

CooloutAC

ResidentContrarian wrote: »

Disagree.

Players should be able to play how and when they want. Why do others feel the need to control where players play and what they do?

If a player is strong and you want them on your side then instead of trying to FORCE them to do what you want, maybe you should make them want to not leave your faction instead.

Faction locks don't contribute anything positive to the game in the first place. There is still scroll trolling, toxicity, failure to act in unison when necessary, etc. and that is because the biggest advocates for lock or restrictions think players really care or want to follow them when it's the opposite. Faction locks actually seem to encourage toxicity in PvP from what I've seen.

Players that lead groups have their own group, so they can rule over their group and let others do whatever they want in the game. It's a game, not a job, and faction-lock lovers are not the supervisors of players in any given campaign and other players are not your pawns on a chess table.

Even if there were a lock, said player could have simply logged off and/or refused to enter the campaign or go troll. The end result would have still been the same: you and those who made them emperor would not get what you wanted.

In an unlocked campaign, most players that swap do so because the campaign is lopsided. And here, the player swapped to the losing and outnumbered side and this is the case for faction locking the campaign?

Also, calling them a griefer is beyond silly.

I think grayhost proves you wrong.

I mean have you seen blackreach lately in NA. At Times, literally, ad is pop locked and the other two factions have not even 1 bar while ad has every single keep on the map. Me and you might be players who join the low pop side, but its obvious most of the community does not. And thats human nature. Ever read the book lord of the flies? lol. That fact is people will exploit anything they can to take the easy road.

nryerson1025

Oh my god, this post made me cry it is so absurd. The AD faction here was conditioned to only engage in pvp with numbers of 30 or more. One day in blackreach typically involves finding one or two ad trying to do pve or something and they either STAND THERE AND LET YOU KILL THEM or RUN AWAY. This is conservatively 90% of engagements. When they do fight, it is with a team of no less than 30 and they take every single point on the map until everyone else logs off. They also win every campaign by a landslide.

Any faction swapping involving the AD faction cannot possibly be harmful to the health of this campaign. It is already very sick and personally, I applaud any action taken against this behavior

In blackreachs scale, a team of 30 is tremendous, most likely larger than the total population of both opposing factions combined

Kwoung

nryerson1025 wrote: »

In blackreachs scale, a team of 30 is tremendous, most likely larger than the total population of both opposing factions combined

Yup, played there for quite a while. BR is a dead campaign made for those who want to PVD, 1vX noobs or boost emps. That whole campaign should just go away. No idea why they made it, but it is a failed experiment that has nothing to do with PVP. Folks wait for hours to login to the other campaigns, and are slammed with lag upon arrival... all while BR sits empty, and wasting server resources better deployed elsewhere..

IAmIcehouse

RaikaNA wrote: »

I don't understand why Greyhost is the only campaign that is faction locked, and not the others (Ravenwatch and Blackreach). Greyhost is nearly impossible to get into as a group when the campaign is lock popped by all three factions most of the time. There was an incident that happens in Blackreach on the NA server not that long ago... 2021-04-16. My guild (AD only) was running 2 groups... we fought hard and well, and after 2 to 3 hours later we help emp'ed the faction (AD) all to find out later that the person that we help emp'ed was NOT on AD to help take the map back, but on EP in the same campaign fighting against us (WHO EMP'ED HIM!!) while he had Emperor ON AD.

How on earth can this kind of practice even happen in this game, and what's worst is that there is nothing that the faction can do about it because ZOS promotes this kind of ridiculous gameplay. There are no consequences for switching factions in the middle of an ongoing campaign. You can be emp on AD and still play on another faction in the same campaign that you're currently emp on.

I would like to make a proposal that can help make the campaign better.

1) Reinstate faction locks to all campaigns.. including sub50. You may switch factions after the campaign ends. (Sounds reasonable).
2) If you elect to switch factions while the campaign is ongoing.. A message should pop up giving you an option to either cancel the swap or accept and agree to forfeit your tier rewards and the points that you currently have on the leaderboard. e.g. If you're first in line for emp on the current faction you're playing on.. you forfeit that spot to switch to the faction that you want to play on.

Some people play the game for the campaign, some people play the game for quality PvP. If you have emp on a the extremely dominant faction, you're not going to have fun PvP. You will run through whatever you fight.

Stop this nonsense of "my way of enjoying the game is the only valid way of playing the game and anything that doesn't coincide with this should be changed so that it does". All you have to do is act like that guys AD and EP toons are two different people who don't play at the same time.

There are very good reasons for why faction locks should not exist on all campaigns and they get posted everytime we remake this forum post. Let people play the game in the way they enjoy it.

Grimlok_S

OP, that is absolutely disgraceful. How dare the emp swap to another faction, there is so much more work to be done on this map! I hope you find justice.

https://imgur.com/a/Hkwqf7M
SS taken at 5:45 today

TBois

Man it has been a while since I heard someone care about the campaign score in a low pop campaign. I used to care. Cut my teeth playing AD on Bloodthorn trying to dethrone Naw Sunrest every day. For those who were not around at launch with how dynamic ult gen, emp and dk's worked, this means I banged my head against a wall every evening to try and get as many points as possible. Suddenly after a year or so I stopped caring...because I realized ZOS doesn't care. These issues about emp and just the way the leaderboards are calculated have not been touched since day one. Soon enough you will come to the forums to complain about something else, actually maybe even the same issue, and you will think back to this thread. Why? Well one reason is that I'm telling you that you will remember this for the rest of your life, but another reason is that I am giving you the best answer to maximize your fun in ESO. The way to have fun in ESO is to ignore the bad ***. You will have a heart attack if you trouble yourself waiting for ZOS to fix something specific.

Agrippa_Invisus

TBois wrote: »

Man it has been a while since I heard someone care about the campaign score in a low pop campaign. I used to care. Cut my teeth playing AD on Bloodthorn trying to dethrone Naw Sunrest every day. For those who were not around at launch with how dynamic ult gen, emp and dk's worked, this means I banged my head against a wall every evening to try and get as many points as possible. Suddenly after a year or so I stopped caring...because I realized ZOS doesn't care. These issues about emp and just the way the leaderboards are calculated have not been touched since day one. Soon enough you will come to the forums to complain about something else, actually maybe even the same issue, and you will think back to this thread. Why? Well one reason is that I'm telling you that you will remember this for the rest of your life, but another reason is that I am giving you the best answer to maximize your fun in ESO. The way to have fun in ESO is to ignore the bad ***. You will have a heart attack if you trouble yourself waiting for ZOS to fix something specific.

Dethroning Naw Sunrest was a right of passage for my guild back in the day.

Dang, that's some nostalgia right there.

I both loved and hated Bloodthorn for all that.

Glad to see there's a few of us still around that can compare/contrast the pre-1.5 patch Cyrodiil with what we have nowadays. But you're right about avoiding the stress. I stopped raid leading because my blood pressure literally went up 30 points from the start of it. I long ago learned (and suggest this to others) -- take a chill pill and take breaks when needed.

Cyrodiil doesn't give rewards that have any value (more like a gotcha prize) to the winners more than it gives the losers. The only thing is 'faction pride', and that's been dead for years. The locks were a bad idea, implemented at the behest of the paranoid, much like the proc disabling was as well. Vast, sweeping changes when instead it could be handled in one off ways (such as enforcing TOS against ACTUAL griefers, small a number as they were) or rebalancing the terrible sets like Crimson, Earthgore, and Harbinger.

Anyways, good post, @TBois . Glad to see old guard like you still around, hope you're being treated well by life in general and in ESO.

Syrusthevirus187

RaikaNA wrote: »

Kartalin wrote: »

Lately it seems like too many players on various factions are more interested in fighting guards and sieging keeps when fewer opponents are around to contest them.

The intention of being in an AvA campaign is to take keeps. Your primary objective is to recruit as many people that you can fit into a group, and start invading enemy keeps. If the keep is not being well guarded by other players.. that is the fault of the faction for not properly guarding their keeps, and they deserve to lose their keeps for being so careless and neglectful. Why is it a bad thing to use intellectual strategy to put a faction in a weakened position by taking keeps beneath their noses?

Why do you even play pvp if you don't pvp?

nryerson1025

another day goes by, and another day of dirty ep and dc faction swapping crippling tireless ad faction

https://imgur.com/a/dIFB6z1"][url="http://"]https://imgur.com/a/dIFB6z1[/url][/url]

CooloutAC

CooloutAC wrote: »

ResidentContrarian wrote: »

Disagree.

Players should be able to play how and when they want. Why do others feel the need to control where players play and what they do?

If a player is strong and you want them on your side then instead of trying to FORCE them to do what you want, maybe you should make them want to not leave your faction instead.

Faction locks don't contribute anything positive to the game in the first place. There is still scroll trolling, toxicity, failure to act in unison when necessary, etc. and that is because the biggest advocates for lock or restrictions think players really care or want to follow them when it's the opposite. Faction locks actually seem to encourage toxicity in PvP from what I've seen.

Players that lead groups have their own group, so they can rule over their group and let others do whatever they want in the game. It's a game, not a job, and faction-lock lovers are not the supervisors of players in any given campaign and other players are not your pawns on a chess table.

Even if there were a lock, said player could have simply logged off and/or refused to enter the campaign or go troll. The end result would have still been the same: you and those who made them emperor would not get what you wanted.

In an unlocked campaign, most players that swap do so because the campaign is lopsided. And here, the player swapped to the losing and outnumbered side and this is the case for faction locking the campaign?

Also, calling them a griefer is beyond silly.

I think grayhost proves you wrong.

Kwoung wrote: »

nryerson1025 wrote: »

In blackreachs scale, a team of 30 is tremendous, most likely larger than the total population of both opposing factions combined

Yup, played there for quite a while. BR is a dead campaign made for those who want to PVD, 1vX noobs or boost emps. That whole campaign should just go away. No idea why they made it, but it is a failed experiment that has nothing to do with PVP. Folks wait for hours to login to the other campaigns, and are slammed with lag upon arrival... all while BR sits empty, and wasting server resources better deployed elsewhere..

but have you asked yourself why? To me the answer is obvious. When the campaign is not locked it attracts all sorts of cheating deplorables who want to undermine it and people go to grayhost to avoid them. Even if it means playing in terrible lag.

CooloutAC

Syrusthevirus187 wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

Kartalin wrote: »

Lately it seems like too many players on various factions are more interested in fighting guards and sieging keeps when fewer opponents are around to contest them.

The intention of being in an AvA campaign is to take keeps. Your primary objective is to recruit as many people that you can fit into a group, and start invading enemy keeps. If the keep is not being well guarded by other players.. that is the fault of the faction for not properly guarding their keeps, and they deserve to lose their keeps for being so careless and neglectful. Why is it a bad thing to use intellectual strategy to put a faction in a weakened position by taking keeps beneath their noses?

Why do you even play pvp if you don't pvp?

cyrodil is really openworld pvp questing for those that want it. I bet you pve more then me. Since I never even did a dungeon or more then a couple pve quests till i reached cp300. and that was so I can unlock psijic order and undaunted passives. I strictly leveled 3 toons in nothing but cyrodil and bg's.

If you want instant pvp gratification or more small scale fighting maybe you should try the bg's, but don't go into cyrodil and then selfishly try to ruin it for others by undermining its intention.

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

TBois wrote: »

Man it has been a while since I heard someone care about the campaign score in a low pop campaign. I used to care. Cut my teeth playing AD on Bloodthorn trying to dethrone Naw Sunrest every day. For those who were not around at launch with how dynamic ult gen, emp and dk's worked, this means I banged my head against a wall every evening to try and get as many points as possible. Suddenly after a year or so I stopped caring...because I realized ZOS doesn't care. These issues about emp and just the way the leaderboards are calculated have not been touched since day one. Soon enough you will come to the forums to complain about something else, actually maybe even the same issue, and you will think back to this thread. Why? Well one reason is that I'm telling you that you will remember this for the rest of your life, but another reason is that I am giving you the best answer to maximize your fun in ESO. The way to have fun in ESO is to ignore the bad ***. You will have a heart attack if you trouble yourself waiting for ZOS to fix something specific.

Dethroning Naw Sunrest was a right of passage for my guild back in the day.

Dang, that's some nostalgia right there.

I both loved and hated Bloodthorn for all that.

Glad to see there's a few of us still around that can compare/contrast the pre-1.5 patch Cyrodiil with what we have nowadays. But you're right about avoiding the stress. I stopped raid leading because my blood pressure literally went up 30 points from the start of it. I long ago learned (and suggest this to others) -- take a chill pill and take breaks when needed.

Cyrodiil doesn't give rewards that have any value (more like a gotcha prize) to the winners more than it gives the losers. The only thing is 'faction pride', and that's been dead for years. The locks were a bad idea, implemented at the behest of the paranoid, much like the proc disabling was as well. Vast, sweeping changes when instead it could be handled in one off ways (such as enforcing TOS against ACTUAL griefers, small a number as they were) or rebalancing the terrible sets like Crimson, Earthgore, and Harbinger.

Anyways, good post, @TBois . Glad to see old guard like you still around, hope you're being treated well by life in general and in ESO.

what do you consider griefing and how could they prove and enforce it? I think just locking the campaigns stops most of it. Since I started playing grayhost i've been in many guilds who run raids. And many of them have verbally told me they don't play in the other campaigns because they are not locked and people faction swap. There is no paranoia about it. I've quit just as many guilds who do it. I mean people are seeing this with their own eyes, its not a theory they are assuming. Its something that is done publicly and right in the open because they don't even see it as a bad thing.

Agrippa_Invisus

CooloutAC wrote: »

Syrusthevirus187 wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

Kartalin wrote: »

Lately it seems like too many players on various factions are more interested in fighting guards and sieging keeps when fewer opponents are around to contest them.

The intention of being in an AvA campaign is to take keeps. Your primary objective is to recruit as many people that you can fit into a group, and start invading enemy keeps. If the keep is not being well guarded by other players.. that is the fault of the faction for not properly guarding their keeps, and they deserve to lose their keeps for being so careless and neglectful. Why is it a bad thing to use intellectual strategy to put a faction in a weakened position by taking keeps beneath their noses?

Why do you even play pvp if you don't pvp?

cyrodil is really openworld pvp questing for those that want it. I bet you pve more then me. Since I never even did a dungeon or more then a couple pve quests till i reached cp300. and that was so I can unlock psijic order and undaunted passives. I strictly leveled 3 toons in nothing but cyrodil and bg's.

If you want instant pvp gratification or more small scale fighting maybe you should try the bg's, but don't go into cyrodil and then selfishly try to ruin it for others by undermining its intention.

Agrippa_Invisus wrote: »

TBois wrote: »

Man it has been a while since I heard someone care about the campaign score in a low pop campaign. I used to care. Cut my teeth playing AD on Bloodthorn trying to dethrone Naw Sunrest every day. For those who were not around at launch with how dynamic ult gen, emp and dk's worked, this means I banged my head against a wall every evening to try and get as many points as possible. Suddenly after a year or so I stopped caring...because I realized ZOS doesn't care. These issues about emp and just the way the leaderboards are calculated have not been touched since day one. Soon enough you will come to the forums to complain about something else, actually maybe even the same issue, and you will think back to this thread. Why? Well one reason is that I'm telling you that you will remember this for the rest of your life, but another reason is that I am giving you the best answer to maximize your fun in ESO. The way to have fun in ESO is to ignore the bad ***. You will have a heart attack if you trouble yourself waiting for ZOS to fix something specific.

Dethroning Naw Sunrest was a right of passage for my guild back in the day.

Dang, that's some nostalgia right there.

I both loved and hated Bloodthorn for all that.

Glad to see there's a few of us still around that can compare/contrast the pre-1.5 patch Cyrodiil with what we have nowadays. But you're right about avoiding the stress. I stopped raid leading because my blood pressure literally went up 30 points from the start of it. I long ago learned (and suggest this to others) -- take a chill pill and take breaks when needed.

Cyrodiil doesn't give rewards that have any value (more like a gotcha prize) to the winners more than it gives the losers. The only thing is 'faction pride', and that's been dead for years. The locks were a bad idea, implemented at the behest of the paranoid, much like the proc disabling was as well. Vast, sweeping changes when instead it could be handled in one off ways (such as enforcing TOS against ACTUAL griefers, small a number as they were) or rebalancing the terrible sets like Crimson, Earthgore, and Harbinger.

Anyways, good post, @TBois . Glad to see old guard like you still around, hope you're being treated well by life in general and in ESO.

what do you consider griefing and how could they prove and enforce it? I think just locking the campaigns stops most of it. Since I started playing grayhost i've been in many guilds who run raids. And many of them have verbally told me they don't play in the other campaigns because they are not locked and people faction swap. There is no paranoia about it. I've quit just as many guilds who do it. I mean people are seeing this with their own eyes, its not a theory they are assuming. Its something that is done publicly and right in the open because they don't even see it as a bad thing.

I dunno. You're the faction lock supporter. You tell me all the terrible, horrible things you think they prevent.

I'm not particularly interested in defining it for you. But the argument of 'well, people faction swap' is a bad one because you have not proven, stated, or shown a harm from this. People swap? So? Usually it's to play with their friends which is exactly the behavior an MMO should support.