Can a player be too generous?

SilverBride

I have a friend who I think takes in game generosity way too far.

For example, just a week after becoming friends I offhand mentioned I was considering a race change. A minute later I got a popup saying he was gifting me a race change token.

Recently he bought a lot of rocks from a guild auction that he didn't want or need "because the seller may be watching and I didn't want them to feel bad that no one was bidding on their items".

He is always trying to give me things and if I decline I get a "sigh".

We ended up having a big "discussion" and almost ended the friendship, because in his words if he couldn't give me things we weren't friends, but rather just "random people who sometimes do things together". Somehow we were able to work things out, but I have learned to never mention I want or need or like anything for fear that he will feel obligated to provide it.

I guess what I'm asking is do others also feel that a player can be generous to the point of discomfort?

Vevvev

It is possible to be too generous, but it's a case by case thing. Some people just don't feel comfortable when people give them things either out of distrust or wanting to earn the things themselves.

SilverBride

Vevvev wrote: »

Some people just don't feel comfortable when people give them things either out of distrust or wanting to earn the things themselves.

For me it's partly wanting to earn my own way. But I also don't want to give the impression that my friendiship is reliant on how much someone can give me.

Sure friends help each other out with items now and then, but that isn't what should define the friendship.

redspecter23

I think it's something only you can answer.

My thought is this. If someone does anything that you don't want them to, they should accept that you may not want them to do that thing. This can be negative actions as well as positive actions as those things are relative to the person in question.

For your friend, they want to do nice things. They can't understand why you don't appreciate the gifts. However, you may not want to receive gifts for whatever reason. You may not want to feel like you're in debt to them or that you owe them in any way. It may even be seen as a big money power play and them bragging for having more than others or it coulld make people feel bad that they can't afford the same sort of luxuries. You may just not want your friendship to hinge on material gifts.
They don't see it this way, but that doesn't matter. If you're uncomfortable by an action that is your choice and your friend should respect your choice.

amm7sb14_ESO

I agree with the wanting to make my own way thing. I don't want everything just given to me. Otherwise what's the point of playing the game

VaranisArano

At the risk of turning this into relationship advice, it's worth evaluating what you are and aren't comfortable with in terms of gift-giving as well as how much your wishes are being respected. Your friend can be as generous as they want in the guild auction, but you get to determine what gifts you'll accept.

If continued and extravagant gift giving over and against your expressed desires makes you uncomfortable...

First off, it's entirely valid to feel that way.
Second, friends should respect friends' boundaries.

Assuming you want to stay friends with this person, I suggest:
1. Decide on your boundaries. Do you want the gifts or not at all? Are you comfortable with gold gifts and not crown gifts? Would you prefer to only be gifted if you explicitly ask your friend for something? Where does your line in the sand fall?
2. Inform your friend of your boundaries. This is not a negotiating session; either they stick to those boundaries or...insert consequence you are comfortable with. I suggest beginning with "I'm going to return your gift if it's not within my guidelines.
3. Stick to your boundaries. Stick to your consequences. Be prepared to see some boundary pushing. If they send you a gift when you said not to? Return it! Or do whatever consequence you said you would.

If you are reading this thinking, "Hey, its not that bad", great! Hopefully you two figure out something that works!

If you are reading the above thinking "Whoa, there, that's not worth the drama," then I guess it's up to you to determine if you want to accept gifts to keep the peace or choose a different path.

On the other hand, if you are thinking "Hmm, setting boundaries is NOT going to go over well," then I humbly suggest that the red flags you see waving are not that of the Ebonheart Pact.

Friends should respect their friends' boundaries. Period.

Inaya

Yes, people can be too generous. I am horrible at accepting gifts but have no problem giving them. For me it's about independence and gettting things on my own, plus I never want to feel like I owe someone.

Sometimes when people are overly generous it comes from a place of insecurity, wanted to be accepted etc. Have a talk with your friend about boundaries. About why it makes you uncomfortable and why it's so important to him?

geonsocal

really interesting question from a perspective you do not often hear voiced, but - no doubt there are many of us whom don't really like to be given stuff...

interesting post, I had never really given it much thought before...

being honest with folks is important though, definitely let them know you appreciate them, but, also let them know how you feel about having folks give you stuff...

somehow you have to get them to understand it's about you and not about them...not always easy to do...

WabanakiWarrior

I agree man! When people give things to me, it feels like I owe them a debt and I hate it. On the surface it seems like kindness, but for an introverted socially anxious kinda guy like me, it's miserable. (And people really do expect things in return even if they don't say it. When they ask you to run them through skyreach 50 times you better say yes because come on I gave you a race change token, but I never asked for that, let me tf alone)
And when you tried to say no, and he acted all butt hurt? F that. That's just a social guilt trip, not friendship

Araneae6537

If it makes them happy, it’s up to them how they wish to spend their money. I only see it as problematic in the case of people who have difficulty saying “no” to those who ask them for things.

In your case, I think I would speak with this friend just to make sure they didn’t feel any obligation or that the friendship was contingent on it, and maybe within a means that you were able to reciprocate so it doesn’t feel one-sided, but without knowing how the conversation went etc., I realize that may all be useless advice.

For myself, when receiving help or gifts I express my sincere gratitude and look for opportunities to return favors or pay it forward as I am able. It is a good feeling.

Neriak

hmm, I can't speak for everyone obviously, but I'm one of the people who gets "too far" with generosity and not respecting someone's boundaries.
Totally guilty, I admit that.
Made this mistake in other MMOs and in ESO too.
But for me, it's just part of the fun, part of interacting with other people in the virtual world. I realize it could make people uncomfortable, but this realization came to me just recently.
I guess it started long ago when I was a complete n00b in another MMO. A guild of brilliant people helped me TREMENDOUSLY (some of them are my friends IRL till this day) and I guess, I decided to help others too. The problem is, it's hard for me to keep boundaries.

I'd say, set your boundaries, like in-game gifts is not a big deal, but when a person spends real-life cash (Crown Store), you can say something like:
okay, I really appreciate your (Crown Store) gifts BUT I'm not sure if I can repay you. Is it okay with you?

And just keep in mind, in any case, you owe NOTHING to them. Accept help if you want to. If they insist, say that you'll donate (the gift) to a guild bank. Or sell it. And see the reaction.
If a person does it just for fun, with no hidden intent, (s)he would say: okay, no problem. But if not - you'll know.

RedMuse

To me this reads not so much as a problem with generosity as it is a problem with your friend not respecting your boundaries. When you say no they get emotionally manipulative. And yeah, that 'sigh' is an attempt at manipulation. It might be a case of 'love languages', ie the way we show someone we like them whether platonically or romantically, differing a lot between you. For him it was a case of giving gifts, for you it might exactly be that "doing stuff together" thing that he disparaged.

I'm just like you. I don't really like people giving me gifts unless I know them well, because I always feel indebted to them and I hate that. I'd much rather we do something together. But I do get where people who show affection by giving gifts are coming from and I can understand that they can feel rejected when I refuse, just as I can feel rejected if they don't want to do something with me. Only way to solve this is by talking it out and finding a compromise that works for both of you. Not sure that was what you did OP, as always having to be careful around someone isn't finding a working compromise in my book. Maybe you could have the conversation again?

Kwoung

Generosity is a fine line to walk. I just gifted a Rabbit to a guildie, who is notorious for killing every rabbit in Kynes Aegis, we thought it was funny and appropriate, as did he. However, I had a guild member randomly gift me some event tickets once, which really creeped me out until I realized there was a promotion to get crown crates by gifting tickets, which then I felt honored he choose me as a recipient for something he was doing for himself.

Random gifts make me very uncomfortable, forcing them on me even moreso.

SilverBride

Araneae6537 wrote: »

If it makes them happy, it’s up to them how they wish to spend their money.

It is also up to the recipient whether or not they want someone else's money spent on them. Having someone I was just beginning a friendship with gift me a race change token that costs 3000 crowns just because I offhand mentioned I was considering it was beyond what I perceive as an average reaction.

Am I the only one who finds this excessive?

And I did immediately bring up my concerns and express how uncomfortable that made me feel.

SeaGtGruff

I feel more comfortable giving things to random strangers than to "friends." I guess it's because then I feel like I'm doing it to be helpful and generous without expecting anything in return, as opposed to doing it because I either feel obligated to be nice or am expecting friendship or whatever in return, as well as not feeling like the other person might get into the habit of hitting me up for more "favors" in the future.

colossalvoids

Had pretty similar experience, that's pretty frustrating but lessons learned.

Odovacar

Yes they can, imho...

Friends helping friends out when one is in need (even if they didn't ask for help) is pretty standard in life and points to prove you have a loyal buddy by your side. The occasional nice gestures are best mutual as you would be there to help if they needed you to etc... What you explained seemed to be something a bit different. If I were you I wouldn't like that situation either.

I'm guessing whoever he/she is does this quite often as this may be one of their main ways of making new friends. Unfortunately, it usually makes the recipient feel unwantedly indebted as the generosity piles on. Either way you look at it it's good you spoke up and let this individual know it makes you feel a little awkward/uncomfortable.

SickleCider

I've been in both sides of this. I've made the mistake of accepting extravagant gifts in the past and had it thrown in my face later on. I'm not sure if it has anything to do with my taste in gifts becoming subsequently quite simple. (For my birthday, I received a little piece of citrine and I was over the moon about it.)

On the other hand, my "love language" is like that of a magpie. I love to give people shinies. Here's the rub, though: just saying it's your "love language" and moving on from there isn't enough. Just like it's important for the recipient to evaluate why they don't want the gift, it's important for those that are fond of giving gifts to consider why they do it. For me, I discovered it doesn't always come from a purely magnanimous place. It's... How do I put this, compensation for what I perceive to be my general failings, I think. So I've been working on adapting my "love language" to substitute moments of consideration and communication, or a simple volunteering of time, rather than a material (or digital) object. I'll still give gifts, but smaller ones, less frequently.

SilverBride

Inaya wrote: »

Sometimes when people are overly generous it comes from a place of insecurity, wanted to be accepted etc.

I think this is why he does it, which would explain why he gets upset if I decline his gifts. Maybe he interprets it as me declining him.

One of the first things he told me when we first met was that he was a "giver". He then proceeded to give me examples of how much he gave to the guild. I should have seen the red flag then.

I would just walk away but I honestly enjoy doing things with this player, just for his company and friendship. Things have gotten a lot better but I'm still cautious.

vibeborn

It's always good to be generous, (I've given and received things in game due to generousity) but it seriously sounds like your friend is taking it too far. Also friendships or any other relationships (whether in game OR irl) should NEVER depend on material goods, I hope your friend realizes this sooner the better

AlnilamE

SilverBride wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

If it makes them happy, it’s up to them how they wish to spend their money.

It is also up to the recipient whether or not they want someone else's money spent on them. Having someone I was just beginning a friendship with gift me a race change token that costs 3000 crowns just because I offhand mentioned I was considering it was beyond what I perceive as an average reaction.

Am I the only one who finds this excessive?

And I did immediately bring up my concerns and express how uncomfortable that made me feel.

As @VaranisArano aptly said, those red flags you are seeing are NOT from the Ebonheart Pact.

Only you get to decide what you are comfortable with, and a true friend would respect your boundaries.

Araneae6537

SilverBride wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

If it makes them happy, it’s up to them how they wish to spend their money.

It is also up to the recipient whether or not they want someone else's money spent on them. Having someone I was just beginning a friendship with gift me a race change token that costs 3000 crowns just because I offhand mentioned I was considering it was beyond what I perceive as an average reaction.

Am I the only one who finds this excessive?

And I did immediately bring up my concerns and express how uncomfortable that made me feel.

Hmm, now from reading your other posts, I can see why you might need to exercise caution with this person — not that I’m assuming anything bad about them, understand, but some relationships can turn unhealthy without anyone having ill intent.

I was coming from the perspective of having received Crown gifts, in one case from a stranger who granted many people’s New Life wishes this past holiday. I am still astounded by their generosity without wishing for anything in return. I don’t think this is something many people could afford to do, but there is nothing wrong with doing so if you can, and they made me and many others very grateful and happy.

Context is important and in the case of any sort of relationship, it is essential to respect boundaries and feelings on all sides.

Neriak

Can I be a devil's advocate for a moment, for all my over-generous people? Yeah, we don't respect boundaries and make everyone feel uncomfortable.
But what you must understand, we give something and forget about it in 5 minutes. While a person who received might feel bad for weeks. I'm sorry about that. I really do, even though I don't understand why they feel this way.
My friends in ESO do Twitch streaming, I showed up, had a great time, and spend a bunch of bits and gifted subs. As result, it damaged the friendship (in my opinion). I don't even care about all this virtual stuff, but they do. They feel obligated, for what? For NOTHING in my opinion. I had fun, I'm grateful. It doesn't get hella more complicated than that.
By the twist of fate, I've found few players from my prev MMO and helped them in ESO with gold, grind, and few gifts. Guess what happened? Same thing. We still do things together, but I feel the tension.

Ofc, there could be people with twisted and ill intents, but even if they do, so what? Once they realise they can't buy your friendship, they'll just move on to the next target. I actually believe these people are rare and most are just like me - do things for fun and probably ignorant when it comes to boundaries. Doesn't mean you should tolerate our antics, ofc, keep the boundaries high or just ignore it like it's normal.
You. Owe. Nothing.

SilverBride

Neriak wrote: »

Can I be a devil's advocate for a moment, for all my over-generous people? Yeah, we don't respect boundaries and make everyone feel uncomfortable.

Why do you do things you know makes everyone uncomfortable? How does that help you, or them? This is what I don't understand.

I don't want a friendship with someone who doesn't respect my boundaries. That shows a complete lack of respect, and how can you be friends under those circumstances?

Luckily after much discussion my friend and I fell into an agreement of bartering. For example, he wanted a certain Redguard table for his house, I wanted an Orc table he had but didn't like, so I bought the Redguard table and traded him for his Orc table. This arrangement works for us because it's based on mutual giving.

JKorr

When I help people, if I help people I always ask that they pay it forward. They owe me nothing; people helped me starting out, and just asked that I help others in turn, when I could, so I do. Besides I invested all that research time on my crafters, all that effort should benefit someone....

amm7sb14_ESO

JKorr wrote: »

When I help people, if I help people I always ask that they pay it forward. They owe me nothing; people helped me starting out, and just asked that I help others in turn, when I could, so I do. Besides I invested all that research time on my crafters, all that effort should benefit someone....

This happened to me the other night in my guild. A new member asked for 3 Rosin to upgrade some of his weapons. I had quite a few in my craft bag, so I gifted them to him. He was adamant that he do something in return for me, but there is nothing I need. I just wanted to help someone out in my guild the way my guild helped me out when I was still green.

Eventually, I told him to just pay it forward to someone else when he is capable of helping others. That's how he could give back.

Neriak

SilverBride wrote: »

I don't want a friendship with someone who doesn't respect my boundaries.

Exactly!
it took me a long time to understand.. many YEARS..
Now I'm much more cautious.. and mindful. Takes a lot of effort to behave appropriately but I'm trying.

It's not a matter of disrespect. What comes naturally for some people is offensive to others. The last thing we're thinking of (esp when spending "real-life" money).. is disrespect.
Some people can just send a Crown gift and forget about it in a minute. Because.. Crown store is just part of the game. If you really want to test your friend's intentions, next time he suggests a Crown gift, tell your guild house needs a Training dummy. You're not declining the gift, but you also don't need it for yourself.

As other people mentioned already, the nuances and the intentions are the keys.. We here don't know the full story, but most likely, even if you decline the gifts, the person has other people on the friend list who would gladly accept. Don't wanna be rude, but that's the reality. As he said, "he told me when we first met was that he was a "giver". (actually, sounds like a red weirdo flag, but whatever... everyone has their own fun in the game..)

"Why do you do things you know makes everyone uncomfortable? How does that help you, or them?"

Well.. honestly.. Just my perspective. I received an enormous amount of help from people in MMOs and in real life. If not for them, I wouldn't be where I'm now. And I'm not alone with this experience. I guess I'm subconsciously trying to pay back. Giving away stuff is much easier than let's say.. helping someone with a consistent grind or *some item* farm. But when I have the time, I always enjoy their company, ofc.

tsaescishoeshiner

Some people give impersonal gifts that are just big amounts of money because to them a gift is about wanting the person to be happy, and the satisfaction of being a good gift giver, even if they haven't thought through the social context of gift giving or know what the person wants.

It's also a demonstration of commitment and selflessness, which makes it feel like they're doing more than just "spending time with you" ... which to me is what friends do lol. It all honestly reminds me of the way certain parents/grandparents act.

You can also let them know you're uncomfortable getting random gifts but you appreciate their generosity, so maybe work out a special friend-rate for buying crowns. Something low like 100:1 or less (depending on your platform, that's low for PC NA). That would certainly still be generous of them : p Especially since it can be hard to find a crown seller, let alone at a really good rate

SilverBride

Neriak wrote: »

I received an enormous amount of help from people in MMOs and in real life. If not for them, I wouldn't be where I'm now. And I'm not alone with this experience. I guess I'm subconsciously trying to pay back. Giving away stuff is much easier than let's say.. helping someone with a consistent grind or *some item* farm. But when I have the time, I always enjoy their company, ofc.

I have been helped a lot, too. When I returned to ESO after a long absence, a random player gifted me a horse and made me a set of armor. I didn't feel uncomfortable by that because I didn't find it excessive. And I greatly appreciated it.

I try to pay it forward by helping others myself. I used up some of my precious heartwood to make some furnishings for a random guildmate the other day who asked if anyone could sell them some things for their first house. I was glad to make them some items because I hoped they would end up loving housing as much as I do, and of course I didn't charge them for it. But this was a one time gesture for a guildmate. If they had asked for a race change token, or some such item, I would have said are you nuts?

I also help any time I hear someone asking for help with a World Boss, etc.. Those are ways I pay it forward. They aren't excessive and don't push boundaries.

But that is very different than the situation I described.

Vlad9425

Have you considered he might want to be more than friends if he’s buying you stuff with real money?

SilverBride

Vlad9425 wrote: »

Have you considered he might want to be more than friends if he’s buying you stuff with real money?

No, it's not like that with us. And after only knowing each other a week and not having spent that much time together yet, I doubt that very much.