LOL Seriously, ZOS, a DPS Check on Veteran Vateshran Final Boss?

GrumpyDuckling

I went in blind with a tanky/fun disease-themed Necro build that uses Plague Slinger and Leeching. Of course I'm not efficient killing enemies, but it's a fun thematic golded-out build and it was doing great as long as my mechanics were tight. I was nowhere near on pace for a leaderboard score, but I didn't care, I was using my fun build and mastering the mechanics.

Then, I get to the final boss and encounter the ring of death DPS check. Are you serious, ZOS, with this nonsense? It seems silly that the game so drastically encourages me to change my build because of a single mechanic. I mean, we wouldn't want people playing how they want, right? Why should the same build that gets a player through the first 3 zones of Vateshran still be expected to compete in the final zone, right?

Stahlor

Can you complete Ice Arena 5 in Maelstrom with that build?

Merlin13KAGL

It's not the DPS check that failed you as a tanky build.
It was the inability to eat the combined damage of the entire ring's explosion.

You had to expect a solo arena would favor damage?

Jaimeh

That fight does have a dps check (and there are other minor ones throughout in the arena), which I personally don't like, because it's a bit prohibiting, but I also don't agree with the notion of refusing to adjust a build. Part of the fun and the challenge in beating solo content is to fugure out the strategies to do it (if, like in this case, you don't have the damage to flat out burn through the mechanic), and adjusting your build is a logical choice. Overall, I find that Vateshran has more parse-type fights, than mechanics-heavy fights compared to vMA, so it favours damage, whereas in vMA, with the esception of stage 5, you can be tanky and take your time.

simple_specops

The fact you got there on the tank is just so unbelievable, and for that I congratulate you! As others have said its solo content, and it is meant to be challenging. Otherwise perfect weapon might be as well in the daily rewards. It has to have a challenge or else why would anyone play it? Dps checks in solo arena are everywhere, from round 5 in vma, last boss on 8th round in vma, crystal phase on the last boss and many more, I cannot stress this enough, it's a solo arena and you just kill things in order to complete it!

mobicera

It's not really a very large dps check.
I am an average dps, nothing great last patch I was averaged around 75-77k on magnb on console so good enough for vet trials but not really score pushing HM vdlc numbers, I have no idea this patch I haven't even bothered to parse.
Now this fight for me is simple.
I nuke...
Round 1 I hard target the boss and nuke from %100 to about 8% then I go grapple and portal it.
Round 2 and each subsequent round I hard target the boss and nuke from under 50%.
All adds die in cleave or disappear when you kill the final.
I mean how much dps does a shade really require?
When even mediocre dps can ignore everything and burn the boss before mechanics occur...
Have you considered playing a character built for veteran content?
It's pretty helpful...

GrumpyDuckling

Jaimeh wrote: »

but I also don't agree with the notion of refusing to adjust a build.

I didn't refuse to adjust my build. I switched my gear and completed it.

This post was just about how silly it is that the game so drastically encourages me to change my build because of a single mechanic after the entirety of the first 3 zones were completed fine with the first build I had.

GrumpyDuckling

mobicera wrote: »

Have you considered playing a character built for veteran content?
It's pretty helpful...

The character was built for veteran content... the first three zones of vet Vateshran were fine -- and this character has also beat VMA.

mobicera

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

mobicera wrote: »

Have you considered playing a character built for veteran content?
It's pretty helpful...

The character was built for veteran content... the first three zones of vet Vateshran were fine -- and this character has also beat VMA.

I disagree
Leeching and plague without the dps to kill a shade...

So you have neither vet tank which isn't really ideal in solo in fact it's pretty far from ideal.
And you don't have vet dps if you can't kill a shade.
What you are in fact in is an overworld role playing build, I'm sorry...

GrumpyDuckling

simple_specops wrote: »

The fact you got there on the tank is just so unbelievable, and for that I congratulate you! As others have said its solo content, and it is meant to be challenging. It has to have a challenge or else why would anyone play it?

I'd argue that what I was doing with my tanky build was far more challenging. Do you know how tight your mechanics have to be to endure lengthy drawn-out battles where you simply aren't nuking enemies down and skipping mechanics?

GrumpyDuckling

mobicera wrote: »

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

mobicera wrote: »

Have you considered playing a character built for veteran content?
It's pretty helpful...

The character was built for veteran content... the first three zones of vet Vateshran were fine -- and this character has also beat VMA.

I disagree
Leeching and plague without the dps to kill a shade...

So you have neither vet tank which isn't really ideal in solo in fact it's pretty far from ideal.
And you don't have vet dps if you can't kill a shade.
What you are in fact in is an overworld role playing build, I'm sorry...

Seems like you have a very narrow view of this game. Classifying the build as "overworld" is not only flat wrong, it's just a shallow assessment. The build has completed numerous types of Veteran content, including VMA. The build did all of Vateshran Hollow fine until the random DPS check popped up.

I know that the build is not optimal -- but I really like it so I've endured long-drawn out battles with multiple phases of mechanics. I made the game far more challenging than it needed to be, but the point was that I could still do it as long as I played well and maintained tight mechanics-- that all went out the window with the DPS check. I wish you could see how silly and unnecessary it is for a game to include a mechanic like this that so harshly encourages a person to change the build they've been using because specific numbers are need in a specific window of time.

El_Borracho

VMA builds do not work as well in Vateshran as they do in VMA. Regular PVE DPS builds work better.

Jaimeh

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

Jaimeh wrote: »

but I also don't agree with the notion of refusing to adjust a build.

I didn't refuse to adjust my build. I switched my gear and completed it.

This post was just about how silly it is that the game so drastically encourages me to change my build because of a single mechanic after the entirety of the first 3 zones were completed fine with the first build I had.

It's because, unlike vMA, where the difficulty rises sequentially with each arena, in Vateshran you have 3 easy to mid difficulty stages, and then it spikes a great deal for the last boss fight. This discrepancy was mentioned frequently in the feedback during the PTS cycle.

ForfiniteStories

I agree with OPs point whole-heartedly.

Endgame content in ESO is indeed disjointed from the rest of the game's design philosophy. I don't mind challenging content, but all builds should be viable for all content, more or less. I shouldn't need to farm multiple sets just for one boss or run; it defeats the purpose of playing a role-playing game. It also just isn't fun.

Like, if I don't have the build or a set or an ability a team requires, screw me, I guess?

I don't like seeing ESO pretend to be like other MMORPGs. Parsing, addons, prog; I mean really?

That's a lot of unnecessarily tedious work just for a chance at a weapon you want. It kind of makes me wonder why those who put themselves through that don't just play other MMOs instead of feeding one of the worst things about ESO.

mustangmorgan31

If every build was viable to complete Vateshran then it would be too easy. Why would you not want to be the best player you can possibly be using the best gear to complete the content? I can make a build out of spelunkers but do you think I am going to run any kind of content with it? A lot of players I have noticed are ok with mediocrity and that is totally fine. But don't get on the forums complaining about a mechanic when you are running a subpar build for the content in question.

GrumpyDuckling

mustangmorgan31 wrote: »

But don't get on the forums complaining about a mechanic when you are running a subpar build for the content in question.

The build only becomes "subpar" during that singular mechanic.

That was, ya know, the ENTIRE point of this thread. That it's silly that the game so drastically encourages me to change my build because of a single mechanic.

mustangmorgan31

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

mustangmorgan31 wrote: »

But don't get on the forums complaining about a mechanic when you are running a subpar build for the content in question.

The build only becomes "subpar" during that singular mechanic.

That was, ya know, the ENTIRE point of this thread. That it's silly that the game so drastically encourages me to change my build because of a single mechanic.

That build is subpar for PVE.

Dagoth_Rac

You seem to be upset that the final boss presents the biggest challenge. That is the essence of a final boss. It will point out weaknesses in your build or approach that you may have gotten away with along the way, but will not cut it against a final boss. For some builds, they may not have enough healing to keep themselves topped off. For some builds, they may not have enough health or mitigation to avoid one-shots. For some builds, they may not have enough damage to take out high priority targets quickly. Your build is in the latter situation.

The DPS check in there is not steep at all. It does not require some glass cannon build with Trial leaderboard DPS. It just requires a balanced build. Some healing, some mitigation, some damage.

You are doing so little damage that you are the tank equivalent of a DPS with 12k health. That DPS does not need to go full tank and have 40k health, but 12k health is way too low. You do not need full-on DPS damage, but you do need a little more. It is a final boss. It is going to demand more out of you than earlier bosses.

Juhasow

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

Jaimeh wrote: »

but I also don't agree with the notion of refusing to adjust a build.

I didn't refuse to adjust my build. I switched my gear and completed it.

This post was just about how silly it is that the game so drastically encourages me to change my build because of a single mechanic after the entirety of the first 3 zones were completed fine with the first build I had.

It may be a suprise for You but switching setups to complete certain mechanics was in this game since 2014.

GrumpyDuckling

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

You seem to be upset that the final boss presents the biggest challenge. That is the essence of a final boss.

Nope. I was clear about what I thought was silly -- a singular mechanic drastically encouraging me to change my build.

GrumpyDuckling

Juhasow wrote: »

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

Jaimeh wrote: »

but I also don't agree with the notion of refusing to adjust a build.

I didn't refuse to adjust my build. I switched my gear and completed it.

This post was just about how silly it is that the game so drastically encourages me to change my build because of a single mechanic after the entirety of the first 3 zones were completed fine with the first build I had.

It may be a suprise for You but switching setups to complete certain mechanics was in this game since 2014.

Okay. I still think the Vateshran DPS check is silly.

GrumpyDuckling

mustangmorgan31 wrote: »

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

mustangmorgan31 wrote: »

But don't get on the forums complaining about a mechanic when you are running a subpar build for the content in question.

The build only becomes "subpar" during that singular mechanic.

That was, ya know, the ENTIRE point of this thread. That it's silly that the game so drastically encourages me to change my build because of a single mechanic.

That build is subpar for PVE.

Ah, okay. Thanks for telling me. I'll be sure to never ever make use that build again for any PVE content. What was I thinking?

Gaggin

It's crazy how some of the content in this game forces you to be good at the game in order to complete it.

Destyran

It’s 18k dps. You need to practice

GrumpyDuckling

Gaggin wrote: »

It's crazy how some of the content in this game forces you to be good at the game in order to complete it.

Yeah, cuz switching my build to one that does more damage then completing it totally made me "good."

You are missing the point. It's silly that the game so drastically encourages a player to change their build because of a single mechanic.

VoidBiscuit

Banter

Provin915

Anyone done it as bow/bow? I've seen a few people do it. Tried it myself but I'm not geared enough.. (vet btw)

Stahlor

I'm a pacifist and I really like ESO a lot. My target is to spread love all over Tamriel. After I was very successful to do so in overland content, I tried to have a conversation with the final boss in Vet Vateshran solo arena. However the creatures in there are very aggressive and violent to me. Before we could talk, they started attacking me and I have a hard time to defend myself. I'm neither wearing armor nor weapons, since this is my style of living. So I tried to survive with my fists only, but very often I get killed. When I reached the final boss after hours of running and defending, he started attacking me instantly. After a while he disappeared completely and some shades forced me to stop spreading my love. I was defending myself hard with my fists, but died in the end. Dear Zenimax! I am very disappointed and there is something completely wrong with this game. Why can't I play the game how I want and you force me to play a specific and very savage role?

GrumpyDuckling

Stahlor wrote: »

I'm a pacifist and I really like ESO a lot. My target is to spread love all over Tamriel. After I was very successful to do so in overland content, I tried to have a conversation with the final boss in Vet Vateshran solo arena. However the creatures in there are very aggressive and violent to me. Before we could talk, they started attacking me and I have a hard time to defend myself. I'm neither wearing armor nor weapons, since this is my style of living. So I tried to survive with my fists only, but very often I get killed. When I reached the final boss after hours of running and defending, he started attacking me instantly. After a while he disappeared completely and some shades forced me to stop spreading my love. I was defending myself hard with my fists, but died in the end. Dear Zenimax! I am very disappointed and there is something completely wrong with this game. Why can't I play the game how I want and you force me to play a specific and very savage role?

Yup, our experiences are exactly the same.

SgtNuttzmeg

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

mobicera wrote: »

Have you considered playing a character built for veteran content?
It's pretty helpful...

The character was built for veteran content... the first three zones of vet Vateshran were fine -- and this character has also beat VMA.

If you can't beat this check on your standard DPS build your character is not built for vet content. Its not much of a DPS check. Idk what the point is of running a tank through a solo arena. The content is meant to challenge you, if you aren't looking for a challenge try it on normal.

GrumpyDuckling

Provin915 wrote: »

Anyone done it as bow/bow? I've seen a few people do it. Tried it myself but I'm not geared enough.. (vet btw)

Yeah, I've done it on a bow/bow stamina sorcerer. It was much easier than going through on my tanky build because you just skip most of the mechanics with the amount of damage you put out.