Suggestion for a new Story Arc unrelated to..

Vanya

Before I state my opinion I wish to say that Main quest , and Dark heart of Skyrim were truly mind blowing,epic beyond mortal comprehension,emotional,thrilling,intriguing etc, I cannot say for Season of Dragon or Deadric wars I yet have to complete it, I m sure they will be superb too, Quality is really unmatched I always praised but

Isn't it always

Deadric problem
Vampire Crysis
Dragon Menace

The main plots?

CAN we have something unrelated to

Morrowind
Oblivion
Skyrim

Its quite obvious another God is coming to threaten Nirn, we had plot of others , Molag, Dragons and Vampire blood suckers,

Can we please not have same in future?

Thank you kindly

Xuhora

im far far away from a lore expert on ESO, its not what peaks my interest in this game. nontheless i want to chime in my two cents regarding your statement.

For a franchise that exists as long as ES, with a deep lore, beloved by players, its the safer route for developers to go with what worked once before.
the closest comparison that comes to my mind is: remember when Game of Throns went ahead of the writer and had to write the story themselfs? was an actual desaster. Same could happen when ZOS decides to venture out of the beaten path.

then again, it wont affect me personally, but i think it has potential to destroy a lot of what they have built in this game. pair this with the concurrent bugs and problems and it could lead to an exodus.

but as i said, i could be very very wrong, since it is not im my field of expertise.

Edit for typo and easier sentences

Lugaldu

It is said that the best way to make the past understandable and interesting is to include things from the present, something that people know. Here it is exactly the opposite. Lots of players have been with Elder Scrolls since the earlier parts, and it's much easier to relate emotionally to the game when you encounter familiar things. I think it's optimal when you start with the familiar and then break new ground. If I wanted something completely different, I could play a different game.

nukk3r

If not for daedric/dragon/vampire invasions you'd be fighting mudcrabs 24/7, because the biggest threat would be a couple of skeletons in an old crypt.

Syldras

nukk3r wrote: »

If not for daedric/dragon/vampire invasions you'd be fighting mudcrabs 24/7, because the biggest threat would be a couple of skeletons in an old crypt.

How about a bigger invasion from Akavir or Pyandonea? Or cultists reviving (or someone accidentially freeing) some ancient evil that is not vampiric/daedric/dragons? There are possibilities. But what's clear: There always has to be some kind of antagonist - and who would that normally be in the TES world? Probably not a powerhungy guar farmer, and not an insane seamstress either.

Vanya wrote: »

Isn't it always
Deadric problem
Vampire Crysis
Dragon Menace
The main plots?

"Always"? There were 4 chapters so far, with the upcoming one and the main story we have 6 "chapters" altogether (although Morrowind and Summerset are actually one bigger story), and you list 3 different themes. Or, put differently: So far we had a Daedric mainstory, Daedric triad in Morrowind/Summerset, dragons, vampires, after 3 years: Daedra again. Considering the impact the Daedra have in TES, I don't think they are overrepresented here.

Vanya wrote: »

CAN we have something unrelated to
Morrowind
Oblivion
Skyrim

I'm quite sure that after these regions with nostalgia bonus they'll move on to different places after this year, and not start with Morrowind, Skyrim, Oblivion again

adriant1978

And if they have to keep wheeling out the Daedric Princes, must it always be the usual suspects like Bal and Dagon?

How about giving some of the lesser known ones a turn in the limelight? Then again, Sanguine's idea of invading Tamriel would probably risk turning this into another kind of game altogether.

Would love to see more of Hermaeus Mora though ...

Syldras

adriant1978 wrote: »

And if they have to keep wheeling out the Daedric Princes, must it always be the usual suspects like Bal and Dagon?

Clavicus Vile, Nocturnal, Mephala...

adriant1978 wrote: »

How about giving some of the lesser known ones a turn in the limelight?

I'm quite sure that every daedra will get their share.

Honestly, we only had 5 big stories so far, 3 of them daedra-centric, so how are people talking about "always" and "usually"?

Lugaldu

adriant1978 wrote: »

And if they have to keep wheeling out the Daedric Princes, must it always be the usual suspects like Bal and Dagon?

How about giving some of the lesser known ones a turn in the limelight? Then again, Sanguine's idea of invading Tamriel would probably risk turning this into another kind of game altogether.

Would love to see more of Hermaeus Mora though ...

Maybe that will be the case. With regard to the coins as a teaser for chapter 2021, there is a goat head and a bat head in addition to the references to Mehrunes Dagon - perhaps references to Sanguine (goat) and Namira (bat)?

Hermaeus Mora I would also love to see.

adriant1978

Something else I'd like to see when it comes to Daedric Princes would be Azura and Meridia used as antagonists.

IMO, the writers of this game are making those two in particular seem way too "good".

Lugaldu

I have to admit that I find Meridias optical implementation in ESO lousy...

DreadDaedroth

I'd like to see something unrelated to:
Big menace
Bad ruler
Put righteous heir on throne

Lugaldu

Hm, I think a great threat (from whatever) in a fantasy game is fitting. I wouldn't be interested in, I dont know, a great love story, for example...

Syldras

adriant1978 wrote: »

Something else I'd like to see when it comes to Daedric Princes would be Azura and Meridia used as antagonists. IMO, the writers of this game are making those two in particular seem way too "good".

Who defines the way the Daedra are - if not the writers?

Lugaldu wrote: »

Hm, I think a great threat (from whatever) in a fantasy game is fitting. I wouldn't be interested in, I dont know, a great love story, for example...

I suggest a Godzilla story. Return of the Emperor crabs Like the dead one in Ald'ruhn that's used as a building.

TX12001rwb17_ESO

Plenty of ideas that do not involve any of that, look at the Thieves Guild and Dark Brotherhood Questlines, no God/Vampire/Dragon is needed to create an engaging storyline.

An expansion could be centered around a rare artifact been stolen and the entire quest line could be about tracking it down, another example is maybe a Tournament of Warriors is happening somewhere and you have been invited to participate, it would similar to the questline from Oblivion but be more story-driven where the final villain is merely the Tournament Champion who is just a very powerful warrior instead of some God or something.

Ghanima_Atreides

Syldras wrote: »

adriant1978 wrote: »

Something else I'd like to see when it comes to Daedric Princes would be Azura and Meridia used as antagonists. IMO, the writers of this game are making those two in particular seem way too "good".

Who defines the way the Daedra are - if not the writers?

Sure, but if the writers start offering simplistic representations of certain characters and concepts that contradict pre-existing lore, those of us who remember when Meridia was the antagonist in a DLC start to get annoyed that the Daedra are being watered down into "good Daedra" vs "bad Daedra" when they are supposed to be neither.

Lugaldu

Syldras wrote: »

adriant1978 wrote: »

Something else I'd like to see when it comes to Daedric Princes would be Azura and Meridia used as antagonists. IMO, the writers of this game are making those two in particular seem way too "good".

Who defines the way the Daedra are - if not the writers?

Lugaldu wrote: »

Hm, I think a great threat (from whatever) in a fantasy game is fitting. I wouldn't be interested in, I dont know, a great love story, for example...

I suggest a Godzilla story. Return of the Emperor crabs Like the dead one in Ald'ruhn that's used as a building.

I cant help myself, somehow a mood like in "The Tripods" comes to mind...

Aetherderius

What we need is a story where a minor noble gets murdered, but we don't know by who! We investigate the who's and why's of the area to find the killer. And then his GHOST shows up with an army of other ghosts to lay siege to his murderer's city! And then something Dragon Breaky happens and we get five different endings.

Wait.

Lugaldu

In the end, however, there is always the bad opponent. It would be something new if you could end up being the bad guy yourself.

Aetherderius

I got it.

An EVIL mage has kidnapped a powerful noble and has been disguised as them for the past few years! We get a dream vision to find the seven parts of some gizmo to defeat the mage and rescue the noble!

Wait no, that's Arena. Would be a good Trial though.

Lugaldu

It could also be more subtle, we're fighting a threat, but in the end we can't figure out its origin. A mind-controlling threat that makes everyone act contrary to their true nature. One might suspect the Dwemer behind it, or Clavicus Vile, but they're not.

Syldras

Ghanima_Atreides wrote: »

Sure, but if the writers start offering simplistic representations of certain characters and concepts that contradict pre-existing lore, those of us who remember when Meridia was the antagonist in a DLC start to get annoyed that the Daedra are being watered down into "good Daedra" vs "bad Daedra" when they are supposed to be neither.

Have we even seen enough of the Daedra in ESO to make an assumption whether their portrayal is correct or not? We only know bits, and all could still change in upcoming content.

Lugaldu wrote: »

I cant help myself, somehow a mood like in "The Tripods" comes to mind...

I thought of that too

Lugaldu wrote: »

In the end, however, there is always the bad opponent. It would be something new if you could end up being the bad guy yourself.

Actually I already had hoped that you could decide to be either a "good" or a "bad" vampire (siding with either Ravenwatch or the other vampires) when last year's theme was announced. It's a pity you couldn't.

Lugaldu wrote: »

A mind-controlling threat that makes everyone act contrary to their true nature.

Brave Bretons? Generous Hlaalu? Happy cheerful infantile necromancers?`:o

Lugaldu

Syldras wrote: »

Brave Bretons? Generous Hlaalu? Happy cheerful infantile necromancers?`:o

Not to forget the salad-loving Bosmer!

Well, somehow they always manage to get you earlier or later to the point that you would rather follow the other side....Maybe one day it will come as a great innovation. And that decisions really have consequences.

Ghanima_Atreides

Syldras wrote: »

Ghanima_Atreides wrote: »

Sure, but if the writers start offering simplistic representations of certain characters and concepts that contradict pre-existing lore, those of us who remember when Meridia was the antagonist in a DLC start to get annoyed that the Daedra are being watered down into "good Daedra" vs "bad Daedra" when they are supposed to be neither.

Have we even seen enough of the Daedra in ESO to make an assumption whether their portrayal is correct or not? We only know bits, and all could still change in upcoming content.

That's what I'm hoping for! More nuanced/less formulaic plots and Daedra portrayals.

Syldras

Lugaldu wrote: »

Not to forget the salad-loving Bosmer!

They'll all end up in the tar pits of Ouze.

Lugaldu wrote: »

Maybe one day it will come as a great innovation. And that decisions really have consequences.

It would be an improvement for sure.

Ghanima_Atreides wrote: »

That's what I'm hoping for! More nuanced/less formulaic plots and Daedra portrayals.

Agreed.

Lugaldu

What other possibilities are there apart from the Daedric threat, usurpers, dragons and other insane figures. Perhaps a threat from within Nirn, a menace which would result in the sinking of some continents? And we have to go on a scientific expedition to find out where the problem lies. Maybe to figure out that something similar already happened before?

Ok, but this story smells like there is a higher force behind it again ...

Mettaricana

Wont be happy til we can actually fight a daedric prince as a trial and get a trial themed motif for each prince like a 12 or 6 man half trial where we fight just the daedric prince make up any bs lore ya want simalcrum, magic, voodoo whatever we fighting them as a trial. That would be a badass expansion. I would also like to have a less world destroying storyline akin to theives guild and dark brotherhood a more down to earthy ... nirny story but other than maybe a bard or something not sure what interesting feature they could add skills

VampireLordLover99

Vanya wrote: »

Before I state my opinion I wish to say that Main quest , and Dark heart of Skyrim were truly mind blowing,epic beyond mortal comprehension,emotional,thrilling,intriguing etc, I cannot say for Season of Dragon or Deadric wars I yet have to complete it, I m sure they will be superb too, Quality is really unmatched I always praised but

Isn't it always

Deadric problem
Vampire Crysis
Dragon Menace

The main plots?

CAN we have something unrelated to

Morrowind
Oblivion
Skyrim

Its quite obvious another God is coming to threaten Nirn, we had plot of others , Molag, Dragons and Vampire blood suckers,

Can we please not have same in future?

Thank you kindly

What was so mind blowing about Dark Heart, exactly? The greymoor portion of the story was literally a copy and paste of Elsweyr's story from last year, all the way down to having 3 categories of bad guys. The plot was also insanely similar and horribly written, mainly due to the fact it mirrors Elsweyr so well.

A real story was the Morrowind-Clockwork city-Summerset 3 part continuous story. Now THAT was an epic story full of variation and surprise.

Not saying you can't like Dark Heart, but I'm highly curious and somewhat skeptical of what makes it 'mind blowing and epic beyond mortal comprehension.' Especially when the story is cookie cutter of the previous year's story, does little to advance the world plot, and offers essentially no meaningful choices.

Things ZoS could have done to make the story truly outstanding:

-Avoid the whole reluctant/rebel princess trope /again/.
-Avoid the same path of events that lead to the downfall of the big bad guy that has some sort of same-y gimmick the player can use to lower their hp in the final fight.
-Give players an actual choice in the matter. What if players could join Rada and try to help the grey host? Thus getting a whole new vampire line if they're a vampire along with a new narrative experience? Or players could continue along the 'hero' path and assist Lyris and Fenn/Virandis. Similar to dawnguard in Skyrim, both outcomes could lead to the same end of fighting Rada. Just a different path of getting there.
-Avoid the bad guys essentially following the same exact path of defeat as the bad guys in elsweyr did.

The story would have been good if Greymoor was written as well as Markarth, the better half of the two. Or if Elsweyr's story didn't hang on so many of the same tropes.

Ghanima_Atreides

VampireLordLover99 wrote: »

What was so mind blowing about Dark Heart, exactly? The greymoor portion of the story was literally a copy and paste of Elsweyr's story from last year, all the way down to having 3 categories of bad guys. The plot was also insanely similar and horribly written, mainly due to the fact it mirrors Elsweyr so well.

Not to mention the fact that the king was a traitor was so obviously telegraphed from the very beginning it spoiled the surprise twist it was meant to be. Then they did the same thing later with Lady Belain, although in their defence that portion of the story held a few genuine surprises.

MasterSpatula

I get where you're coming from, but do you really expect them not to celebrate the fifteenth anniversary of Oblivion?

Hell, I just wish they hadn't shoved all of High Rock into the base game and made if feel so tiny. Bring on the Daggerfall love!

Sephyr

VampireLordLover99 wrote: »

Vanya wrote: »

Before I state my opinion I wish to say that Main quest , and Dark heart of Skyrim were truly mind blowing,epic beyond mortal comprehension,emotional,thrilling,intriguing etc, I cannot say for Season of Dragon or Deadric wars I yet have to complete it, I m sure they will be superb too, Quality is really unmatched I always praised but

Isn't it always

Deadric problem
Vampire Crysis
Dragon Menace

The main plots?

CAN we have something unrelated to

Morrowind
Oblivion
Skyrim

Its quite obvious another God is coming to threaten Nirn, we had plot of others , Molag, Dragons and Vampire blood suckers,

Can we please not have same in future?

Thank you kindly

What was so mind blowing about Dark Heart, exactly? The greymoor portion of the story was literally a copy and paste of Elsweyr's story from last year, all the way down to having 3 categories of bad guys. The plot was also insanely similar and horribly written, mainly due to the fact it mirrors Elsweyr so well.

A real story was the Morrowind-Clockwork city-Summerset 3 part continuous story. Now THAT was an epic story full of variation and surprise.

Not saying you can't like Dark Heart, but I'm highly curious and somewhat skeptical of what makes it 'mind blowing and epic beyond mortal comprehension.' Especially when the story is cookie cutter of the previous year's story, does little to advance the world plot, and offers essentially no meaningful choices.

Things ZoS could have done to make the story truly outstanding:

-Avoid the whole reluctant/rebel princess trope /again/.
-Avoid the same path of events that lead to the downfall of the big bad guy that has some sort of same-y gimmick the player can use to lower their hp in the final fight.
-Give players an actual choice in the matter. What if players could join Rada and try to help the grey host? Thus getting a whole new vampire line if they're a vampire along with a new narrative experience? Or players could continue along the 'hero' path and assist Lyris and Fenn/Virandis. Similar to dawnguard in Skyrim, both outcomes could lead to the same end of fighting Rada. Just a different path of getting there.
-Avoid the bad guys essentially following the same exact path of defeat as the bad guys in elsweyr did.

The story would have been good if Greymoor was written as well as Markarth, the better half of the two. Or if Elsweyr's story didn't hang on so many of the same tropes.

Agreed. Although I've been underwhelmed with almost every single expansion released storywise, the Dark Heart of Skyrim was rather forgettable. If it wasn't for the performance issues, the new (yet somehow unimproved) vampire system, and just ball drop after ball drop - it would be completely forgettable compared to the other expansions. At least with Elsweyr they actually brought in culture in the backdrop. There wasn't too much in the Reach for me to really feel the same vibe and to me the best part of the whole year was the fact there was a pettable dog. How riveting.

adriant1978

MasterSpatula wrote: »

I get where you're coming from, but do you really expect them not to celebrate the fifteenth anniversary of Oblivion?

I just hope they celebrate it in such a way that it isn't a straight up copy/paste of the story from 15 years ago ...