Nightblade’s Dark Veil passive

Zeromaz

Why is this even a passive? Add 2 seconds to your non-invisibility shadow abilities. Seems like a filler. Why not just make all those shadow abilities 2 seconds longer and give us something useful?

What other passives are pointless?

GrumpyDuckling

All the passives in this game need to be entirely reworked so we can slot passives that actually fit the way we want our builds to play.

Here's a completely useless one for any Sorcerer who doesn't want to use the pets:
Expert Summoner: Increases your Max Health by 8% while you have a Daedric Summoning pet active.

Zeromaz

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

All the passives in this game need to be entirely reworked so we can slot passives that actually fit the way we want our builds to play.

Here's a completely useless one for any Sorcerer who doesn't want to use the pets:
Expert Summoner: Increases your Max Health by 8% while you have a Daedric Summoning pet active.

I don’t have a problem with passives that say if you slot this or use that you get X. Dark Veil just add time to a skills that already have a timer... seems odd. Seems redundant

Everest_Lionheart

It makes shade fit more comfortably into your rotations and allows you to get off 2 more skills before needing to activate it again. It also makes shade line up neatly with leeching/siphon strikes. Add to that that the shade gets a few more damage ticks and minor maim is also extended by a few seconds and this passive is worth way more than it looks on paper.

YandereGirlfriend

I think the broader point is that the skill should simply be that long by default and then you can free up the passive to do something more interesting.

As it is, you basically get 80% of a skill with the skill point and morph and then you have to use two more just to buff the skill to the strength that it is balanced against--and that's lame.

DK also has this problem with one of their passives. Same with Templar. And there are likely others.

Zeromaz

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

I think the broader point is that the skill should simply be that long by default and then you can free up the passive to do something more interesting.

As it is, you basically get 80% of a skill with the skill point and morph and then you have to use two more just to buff the skill to the strength that it is balanced against--and that's lame.

DK also has this problem with one of their passives. Same with Templar. And there are likely others.

Exactly the point. Thank you for wording it more clearly

Everest_Lionheart

Those extended passives make the builds more user friendly by extending dots which are the keys to dealing huge damage. On Templar buying 2 more elemental weapons at 30K per hit is a massive damage increase. This also extends the ultimate from that line giving another 2 ticks of damage plus major maim and a 30% damage reduction to incoming damage for the group. This is a huge debuff.

Similarly the DK version brings the skill duration in line with blockade and scalding rune giving you what amounts to 3-4 whips at 25k per hit. It also extends the length of Standard which massively boosts all of your damage. If you are using whip and managing the seething fury stacks properly depending on rotation you will get 4 fully stacked whips or 2 fully stacked plus 8 normal whips with bonus damage.

The point is the extra spamable attacks you can get in on your target is a huge driving force behind bigger DPS numbers. 2 seconds doesn’t seem like a lot but it streamlines rotations in a huge way. Take a look at the huge jump wardens have made in the PTS by gaining a single GCD now that netch is every 6th skill instead of every 3rd skill and that is with one of the weakest spamables in the game. For the casual player none of this matters all that much but for content where you have to push high DPS and race to beat certain mechanics every second counts.

the1andonlyskwex

Okay @Everest_Lionheart, I propose we take all of the skills from your class of choice, make their durations 2 seconds shorter, and then replace one of your current passives with something whose only purpose is to give back the duration we just took away. It'll be great. The new passive will really tie your rotation together.

MrBrownstone

I don't think he gets it, i see your point op

MrBrownstone

It's the same thing with some non-class skill trees where some passives just decrease the cost of the skills. Just lower the cost of them and make it a useful passive maybe. The thing is, yes, they're fillers. Skill point sinks i'd say.

Zeromaz

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Okay @Everest_Lionheart, I propose we take all of the skills from your class of choice, make their durations 2 seconds shorter, and then replace one of your current passives with something whose only purpose is to give back the duration we just took away. It'll be great. The new passive will really tie your rotation together.

This made me laugh. Thank you

Ryuvain

Never understood duration or cost decrease passives since there are already skills that do both alone by leveling. Could be filled by something much better and exciting.

Everest_Lionheart

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Okay @Everest_Lionheart, I propose we take all of the skills from your class of choice, make their durations 2 seconds shorter, and then replace one of your current passives with something whose only purpose is to give back the duration we just took away. It'll be great. The new passive will really tie your rotation together.

NB is already at or near the top of both stam and mag in terms of damage and doesn’t need the base skills to run longer and be given an additional passive on top of it. This argument makes about as much sense as the one last week where people were complaining about having to waste a cast to re-up relentless/merciless on NB. That cast is necessary to maintain balance otherwise you could skip it and get huge damage in its place. NB does not need anything that gives it more damage or mitigation for that matter. Honestly speaking it’s one of the most well done classes in the game.

Templar lack shields but is an aoe death machine. I’ll take 2 extra seconds on the aoe that boosts my damage by 40%. Paired with elemental weapon plus psijic orb passive all of that damage adds up fast. For me that’s 72k dps in non trials gear with no monster set. 2 seconds buys me 144K DPS. Not a wasted skill point at all.

MagDK is just a horrible class to sustain on full of expensive dots. Longer duration on dots is the only hope of sustain on the class and even then you have to use spell symmetry to cheese it a bit. DK also hits harder in general than the other mag classes but that’s the trade, power for sustain.

Those passives are by design to balance the classes. The math is pretty simple here, less casting is aoe/dots and more spamables equals significantly higher damage and better sustain.

Foxtrot39

Everest_Lionheart wrote: »

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

Okay @Everest_Lionheart, I propose we take all of the skills from your class of choice, make their durations 2 seconds shorter, and then replace one of your current passives with something whose only purpose is to give back the duration we just took away. It'll be great. The new passive will really tie your rotation together.

NB is already at or near the top of both stam and mag in terms of damage and doesn’t need the base skills to run longer and be given an additional passive on top of it. This argument makes about as much sense as the one last week where people were complaining about having to waste a cast to re-up relentless/merciless on NB. That cast is necessary to maintain balance otherwise you could skip it and get huge damage in its place. NB does not need anything that gives it more damage or mitigation for that matter. Honestly speaking it’s one of the most well done classes in the game.

Templar lack shields but is an aoe death machine. I’ll take 2 extra seconds on the aoe that boosts my damage by 40%. Paired with elemental weapon plus psijic orb passive all of that damage adds up fast. For me that’s 72k dps in non trials gear with no monster set. 2 seconds buys me 144K DPS. Not a wasted skill point at all.

MagDK is just a horrible class to sustain on full of expensive dots. Longer duration on dots is the only hope of sustain on the class and even then you have to use spell symmetry to cheese it a bit. DK also hits harder in general than the other mag classes but that’s the trade, power for sustain.

Those passives are by design to balance the classes. The math is pretty simple here, less casting is aoe/dots and more spamables equals significantly higher damage and better sustain.

Thing is here, the dark veil passive is utter trash and affect the weakest segment of the NB class : healer/tank

The only damage buff it give is on aspect of terror with its morph (indirectly via class/DW passive) and twisted path : unlike other classes you don't even get any real benefits from those 2s at all outside the major resolve passive synergy it offers as tank in full heavy

If you want to do an AOE scare Turn evil, does 5s fear on top of a 20s buff zone granting minor protection and +15% stam regen

Stx

Nice thread necro

ZOS_GabeS

Greetings,

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