Most frustrating thing about ESO is lack of load outs.

washbern

I want to start that I am a fairly new player and overall I love the game. But I find that the most annoying part of this game is lack of load outs. Its not even the bugs.

I want to play or try different builds. I can't do that without to constantly having to respec my attributes or morphs or skill points or champion points or all of the above. It is infuriating! I play a mag sorc and I find that the morphs of skills apply to different playstyles. I am not even talking about if I want to switch to stam (which i sometimes do).

Fennwitty

What do you mean by load-outs?

At the heart of it, there's not much reason to change your attribute allocation. You can rearrange your effective ability scores almost entirely by using different gear and foods.

Now on PC, we have addons like Dressing Room that help you quickly swap your equipment and skills all at once. So you could press one button and change from light to heavy armor and completely different front and back bar skills if you wanted.

It wouldn't address morphs though. Morphs will almost always be role based. But, there's enough skill points and skill lines in the game you generally won't *have to* remorph particular skills just to change your role.

Unless you're aiming for top score leaderboard, most of your CP can be fairly generalist. Red defenses are pretty standard across classes and even roles. Green line to a great extent doesn't need much adjustment between roles either, as long as you don't change your main attribute. Blue can be fairly generalized as well.

Also for PC, there are addons which can quickly reallocate your CP to saved presets.

Now PvP to PvE yes some skills benefit from a morph. CP also can require significant changes.

Bashev

Actually in ESO is quite easy and not so expensive to respec and try other builds.

Vevvev

To make it even easier the devs gave us the ability to change out morphs only making the process cheaper than refunding every single skill point. Now flipping from a mag build to a stam build would be expensive when it comes to skills, but with attributes and CP it is pretty cheap as well.

I think OP just hates how much time it takes to go through and change everything out that they'd otherwise do with the press of a single button. Like in Planetside 2 for instance I have 4 different loadouts for my healer to use in different situations and combat distances. ESO can only accomplish that with addons, which are unavailable to consoles and stadia players, and even then they can only do much. If you want to change mundus stones you'd have to go to a player home or to the physical place the stone is in the world, and also visit the bank if you don't have the sets on hand if you don't have the banker assistant.

Sadly the way ESO is structured a true loadout system is impossible.

p00tx

That's why you can make so many different characters. You can have one of everything if you decide you want that.

washbern

If the achievements and titles and waypoints were account wide, this wouldn't be a question

If I want to spec one way for dungeons and another way for trials that's about 5 k per night at best and I can't switch on the fly. Which means I have to stand next to the damn altar for 20 minutes each time. This is a very basic QOL change i am complaining about that would make a world of difference

Wolfpaw

washbern wrote: »

I want to start that I am a fairly new player and overall I love the game. But I find that the most annoying part of this game is lack of load outs. Its not even the bugs.

I want to play or try different builds. I can't do that without to constantly having to respec my attributes or morphs or skill points or champion points or all of the above. It is infuriating! I play a mag sorc and I find that the morphs of skills apply to different playstyles. I am not even talking about if I want to switch to stam (which i sometimes do).

Dual specialization would be a great qol update.

Zodiarkslayer

washbern wrote: »

I want to start that I am a fairly new player and overall I love the game. But I find that the most annoying part of this game is lack of load outs. Its not even the bugs.

I want to play or try different builds. I can't do that without to constantly having to respec my attributes or morphs or skill points or champion points or all of the above. It is infuriating! I play a mag sorc and I find that the morphs of skills apply to different playstyles. I am not even talking about if I want to switch to stam (which i sometimes do).

I dont get your problem. Loadouts is a thing for PvP first person shooters, not for a RPG. And complete respecs aren't that expensive either.
3200 for attribute points
3000 for champion points
And aprox 1000 for morph changes, depending on how much skills you mastered. That is really not much. You can easily get that from an evening of lazy questing.

Besides as long as you dont respec attributes from one ressource to another, all you really need is enough skill points to have all relevant skills unlocked. It's not hard to get enough.

@washbern You are probably overthinking your need to minmax and thus are constantly respeccing. My main is a magsorc too and i had to respec twice. But only because i missspend skill points into stupid things like medium armor and guild skill line passives I didn't need.

washbern

@Zodiarkslayer my problem is that a single class is doomed to play one spec at a time. Sorcs suffer from the fact that their dps abilities overlap their support ones. Yes, if you are happy playing multiple tools or never changing your playstyle this post does not apply. For those who want to play several roles on a single character, the loadout system would be an amazing improvement.

Hell, you can't even swap gear easily unless you are on pc and I have an addon.

zvavi

washbern wrote: »

my problem is that a single class is doomed to play one spec at a time. Sorcs suffer from the fact that their dps abilities overlap their support ones. Yes, if you are happy playing multiple tools or never changing your playstyle this post does not apply. For those who want to play several roles on a single character, the loadout system would be an amazing improvement.

Hell, you can't even swap gear easily unless you are on pc and I have an addon.

Agreed. My PvP, heal, tank, dd, dd if my healer is ***, are all specs that will need different morphs each. The nonexistence of load outs makes it impossible for me to PvP and be queued for a dungeon at the same time.

Zodiarkslayer

washbern wrote: »

@Zodiarkslayer my problem is that a single class is doomed to play one spec at a time. Sorcs suffer from the fact that their dps abilities overlap their support ones. Yes, if you are happy playing multiple tools or never changing your playstyle this post does not apply. For those who want to play several roles on a single character, the loadout system would be an amazing improvement.

Hell, you can't even swap gear easily unless you are on pc and I have an addon.

@washbern I totally understand you. I get your frustration. I am not even saying that a "loadout like" system wouldn't be a tremendous QoL improvement.

What I wanted to point out is that you cannot expect systems like that in any RPG. It is a role you are playing after all. If you can't live with an either/or decision making system RPGs may not be for you. This is not meant as an offense.

zvavi wrote: »

washbern wrote: »

my problem is that a single class is doomed to play one spec at a time. Sorcs suffer from the fact that their dps abilities overlap their support ones. Yes, if you are happy playing multiple tools or never changing your playstyle this post does not apply. For those who want to play several roles on a single character, the loadout system would be an amazing improvement.

Hell, you can't even swap gear easily unless you are on pc and I have an addon.

Agreed. My PvP, heal, tank, dd, dd if my healer is ***, are all specs that will need different morphs each. The nonexistence of load outs makes it impossible for me to PvP and be queued for a dungeon at the same time.

And I think that is a good thing. It keeps the game interesting in the long run.
Besides, the guys in the 42k club have found a way around that too. As you are probably one of them too. ;-)

zvavi

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

And I think that is a good thing. It keeps the game interesting in the long run.
Besides, the guys in the 42k club have found a way around that too. As you are probably one of them too. ;-)

How exactly does not being able to PvP while you are queued for a dungeon makes the game more interesting? If anything I am more likely to stop playing because I have nothing to do while I am in dd queue.
How does not being able to swap for healer if group is deemed like it needs one a good thing? Or to tank if we got a fake tank in vDLC queue?
The only difference between having loadouts, and not having them, is
1. option to switch on the fly without relogging
2. without grinding another character
both activities (relogging and leveling another max level character), I can't understand how you find them "fun" (and that's excluding the explaining to the group that you are relogging to the real character you wanted to queue to the dungeon for, and the 20% chance they will actually invite you back).

Ye. Definitely makes game more fun in the long run. /s

Wolfpaw

ZOS could give Multi Specialization (out of combat swap of skills, cp, & attributes) the Outfit system treatment, first one is free, & each additional Specialization at a Crown Store purchase.

washbern

Wolfpaw wrote: »

ZOS could give Multi Specialization (out of combat swap of skills, cp, & attributes) the Outfit system treatment, first one is free, & each additional Specialization at a Crown Store purchase.

Thats exactly what I'm advocating for.

Wolfpaw

washbern wrote: »

Wolfpaw wrote: »

ZOS could give Multi Specialization (out of combat swap of skills, cp, & attributes) the Outfit system treatment, first one is free, & each additional Specialization at a Crown Store purchase.

Thats exactly what I'm advocating for.

Need this posted in General w/devs tagged!

This would alleviate some lfg dungeon issues, & filling roles in Cyrodiil's new group restrictions.

Zodiarkslayer

zvavi wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

And I think that is a good thing. It keeps the game interesting in the long run.
Besides, the guys in the 42k club have found a way around that too. As you are probably one of them too. ;-)

How exactly does not being able to PvP while you are queued for a dungeon makes the game more interesting? If anything I am more likely to stop playing because I have nothing to do while I am in dd queue.
How does not being able to swap for healer if group is deemed like it needs one a good thing? Or to tank if we got a fake tank in vDLC queue?
The only difference between having loadouts, and not having them, is
1. option to switch on the fly without relogging
2. without grinding another character
both activities (relogging and leveling another max level character), I can't understand how you find them "fun" (and that's excluding the explaining to the group that you are relogging to the real character you wanted to queue to the dungeon for, and the 20% chance they will actually invite you back).

Ye. Definitely makes game more fun in the long run. /s

Personally, if had no fun playing a game, I wouldn't play it. And I do find fun things to do while waiting for a Group Finder Que. In a massive game like ESO it is not hard.

Wolfpaw wrote: »

washbern wrote: »

Wolfpaw wrote: »

ZOS could give Multi Specialization (out of combat swap of skills, cp, & attributes) the Outfit system treatment, first one is free, & each additional Specialization at a Crown Store purchase.

Thats exactly what I'm advocating for.

Need this posted in General w/devs tagged!

This would alleviate some lfg dungeon issues, & filling roles in Cyrodiil's new group restrictions.

... and necessitate a complete rework of character creation system, group finder, dungeon mechanics and user interface at least! Not to speak of the usual balancing and optimization issues or the technological aspects that come with such dramatic and far reaching changes to the core game. Let alone that implementation would probably not go without prolonged sever shutdowns.

I am Sorry, but the whole idea is just wet bovine secretion from its rearward orifice, in my opinion.

zvavi

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

And I think that is a good thing. It keeps the game interesting in the long run.
Besides, the guys in the 42k club have found a way around that too. As you are probably one of them too. ;-)

How exactly does not being able to PvP while you are queued for a dungeon makes the game more interesting? If anything I am more likely to stop playing because I have nothing to do while I am in dd queue.
How does not being able to swap for healer if group is deemed like it needs one a good thing? Or to tank if we got a fake tank in vDLC queue?
The only difference between having loadouts, and not having them, is
1. option to switch on the fly without relogging
2. without grinding another character
both activities (relogging and leveling another max level character), I can't understand how you find them "fun" (and that's excluding the explaining to the group that you are relogging to the real character you wanted to queue to the dungeon for, and the 20% chance they will actually invite you back).

Ye. Definitely makes game more fun in the long run. /s

Personally, if had no fun playing a game, I wouldn't play it. And I do find fun things to do while waiting for a Group Finder Que. In a massive game like ESO it is not hard.

Precisely the reason I am not doing any of those things, I am not leveling alts for just PvP, nor do I queue with characters with different specs than what I am queued for, but if there were loadouts, I would be able to have more fun in game, by having more freedom on the activities I can do.

Zodiarkslayer

zvavi wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

And I think that is a good thing. It keeps the game interesting in the long run.
Besides, the guys in the 42k club have found a way around that too. As you are probably one of them too. ;-)

How exactly does not being able to PvP while you are queued for a dungeon makes the game more interesting? If anything I am more likely to stop playing because I have nothing to do while I am in dd queue.
How does not being able to swap for healer if group is deemed like it needs one a good thing? Or to tank if we got a fake tank in vDLC queue?
The only difference between having loadouts, and not having them, is
1. option to switch on the fly without relogging
2. without grinding another character
both activities (relogging and leveling another max level character), I can't understand how you find them "fun" (and that's excluding the explaining to the group that you are relogging to the real character you wanted to queue to the dungeon for, and the 20% chance they will actually invite you back).

Ye. Definitely makes game more fun in the long run. /s

Personally, if had no fun playing a game, I wouldn't play it. And I do find fun things to do while waiting for a Group Finder Que. In a massive game like ESO it is not hard.

Precisely the reason I am not doing any of those things, I am not leveling alts for just PvP, nor do I queue with characters with different specs than what I am queued for, but if there were loadouts, I would be able to have more fun in game, by having more freedom on the activities I can do.

Fair enough. But it sounds like your limitation at that point is your unwillingness to do something else. Rather then the game not permitting you to play everything you enjoy with the one and the same character. Or am I getting this wrong again?

And my point for long term fun was simply, that I can enjoy the same content from a different perspective, when character creation limitation force me to adopt. If I had total freedom everytime, i would play anything only once and boredom would be quick to come. You know, getting more fun from the same thing is the definition of replayability of a game and thus its long term fun. At least I thought it was.

washbern

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

And I think that is a good thing. It keeps the game interesting in the long run.
Besides, the guys in the 42k club have found a way around that too. As you are probably one of them too. ;-)

How exactly does not being able to PvP while you are queued for a dungeon makes the game more interesting? If anything I am more likely to stop playing because I have nothing to do while I am in dd queue.
How does not being able to swap for healer if group is deemed like it needs one a good thing? Or to tank if we got a fake tank in vDLC queue?
The only difference between having loadouts, and not having them, is
1. option to switch on the fly without relogging
2. without grinding another character
both activities (relogging and leveling another max level character), I can't understand how you find them "fun" (and that's excluding the explaining to the group that you are relogging to the real character you wanted to queue to the dungeon for, and the 20% chance they will actually invite you back).

Ye. Definitely makes game more fun in the long run. /s

Personally, if had no fun playing a game, I wouldn't play it. And I do find fun things to do while waiting for a Group Finder Que. In a massive game like ESO it is not hard.

Wolfpaw wrote: »

washbern wrote: »

Wolfpaw wrote: »

ZOS could give Multi Specialization (out of combat swap of skills, cp, & attributes) the Outfit system treatment, first one is free, & each additional Specialization at a Crown Store purchase.

Thats exactly what I'm advocating for.

Need this posted in General w/devs tagged!

This would alleviate some lfg dungeon issues, & filling roles in Cyrodiil's new group restrictions.

... and necessitate a complete rework of character creation system, group finder, dungeon mechanics and user interface at least! Not to speak of the usual balancing and optimization issues or the technological aspects that come with such dramatic and far reaching changes to the core game. Let alone that implementation would probably not go without prolonged sever shutdowns.

I am Sorry, but the whole idea is just wet bovine secretion from its rearward orifice, in my opinion.

I think that your limited view of this system is whatever bovine blah blah blah.

This does not pose a rework of anything. Character creation remains as is. Dungeon balance remains as is. What this will cut back on is the stupid amount of fake healers and fake tanks because with this system people wouldn't have to change their dps spec just to do a dungeon.

Advocating against this change is just stupid since it really doesn't hurt anyone and solves a lot of issues

zvavi

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

And I think that is a good thing. It keeps the game interesting in the long run.
Besides, the guys in the 42k club have found a way around that too. As you are probably one of them too. ;-)

How exactly does not being able to PvP while you are queued for a dungeon makes the game more interesting? If anything I am more likely to stop playing because I have nothing to do while I am in dd queue.
How does not being able to swap for healer if group is deemed like it needs one a good thing? Or to tank if we got a fake tank in vDLC queue?
The only difference between having loadouts, and not having them, is
1. option to switch on the fly without relogging
2. without grinding another character
both activities (relogging and leveling another max level character), I can't understand how you find them "fun" (and that's excluding the explaining to the group that you are relogging to the real character you wanted to queue to the dungeon for, and the 20% chance they will actually invite you back).

Ye. Definitely makes game more fun in the long run. /s

Personally, if had no fun playing a game, I wouldn't play it. And I do find fun things to do while waiting for a Group Finder Que. In a massive game like ESO it is not hard.

Precisely the reason I am not doing any of those things, I am not leveling alts for just PvP, nor do I queue with characters with different specs than what I am queued for, but if there were loadouts, I would be able to have more fun in game, by having more freedom on the activities I can do.

Fair enough. But it sounds like your limitation at that point is your unwillingness to do something else. Rather then the game not permitting you to play everything you enjoy with the one and the same character. Or am I getting this wrong again?

And my point for long term fun was simply, that I can enjoy the same content from a different perspective, when character creation limitation force me to adopt. If I had total freedom everytime, i would play anything only once and boredom would be quick to come. You know, getting more fun from the same thing is the definition of replayability of a game and thus its long term fun. At least I thought it was.

We never said loadouts instead of character slots, especially since loadouts are class based. And yes, you are right, it is my unwillingness to respec 5 times a week. Sometimes multiple times a day. Nor levelling another character that plays exactly the same excluding different morphs.

Wolfpaw

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

And I think that is a good thing. It keeps the game interesting in the long run.
Besides, the guys in the 42k club have found a way around that too. As you are probably one of them too. ;-)

How exactly does not being able to PvP while you are queued for a dungeon makes the game more interesting? If anything I am more likely to stop playing because I have nothing to do while I am in dd queue.
How does not being able to swap for healer if group is deemed like it needs one a good thing? Or to tank if we got a fake tank in vDLC queue?
The only difference between having loadouts, and not having them, is
1. option to switch on the fly without relogging
2. without grinding another character
both activities (relogging and leveling another max level character), I can't understand how you find them "fun" (and that's excluding the explaining to the group that you are relogging to the real character you wanted to queue to the dungeon for, and the 20% chance they will actually invite you back).

Ye. Definitely makes game more fun in the long run. /s

Personally, if had no fun playing a game, I wouldn't play it. And I do find fun things to do while waiting for a Group Finder Que. In a massive game like ESO it is not hard.

Wolfpaw wrote: »

washbern wrote: »

Wolfpaw wrote: »

ZOS could give Multi Specialization (out of combat swap of skills, cp, & attributes) the Outfit system treatment, first one is free, & each additional Specialization at a Crown Store purchase.

Thats exactly what I'm advocating for.

Need this posted in General w/devs tagged!

This would alleviate some lfg dungeon issues, & filling roles in Cyrodiil's new group restrictions.

... and necessitate a complete rework of character creation system, group finder, dungeon mechanics and user interface at least! Not to speak of the usual balancing and optimization issues or the technological aspects that come with such dramatic and far reaching changes to the core game. Let alone that implementation would probably not go without prolonged sever shutdowns.

I am Sorry, but the whole idea is just wet bovine secretion from its rearward orifice, in my opinion.

Character creation, group finder, dungeon mechanics? I'm not sure what you're are even talking about?

This type of qol system is over a decade old in some other mmorpg's.

Zodiarkslayer

Wolfpaw wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

And I think that is a good thing. It keeps the game interesting in the long run.
Besides, the guys in the 42k club have found a way around that too. As you are probably one of them too. ;-)

How exactly does not being able to PvP while you are queued for a dungeon makes the game more interesting? If anything I am more likely to stop playing because I have nothing to do while I am in dd queue.
How does not being able to swap for healer if group is deemed like it needs one a good thing? Or to tank if we got a fake tank in vDLC queue?
The only difference between having loadouts, and not having them, is
1. option to switch on the fly without relogging
2. without grinding another character
both activities (relogging and leveling another max level character), I can't understand how you find them "fun" (and that's excluding the explaining to the group that you are relogging to the real character you wanted to queue to the dungeon for, and the 20% chance they will actually invite you back).

Ye. Definitely makes game more fun in the long run. /s

Personally, if had no fun playing a game, I wouldn't play it. And I do find fun things to do while waiting for a Group Finder Que. In a massive game like ESO it is not hard.

Wolfpaw wrote: »

washbern wrote: »

Wolfpaw wrote: »

ZOS could give Multi Specialization (out of combat swap of skills, cp, & attributes) the Outfit system treatment, first one is free, & each additional Specialization at a Crown Store purchase.

Thats exactly what I'm advocating for.

Need this posted in General w/devs tagged!

This would alleviate some lfg dungeon issues, & filling roles in Cyrodiil's new group restrictions.

... and necessitate a complete rework of character creation system, group finder, dungeon mechanics and user interface at least! Not to speak of the usual balancing and optimization issues or the technological aspects that come with such dramatic and far reaching changes to the core game. Let alone that implementation would probably not go without prolonged sever shutdowns.

I am Sorry, but the whole idea is just wet bovine secretion from its rearward orifice, in my opinion.

Character creation, group finder, dungeon mechanics? I'm not sure what you're are even talking about?

This type of qol system is over a decade old in some other mmorpg's.

What i mean is that if you dabble with core mechanics of gameplay, there will be consequences throughout the entire system. Not even speaking technologically here. It is like playing Monopoly without being forced to pay the rent.

Please all see that your idea of loadouts would mean the availability of all skills (except the skills from different classes) at all times! At the "touch of a button" (figuratively).

That effectively takes the R out of RPG.

Or what other restrictions would there be? Only one loadoutchange per dungeon? Is there a loadoutchange alter now in every dungeon? How would the servers track that count? Are CP affected too? How does damage calculation function now that there are more possibilities? Or do you want to cache every loadout on the servers, putting more strain on the already weak and not exactly state of the art servers we now have? How are dungeon PUGs affected, when everyone decides to take the tank loadout? Do you let them rerespec after they notice their error?

And now gameplay wise:
The decision of either/or is what makes one's build. Having all options available at all times means taking away that decision. The whole concept of specialised roles, the trinity of tank healer damage dealer would become totally obsolete, since everyone can respec himself too easily.

There are so many potentially bad repercussions. Think about it: if one player is better at healing, tanking and dps than all the rest of the group, why would he even consider playing with others?

That idea of loadouts makes sense in a shooter, or an adventure game with a multiplayer. A short intense and repetitive experience. Ideal for people with an unwillingness for long term dedication. It is fine. Just has no place in a rolebased game.

Applause to you for staying with me to the end! And this referance is your reward:

For ESO loadouts would be a deep rabbit hole. And before long we would all be sipping tea with the mad hatter!

zvavi

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

Wolfpaw wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

And I think that is a good thing. It keeps the game interesting in the long run.
Besides, the guys in the 42k club have found a way around that too. As you are probably one of them too. ;-)

How exactly does not being able to PvP while you are queued for a dungeon makes the game more interesting? If anything I am more likely to stop playing because I have nothing to do while I am in dd queue.
How does not being able to swap for healer if group is deemed like it needs one a good thing? Or to tank if we got a fake tank in vDLC queue?
The only difference between having loadouts, and not having them, is
1. option to switch on the fly without relogging
2. without grinding another character
both activities (relogging and leveling another max level character), I can't understand how you find them "fun" (and that's excluding the explaining to the group that you are relogging to the real character you wanted to queue to the dungeon for, and the 20% chance they will actually invite you back).

Ye. Definitely makes game more fun in the long run. /s

Personally, if had no fun playing a game, I wouldn't play it. And I do find fun things to do while waiting for a Group Finder Que. In a massive game like ESO it is not hard.

Wolfpaw wrote: »

washbern wrote: »

Wolfpaw wrote: »

ZOS could give Multi Specialization (out of combat swap of skills, cp, & attributes) the Outfit system treatment, first one is free, & each additional Specialization at a Crown Store purchase.

Thats exactly what I'm advocating for.

Need this posted in General w/devs tagged!

This would alleviate some lfg dungeon issues, & filling roles in Cyrodiil's new group restrictions.

... and necessitate a complete rework of character creation system, group finder, dungeon mechanics and user interface at least! Not to speak of the usual balancing and optimization issues or the technological aspects that come with such dramatic and far reaching changes to the core game. Let alone that implementation would probably not go without prolonged sever shutdowns.

I am Sorry, but the whole idea is just wet bovine secretion from its rearward orifice, in my opinion.

Character creation, group finder, dungeon mechanics? I'm not sure what you're are even talking about?

This type of qol system is over a decade old in some other mmorpg's.

What i mean is that if you dabble with core mechanics of gameplay, there will be consequences throughout the entire system. Not even speaking technologically here. It is like playing Monopoly without being forced to pay the rent.

Please all see that your idea of loadouts would mean the availability of all skills (except the skills from different classes) at all times! At the "touch of a button" (figuratively).

That effectively takes the R out of RPG.

Or what other restrictions would there be? Only one loadoutchange per dungeon? Is there a loadoutchange alter now in every dungeon? How would the servers track that count? Are CP affected too? How does damage calculation function now that there are more possibilities? Or do you want to cache every loadout on the servers, putting more strain on the already weak and not exactly state of the art servers we now have? How are dungeon PUGs affected, when everyone decides to take the tank loadout? Do you let them rerespec after they notice their error?

And now gameplay wise:
The decision of either/or is what makes one's build. Having all options available at all times means taking away that decision. The whole concept of specialised roles, the trinity of tank healer damage dealer would become totally obsolete, since everyone can respec himself too easily.

There are so many potentially bad repercussions. Think about it: if one player is better at healing, tanking and dps than all the rest of the group, why would he even consider playing with others?

That idea of loadouts makes sense in a shooter, or an adventure game with a multiplayer. A short intense and repetitive experience. Ideal for people with an unwillingness for long term dedication. It is fine. Just has no place in a rolebased game.

Applause to you for staying with me to the end! And this referance is your reward:

For ESO loadouts would be a deep rabbit hole. And before long we would all be sipping tea with the mad hatter!

Everything you just said we could say about the new reconstruction system. But they made it. Somehow. Will it be hard to make because ESO is not optimized af? Yes. Is it impossible? No.

Zodiarkslayer

Again a fair point in principle. I would only add that skill choices are a few layers closer to the core of the game. Table top and pen and paper Roleplayers would even say that is the core of any RPG. But I digress.
Would it be possible? Yes. Thats beside the question. Is it necessary? In my opinion not. It's substantial change for a little bit of convenience. And at that level of change the devs can make a completly new game. Ironically that would probably be a good thing.

Fermian

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

What I wanted to point out is that you cannot expect systems like that in any RPG. It is a role you are playing after all. If you can't live with an either/or decision making system RPGs may not be for you. This is not meant as an offense.

I do think its a good thing that there are some permanent character choices. But the class selection is still there with this proposal. And besides that its not like you cant play different roles in an rpg. Following your logic it is SRPG, single role playing game.

Zodiarkslayer

Fermian wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

What I wanted to point out is that you cannot expect systems like that in any RPG. It is a role you are playing after all. If you can't live with an either/or decision making system RPGs may not be for you. This is not meant as an offense.

I do think its a good thing that there are some permanent character choices. But the class selection is still there with this proposal. And besides that its not like you cant play different roles in an rpg. Following your logic it is SRPG, single role playing game.

Yes! You can play different roles with a different character. Or you take time and money to respec the one you want to use. The point is not to be able to fill several roles at the same time. The lower the cost in time and money for a respec, the less meaningful your character creation decisions are becoming.

Just to illustrate: Class/Race choice is the most important/meaningful decision in this game, not because they have the biggest impact, but because they cannot be undone or repeated at one's convenience (for the sake of the discussion we should leave crown store purchases out of it).

washbern

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

Fermian wrote: »

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

What I wanted to point out is that you cannot expect systems like that in any RPG. It is a role you are playing after all. If you can't live with an either/or decision making system RPGs may not be for you. This is not meant as an offense.

I do think its a good thing that there are some permanent character choices. But the class selection is still there with this proposal. And besides that its not like you cant play different roles in an rpg. Following your logic it is SRPG, single role playing game.

Yes! You can play different roles with a different character. Or you take time and money to respec the one you want to use. The point is not to be able to fill several roles at the same time. The lower the cost in time and money for a respec, the less meaningful your character creation decisions are becoming.

Just to illustrate: Class/Race choice is the most important/meaningful decision in this game, not because they have the biggest impact, but because they cannot be undone or repeated at one's convenience (for the sake of the discussion we should leave crown store purchases out of it).

Following your logic i do not pick a sorc to play DPS. I play sorc to play all the sorc can offer. A loadout for a different build does not negate the class choice but a role choice. Which shouldn't matter as long as the class remains the same.