ZOS and Group Content

Khallarion

Greetings,

This topic has as goal to express some thoughts towards the game group content, and how it might be experienced differently accordingly to different types of players.

The Elder Scrolls Online has, as a game, the goal to satisfy both people who are used to single player games, but also, people who enjoy multiplayer activities. That happens in different games, but I personally feel that ESO has this "plus", allowing individuals, or individual players, to be as free as possible, resembling some single player Elder Scrolls games, which is very good. This is good for one simple fact; the majority of time, you're not "obligated" to play in group, aside of course, activities such as dungeons and trials.

Still, as a MMO, the game requires you to make parties and play in group, and some contents that's not optional, obligating people to party up with strangers, and that will always bring several issues, since we have different people playing, and different people with different background, different ages, not mentioning different people from different countries and culture, such as myself, since I'm not in the US.

If you have a couple of friends in order to play, then it's fine. If you have siblings, alright. You can even socialize and meet people in-game, being lucky enough to find someone that will help you out, not screaming at microphone because you did something wrong, or died. You can participate in a guild, finding different guilds accordingly to your needs, but still, you need to find those kind people to help you our, or be social enough and have enough patience for that.

Personally, interacting with people I could notice some behavior that I dislike, don't agree, or that makes me not wanting to interact with them at all. Again, I do understand people are different, and I respect that, but I don't want to feel obligated to party up with people I don't know. Here, when I say "people that I don't know", it includes people from guilds, or in-game friends, that has no bounds with me, thus not obligating them to respect me.

You might think; "Oh, but people should respect you". Nop... don't be so deluded, as someone in-game told me once; "respect you earn". But you earn such respect differently, accordingly to different individuals, as for example, when you're capable of getting Emperor, or complete a Dungeon in Veteran or Hard Mode. If you're not capable, then people, or lots of people who play group content, will despise you, humiliate you etc.

Again, even being capable of such achievements, this behavior people have just make me feel not inclined to interact with others. Due this fact I would love if we could complete group content alone, even Trials, because the majority of dungeons you can actually complete that solo, in normal mode. Having a content that blocks you to complete it solo limits the experience and liberty people should have.

I would like to be able to solo a Trial, or a version of a Trial similar to vMA, and get my achievements, skins, colors and so on by myself, not depending on others, or on the needs of socializing the majority of people have. We could have what they did with Battlegrounds; Group and Solo Battlegrounds. Of course in BG you still play with people, and still need people to fight and so on, no matter if you're solo or in a pre-made group, but you get the idea.

I'm tired of the drama, lack of respect, idiotic behavior and so on. I just want to play my game, my way, without anything bothering me, or with the need of hearing people, or using discord to do absolutely everything... You might think; just go play Skyrim, or a single player game. I would love to, but the market nowadays "obligates" companies to focus group content. I'm an old gamer, at least for a gamer I'm old, and I'm just so tired of teenager drama... that's why I'm here asking for more solo content.

Not mentioning the fact you have a guild, you have adults playing, but sometimes you can't just fill enough people for a Trail, thus wasting time trying to fill it, or even worse, canceling it, or getting PUGs that will ruin the run as well, or will make drama and so on, so on. I have family, I have things to do, I have other obligations, I just want to sit and play my game, I don't want to interact with strangers, I don't want to talk, I don't want to deal with other people aside my obligations, and I don't want to turn a game into an "obligation", if you understand what I mean.

There are probably a couple of people, probably old enough, to feel the way I feel.

Anyways, thank you for your attention, and hope ZOS take a look at it.

zvavi

Trials are group content, it is indeed hard getting 12 people together, and work together as well, but the skins associated with them are rewards for completing them with a group. And most skin/polymorph/mount in a trial had their crownstore counterpart (similar but not exactly), in case you really like it and want something similar.

What you are asking for, is taking away the rewards for completing trials with groups, while I understand the sentiment, there should be a reward exclusive for group play. And I don't think the rewards should be something no one wants.

VaranisArano

Are you asking for trials to be given a additional nerfed solo mode at about the same difficulty as vMA and the new vet solo arena?

Sure.

Just don't go asking for the same achievements and trial rewards as the people who played the full trial as intended. You can have different achievements and arena rewards that reflect what you actually did, but don't go begging for achievements and rewards you didn't earn. If you don't play the same content, you don't get the same reward.


On a side note, there are a few players who have soloed parts of trials. I believe Vaoh is one? But obviously, that was soloing the trial at its intended difficulty, which doesn't seem to be what you are asking for.

Tommy_The_Gun

Tbh. I think If we had a solo or group mode added to different type of content with different rewards (achievements, skins, titles etc.) then it would be quite nice. Besides, assets are already in the game. Slight mechanics changes would be a cheap way to add new content. Imagine if we had for example a "group" mode for vMA (of course it will be way harder with ramped-up difficulty to accommodate 4 man group). Same for other content. "Solo" mode for trials or other group content.

I know it is nice to have some wishes that most likely will never come, as ZOS has troubles to make normal group finder to work, let alone to add arenas & trials support to group finder support.

^ Yes, this question was asked during Q&A on a Bethesda live stream and the answer was basically that they think about it constantly, but they are worried since they can not make even normal group finder to work reliably, let alone adding new content support to it.

Because imho this is what will happen sooner. We are more likely to (eventually) get all group content to be sported by group finder, rather than solo / group mode added to content.

TequilaFire

Human beings are by nature social animals and it is good for our mental health to meet new people with different cultures, lifestyles and ideas.

Khallarion

Doesn't matter if you complete it with a group or not. The majority of content are choreographed mechanics you don't actually need to think about, just study and imitate what others already figured out, unless you want to figure our it by yourself, which hardly ever someone does.

Actually, a solo content might be even harder, specially if you don't look how to do that on the internet, thus the reward might be even better than what you have in a group content. Everything will be based on the audience's intentions and goals. Now, of course they can't do something too hard, because people would just complain, since it's easier to put the responsibility of your fails at your group, or at others.

Now though, what someone said is true, you can get a similar skin at the Crown Store. Also, you don't even need to go that far, buying achievement-like stuff, If you take for example the dyes, the Daedric Red Dye, an easy rare dye to get, it is almost identical to the Ruby Throne Red, which you get by becoming an Emperor. Becoming Emperor is hard? Definitely more than just kill a bit of mobs at the Anchors, but worth the effort? Nop, not only for the dye, unless you want to complete your hue of colors. So, I'm not asking to take away group rewards, you might have different achievements based on different content.

Again, you don't need to actually nerf something, you can get an extremely hard gameplay in a solo content, if you want to do that. Take, for example, Dark Souls mechanics and bosses, and you can get even better rewards for that, as stated before. So I'm begging for a content I can play on myself, rely on my abilities, and not on others. Also, I'm not asking for partially solo something, I want to be able to complete it alone, something crafted for me to improve, thus why I mentioned vMA.

We have group arenas and so on, that's not hard to do, Dragonstar Arena is an example of that, so why not apply the reverse-engineering? Again, it's a matter of interest and public, what people want, and the effort the company is willing to make in order to deliver such content, and earn profit.

The main issue towards grouping in ESO is due the simple fact there are lots of DDs. People want to do their stuff, they want to have DPS and so on. Being a healer is boring for the majority of people, and a Tank is hard since you somehow carry the party, you need to know the mechanics and be able to tank properly etc. All MMOs have this same issue, hardly ever we find tank and healers, that's why I have all roles and play all roles, but I don't want to depend on what my group need, I want to sit and do my stuff, not be attached to people, groups and so on, as stated at first.

In Final Fantasy everything is based on group finding. It's everything automatic, and we have several games that work the same way. Usually Asian rpgs are more adapted to that, and honestly, ESO is way easier than the majority of Asian games I already played, thus the reason I play this time, because I just want to have fun.

idk

VaranisArano wrote: »

Are you asking for trials to be given a additional nerfed solo mode at about the same difficulty as vMA and the new vet solo arena?

Sure.

Just don't go asking for the same achievements and trial rewards as the people who played the full trial as intended. You can have different achievements and arena rewards that reflect what you actually did, but don't go begging for achievements and rewards you didn't earn. If you don't play the same content, you don't get the same reward.


On a side note, there are a few players who have soloed parts of trials. I believe Vaoh is one? But obviously, that was soloing the trial at its intended difficulty, which doesn't seem to be what you are asking for.

Yes, they are asking for solo versions of the trials. They specifically state "I would like to be able to solo a Trial, or a version of a Trial similar to vMA, and get my achievements, skins, colors and so on by myself,"

This is problematic as the trials would have to be dumbed down on tops of having a radical redesign for them to even be challenging solo.

However, that is not a problem. The real problem seems to who OP is running with. I have been raiding for years and have been able to raid on good teams without dealing with the drama, lack of respect, idiotic behavior OP speaks of. Yes, it is there in some raid groups. I have seen it and walked away from it as I will not lower myself to deal with people like that.

As a result, I have raided with some great people and have enjoyed running the trials with them in both progression and pushing time for leaderboards. Even with the groups I have been asked to help with I have seen mostly good people. Much really comes down to the quality of guild raid leadership.

Quality begets quality. Also, in the end, these people are not strangers but my in-game friends. Some that I have known for about a decade.

Jeremy

Khallarion wrote: »

Greetings,

This topic has as goal to express some thoughts towards the game group content, and how it might be experienced differently accordingly to different types of players.

The Elder Scrolls Online has, as a game, the goal to satisfy both people who are used to single player games, but also, people who enjoy multiplayer activities. That happens in different games, but I personally feel that ESO has this "plus", allowing individuals, or individual players, to be as free as possible, resembling some single player Elder Scrolls games, which is very good. This is good for one simple fact; the majority of time, you're not "obligated" to play in group, aside of course, activities such as dungeons and trials.

Still, as a MMO, the game requires you to make parties and play in group, and some contents that's not optional, obligating people to party up with strangers, and that will always bring several issues, since we have different people playing, and different people with different background, different ages, not mentioning different people from different countries and culture, such as myself, since I'm not in the US.

If you have a couple of friends in order to play, then it's fine. If you have siblings, alright. You can even socialize and meet people in-game, being lucky enough to find someone that will help you out, not screaming at microphone because you did something wrong, or died. You can participate in a guild, finding different guilds accordingly to your needs, but still, you need to find those kind people to help you our, or be social enough and have enough patience for that.

Personally, interacting with people I could notice some behavior that I dislike, don't agree, or that makes me not wanting to interact with them at all. Again, I do understand people are different, and I respect that, but I don't want to feel obligated to party up with people I don't know. Here, when I say "people that I don't know", it includes people from guilds, or in-game friends, that has no bounds with me, thus not obligating them to respect me.

You might think; "Oh, but people should respect you". Nop... don't be so deluded, as someone in-game told me once; "respect you earn". But you earn such respect differently, accordingly to different individuals, as for example, when you're capable of getting Emperor, or complete a Dungeon in Veteran or Hard Mode. If you're not capable, then people, or lots of people who play group content, will despise you, humiliate you etc.

Again, even being capable of such achievements, this behavior people have just make me feel not inclined to interact with others. Due this fact I would love if we could complete group content alone, even Trials, because the majority of dungeons you can actually complete that solo, in normal mode. Having a content that blocks you to complete it solo limits the experience and liberty people should have.

I would like to be able to solo a Trial, or a version of a Trial similar to vMA, and get my achievements, skins, colors and so on by myself, not depending on others, or on the needs of socializing the majority of people have. We could have what they did with Battlegrounds; Group and Solo Battlegrounds. Of course in BG you still play with people, and still need people to fight and so on, no matter if you're solo or in a pre-made group, but you get the idea.

I'm tired of the drama, lack of respect, idiotic behavior and so on. I just want to play my game, my way, without anything bothering me, or with the need of hearing people, or using discord to do absolutely everything... You might think; just go play Skyrim, or a single player game. I would love to, but the market nowadays "obligates" companies to focus group content. I'm an old gamer, at least for a gamer I'm old, and I'm just so tired of teenager drama... that's why I'm here asking for more solo content.

Not mentioning the fact you have a guild, you have adults playing, but sometimes you can't just fill enough people for a Trail, thus wasting time trying to fill it, or even worse, canceling it, or getting PUGs that will ruin the run as well, or will make drama and so on, so on. I have family, I have things to do, I have other obligations, I just want to sit and play my game, I don't want to interact with strangers, I don't want to talk, I don't want to deal with other people aside my obligations, and I don't want to turn a game into an "obligation", if you understand what I mean.

There are probably a couple of people, probably old enough, to feel the way I feel.

Anyways, thank you for your attention, and hope ZOS take a look at it.

Don't be shy about using the ignore button. Works wonders on dealing with people who annoy you.

I do agree with you about trials being a pain to put together. I think the solution is to make them accessible on the activity finder, not to turn them into solo content.

VaranisArano

idk wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Are you asking for trials to be given a additional nerfed solo mode at about the same difficulty as vMA and the new vet solo arena?

Sure.

Just don't go asking for the same achievements and trial rewards as the people who played the full trial as intended. You can have different achievements and arena rewards that reflect what you actually did, but don't go begging for achievements and rewards you didn't earn. If you don't play the same content, you don't get the same reward.


On a side note, there are a few players who have soloed parts of trials. I believe Vaoh is one? But obviously, that was soloing the trial at its intended difficulty, which doesn't seem to be what you are asking for.

Yes, they are asking for solo versions of the trials. They specifically state "I would like to be able to solo a Trial, or a version of a Trial similar to vMA, and get my achievements, skins, colors and so on by myself,"

This is problematic as the trials would have to be dumbed down on tops of having a radical redesign for them to even be challenging solo.

However, that is not a problem. The real problem seems to who OP is running with. I have been raiding for years and have been able to raid on good teams without dealing with the drama, lack of respect, idiotic behavior OP speaks of. Yes, it is there in some raid groups. I have seen it and walked away from it as I will not lower myself to deal with people like that.

As a result, I have raided with some great people and have enjoyed running the trials with them in both progression and pushing time for leaderboards. Even with the groups I have been asked to help with I have seen mostly good people. Much really comes down to the quality of guild raid leadership.

Quality begets quality. Also, in the end, these people are not strangers but my in-game friends. Some that I have known for about a decade.

I honestly don't mind the idea of adding a Solo Arena that matches up to the trial content and theme. It'd have to be nerfed and have any group-required mechanics changed, but that could be a fun addition for players who want challenging solo content without having to wait for ZOS to design something with completely new assets like Blackrose Prison or Vateshran Hollows. Its always easier to adjust assets that already exist - ZOS recycles content all the time, if not quite on that scale.

But it wouldn't be the same as doing the trial, and so it shouldn't have the same rewards. That's the part I object to.

Taleof2Cities

VaranisArano wrote: »

idk wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Are you asking for trials to be given a additional nerfed solo mode at about the same difficulty as vMA and the new vet solo arena?

Sure.

Just don't go asking for the same achievements and trial rewards as the people who played the full trial as intended. You can have different achievements and arena rewards that reflect what you actually did, but don't go begging for achievements and rewards you didn't earn. If you don't play the same content, you don't get the same reward.


On a side note, there are a few players who have soloed parts of trials. I believe Vaoh is one? But obviously, that was soloing the trial at its intended difficulty, which doesn't seem to be what you are asking for.

Yes, they are asking for solo versions of the trials. They specifically state "I would like to be able to solo a Trial, or a version of a Trial similar to vMA, and get my achievements, skins, colors and so on by myself,"

This is problematic as the trials would have to be dumbed down on tops of having a radical redesign for them to even be challenging solo.

However, that is not a problem. The real problem seems to who OP is running with. I have been raiding for years and have been able to raid on good teams without dealing with the drama, lack of respect, idiotic behavior OP speaks of. Yes, it is there in some raid groups. I have seen it and walked away from it as I will not lower myself to deal with people like that.

As a result, I have raided with some great people and have enjoyed running the trials with them in both progression and pushing time for leaderboards. Even with the groups I have been asked to help with I have seen mostly good people. Much really comes down to the quality of guild raid leadership.

Quality begets quality. Also, in the end, these people are not strangers but my in-game friends. Some that I have known for about a decade.

I honestly don't mind the idea of adding a Solo Arena that matches up to the trial content and theme. It'd have to be nerfed and have any group-required mechanics changed, but that could be a fun addition for players who want challenging solo content without having to wait for ZOS to design something with completely new assets like Blackrose Prison or Vateshran Hollows. Its always easier to adjust assets that already exist - ZOS recycles content all the time, if not quite on that scale.

But it wouldn't be the same as doing the trial, and so it shouldn't have the same rewards. That's the part I object to.

Seems like you’re bending over backwards to reach a compromise with a handful of finicky solo players, @VaranisArano.

My proposal would be to let solo players have their “veteran overland content” ... but only after they’ve completed the solo content already in the game.

Which means clears in vMA and vVH before they move on to a rehash of existing content at a higher difficulty.

idk

VaranisArano wrote: »

idk wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Are you asking for trials to be given a additional nerfed solo mode at about the same difficulty as vMA and the new vet solo arena?

Sure.

Just don't go asking for the same achievements and trial rewards as the people who played the full trial as intended. You can have different achievements and arena rewards that reflect what you actually did, but don't go begging for achievements and rewards you didn't earn. If you don't play the same content, you don't get the same reward.


On a side note, there are a few players who have soloed parts of trials. I believe Vaoh is one? But obviously, that was soloing the trial at its intended difficulty, which doesn't seem to be what you are asking for.

Yes, they are asking for solo versions of the trials. They specifically state "I would like to be able to solo a Trial, or a version of a Trial similar to vMA, and get my achievements, skins, colors and so on by myself,"

This is problematic as the trials would have to be dumbed down on tops of having a radical redesign for them to even be challenging solo.

However, that is not a problem. The real problem seems to who OP is running with. I have been raiding for years and have been able to raid on good teams without dealing with the drama, lack of respect, idiotic behavior OP speaks of. Yes, it is there in some raid groups. I have seen it and walked away from it as I will not lower myself to deal with people like that.

As a result, I have raided with some great people and have enjoyed running the trials with them in both progression and pushing time for leaderboards. Even with the groups I have been asked to help with I have seen mostly good people. Much really comes down to the quality of guild raid leadership.

Quality begets quality. Also, in the end, these people are not strangers but my in-game friends. Some that I have known for about a decade.

I honestly don't mind the idea of adding a Solo Arena that matches up to the trial content and theme. It'd have to be nerfed and have any group-required mechanics changed, but that could be a fun addition for players who want challenging solo content without having to wait for ZOS to design something with completely new assets like Blackrose Prison or Vateshran Hollows. Its always easier to adjust assets that already exist - ZOS recycles content all the time, if not quite on that scale.

But it wouldn't be the same as doing the trial, and so it shouldn't have the same rewards. That's the part I object to.

I would not object either. A solo version so players could see the story without having to deal with the challenges.

However, OP is asking to be able to get the skins, titles, and other rewards for completing the most challenging content in the game without completing it. There is a grand difference between a no-death run of a 12 man group and a no-death run for a solo player.

renne

Khallarion wrote: »

I would like to be able to solo a Trial, or a version of a Trial similar to vMA, and get my achievements, skins, colors and so on by myself, not depending on others, or on the needs of socializing the majority of people have. We could have what they did with Battlegrounds; Group and Solo Battlegrounds. Of course in BG you still play with people, and still need people to fight and so on, no matter if you're solo or in a pre-made group, but you get the idea.

I mean, nothing is stopping you from going into a trial solo and attempting to get those skins, titles, achievements, etc. But wanting a nerfed solo easy mode so you can get exactly the same thing?

No. They are rewards for doing group content.

And if they just make a nerfed solo easy mode of a trial with new skins, titles, achievements, etc, you still end up with the same complaint that you already have that you can't get the skins, titles, achievements, etc from the group content because you don't want to group.

And that is your choice to make. You absolutely have the "liberty" to attempt to solo them as is, the same way you can attempt to solo all the dungeons.

Your Battlegrounds example is not a good one because as you say, even if you queue solo, you're still part of a group and you're fighting as part of a group. So why should trials be any different? This game is FULL of solo or challengingly soloable "group" content. Existing group content like trials doesn't need to be neutered just to cater to the handful of people who refuse to group up in group content.

And pugs aren't nearly as toxic and drama-riddled as you're making out, sure there is the occasional toxic fool, but they're the minority, and if you're worried of going into group content and being ~shamed for not knowing something, say if you pugged into Sunspire or whatever, the internet is FULL of people making helpful videos and guides on mechanics you can make yourself aware of first. It's the same with dungeons.

VaranisArano

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

idk wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Are you asking for trials to be given a additional nerfed solo mode at about the same difficulty as vMA and the new vet solo arena?

Sure.

Just don't go asking for the same achievements and trial rewards as the people who played the full trial as intended. You can have different achievements and arena rewards that reflect what you actually did, but don't go begging for achievements and rewards you didn't earn. If you don't play the same content, you don't get the same reward.


On a side note, there are a few players who have soloed parts of trials. I believe Vaoh is one? But obviously, that was soloing the trial at its intended difficulty, which doesn't seem to be what you are asking for.

Yes, they are asking for solo versions of the trials. They specifically state "I would like to be able to solo a Trial, or a version of a Trial similar to vMA, and get my achievements, skins, colors and so on by myself,"

This is problematic as the trials would have to be dumbed down on tops of having a radical redesign for them to even be challenging solo.

However, that is not a problem. The real problem seems to who OP is running with. I have been raiding for years and have been able to raid on good teams without dealing with the drama, lack of respect, idiotic behavior OP speaks of. Yes, it is there in some raid groups. I have seen it and walked away from it as I will not lower myself to deal with people like that.

As a result, I have raided with some great people and have enjoyed running the trials with them in both progression and pushing time for leaderboards. Even with the groups I have been asked to help with I have seen mostly good people. Much really comes down to the quality of guild raid leadership.

Quality begets quality. Also, in the end, these people are not strangers but my in-game friends. Some that I have known for about a decade.

I honestly don't mind the idea of adding a Solo Arena that matches up to the trial content and theme. It'd have to be nerfed and have any group-required mechanics changed, but that could be a fun addition for players who want challenging solo content without having to wait for ZOS to design something with completely new assets like Blackrose Prison or Vateshran Hollows. Its always easier to adjust assets that already exist - ZOS recycles content all the time, if not quite on that scale.

But it wouldn't be the same as doing the trial, and so it shouldn't have the same rewards. That's the part I object to.

Seems like you’re bending over backwards to reach a compromise with a handful of finicky solo players, @VaranisArano.

My proposal would be to let solo players have their “veteran overland content” ... but only after they’ve completed the solo content already in the game.

Which means clears in vMA and vVH before they move on to a rehash of existing content at a higher difficulty.

Honestly, I just like the idea of more solo arenas. That has a lot of appeal to players who want harder content like the old Craglorn without messing with the current difficulty tiers or requiring ZOS to create a lot of new assets.

It wouldn't satisfy everyone. Nothing will. Craglorn, VMA, and vVH don't do that - how could anything new hope to? But its taken 5 years for us to get a 2nd Solo arena in ESO, and basing the solo arena around a nerfed version of the Chapter trial seems like a reasonable way that ZOS could add more hard solo content to the game without as much effort as creating more arenas from whole cloth would be.

I mean, ideally, we'd get more original solo arenas. But I also recognize that the Devs have a lot on their plate and that at some point, me asking for more of a certain type of content on their current schedule means that I need to be willing to put up with reused assets and enemies - just look at the reused stuff in Elsweyr/Dragonhold!

VaranisArano

idk wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

idk wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Are you asking for trials to be given a additional nerfed solo mode at about the same difficulty as vMA and the new vet solo arena?

Sure.

Just don't go asking for the same achievements and trial rewards as the people who played the full trial as intended. You can have different achievements and arena rewards that reflect what you actually did, but don't go begging for achievements and rewards you didn't earn. If you don't play the same content, you don't get the same reward.


On a side note, there are a few players who have soloed parts of trials. I believe Vaoh is one? But obviously, that was soloing the trial at its intended difficulty, which doesn't seem to be what you are asking for.

Yes, they are asking for solo versions of the trials. They specifically state "I would like to be able to solo a Trial, or a version of a Trial similar to vMA, and get my achievements, skins, colors and so on by myself,"

This is problematic as the trials would have to be dumbed down on tops of having a radical redesign for them to even be challenging solo.

However, that is not a problem. The real problem seems to who OP is running with. I have been raiding for years and have been able to raid on good teams without dealing with the drama, lack of respect, idiotic behavior OP speaks of. Yes, it is there in some raid groups. I have seen it and walked away from it as I will not lower myself to deal with people like that.

As a result, I have raided with some great people and have enjoyed running the trials with them in both progression and pushing time for leaderboards. Even with the groups I have been asked to help with I have seen mostly good people. Much really comes down to the quality of guild raid leadership.

Quality begets quality. Also, in the end, these people are not strangers but my in-game friends. Some that I have known for about a decade.

I honestly don't mind the idea of adding a Solo Arena that matches up to the trial content and theme. It'd have to be nerfed and have any group-required mechanics changed, but that could be a fun addition for players who want challenging solo content without having to wait for ZOS to design something with completely new assets like Blackrose Prison or Vateshran Hollows. Its always easier to adjust assets that already exist - ZOS recycles content all the time, if not quite on that scale.

But it wouldn't be the same as doing the trial, and so it shouldn't have the same rewards. That's the part I object to.

I would not object either. A solo version so players could see the story without having to deal with the challenges.

However, OP is asking to be able to get the skins, titles, and other rewards for completing the most challenging content in the game without completing it. There is a grand difference between a no-death run of a 12 man group and a no-death run for a solo player.

Yep. It sounds like we agree that, no, players shouldn't get the rewards/achievements without playing the content as intended.

Kurat

What's with all these solo threads lately. It's an MMO.

Starlight_Whisper

zvavi wrote: »

Trials are group content, it is indeed hard getting 12 people together, and work together as well, but the skins associated with them are rewards for completing them with a group. And most skin/polymorph/mount in a trial had their crownstore counterpart (similar but not exactly), in case you really like it and want something similar.

What you are asking for, is taking away the rewards for completing trials with groups, while I understand the sentiment, there should be a reward exclusive for group play. And I don't think the rewards should be something no one wants.

This^

Khallarion

Actually this conversation went to a good direction, and honestly I wasn't expecting that, even though some missed the point, but this always happens anyways.

Well, if you guys feel so worried about someone earning the same content others had so much work to accomplish, just give part of it, a nerfed version, whatever. As stated, I want to play and have fun, since a game is a game, and wouldn't prove anything at all, in comparison to great life achievements, which are also relative, accordingly to different people, values, etc.

But something really cool that I read and forgot to mention is the fact of players being able to solo the content in order to follow the story, read stuff at their own pace and so on. I personally take screenshots of everything, so I don't bother people asking them to stop, neither I lose something I would like to read. We have the Shalidor's Library? But I like to get a book within the Trial/Dungeon/Delve context and read it there.

Anyways, it's also true that the majority of people I encountered were extremely competitive and toxic, to the point I don't wanna group up anymore or even using the ignore button... the problem is having the need of using it, unless I just ignore everybody, or remove the chat tab and pretend people were NPCs, but still, the dungeon might fail, and that wouldn't remove the issue of getting lots of people together in order to complete a Trial.

Recently though, I entered a decent guild, with decent people, and we might play and have smooth runs, complete Trials under 33 minutes, and so on, pretty good, but it's still a pain to fill the party, to the point we waste half time trying to party up... the Saturday Night Trials start at, for example, 11pm, and we start doing it at 11.30 pm, completing it at 12 am, and just ending the run because there's no people to run again, or another Trial, or they are just too tired.

But again, achievements, those are relative, or their quality and value. I personally like some skins, such as the skin we get from Depths of Malatar, more than others that are just horrible, in my opinion, but that are earned through Trial Achievements. Same applies with dyes, Daedric Red is easy to get, and it's the same as the Ruby Throne Red... so, whatever, it's a matter of taste.

Iccotak

VaranisArano wrote: »

Are you asking for trials to be given a additional nerfed solo mode at about the same difficulty as vMA and the new vet solo arena?

Sure.

Just don't go asking for the same achievements and trial rewards as the people who played the full trial as intended. You can have different achievements and arena rewards that reflect what you actually did, but don't go begging for achievements and rewards you didn't earn. If you don't play the same content, you don't get the same reward.


On a side note, there are a few players who have soloed parts of trials. I believe Vaoh is one? But obviously, that was soloing the trial at its intended difficulty, which doesn't seem to be what you are asking for.

Hell why doesn’t ZOS just create a solo and group version of everything.

Each side with its own levels of difficulty and different achievements, thus providing incentive to participate in both sides.

Sounds like a TON of work ngl

idk

Iccotak wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Are you asking for trials to be given a additional nerfed solo mode at about the same difficulty as vMA and the new vet solo arena?

Sure.

Just don't go asking for the same achievements and trial rewards as the people who played the full trial as intended. You can have different achievements and arena rewards that reflect what you actually did, but don't go begging for achievements and rewards you didn't earn. If you don't play the same content, you don't get the same reward.


On a side note, there are a few players who have soloed parts of trials. I believe Vaoh is one? But obviously, that was soloing the trial at its intended difficulty, which doesn't seem to be what you are asking for.

Hell why doesn’t ZOS just create a solo and group version of everything.

Each side with its own levels of difficulty and different achievements, thus providing incentive to participate in both sides.

Sounds like a TON of work ngl

It is one thing to create a solo version of group content that is not challenging. However, when talking about doing a solo version of challenging group content and trying to still keep the challenge it is a very different level of work since the original mechanics do not work well, or sometimes are utterly pointless, in a solo setting.

As such it works fine so someone can see the story or even get the books for whatever reason, but Zos should not put in the effort to try to create two different designs so the group version is challenging and the solo version is challenging.

Further, OP clearly stated their reason for this and it is they do not fit with the people they have been grouping with. They really need to find a group that works for them.