gatekeeper13 wrote: »vSS trial is actually pretty easy as far as group plays in coordination and follows simple strategy. There is nothing special besides staying out of aoe and killing certain adds in a specific order. Still, people need to have some experience about basic stuff and do some decent dps. Not high, just decent.
The reason why many groups ask for 810 CP players is not that much about the CP points themselves. It's because if you were going to gamble, then an 810 CP player would have more chances at being better and more experienced than a low CP player. Not saying that a 810CP player is necessary better than a 300CP player though.
Although I dont even do high dps (65k on trial dummy), in my succesful vSS run I was doing 18% of group dps. Which means that the trial is perfectly doable with mediocre dps.
As for the video (where 6/12 players where 810 or close), as I said, low CP means nothing if you know the players are ok. But what happens if players are random and dont know each other? What are they going to do? Risk getting DDs that would do 10k dps?
I have tried many pug runs in vSS and many of them could not even clean half of adds in first boss before dragon landed again.
gatekeeper13 wrote: »vSS trial is actually pretty easy as far as group plays in coordination and follows simple strategy. There is nothing special besides staying out of aoe and killing certain adds in a specific order. Still, people need to have some experience about basic stuff and do some decent dps. Not high, just decent.
The reason why many groups ask for 810 CP players is not that much about the CP points themselves. It's because if you were going to gamble, then an 810 CP player would have more chances at being better and more experienced than a low CP player. Not saying that a 810CP player is necessary better than a 300CP player though.
Although I dont even do high dps (65k on trial dummy), in my succesful vSS run I was doing 18% of group dps. Which means that the trial is perfectly doable with mediocre dps.
As for the video (where 6/12 players where 810 or close), as I said, low CP means nothing if you know the players are ok. But what happens if players are random and dont know each other? What are they going to do? Risk getting DDs that would do 10k dps?
I have tried many pug runs in vSS and many of them could not even clean half of adds in first boss before dragon landed again.
All trials are pretty easy if people do not fail the mechanics. Difference is only how many mechanik you need people on it.
As example vCR - 2 portal groups, if you have not enough dps to kill before second group go portal.
If all 2 portal groups is ok, you need people who do not fail on upper level.
That is all.
Nothing is hard if people do not fail the mechanicks.
But some of them do, so it is simpler do dps before it starts, it is all the meta is about.
Kill the boss before it show any mechanick, because people afraid to fail it.
It is all, nothing is difficult in this game. But for some trials you just have to have more good playing friends.
Or dps before boss do something or it will be a fail
OP, I think most people can appreciate that CP/gear do not equal experience, as has been documented by many naked trial runs, or runs without CP allocated, etc. Having just a few experienced people in a run, can make a huge difference, however, like the other comment said above, PUGs with a majority of lowbies and/or inexperienced players very often fail, and are very different from what you have demonstrated.
OP, I think most people can appreciate that CP/gear do not equal experience, as has been documented by many naked trial runs, or runs without CP allocated, etc. Having just a few experienced people in a run, can make a huge difference, however, like the other comment said above, PUGs with a majority of lowbies and/or inexperienced players very often fail, and are very different from what you have demonstrated.
OP, I think most people can appreciate that CP/gear do not equal experience, as has been documented by many naked trial runs, or runs without CP allocated, etc. Having just a few experienced people in a run, can make a huge difference, however, like the other comment said above, PUGs with a majority of lowbies and/or inexperienced players very often fail, and are very different from what you have demonstrated.
Half of that players were the first time there.
And it is 2 different way of play ad thinking.
First - you empower some eletist part of the group with your own sets. Count on them. And your play is just like ... . Nothing interesting at all.
Second - you empower your self.
And you play like you want.
If you do some buffs it is good, but you must not do it.
After some period of time you can make your own build, that is comfortable for you to play. Count on your self. And do not die, tank, heal dps just like you want.
It is more interesting to play that way.
If you kill boss faster on 1 minute will it be funny for you? May be. But it can be more uncomfortable to play.
So if you do not like some thing, but it make 1% more dps will you chouse it ? For meta yes.
For no meta ? No.
But if some thing is more comfortable to you to play you upgrade it in your own favaratable playstyle. And will always do better than those standart meta does. You will have more option. Not just dps - may be heal, tankness, aoe dps and etc.
And what will be better ? On the paper meta of course.
In reality, just as you say skill , but your gear and your play style is your skill, that will never be powered by some other guys meta, so it is anchor fo a lot of players, who just try to copy other guys play style.
And copy is what a meta does. It is not like a lot of people want to play.
Hi.
And it is me again.
[snip]
Because it always is like:
-I need some gear? Can i go in raid with you ?
-Make necromancer 810+ and we will think about it.
-But i want to play my templar.
-No necro no sets | do not care.
---
[snip]
-Man i really need some sets.
-Lets get some! You can take your friends with you.
-But they are all low level ?
-Who cares.
Tank 380+, some 180+ DDs and heals and some 810+ players to help tham.https://youtu.be/4qme8unsTd4
More like this here:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/549000/how-many-of-us-can-you-handle-vso#latest
[edited for baiting]
Grandchamp1989 wrote: »Hi.
And it is me again.
[snip]
Because it always is like:
-I need some gear? Can i go in raid with you ?
-Make necromancer 810+ and we will think about it.
-But i want to play my templar.
-No necro no sets | do not care.
---
[snip]
-Man i really need some sets.
-Lets get some! You can take your friends with you.
-But they are all low level ?
-Who cares.
Tank 380+, some 180+ DDs and heals and some 810+ players to help tham.https://youtu.be/4qme8unsTd4
More like this here:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/549000/how-many-of-us-can-you-handle-vso#latest
[edited for baiting]
That is pretty awesome.
Most vSS trials I have seen the minimun requirements are
dd: 45k dps
healer: Olo, Hollow, and two other dps sets I forget for debuff
Tank: Alkosh, Ebon, PA, Yolna
810cp + show achievement
It's extremely rigid
This is basicly show the bird to all that, showing it can be done.
I get the feeling meta doesn't mean wat you think it does. It's not just about damage. Regardless, the game gives a lot of freedom to play how you want, in such I don't understand the passive vitriol in your posts vs what you deem meta. It doesn't have to be a you vs them approach or mentality here--doing as you do with the group you do it with is great, why does that have to be reported out in a manner of veiled attack? [snip]
[edited for baiting]
I get the feeling meta doesn't mean wat you think it does. It's not just about damage. Regardless, the game gives a lot of freedom to play how you want, in such I don't understand the passive vitriol in your posts vs what you deem meta. It doesn't have to be a you vs them approach or mentality here--doing as you do with the group you do it with is great, why does that have to be reported out in a manner of veiled attack? [snip]
[edited for baiting]
I think you(and others) are misunderstanding what the OP is trying to say here. I am going to go out on a limb and say English is not their first language, so a lot is lost in translation. Anyone who has ever pugged trials in Craglorn(or attempted to) has seen this:
Trial Lead: "looking for 4 DPS for vHRC"(or whatever other trial of your choice)
Trial Seeker: /whisper "I'll DPS it"
Trial Lead: "Do you have clear?"
Trial Seeker: "No."
Trial Lead: "What is your CP level?"
Trial Seeker: "300CP"
Trial Lead: "LOL, no."
I am not saying that the trial lead in this case isn't justified in wanting the most experienced, highest DPS they can get(they are)...everyone wants a smooth run after all. The reality though is that the whole attitude comes off as elitist and exclusionary. To be honest, its rather toxic and the reason that I rarely tank pug trials, because most of the time if you get into a pug trial group that falls apart, there is no attempt whatsoever to work together to overcome lower-than-ideal DPS...its just a toxic blame-slinging match because a few people int he group do great DPS and often think everyone in every single pug group should because they do. Its a stark contrast to dungeons....where people are far more willing to work together to overcome some handicap. As an average player needing to farm trials for meta-sets, the whole attitude makes it very unpleasant and discourages new players from getting involved. Do you know...the last new trial I actually tanked was vAS back when clockwork city came out? I am sure I am perfectly capable of tanking the new trials and would love to get some gear from them...but I dont want to deal with ^^^^. Its far easier for me to stick to less toxic 4-man content. I have plenty of friends...but its still much easier to get a group of non-toxic friends together for a 4-man run than for a 12-man run. I still tank all the older trials I am familiar with before end-game became such a toxic mess...but I have no need to mess with the new ones with the current mess it is.....and THAT is what the OP's post is about. Ridiculous expectations of gear/skill/experience/CP from people just starting out.
colossalvoids wrote: »Grandchamp1989 wrote: »Hi.
And it is me again.
[snip]
Because it always is like:
-I need some gear? Can i go in raid with you ?
-Make necromancer 810+ and we will think about it.
-But i want to play my templar.
-No necro no sets | do not care.
---
[snip]
-Man i really need some sets.
-Lets get some! You can take your friends with you.
-But they are all low level ?
-Who cares.
Tank 380+, some 180+ DDs and heals and some 810+ players to help tham.https://youtu.be/4qme8unsTd4
More like this here:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/549000/how-many-of-us-can-you-handle-vso#latest
[edited for baiting]
That is pretty awesome.
Most vSS trials I have seen the minimun requirements are
dd: 45k dps
healer: Olo, Hollow, and two other dps sets I forget for debuff
Tank: Alkosh, Ebon, PA, Yolna
810cp + show achievement
It's extremely rigid
This is basicly show the bird to all that, showing it can be done.
That's for farm runs, people want to get in comfortably and be done quickly. If you want an actual progression through the trials I'd say better find a specialised guild for that as it's not what most people in raiding guids up for.
Everyone knows you don't need much cp or exceptional gear for a completion, but you should find people on the same page as yours and manage expectations to not be like OP blaming people left and right.
Some people are giving OP issues. Honestly.
At least he put his money where his mouth was, and made a group to do it. Usually the conversation goes like this:
"All the guilds I join require: X, and I don't want to play X! You can do without X!"
Response:
"Well you can form you own group/trial with your own set of requirements or lack of requirements. Anyone can."
....
"Nooooo! I just want to tell OTHER raid leads how to run THEIR raid. Doing all that nasty work stuff is a little daunting for me, but surely other people who went through it all will just change their entire team to my will!"
If anything the thread title is a little baity. Just glancing there really isn't a TON of low CP there. I think my min I set is literally 300 CP for it even if pug from craglorn.