Replacement for templar skills during Cyrodiil AoE-tests

MKintr

With the upcoming AoE-tests in Cyrodiil and the templar class consisting to ~90% of AoEs:
What skills will you use instead in PvP? (especially for stamina chars)

Tsunahmie

I have no issues on my stamplar build lol, just use crit rush and full crit

Dusk_Coven

If you don't do what you normally do, you are sabotaging the test.

FrancisCrawford

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

If you don't do what you normally do, you are sabotaging the test.

Why would one play a build with a spammable that can't be spammed?

Jierdanit

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

If you don't do what you normally do, you are sabotaging the test.

Why would one play a build with a spammable that can't be spammed?

He is just plain wrong anyways.

Zos wants to test how the performace is going to look with the aoe changes so ofc you should change up your build to what you would play with the changes in place cuz it isnt representative of the situation otherwise.

tsaescishoeshiner

Dark Flare, Javelin, Radiant Oppression. All a khajiit needs to farm salt in battlegrounds ...

Charon_on_Vacation

they should exempt aoe class spammables like jabs and scythe from the test or rework them to single target.

Bucky_13

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

If you don't do what you normally do, you are sabotaging the test.

It's pretty hard to use a spammable every second when there's a 3 second cooldown on using it, which means doing what you normally do is... challenging.... Sadly, this probably means that the vast majority of players will "sabotage" the test by not using the exact builds and rotations they normally do.

If you have a templar in Cyro, I would love to duel you there during the tests assuming you stick to using aoe spammables....

Firstmep

Charon_on_Vacation wrote: »

they should exempt aoe class spammables like jabs and scythe from the test or rework them to single target.

They can't really rework anything until they decide which route to go with.
That being said a lot of skills don't make sense to be on the list.
I'll prob hop on my stamblade and check out cyro to see for myself how the lag is during primetime.

Charon_on_Vacation

Firstmep wrote: »

Charon_on_Vacation wrote: »

they should exempt aoe class spammables like jabs and scythe from the test or rework them to single target.

They can't really rework anything until they decide which route to go with.
That being said a lot of skills don't make sense to be on the list.
I'll prob hop on my stamblade and check out cyro to see for myself how the lag is during primetime.

i don't know about you, but if i had to change the amount of targets for a skill, it would probably take a few minutes.
it really is not hard to take the few class spammables, change some data and be done with it for the test. i'd say about 3 minutes per skill.
we are talking about a test and a short term fix for it, not a sensible solution for long term.
of course, IF they go through with the changes, then we can talk about a sensible long term solution.

Xarc

all classes are using AOE in pvp, not only templars

Firstmep

Charon_on_Vacation wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

Charon_on_Vacation wrote: »

they should exempt aoe class spammables like jabs and scythe from the test or rework them to single target.

They can't really rework anything until they decide which route to go with.
That being said a lot of skills don't make sense to be on the list.
I'll prob hop on my stamblade and check out cyro to see for myself how the lag is during primetime.

i don't know about you, but if i had to change the amount of targets for a skill, it would probably take a few minutes.
it really is not hard to take the few class spammables, change some data and be done with it for the test. i'd say about 3 minutes per skill.
we are talking about a test and a short term fix for it, not a sensible solution for long term.
of course, IF they go through with the changes, then we can talk about a sensible long term solution.

Yeah, thats not how game development works, changes need to be approved by multiple people.

Also on the coding side of things its really not just changing a few lines of code.

red_emu

tsaescishoeshiner wrote: »

Dark Flare, Javelin, Radiant Oppression. All a khajiit needs to farm salt in battlegrounds ...

Dark flare has an AOE attached to it

Charon_on_Vacation

Firstmep wrote: »

Charon_on_Vacation wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

Charon_on_Vacation wrote: »

they should exempt aoe class spammables like jabs and scythe from the test or rework them to single target.

They can't really rework anything until they decide which route to go with.
That being said a lot of skills don't make sense to be on the list.
I'll prob hop on my stamblade and check out cyro to see for myself how the lag is during primetime.

i don't know about you, but if i had to change the amount of targets for a skill, it would probably take a few minutes.
it really is not hard to take the few class spammables, change some data and be done with it for the test. i'd say about 3 minutes per skill.
we are talking about a test and a short term fix for it, not a sensible solution for long term.
of course, IF they go through with the changes, then we can talk about a sensible long term solution.

Yeah, thats not how game development works, changes need to be approved by multiple people.

Also on the coding side of things its really not just changing a few lines of code.

i'm not sure where you are working, but clearing that thing is a minute in a meeting, a short walk or an email.
if you are already preparing for a test and something comes up, its really easy to get it in if it serves the purpose.
i've never worked with the hero engine, but with several other ones, and it shouldn't take more than a few minutes.
feel free to pm me and we can discuss how this would work in other engines with the usual setup of references and entries.

Firstmep

Charon_on_Vacation wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

Charon_on_Vacation wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

Charon_on_Vacation wrote: »

they should exempt aoe class spammables like jabs and scythe from the test or rework them to single target.

They can't really rework anything until they decide which route to go with.
That being said a lot of skills don't make sense to be on the list.
I'll prob hop on my stamblade and check out cyro to see for myself how the lag is during primetime.

i don't know about you, but if i had to change the amount of targets for a skill, it would probably take a few minutes.
it really is not hard to take the few class spammables, change some data and be done with it for the test. i'd say about 3 minutes per skill.
we are talking about a test and a short term fix for it, not a sensible solution for long term.
of course, IF they go through with the changes, then we can talk about a sensible long term solution.

Yeah, thats not how game development works, changes need to be approved by multiple people.

Also on the coding side of things its really not just changing a few lines of code.

i'm not sure where you are working, but clearing that thing is a minute in a meeting, a short walk or an email.
if you are already preparing for a test and something comes up, its really easy to get it in if it serves the purpose.
i've never worked with the hero engine, but with several other ones, and it shouldn't take more than a few minutes.
feel free to pm me and we can discuss how this would work in other engines with the usual setup of references and entries.

My original statement stands that they wont rework anything till they decide what route to go with.

I understand your concern, im a templar main myself and it sucks, and frankly most of tests are way too harsh, but thats what they decided on.

Also, we are not talking about changing a few lines of code, they would have to change the skills animations, ensure that the now single target version interact with all of the game systems properly( there was a time when jabs was considered both a dot and direct dmg for a while, for example).
Skills like jabs or scythe arent just classified as "aoe" in a few lines of code, they have radius checks, hit checks etc, positional checks etc, it would really take them more than a few minutes to change the skills, and if they decide to not hinder spamming aoes in the end, than it would end up being wasted development time.
And if we have learned anything about zeni, is that they really dont want to spend more money on development, than its absolutely necessary.

Charon_on_Vacation

Firstmep wrote: »

Charon_on_Vacation wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

Charon_on_Vacation wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

Charon_on_Vacation wrote: »

they should exempt aoe class spammables like jabs and scythe from the test or rework them to single target.

They can't really rework anything until they decide which route to go with.
That being said a lot of skills don't make sense to be on the list.
I'll prob hop on my stamblade and check out cyro to see for myself how the lag is during primetime.

i don't know about you, but if i had to change the amount of targets for a skill, it would probably take a few minutes.
it really is not hard to take the few class spammables, change some data and be done with it for the test. i'd say about 3 minutes per skill.
we are talking about a test and a short term fix for it, not a sensible solution for long term.
of course, IF they go through with the changes, then we can talk about a sensible long term solution.

Yeah, thats not how game development works, changes need to be approved by multiple people.

Also on the coding side of things its really not just changing a few lines of code.

i'm not sure where you are working, but clearing that thing is a minute in a meeting, a short walk or an email.
if you are already preparing for a test and something comes up, its really easy to get it in if it serves the purpose.
i've never worked with the hero engine, but with several other ones, and it shouldn't take more than a few minutes.
feel free to pm me and we can discuss how this would work in other engines with the usual setup of references and entries.

My original statement stands that they wont rework anything till they decide what route to go with.

I understand your concern, im a templar main myself and it sucks, and frankly most of tests are way too harsh, but thats what they decided on.

Also, we are not talking about changing a few lines of code, they would have to change the skills animations, ensure that the now single target version interact with all of the game systems properly( there was a time when jabs was considered both a dot and direct dmg for a while, for example).
Skills like jabs or scythe arent just classified as "aoe" in a few lines of code, they have radius checks, hit checks etc, positional checks etc, it would really take them more than a few minutes to change the skills, and if they decide to not hinder spamming aoes in the end, than it would end up being wasted development time.
And if we have learned anything about zeni, is that they really dont want to spend more money on development, than its absolutely necessary.

of course they won't, and they easily could.
i HAVE done stuff like that so often, i wouldn't even start to count, so let me tell you, it doesn't take long and it isn't hard.
i'm also not a templar, i'm just looking at it from a dev perspective.
nobody ever said it's just classified as "aoe" and you just have to change that.
if you work with an engine, you know your entries and where to find/edit them. you don't have to go on a long walk and think about where and what to do.
i'm really curious now about your experience on that matter and which engines you used that make you feel like it would take much longer.
would you be fine with me sending you a pm?
other than that, i don't want to derail this thread further.

MKintr

Please don't get lost in a fundamental discussion about coding or the sense of those tests.

The question is, which skills are good replacements for aeo-skills.

Charon_on_Vacation

MKintr wrote: »

Please don't get lost in a fundamental discussion about coding or the sense of those tests.

The question is, which skills are good replacements for aeo-skills.

in my opinion, there really aren't good and/or enough replacements for a lot of the skills.
if they test this way, it will not only be about the effect of aoe on the server, but also about the general frequency of tasks for the server.
might just become even more of a dizzy fest than before.

ebix_

we all can swap to nb and instead of pvp we can play hide and seek in cryo ,hopefully the server can take it.

West93

Just stick to IC or BG. No point to not being able to use your spammable and with these burning light changes you will deal no damage, it's not a fair fight.

Play other class or dont play a templar there.

maxjapank

According to Compiled List of AoE Cooldown Skills, these are skills not affected by a CD:

Piercing Javeling (both morphs)
Toppling Charge
Radial Sweep (both morphs)
Vamp Bane
Dark Flare
Purifying Light / PoL
Living Dark / UC
Radiant Glory/opression
Nova
Rite of Passage

Everything else has a cd:

All restoring light skills have a cd, including Honor of the Dead (which seems silly as it only hits one person)
Your Rune focus will also have a cd. derp.

So...we are risking it in melee range unless you are using Overwhelming or Auroran, imo.

Elemental weapon seems okay to use. Could be a nice spammable from range. Maybe in combination with Undaunted Unweaver or who knows, maybe even Noble Duelist's Silks.

I'll likely play my MagSorc or Stamcro though.

Sgrug

If I am reading this thread right the Templar is about to once again get massively nerfed?

Justishia808

Sgrug wrote: »

If I am reading this thread right the Templar is about to once again get massively nerfed?

Only for a week, for testing purposes. What & who will be affected by each week's test will change during the six-week testing period. I main a Magplar in Cyro and I'm fine with suffering this week if it means that at the end of these experiments ball groups go the way of the Dodo bird.

West93

Sgrug wrote: »

If I am reading this thread right the Templar is about to once again get massively nerfed?

It is already been nerfed last 2 patches.