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would be great if you didn't have to double slot pet skills
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redspecter23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭They could give it a timed duration, say 5 minutes or 10 minutes and it could work. Keep in mind that some of the power quota given to pet skills takes into account that you need to double bar them. If they were to be made single bar, expect a nerf in power level to go along with that as it opens up more build options.5 -
GrumpyDuckling✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Playboy_Shrek wrote: »would be really nice if the pet stayed on the bar its not slotted on.
Agreed, if they are slotted on a back bar it's not like you can activate their skills anyway without bar-swapping. Numbers could always be tweaked if single-bar pets were too strong.0 -
The_Camper✭✭✭✭✭As of now, to run 2 pets, you have to sacrifice 2 skill slots on your front bar. However, if they were 1 bar skills, pet sorcs could run them on backbar and then equip 2 additional skills without even having to sacrifice anything.
This will definitely push pet sorc pve DPS numbers way ahead of any other class.
This will 100% make pet sorcs untouchable in PVP. Imagine running 3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian and not having to drop streak/mages wrath or another spammable from your bar to make room for those pets.2 -
GrumpyDuckling✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭The_Camper wrote: »As of now, to run 2 pets, you have to sacrifice 2 skill slots on your front bar. However, if they were 1 bar skills, pet sorcs could run them on backbar and then equip 2 additional skills without even having to sacrifice anything.
This will definitely push pet sorc pve DPS numbers way ahead of any other class.
This will 100% make pet sorcs untouchable in PVP. Imagine running 3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian and not having to drop streak/mages wrath or another spammable from your bar to make room for those pets.
PVP has always had silly balancing issues. I'd rather ZOS start giving players tools to make their classes/builds more enjoyable and fun to play, then worry about how to balance it in a sandbox that fluctuates like crazy every few patches anyway.0 -
Ryuvain✭✭✭✭✭
✭The_Camper wrote: »As of now, to run 2 pets, you have to sacrifice 2 skill slots on your front bar. However, if they were 1 bar skills, pet sorcs could run them on backbar and then equip 2 additional skills without even having to sacrifice anything.
This will definitely push pet sorc pve DPS numbers way ahead of any other class.
This will 100% make pet sorcs untouchable in PVP. Imagine running 3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian and not having to drop streak/mages wrath or another spammable from your bar to make room for those pets.
What is this 3rd pet I keep seeing brought up?That one khajiit obsessed with werewolf behemoth and vampire lord. Lady Thorn is bae, dont @ me.
Werewolf behemoth=vampire lord>blood scion>werewolf>vampire.0 -
Taleof2Cities✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The_Camper wrote: »As of now, to run 2 pets, you have to sacrifice 2 skill slots on your front bar. However, if they were 1 bar skills, pet sorcs could run them on backbar and then equip 2 additional skills without even having to sacrifice anything.
This will definitely push pet sorc pve DPS numbers way ahead of any other class.
This will 100% make pet sorcs untouchable in PVP. Imagine running 3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian and not having to drop streak/mages wrath or another spammable from your bar to make room for those pets.
What is this 3rd pet I keep seeing brought up?
Monster set procs such as Maw of the Infernal.2 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭redspecter23 wrote: »They could give it a timed duration, say 5 minutes or 10 minutes and it could work. Keep in mind that some of the power quota given to pet skills takes into account that you need to double bar them. If they were to be made single bar, expect a nerf in power level to go along with that as it opens up more build options.
It would need to be a duration measured in seconds, not minutes, for the pets to be single bar. It would be required to fit the current standards for duration. I know of no skills that will continue to do damage for several minutes after initial activation. Pets have a basic damage level without activating their special skill.
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GrumpyDuckling✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Taleof2Cities wrote: »The_Camper wrote: »As of now, to run 2 pets, you have to sacrifice 2 skill slots on your front bar. However, if they were 1 bar skills, pet sorcs could run them on backbar and then equip 2 additional skills without even having to sacrifice anything.
This will definitely push pet sorc pve DPS numbers way ahead of any other class.
This will 100% make pet sorcs untouchable in PVP. Imagine running 3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian and not having to drop streak/mages wrath or another spammable from your bar to make room for those pets.
What is this 3rd pet I keep seeing brought up?
Monster set procs such as Maw of the Infernal.
Probably means Atronach ultimate as the 3rd pet because they listed "3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian." Wouldn't be able to run Maw of the Infernal along with Engine Guardian.1 -
redspecter23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭redspecter23 wrote: »They could give it a timed duration, say 5 minutes or 10 minutes and it could work. Keep in mind that some of the power quota given to pet skills takes into account that you need to double bar them. If they were to be made single bar, expect a nerf in power level to go along with that as it opens up more build options.
It would need to be a duration measured in seconds, not minutes, for the pets to be single bar. It would be required to fit the current standards for duration. I know of no skills that will continue to do damage for several minutes after initial activation. Pets have a basic damage level without activating their special skill.
I would have suggested seconds, but I don't think many people would give up permanent pets for a variety of reasons and 5 minutes is the lowest amount of time that could be considered essentially permanent.
They could function as you mention and be very similar to necro pets, but they lose a lot of the flavor that pet players want.
Like I mentioned, if they did go with a long term activation with single bar slot, it would have to come with some major downsides to balance it out. Giving up a bar slot is a huge cost that I think many players ignore when requesting changes like in the OP.
Currently the game has two types of durations on effects. Short and permanent. I can't think of too many effects that run in minutes at all. You range from a couple seconds to maybe up to 30 - 40 seconds for some buffs. Then you have some effects that are always on like Bound Aegis, Inner Light, Camo Hunter, etc. It would be mostly unexplored design space to look at any duration longer than 1 minute (but not permanent) for anything in ESO.0 -
Recapitated✭✭✭✭GrumpyDuckling wrote: »The_Camper wrote: »As of now, to run 2 pets, you have to sacrifice 2 skill slots on your front bar. However, if they were 1 bar skills, pet sorcs could run them on backbar and then equip 2 additional skills without even having to sacrifice anything.
This will definitely push pet sorc pve DPS numbers way ahead of any other class.
This will 100% make pet sorcs untouchable in PVP. Imagine running 3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian and not having to drop streak/mages wrath or another spammable from your bar to make room for those pets.
PVP has always had silly balancing issues. I'd rather ZOS start giving players tools to make their classes/builds more enjoyable and fun to play, then worry about how to balance it in a sandbox that fluctuates like crazy every few patches anyway.
What do you see taking up those two slots? Another ten second DOT? A skill like Inner Light that you don't activate anyway?
None of that sounds more or less fun.0 -
GrumpyDuckling✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Recapitated wrote: »GrumpyDuckling wrote: »The_Camper wrote: »As of now, to run 2 pets, you have to sacrifice 2 skill slots on your front bar. However, if they were 1 bar skills, pet sorcs could run them on backbar and then equip 2 additional skills without even having to sacrifice anything.
This will definitely push pet sorc pve DPS numbers way ahead of any other class.
This will 100% make pet sorcs untouchable in PVP. Imagine running 3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian and not having to drop streak/mages wrath or another spammable from your bar to make room for those pets.
PVP has always had silly balancing issues. I'd rather ZOS start giving players tools to make their classes/builds more enjoyable and fun to play, then worry about how to balance it in a sandbox that fluctuates like crazy every few patches anyway.
What do you see taking up those two slots? Another ten second DOT? A skill like Inner Light that you don't activate anyway?
None of that sounds more or less fun.
You could put whatever you want in those two slots.
If you gave me two more slots on my pet sorc I think I would enjoy slotting Bolt Escape, Mist Form, or Daedric Mines.0 -
Atherakhia✭✭✭✭The pets would need to be substantially nerfed to be 1 barred. Look at Necro pets. They're little more than DOTs and they're probably one of the weakest DOTs in the game at that. They don't have any secondary/use effects. The limited benefit they do provide is highly situational. So if you want sorc pets to be pathetic dots that do nothing, so be it.2
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Recapitated✭✭✭✭GrumpyDuckling wrote: »Recapitated wrote: »GrumpyDuckling wrote: »The_Camper wrote: »As of now, to run 2 pets, you have to sacrifice 2 skill slots on your front bar. However, if they were 1 bar skills, pet sorcs could run them on backbar and then equip 2 additional skills without even having to sacrifice anything.
This will definitely push pet sorc pve DPS numbers way ahead of any other class.
This will 100% make pet sorcs untouchable in PVP. Imagine running 3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian and not having to drop streak/mages wrath or another spammable from your bar to make room for those pets.
PVP has always had silly balancing issues. I'd rather ZOS start giving players tools to make their classes/builds more enjoyable and fun to play, then worry about how to balance it in a sandbox that fluctuates like crazy every few patches anyway.
What do you see taking up those two slots? Another ten second DOT? A skill like Inner Light that you don't activate anyway?
None of that sounds more or less fun.
You could put whatever you want in those two slots.
If you gave me two more slots on my pet sorc I think I would enjoy slotting Bolt Escape, Mist Form, or Daedric Mines.
Have you considered not playing with pets? Slot Degen and Mystic Orb and then on the other bar any of the two you named. You'll do less damage needless to say but that would also be the case if you could single-bar pets.0 -
GrumpyDuckling✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Recapitated wrote: »GrumpyDuckling wrote: »Recapitated wrote: »GrumpyDuckling wrote: »The_Camper wrote: »As of now, to run 2 pets, you have to sacrifice 2 skill slots on your front bar. However, if they were 1 bar skills, pet sorcs could run them on backbar and then equip 2 additional skills without even having to sacrifice anything.
This will definitely push pet sorc pve DPS numbers way ahead of any other class.
This will 100% make pet sorcs untouchable in PVP. Imagine running 3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian and not having to drop streak/mages wrath or another spammable from your bar to make room for those pets.
PVP has always had silly balancing issues. I'd rather ZOS start giving players tools to make their classes/builds more enjoyable and fun to play, then worry about how to balance it in a sandbox that fluctuates like crazy every few patches anyway.
What do you see taking up those two slots? Another ten second DOT? A skill like Inner Light that you don't activate anyway?
None of that sounds more or less fun.
You could put whatever you want in those two slots.
If you gave me two more slots on my pet sorc I think I would enjoy slotting Bolt Escape, Mist Form, or Daedric Mines.
Have you considered not playing with pets? Slot Degen and Mystic Orb and then on the other bar any of the two you named. You'll do less damage needless to say but that would also be the case if you could single-bar pets.
I've got a non-pet sorcerer too.0 -
Ryuvain✭✭✭✭✭
✭GrumpyDuckling wrote: »Taleof2Cities wrote: »The_Camper wrote: »As of now, to run 2 pets, you have to sacrifice 2 skill slots on your front bar. However, if they were 1 bar skills, pet sorcs could run them on backbar and then equip 2 additional skills without even having to sacrifice anything.
This will definitely push pet sorc pve DPS numbers way ahead of any other class.
This will 100% make pet sorcs untouchable in PVP. Imagine running 3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian and not having to drop streak/mages wrath or another spammable from your bar to make room for those pets.
What is this 3rd pet I keep seeing brought up?
Monster set procs such as Maw of the Infernal.
Probably means Atronach ultimate as the 3rd pet because they listed "3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian." Wouldn't be able to run Maw of the Infernal along with Engine Guardian.
That's an ultimate that can't be up 100% of the time. It also doesn't move at all?
I do agree engine guardian shouldn't be targetable at all. A huge sustain pet that follows you closely, and no downside to it being killed or taking damage.
I do like the design of targetable pets since there is a downside to most being killed, but necro should've went that way too imo. Much easier to kill than sorc pets but don't have a long cast time.
Does anyone truly like pets that are just glorified untargetable dots? They don't even feel alive that way nor are fun to use.That one khajiit obsessed with werewolf behemoth and vampire lord. Lady Thorn is bae, dont @ me.
Werewolf behemoth=vampire lord>blood scion>werewolf>vampire.0 -
the1andonlyskwex✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭There are only 3 ways I see this working:
1) The passive damage from pet attacks is essentially removed.
2) The pets are changed to work more like Necromancer pets, with short durations (basically making them DoTs/HoTs with pet flavoring)
3) The pets become some sort of toggle with a continuous resource drain while active. This would at least be a (relatively) unique mechanic, but I'm not sure it would be any more desirable than what we have now.0 -
Recapitated✭✭✭✭GrumpyDuckling wrote: »Recapitated wrote: »GrumpyDuckling wrote: »Recapitated wrote: »GrumpyDuckling wrote: »The_Camper wrote: »As of now, to run 2 pets, you have to sacrifice 2 skill slots on your front bar. However, if they were 1 bar skills, pet sorcs could run them on backbar and then equip 2 additional skills without even having to sacrifice anything.
This will definitely push pet sorc pve DPS numbers way ahead of any other class.
This will 100% make pet sorcs untouchable in PVP. Imagine running 3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian and not having to drop streak/mages wrath or another spammable from your bar to make room for those pets.
PVP has always had silly balancing issues. I'd rather ZOS start giving players tools to make their classes/builds more enjoyable and fun to play, then worry about how to balance it in a sandbox that fluctuates like crazy every few patches anyway.
What do you see taking up those two slots? Another ten second DOT? A skill like Inner Light that you don't activate anyway?
None of that sounds more or less fun.
You could put whatever you want in those two slots.
If you gave me two more slots on my pet sorc I think I would enjoy slotting Bolt Escape, Mist Form, or Daedric Mines.
Have you considered not playing with pets? Slot Degen and Mystic Orb and then on the other bar any of the two you named. You'll do less damage needless to say but that would also be the case if you could single-bar pets.
I've got a non-pet sorcerer too.
Cool, problem solved and we didn't have to give sorcs portable LOS in PVP to do it.1 -
GrumpyDuckling✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Recapitated wrote: »GrumpyDuckling wrote: »Recapitated wrote: »GrumpyDuckling wrote: »Recapitated wrote: »GrumpyDuckling wrote: »The_Camper wrote: »As of now, to run 2 pets, you have to sacrifice 2 skill slots on your front bar. However, if they were 1 bar skills, pet sorcs could run them on backbar and then equip 2 additional skills without even having to sacrifice anything.
This will definitely push pet sorc pve DPS numbers way ahead of any other class.
This will 100% make pet sorcs untouchable in PVP. Imagine running 3 pets that can be targeted along with engine guardian and not having to drop streak/mages wrath or another spammable from your bar to make room for those pets.
PVP has always had silly balancing issues. I'd rather ZOS start giving players tools to make their classes/builds more enjoyable and fun to play, then worry about how to balance it in a sandbox that fluctuates like crazy every few patches anyway.
What do you see taking up those two slots? Another ten second DOT? A skill like Inner Light that you don't activate anyway?
None of that sounds more or less fun.
You could put whatever you want in those two slots.
If you gave me two more slots on my pet sorc I think I would enjoy slotting Bolt Escape, Mist Form, or Daedric Mines.
Have you considered not playing with pets? Slot Degen and Mystic Orb and then on the other bar any of the two you named. You'll do less damage needless to say but that would also be the case if you could single-bar pets.
I've got a non-pet sorcerer too.
Cool, problem solved and we didn't have to give sorcs portable LOS in PVP to do it.
Huh?2 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭redspecter23 wrote: »redspecter23 wrote: »They could give it a timed duration, say 5 minutes or 10 minutes and it could work. Keep in mind that some of the power quota given to pet skills takes into account that you need to double bar them. If they were to be made single bar, expect a nerf in power level to go along with that as it opens up more build options.
It would need to be a duration measured in seconds, not minutes, for the pets to be single bar. It would be required to fit the current standards for duration. I know of no skills that will continue to do damage for several minutes after initial activation. Pets have a basic damage level without activating their special skill.
I would have suggested seconds, but I don't think many people would give up permanent pets for a variety of reasons and 5 minutes is the lowest amount of time that could be considered essentially permanent.
They could function as you mention and be very similar to necro pets, but they lose a lot of the flavor that pet players want.
Like I mentioned, if they did go with a long term activation with single bar slot, it would have to come with some major downsides to balance it out. Giving up a bar slot is a huge cost that I think many players ignore when requesting changes like in the OP.
Currently the game has two types of durations on effects. Short and permanent. I can't think of too many effects that run in minutes at all. You range from a couple seconds to maybe up to 30 - 40 seconds for some buffs. Then you have some effects that are always on like Bound Aegis, Inner Light, Camo Hunter, etc. It would be mostly unexplored design space to look at any duration longer than 1 minute (but not permanent) for anything in ESO.
You are correct as OP is only saying they do not want to double bar the pet and does not suggest a willingness that such a change would come at a cost. However, I do not see the point in suggesting a solution that is not a solution at all since it is very unlikely Zos would agree to such a duration.0 -
Dunning_Kruger✭✭✭✭As long as they made pets weaker and non targetable I wouldn’t care.____________________________________
A G G R O - the legendary stamplar GM of <HALL MONITORS>
For the Queen bby0 -
YandereGirlfriend✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I'm sure someone has suggested it before but why not slot pets as a toggle like the Psijic skill Mend Wounds?
Obviously, the pet Light Attack damage would have to be toned down since you would be gaining two skill slots, but that's just an implementation and balance detail that can be easily worked out.
Double-barred pets are awful. So are Necro pets. And, unlike Necro pets, Sorcerers get nothing (e.g. the corpse mechanic) from short-duration pets.
And, of course, I am for making all pets and pet proc sets non-LOS'able as well as optionally transparent for other players.0 -
Playboy_Shrek✭✭✭Dunning_Kruger wrote: »As long as they made pets weaker and non targetable I wouldn’t care.
pets are already really weak? the strongest pet is the warden bear and it barely does more damage than a DoT skill that isn't double barred, other than that the other pets like the shade and the clannefear do about as much damage as a DoT skill.2 -
Wolfpaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Playboy_Shrek wrote: »Dunning_Kruger wrote: »As long as they made pets weaker and non targetable I wouldn’t care.
pets are already really weak? the strongest pet is the warden bear and it barely does more damage than a DoT skill that isn't double barred, other than that the other pets like the shade and the clannefear do about as much damage as a DoT skill.
& that's on a stationary target also...moving target, good luck.Edited by Wolfpaw on November 1, 2020 3:06AM0 -
Everest_Lionheart✭✭✭✭✭Playboy_Shrek wrote: »Dunning_Kruger wrote: »As long as they made pets weaker and non targetable I wouldn’t care.
pets are already really weak? the strongest pet is the warden bear and it barely does more damage than a DoT skill that isn't double barred, other than that the other pets like the shade and the clannefear do about as much damage as a DoT skill.
The warden bear ultimate is all about the crit damage. I’ve seen mine crit over 130K in a group with proper buffs up. When running solo I see regular crits in the 50-60k range with just bull netch and green lotus running. That is only for his ultimate though. The bear has a secondary use as a mini tank if you can kite it properly and also for ranged adds during a boss fight you can swap to bow hit the add with a bow heavy and your bear will go aggro on it.
But sure I’ll take a one bar near any day and run the frosty ult on the other bar instead. That would make warden slightly OP though!0