Style Motif Missing From Quest Journal > Crafting Motifs Section

Shadowshire

@ZOS_BillE @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom

While playing my character Ace Firelight, I attempted to craft furnishings in the Telvanni Style, which he has crafted many times before. However, none of the Fine, Superior or Epic furnishings which he should be able to craft were shown on any of the workstations. The only furnishing shown was the Telvanni Masterwork Candlelabra, for which he had bought the "recipe" from Rolis Hilaalu with vouchers for completed Sealed Master Writs.

As you can see on the first attached screenshot of the Quest Journal > Achievements > Morrowind page, Ace Firelight earned the Telvanni Style Master achievement on 4/14/2018.



However, on the second attached screenshot of the Quest Journal > Lore Library > Crafting Motifs section, the Telvanni Style is not even listed (when displayed for Ace Firelight). It should be listed regardless of whether the character has learned any of its motifs. I have not checked other characters to determine whether it is omitted from that list while I play them, but I expect that the Telvanni Style is currently not shown. UPDATE: The Telvanni Style is also not listed on the Quest Journal > Lore Library >Crafting Motifs section while I am playing the character Ace Adeya.



NOTE: this occurs both with and without any add-ons and their libraries loaded. So, it is a manifest bug in the Base Game Quest Journal UI with serious ramifications for what the player's character is allowed or not allowed to craft. Also, I reported this to Support with screenshots attached, but the website UI did not disclose any Ticket Number for it. It has not been listed on the My Support page after I log-in to the Support section.

[snip]

Fortunately, I have not bought Greymoor yet and, as things stand, I do not see any reason to throw good money after bad. Of course, I will cancel the ESO Plus subscription too. After 5+ years of spending more time dealing with TESO software bugs and Bethesda performance issues than I care to recall, I will eventually abandon the game, if only because it is difficult to engage in crafting without the Craft Bag.

[Edit for Demands.]

virtus753

Are these two separate UI issues? Furnishings are not unlocked by motif knowledge.

ZOS_GregoryV

Greetings!

The motif in question is actually the "House Telvanni Style" in the Lore Library. Hopefully this helps to clear up any confusion others may have.

If there are any questions, please feel free to reach out.

Thank you for your understanding,
-Greg-

Shadowshire

virtus753 wrote: »

Are these two separate UI issues? Furnishings are not unlocked by motif knowledge.

You are right. It seems that either (1) I have discovered two "coincidental" outcomes of a single bug, or (2) I have discovered each of two bugs, either or both of which are unrelated to another bug(s).

First, as far as I know, it is not possible to craft any weapon, piece of armor, or a shield without the character having learned at least one Style. It is possible to craft a gear item without a Trait, but not without choosing a Style for it.

Regardless, it is very odd that the Telvanni Style is not listed at all in the Quest Journal > Lore Library > Crafting motifs section. Just look at the entries for Sunspire Style and Trinimac Style in the second screenshot in the OP. Ace Firelight has never learned to craft any weapon and/or armor for those respective Styles.

But they are shown in the Quest Journal Lore Library list. The Telvanni Style which Ace Firelight learned is not. Why? (See the Update which I have added to the OP.)

Second, the question still remains as to why Ace Firelight cannot craft any Telvanni furnishings except the Telvanni Candelabra Masterwork. He has, in fact, learned to craft almost all Telvanni furnishing items which can be crafted in the game.

As far as I have been able to determine, there is no user interface in TESO by means of which a player can view a list of all the furnishing diagrams, blueprints, patterns, praxes, formulae, sketches, and designs which any character has learned. They are only displayed in the various Furnishing section categories of each crafting station, by means of which they can be created. The only TESO UI that will list all of the Provisioning recipes which a character has learned is a Cooking Fire.

However, all of these respective crafting documents are displayed by at least two add-ons. One is Furniture Catalogue, and the other is ESO Master Recipe List. The user interface for each of them is very different, and each has its advantages and disadvantages. Regardless, they are the only means for readily determining which furnishings and recipes that a character has learned to craft, and which ones that the character has not learned to craft. Suffice it to say that there might be a few craftable furnishings which are not in their respective data files, but which might be available in the game.

That said, apparently all of the numerous Telvanni furnishings which Ace Firelight has learned to craft are displayed by Furniture Catalogue and by ESO Master Recipe List, respectively. Each add-on also displays Telvanni furnishings which Ace Firelight has not learned yet.

newtinmpls

Shadowshire wrote: »

First, as far as I know, it is not possible to craft any weapon, piece of armor, or a shield without the character having learned at least one Style. It is possible to craft a gear item without a Trait, but not without choosing a Style for it.

All characters start with the knowledge of their own racial style, so they don't have to "learn" anything to be able to craft weapons or armor.

However they must possess a style or mimic stone in order to do so (aside from traits).

Shadowshire

ZOS_GregoryV wrote: »

Greetings!

The motif in question is actually the "House Telvanni Style" in the Lore Library. Hopefully this helps to clear up any confusion others may have. ....

Thank you for your understanding,
-Greg-

So it is.

But why are the Telvanni furnishing items which Ace Firelight learned to craft not displayed at the crafting stations (except the Telvanni Candelabra Masterwork)??

A review of the add-on ESO Master Recipe List shows that most, whether all, of the Telvanni furnishings Ace Firelight learned are crafted at an Enchanting workstation. But, when Ace Firelight visited an Enchanting Station, there was no Telvanni furnishing listed in any category. This happened at the Enchanting Stations in Daggerfall, Glenumbra, and in Sentinel, Alik'r Desert, respectively.

Raisin

Shadowshire wrote: »

ZOS_GregoryV wrote: »

Greetings!

The motif in question is actually the "House Telvanni Style" in the Lore Library. Hopefully this helps to clear up any confusion others may have. ....

Thank you for your understanding,
-Greg-

So it is.

But why are the Telvanni furnishing items which Ace Firelight learned to craft not displayed at the crafting stations (except the Telvanni Candelabra Masterwork)??

A review of the add-on ESO Master Recipe List shows that most, whether all, of the Telvanni furnishings Ace Firelight learned are crafted at an Enchanting workstation. But, when Ace Firelight visited an Enchanting Station, there was no Telvanni furnishing listed in any category. This happened at the Enchanting Stations in Daggerfall, Glenumbra, and in Sentinel, Alik'r Desert, respectively.

Can you take screenshots of this maybe? Is it possible that you're missing skillpoints in the skill lines, or that you're missing the materials to craft them and are only displaying what you can actually craft? Small stuff like that, to rule it out before being sure it's a bug.

newtinmpls

Raisin wrote: »

Can you take screenshots of this maybe? Is it possible that you're missing skillpoints in the skill lines, or that you're missing the materials to craft them and are only displaying what you can actually craft? Small stuff like that, to rule it out before being sure it's a bug.

Well, I'm on PC and if a character knows the pattern, but can't craft it (due to lack of materials, or lack of skills) it will still display, I just can't do it "yet".

Raisin

newtinmpls wrote: »

Raisin wrote: »

Can you take screenshots of this maybe? Is it possible that you're missing skillpoints in the skill lines, or that you're missing the materials to craft them and are only displaying what you can actually craft? Small stuff like that, to rule it out before being sure it's a bug.

Well, I'm on PC and if a character knows the pattern, but can't craft it (due to lack of materials, or lack of skills) it will still display, I just can't do it "yet".

Well, it's always possible that you accidentally changed it, so I figured it's worth double checking. Maybe even try just checking and then unchecking the filter options again, just to see if that magically fixes it somehow?

virtus753

Shadowshire wrote: »

ZOS_GregoryV wrote: »

Greetings!

The motif in question is actually the "House Telvanni Style" in the Lore Library. Hopefully this helps to clear up any confusion others may have. ....

Thank you for your understanding,
-Greg-

So it is.

But why are the Telvanni furnishing items which Ace Firelight learned to craft not displayed at the crafting stations (except the Telvanni Candelabra Masterwork)??

A review of the add-on ESO Master Recipe List shows that most, whether all, of the Telvanni furnishings Ace Firelight learned are crafted at an Enchanting workstation. But, when Ace Firelight visited an Enchanting Station, there was no Telvanni furnishing listed in any category. This happened at the Enchanting Stations in Daggerfall, Glenumbra, and in Sentinel, Alik'r Desert, respectively.

Some add-ons have been known to hide known praxeis and other furnishing patterns at crafting stations. Have you tried with all add-ons disabled?

I know this happened to a friend of mine who had learned the gold pattern for the Cabinet, Poisonmaker's. With a certain add-on enabled (it may have been Furniture Preview or Furniture Catalogue), my friend did not see any option to craft the cabinet, even with the proper mats and being at the right station. As soon as the add-on was disabled, the pattern reappeared in the crafting menu. I remember this quite distinctly because my friend bought the pattern again and it said "Already known," even though it was not showing up as an option to be crafted. I don't know which, if any, add-ons still cause this bug.

edit: grammar

Shadowshire

Raisin wrote: »

Shadowshire wrote: »

....

But why are the Telvanni furnishing items which Ace Firelight learned to craft not displayed at the crafting stations (except the Telvanni Candelabra Masterwork)??

A review of the add-on ESO Master Recipe List shows that most, whether all, of the Telvanni furnishings Ace Firelight learned are crafted at an Enchanting workstation. But, when Ace Firelight visited an Enchanting Station, there was no Telvanni furnishing listed in any category. This happened at the Enchanting Stations in Daggerfall, Glenumbra, and in Sentinel, Alik'r Desert, respectively.

Can you take screenshots of this maybe? Is it possible that you're missing skillpoints in the skill lines, or that you're missing the materials to craft them and are only displaying what you can actually craft? Small stuff like that, to rule it out before being sure it's a bug.

Oh, Ace Firelight and four other characters have all of their crafting passive traits at maximum rank. That is, there are no "missing skill points". Nonetheless, I did check Ace Firelight's crafting passives to see whether any were not at maximum rank -- perchance ZOS has done something (again) to invalidate part of the character's records. ....

In my experience, if a character knows how to craft a furnishing, then it will always be listed in a category on the UI of the crafting station where it can be crafted (see note below). If there is an insufficient amount of a material required to craft an item, that will be shown in red on the list of materials which is displayed when I select that furnishing. Also, the "Craft" button will not be displayed while that furnishing is selected (pressing the key to do it will be ignored).

That is, a furnishing is always listed in a category of the crafting station UI unless the "Have (enough) materials" check-box is enabled below the banner of the crafting station UI. If it is enabled, then only each furnishing for which the character currently has enough of each material required to craft it is listed. If the character has enough when they begin to craft furnishings, and afterward doesn't have enough of a material remaining to craft a furnishing again, or to craft a different furnishing for which it is required, then that furnishing will vanish from the UI list.

Note: I rarely enable either the "Have sufficient knowledge" or "Have (enough) materials" check-box below the banner of the crating station UI, because I want to see which material(s) -- if any -- are insufficient and by how much. The first check-box is irrelevant for furnishings, because they do not have Levels or Traits. Regardless, I don't believe that either or both of them was enabled on any crafting station while I checked for the Telvanni furnishing plans.

@virtus753

Some add-ons have been known to hide known praxeis and other furnishing patterns at crafting stations. Have you tried with all add-ons disabled?

As I stated below the second screenshot in the OP, the issue occurs without any add-ons enabled. Or, to put it another way, the issue still occurred after all of the add-ons and their libraries which I ordinarily use with Ace Firelight were disabled.

Raisin

Shadowshire wrote: »

Raisin wrote: »

Shadowshire wrote: »

....

But why are the Telvanni furnishing items which Ace Firelight learned to craft not displayed at the crafting stations (except the Telvanni Candelabra Masterwork)??

A review of the add-on ESO Master Recipe List shows that most, whether all, of the Telvanni furnishings Ace Firelight learned are crafted at an Enchanting workstation. But, when Ace Firelight visited an Enchanting Station, there was no Telvanni furnishing listed in any category. This happened at the Enchanting Stations in Daggerfall, Glenumbra, and in Sentinel, Alik'r Desert, respectively.

Can you take screenshots of this maybe? Is it possible that you're missing skillpoints in the skill lines, or that you're missing the materials to craft them and are only displaying what you can actually craft? Small stuff like that, to rule it out before being sure it's a bug.

Oh, Ace Firelight and four other characters have all of their crafting passive traits at maximum rank. That is, there are no "missing skill points". Nonetheless, I did check Ace Firelight's crafting passives to see whether any were not at maximum rank -- perchance ZOS has done something (again) to invalidate part of the character's records. ....

In my experience, if a character knows how to craft a furnishing, then it will always be listed in a category on the UI of the crafting station where it can be crafted (see note below). If there is an insufficient amount of a material required to craft an item, that will be shown in red on the list of materials which is displayed when I select that furnishing. Also, the "Craft" button will not be displayed while that furnishing is selected (pressing the key to do it will be ignored).

That is, a furnishing is always listed in a category of the crafting station UI unless the "Have (enough) materials" check-box is enabled below the banner of the crafting station UI. If it is enabled, then only each furnishing for which the character currently has enough of each material required to craft it is listed. If the character has enough when they begin to craft furnishings, and afterward doesn't have enough of a material remaining to craft a furnishing again, or to craft a different furnishing for which it is required, then that furnishing will vanish from the UI list.

Note: I rarely enable either the "Have sufficient knowledge" or "Have (enough) materials" check-box below the banner of the crating station UI, because I want to see which material(s) -- if any -- are insufficient and by how much. The first check-box is irrelevant for furnishings, because they do not have Levels or Traits. Regardless, I don't believe that either or both of them was enabled on any crafting station while I checked for the Telvanni furnishing plans.

@virtus753

Some add-ons have been known to hide known praxeis and other furnishing patterns at crafting stations. Have you tried with all add-ons disabled?

As I stated below the second screenshot in the OP, the issue occurs without any add-ons enabled. Or, to put it another way, the issue still occurred after all of the add-ons and their libraries which I ordinarily use with Ace Firelight were disabled.

That's an incredibly long-winded way to say "I don't think I had it filtered but haven't checked again" lol

Shadowshire

Raisin wrote: »

Shadowshire wrote: »

....

Note: I rarely enable either the "Have sufficient knowledge" or "Have (enough) materials" check-box below the banner of the crating station UI, because I want to see which material(s) -- if any -- are insufficient and by how much. The first check-box is irrelevant for furnishings, because they do not have Levels or Traits. Regardless, I don't believe that either or both of them was enabled on any crafting station while I checked for the Telvanni furnishing plans.

That's an incredibly long-winded way to say "I don't think I had it filtered but haven't checked again" lol

After I wrote the "long-winded" reply , I reviewed the check-boxes below the banners of each crafting station UI to see whether any was enabled. None were enabled, except for one crafting station. However, there are no Telvanni furnishings which are crafted with that station, so it did not matter. Nonetheless, I proceeded to disable them on that crafting station, for the reasons which I have given.

That said, the missing Telvanni furnishings have again been displayed (repeatedly) on the Enchanting crafting station UI for Ace Firelight, as they were before, since I wrote the OP for this discussion.

So, the problem is transient.

On one prior occasion two or three weeks ago, the Craft Bag for Ace Gokh did not contain any Style materials at all. When I logged-in to another character, the Style materials were shown present in the Craft Bag as expected. After I selected Ace Gokh to play again, the Style materials were again shown as present in the Craft Bag as they should have been before. That issue per se has not happened since then.

Why such incorrect output is displayed could have any of several causes, but I don't care to speculate as to what they are.

With regard to the missing Telvanni furnishings, Ace Firelight is the only character which I play that has learned any "plans" for Telvanni furnishings. Suffice it to say that reloading the UI did not resolve the problem.

Perhaps it would not have occurred again if I had selected another character to play, then returned to play Ace Firelight again -- which, of course, eventually I did, although I quit playing the game before doing that.

If this happens again with some aspect of the data for any character, then I suppose that I must test whether the problem is resolved by re-logging the character. We shall see. I hope.

Raisin

Shadowshire wrote: »

Raisin wrote: »

Shadowshire wrote: »

....

Note: I rarely enable either the "Have sufficient knowledge" or "Have (enough) materials" check-box below the banner of the crating station UI, because I want to see which material(s) -- if any -- are insufficient and by how much. The first check-box is irrelevant for furnishings, because they do not have Levels or Traits. Regardless, I don't believe that either or both of them was enabled on any crafting station while I checked for the Telvanni furnishing plans.

That's an incredibly long-winded way to say "I don't think I had it filtered but haven't checked again" lol

After I wrote the "long-winded" reply , I reviewed the check-boxes below the banners of each crafting station UI to see whether any was enabled. None were enabled, except for one crafting station. However, there are no Telvanni furnishings which are crafted with that station, so it did not matter. Nonetheless, I proceeded to disable them on that crafting station, for the reasons which I have given.

That said, the missing Telvanni furnishings have again been displayed (repeatedly) on the Enchanting crafting station UI for Ace Firelight, as they were before, since I wrote the OP for this discussion.

So, the problem is transient.

On one prior occasion two or three weeks ago, the Craft Bag for Ace Gokh did not contain any Style materials at all. When I logged-in to another character, the Style materials were shown present in the Craft Bag as expected. After I selected Ace Gokh to play again, the Style materials were again shown as present in the Craft Bag as they should have been before. That issue per se has not happened since then.

Why such incorrect output is displayed could have any of several causes, but I don't care to speculate as to what they are.

With regard to the missing Telvanni furnishings, Ace Firelight is the only character which I play that has learned any "plans" for Telvanni furnishings. Suffice it to say that reloading the UI did not resolve the problem.

Perhaps it would not have occurred again if I had selected another character to play, then returned to play Ace Firelight again -- which, of course, eventually I did, although I quit playing the game before doing that.

If this happens again with some aspect of the data for any character, then I suppose that I must test whether the problem is resolved by re-logging the character. We shall see. I hope.

It seems like you have some sort of magnetism for crafting UI bugs then!

Shadowshire

Raisin wrote: »

Shadowshire wrote: »

....
That said, the missing Telvanni furnishings have again been displayed (repeatedly) on the Enchanting crafting station UI for Ace Firelight, as they were before, since I wrote the OP for this discussion.

So, the problem is transient.

On one prior occasion two or three weeks ago, the Craft Bag for Ace Gokh did not contain any Style materials at all. When I logged-in to another character, the Style materials were shown present in the Craft Bag as expected. After I selected Ace Gokh to play again, the Style materials were again shown as present in the Craft Bag as they should have been before. That issue per se has not happened since then.

Why such incorrect output is displayed could have any of several causes, but I don't care to speculate as to what they are.

With regard to the missing Telvanni furnishings, Ace Firelight is the only character which I play that has learned any "plans" for Telvanni furnishings. Suffice it to say that reloading the UI did not resolve the problem.

Perhaps it would not have occurred again if I had selected another character to play, then returned to play Ace Firelight again -- which, of course, eventually I did, although I quit playing the game before doing that.

If this happens again with some aspect of the data for any character, then I suppose that I must test whether the problem is resolved by re-logging the character. We shall see. I hope.

It seems like you have some sort of magnetism for crafting UI bugs then!

Tell me about it.

God seems to have cursed me with the ability to discover bugs in software that no one else would ever be likely to discover. Then Satan tempted me to learn computer programming, and I fell for it. Oh, I could tell many stories about the weird bugs that I have found across a broad variety of information systems. A few of which I created in the software which I wrote, and some of which I have found while playing TESO during the past 5+ years.

virtus753

ZOS_GregoryV wrote: »

Greetings!

The motif in question is actually the "House Telvanni Style" in the Lore Library. Hopefully this helps to clear up any confusion others may have.

If there are any questions, please feel free to reach out.

Thank you for your understanding,
-Greg-

@ZOS_GregoryV

Thank you for the explanation and screenshot! Any chance we can get this inconsistency addressed?

I’m sure Shadowshire is not the first person to think that the House styles do not appear in the motif section of the Lore Library, and I don’t see what purpose the inconsistent nomenclature serves. If it’s only going to confuse people while not serving a purpose, that seems like a problem that ought to be fixed.

Thanks for your time.