New Crystal Blast - Stop with the light attack conditions!

zDan

Don't get me wrong I'm thrilled that stamsorc is now getting a true class spammable, it's been a long time coming. But I am not a fan of the light attack based skills like this and crushing/ele weapon. They feel very clunky to play with especially in lag. They also tend to cause desyncs A LOT, which is a huge problem. Overall this is great but it needs to be its own skill and not a light attack based one.

Aeternum113

I'm not a fan of such skills either, but what this makes me thing of is that I think regardless of the light attack condition this ability will not ever be able to compete with Rapid Strikes/Bloodthirst with Draugrkin so I reckon this ability won't see much use at all not even by the rare amount of 2h stam sorc players as I suspect dizzying will still prove the superior option but time will tell and I hope to be wrong. It's a shame really. Besides this, I completely agree with you that skills like this one and elemental/crushing weapon are really clunky and just silly by design.

fred4

Isn't the point that you can stack this with other skills for burst? It's not really a spammable. It's a burst skill, more like Curse in it's timing. You could combine it with Ele Weapon. You could try and go Crystal -> Dizzying -> Light Attack -> Dawnbreaker (not sure how a light attack plays after Dizzying as I don't play that). Someone made a video of just going Crystal -> Ele Weapon -> Light Attack -> Executioner. The longer timeout opens up all sorts of possibilities, albeit at the loss of light attack pressure, which you have to withhold. On the other hand this means your enchant will most likely be ready to hit with the burst.

zDan

fred4 wrote: »

Isn't the point that you can stack this with other skills for burst? It's not really a spammable. It's a burst skill, more like Curse in it's timing. You could combine it with Ele Weapon. You could try and go Crystal -> Dizzying -> Light Attack -> Dawnbreaker (not sure how a light attack plays after Dizzying as I don't play that). Someone made a video of just going Crystal -> Ele Weapon -> Light Attack -> Executioner. The longer timeout opens up all sorts of possibilities, albeit at the loss of light attack pressure, which you have to withhold. On the other hand this means your enchant will most likely be ready to hit with the burst.

Ah yes, so even more health desyncs will be happening? Can't wait for that

susmitds

fred4 wrote: »

Isn't the point that you can stack this with other skills for burst? It's not really a spammable. It's a burst skill, more like Curse in it's timing. You could combine it with Ele Weapon. You could try and go Crystal -> Dizzying -> Light Attack -> Dawnbreaker (not sure how a light attack plays after Dizzying as I don't play that). Someone made a video of just going Crystal -> Ele Weapon -> Light Attack -> Executioner. The longer timeout opens up all sorts of possibilities, albeit at the loss of light attack pressure, which you have to withhold. On the other hand this means your enchant will most likely be ready to hit with the burst.

Nothing unique to Stamsorc though. I had used Cloak->Crushing Weapon->Surprise Attack+LA combos for double spammable burst combos in duels for lols and it is not exactly reliable, once people figure out what you are doing. Essentially you are using a GCD to store it's damage as a pseudo burst skill but if your opponent knows that, it is pretty easy to counter with a single dodge. Only time multiple spammable build works reliably is on ranged burst builds with Elemental->Swallow Soul+LA+Caluurion or Crushing->Snipe+LA->Silver Shard.

fred4

susmitds wrote: »

fred4 wrote: »

Isn't the point that you can stack this with other skills for burst? It's not really a spammable. It's a burst skill, more like Curse in it's timing. You could combine it with Ele Weapon. You could try and go Crystal -> Dizzying -> Light Attack -> Dawnbreaker (not sure how a light attack plays after Dizzying as I don't play that). Someone made a video of just going Crystal -> Ele Weapon -> Light Attack -> Executioner. The longer timeout opens up all sorts of possibilities, albeit at the loss of light attack pressure, which you have to withhold. On the other hand this means your enchant will most likely be ready to hit with the burst.

Nothing unique to Stamsorc though. I had used Cloak->Crushing Weapon->Surprise Attack+LA combos for double spammable burst combos in duels for lols and it is not exactly reliable, once people figure out what you are doing. Essentially you are using a GCD to store it's damage as a pseudo burst skill but if your opponent knows that, it is pretty easy to counter with a single dodge. Only time multiple spammable build works reliably is on ranged burst builds with Elemental->Swallow Soul+LA+Caluurion or Crushing->Snipe+LA->Silver Shard.

What's unique to stamsorc is the greater possible delay and, thus, the ability to stack it with Crushing Weapon. I agree with both of you that this may not play as nicely as other burst skills, notably Subterranean. It does fit in with the (mag)sorc ethos of stacking single target burst, though.

Predictability is something you can level at all stacked burst combos. This may not be the nicest nor the most effective among all classes, but it is stacked burst. That must be the idea behind the long timeout of that skill. I see stamsorc bow builds coming, albeit they won't make much of Hurricane and Crit Surge. Hard to predict.

On my magblade I currently use Elemental -> LA -> Soul Harvest -> LA -> Fear (Caluurion). When it works, it's good. When the light attack misses, nothing much happens. I alternate this with going ranged, but going in close is better burst. Soul Harvest buffs Caluurion and Fear drops block.

KuroyukiESO

I agree. The existence of stam frag alone is enough to make me very hopeful the future of some classes *cough* stam whip *cough*

BUT, light attack based skills are super wonky. IF they insist on doing it this way, I feel like it should be something a little more persistent, as opposed to an imbue weapon clonne. The idea I had was that you would apply it, and it would coat your weapon in crystal for 5-10 or so seconds, and buff up to 3 light attacks, with damage up to about 33% of the damage of a regular spammable. The third and final hit could cause the crystal to explode and stun the target. That would make it a very useful skill for weaving, as well as pretty unique. Just my thoughts.

KuroyukiESO

KuroyukiESO wrote: »

The third and final hit could cause the crystal to explode and stun the target. That would make it a very useful skill for weaving, as well as pretty unique. Just my thoughts.

Could also make the final hit do a bit of extra damage, maybe 30-50% more than the base, to reward players for landing all 3

zDan

KuroyukiESO wrote: »

I agree. The existence of stam frag alone is enough to make me very hopeful the future of some classes *cough* stam whip *cough*

BUT, light attack based skills are super wonky. IF they insist on doing it this way, I feel like it should be something a little more persistent, as opposed to an imbue weapon clonne. The idea I had was that you would apply it, and it would coat your weapon in crystal for 5-10 or so seconds, and buff up to 3 light attacks, with damage up to about 33% of the damage of a regular spammable. The third and final hit could cause the crystal to explode and stun the target. That would make it a very useful skill for weaving, as well as pretty unique. Just my thoughts.

Im just sick of ZOS implementing all of these crazy conditions for skills and sets. Keep it simple and effective, it should just be like any other melee spammable in the game, stam sorc deserves that.

nemvar

Turn stam frags into melee crystal frags, with cast-time and proc chance for instant cast. Can even hit like a truck and stun, I don't care.
Don't even play stamsorc but I think that sounds a lot cooler than what we got.

auz

Dks asked for stam whip, got stone fist. Luckily dizzying swing still works. Hopefully crystal weapon works. I am looking forward to trying it, but not holding my breath. I don't understand what zos has against a simple melee spammable. I would have been happy with a suprise attack type skill without all the extra effects for stam dk and sorc. Just 5m range, hits x amount.

fred4

KuroyukiESO wrote: »

I agree. The existence of stam frag alone is enough to make me very hopeful the future of some classes *cough* stam whip *cough*

BUT, light attack based skills are super wonky. IF they insist on doing it this way, I feel like it should be something a little more persistent, as opposed to an imbue weapon clonne. The idea I had was that you would apply it, and it would coat your weapon in crystal for 5-10 or so seconds, and buff up to 3 light attacks, with damage up to about 33% of the damage of a regular spammable. The third and final hit could cause the crystal to explode and stun the target. That would make it a very useful skill for weaving, as well as pretty unique. Just my thoughts.

Has apparently dismissed Stone First out of hand, asks for stam whip, yet proposes crazy proc / stun conditions for stam frags that are not that far off from Stone First. No one likes elaborate PvP skills that give you little control over the timing of the burst and stun. You could argue that adjusting your light attacks / weaving will give you that control, but you already conceded that light attack based skills are super wonky. This one scratches his head.

KuroyukiESO

fred4 wrote: »

KuroyukiESO wrote: »

I agree. The existence of stam frag alone is enough to make me very hopeful the future of some classes *cough* stam whip *cough*

BUT, light attack based skills are super wonky. IF they insist on doing it this way, I feel like it should be something a little more persistent, as opposed to an imbue weapon clonne. The idea I had was that you would apply it, and it would coat your weapon in crystal for 5-10 or so seconds, and buff up to 3 light attacks, with damage up to about 33% of the damage of a regular spammable. The third and final hit could cause the crystal to explode and stun the target. That would make it a very useful skill for weaving, as well as pretty unique. Just my thoughts.

Has apparently dismissed Stone First out of hand, asks for stam whip, yet proposes crazy proc / stun conditions for stam frags that are not that far off from Stone First. No one likes elaborate PvP skills that give you little control over the timing of the burst and stun. You could argue that adjusting your light attacks / weaving will give you that control, but you already conceded that light attack based skills are super wonky. This one scratches his head.

Like I said, I don't like the idea of light attack conditions at all. This was only my idea for if ZOS was 100% sold on light attack conditions. I would much rather just have a regular melee spammable. Stone fist are bad. No way around that. Only good for PvE tanks to get stagger, and absolutely nothing else.

erio

zDan wrote: »

Don't get me wrong I'm thrilled that stamsorc is now getting a true class spammable, it's been a long time coming. But I am not a fan of the light attack based skills like this and crushing/ele weapon. They feel very clunky to play with especially in lag. They also tend to cause desyncs A LOT, which is a huge problem. Overall this is great but it needs to be its own skill and not a light attack based one.

I was happy when i heard stam morph, then incredibly disappointed.