2020 worst year in gaming overall

LuxLunae

2020 might be one of gamings/internets dark moments. It was the moment companies cared more about profit than crafting good entertainment.

Look at TLoU 2 for example, sony is trying to quiet everybody about how they feel about the game. Censorship if you will. Thinking that doing so will save their bottom line. Instead of telling us

" You know what, we hear you. We understand your frustrations with the game and we PROMISE that we will do better next time. This type of criticism shows how invested you are into the game and it's characters. Although we still respect what our staff did with the game and support their creative freedom, we also understand it did not meet your standards of storytelling."

However, it is because of this that companies throw out broken games. They said "wait, the customers didn't like this game and now we probably are going to have to take a loss. Now let's toss out an unfinished game to them see if they bite, and try to shape it into what they want. (FO76 is a GREAT example)"

However, that is also not the solution.

Now I realize this but when a dev/testers/player representatives leaks something from your game, it means that there is a huge disconnect with their players. When that concern is ignored, you purposely release a bad game. Never let somebody fully have control of what the game is.

The thing is, the solution is hard to find. Companies that want to maximize profits will always make mostly bad games or destroy an IP doing so.

Companies that want to tell a great story and give great gameplay but asks for a respectable amount will do well and make enough for 1-2 new game releases every successful release. However WHEN THEY MISS THE MARK (Which happens no matter what. No company has been on point every time) , THEY HAVE A CHANCE OF CLOSING THEIR DOORS FOREVER. Then people will say "man that company made some good games..."

Then there are companies who become the heroes of the medium. Tesla, CDPR, etc. CDPR can make good games and tell great stories because they are trying to go against the grain of what gaming is today. They are still like that company above but their added idea of going against monetization schemes have propped them up into a status where even if they do release a bad game, we would still support them. We know that they would learn from their experience because it has been show that they have.

I remember playing a witcher 3 DLC and they incorporated a bug as the "BEST SECURITY SYSTEM!!" They made a joke at themselves from a bug that was in the early game.

Companies should know if you have great gameplay but your story is crap, we will support it. If your story is the best but your gameplay is not that great, we will support it. If you can do both we will support it and then spread the word like wildfire.
However when you prioritize monetization over any of those, we wont support you.

You can keep your company afloat through those monetization practices, but you lose your games lose its souls in the process. At that point you should just make cheap mobile games...OH WAIT....

Gaming should be like it was back in the day. Give me a finished product and sell DLC to expand the story if needed. DO NOT PLAN FOR DLC by making it and ripping it out of the game. Then try to sell it to us later.

Always be honest about your motives.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TR3Vdo5etCQ

rpa

To be fair, Bethesda & co has never been known for careful polish. Yesterday I played some Oblivion and while it works better than ESO - with unofficial fix patches ofc - it's still rather terrible bugpile.

Mindcr0w

LuxLunae wrote: »

2020 might be one of gamings/internets dark moments. It was the moment companies cared more about profit than crafting good entertainment.

If you truly think companies caring more about profit than "crafting good entertainment" is anything new you've got a world of disappointment coming your way you sweet summer child.

LuxLunae

Mindcr0w wrote: »

LuxLunae wrote: »

2020 might be one of gamings/internets dark moments. It was the moment companies cared more about profit than crafting good entertainment.

If you truly think companies caring more about profit than "crafting good entertainment" is anything new you've got a world of disappointment coming your way you sweet summer child.

No, I knew this, but this might be the moment that broke the camels back. It's all downhill from here. It was a great 20 + yr hobby for me, but now we shall experience the second gaming crash 2024...

I finally see, like me moving on from fast food and cooking myself..it's time for me to move on from gaming and do something else.

I probably just grew out of it.

I remember playing body harvest for countless of hours. On a whim I picked up GTA III thinking it was a racing game because I played GT 3. I played countless hours into that. Then some time later I found out the people who made body harvest made the GTA series. You could see where concepts from body harvest was put into GTA. They built it up to a multi billion dollar IP.

Now that they sustain the online, they have lost drive to make a GTA 6. It's not profitable to stop making money off a current game by making a new one.

Everything will lead to the online dead end cash grab.

Why the hell was WWF no mercy more fluid than some future games?

Gaming has broken up with me. It's time for me to realize that I am not the target audience anymore and move on.

Gaming is becoming a glorified social media avatar that has traits of the games we use to play.

I don't have s social media account.

daemonios

Companies have always chased profits. It's players now who are only too eager to jump on early access to buggy messes, buy special collector's editions of said messes because of virtual fluff, gamble away and throw potentially endless amounts of money at a game in exchange for virtual goods (while refusing to support it through a fixed subscription). So if you buy early access, if you buy virtual currencies, if you buy gambling crates, if you refuse to subscribe to games with ongoing maintenance and development costs, you're part of the problem. The company is just lining its shareholders' and executives' pockets.

In the end, if we want anything to change, we may very well have to walk away from offending games. Sadly that includes ESO, though it didn't at launch. The only reason I picked up this game at all was its commitment to mandatory subs and lack of in-game store. That turned out well...

YstradClud

Can't really put all the blame on developers when gamers are like.

Glurin

rpa wrote: »

To be fair, Bethesda & co has never been known for careful polish. Yesterday I played some Oblivion and while it works better than ESO - with unofficial fix patches ofc - it's still rather terrible bugpile.

True, however Bethesda games, at least as far as the Fallout and TES franchises are concerned, were still good, fun games to play despite the bugs. You didn't care that part of your armor clipped through the arm or that sometimes a slain enemy would suddenly turn into something resembling chewing gum in a blender. The game was still fun regardless. Heck, in some cases the bugs actually made it more fun.

That wasn't at all the case with Fallout 76 of course, but still, gotta give credit where it's due.

Nemesis7884

rpa wrote: »

To be fair, Bethesda & co has never been known for careful polish. Yesterday I played some Oblivion and while it works better than ESO - with unofficial fix patches ofc - it's still rather terrible bugpile.

true...but you can overlook a lot of bugs a lot bettef if you think the devs heart is in it... and cd project red has become the new standard every other dev has to measure up to. I mean I never thought Id say that but even Ubisoft makes comparibly a pretty good impression these days ^^.

In the end people will vote with their wallet and thats what will matter...

VaranisArano

Never mistake your personal dissatisfaction (or the dissatisfaction of the relatively few people you listen to) for the sort of massive market shifts it would take for this to change the priorities of the entire gaming industry.

Frankly, with it being an industry where people can largely work from home selling a product that people mostly play at home...I suspect the gaming companies are doing just fine so far in 2020.

Rukia541

I suspect ESO is just spaghetti code that can't be fixed, only barely managed into a working condition.

StamPlar_1976

YstradClud wrote: »

Can't really put all the blame on developers when gamers are like.

Pretty much. Not to mention the players who accept and defend the lowest common denominator when it comes to game quality and engaging content. That will get on the forums and shoot down any negative feedback about the game.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO

Rukia541 wrote: »

I suspect ESO is just spaghetti code that can't be fixed, only barely managed into a working condition.

Wrathstone update changes cleared a lot of the perceived "spaghetti code". The game is pretty simple when comes to coding.
The game engine on the other hand is a heavily modified Hero engine from over 13 years ago. However the cost to fix it or replace it is the cost to a whole new game so makes no sense.

Lazarus_Rising

Its a cycle. When gaming companies get bigger and bigger they reach a point where economics/finance is more important. Regardless these companies give the possibility to give rise other companies like Larian Studios or CDPR and others which deliver quality content. But it is mostly the fate of becoming really big that money becomes a priority.

parpin

2020 was disappointing year so far:
resident evil 3 remake, i was so excited about this one, RE3 was one of my favorite games of childhood, well the remake was not bad but it was disappointing, i was expecting much better.
streets of rage 4, again childhood game, it was not bad but i was expecting much better another disappointment.
last of us part 2, again it was not a bad game but hugely disappointing.
and some second class game like champion online when devs suddenly changed the difficulty of dungeon you need for end of story arc and made it super hard, now i can not finish it, again disappointment.
disappointing after disappointing after disappointing, this was 2020 so far.

ArchMikem

It depends on what it is you want out of the game. All I want is a world where I can create Cat people, explore lands, and experience Story questing. ESO continues to tick all those boxes adequately with numerous extras thrown on top, despite all the issues concerning other aspects.

I mean, though, this year has been a horrible year in general, not specifically Gaming, and it's not even as bad to me than the year Bioware decided to drop Mass Effect in order to focus on Anthem. That, to me, was hurtful.

gatekeeper13

It's the year of the Last of Us 2. That says it all about the gaming industry in 2020.

Banana

For this one yes. There is another that's coming in November unless it's delayed again that may make me switch.

ItsJustHashtag

StamPlar_1976 wrote: »

YstradClud wrote: »

Can't really put all the blame on developers when gamers are like.

Pretty much. Not to mention the players who accept and defend the lowest common denominator when it comes to game quality and engaging content. That will get on the forums and shoot down any negative feedback about the game.

Shoot, ZOS actively does that through moderations.

Elsonso

Lazarus_Rising wrote: »

Its a cycle. When gaming companies get bigger and bigger they reach a point where economics/finance is more important. Regardless these companies give the possibility to give rise other companies like Larian Studios or CDPR and others which deliver quality content. But it is mostly the fate of becoming really big that money becomes a priority.

The studios might say that this is caused, in part, by players demanding the latest technologies, which cost more to develop and rework. They might argue that they need this just to stand out in the field so people buy the game.

Even looking in here, we find that ESO is dead if they don't rebase the game for the PS5. We find people talking about how graphics and animations are not good enough. I routinely talk about how they skimp on content (locked doors, etc). These can be expensive demands to meet, which require money, and there you have your circle.

I am not blaming gamers, but the situation is more complicated than what is quietly attributed to "greed".

As for game companies "censoring" what players are saying, I find that to be largely a one-sided perspective. I have seen some of these "censored" comments around here, and yes, even though I agree with what is driving the comment, they really aren't contributing anything. Some of them might be making things worse. Just because people are frustrated about customer service, performance, patches, or changes, does not mean they just get to do or say whatever they want here on the forum. Naturally, those who take it too far will think they are being "censored" for what they believe, not how they are expressing it.

Of course, this applies to both sides of the situation. ZOS moderators are also people, and they can also get into a situation where they want to take action, but should not be. Hopefully, ZOS has rules, procedures, and processes to guide them in that.

Ragnarock41

F076 is what happens when you attempt to push ESO standarts for an audience that expects an actually working product, by the way. People don't play western MMOs for the absolutely garbage PvE combat, shocking suprise I know.

Edit: I might aswell say MMORPG standarts instead of ESO standarts, cause thats really why ESO gets away with it to begin with. There is no competition in the MMO market.

Tandor

VaranisArano wrote: »

Never mistake your personal dissatisfaction (or the dissatisfaction of the relatively few people you listen to) for the sort of massive market shifts it would take for this to change the priorities of the entire gaming industry.

Frankly, with it being an industry where people can largely work from home selling a product that people mostly play at home...I suspect the gaming companies are doing just fine so far in 2020.

All good points. Also, players who have particular issues with a game shouldn't assume that everyone else has issues with that game, or accuse other players of accepting poor quality, when the truth is that there are plenty of players who really don't have such issues. In ESO, for example, it is extremely unlikely that most of the reported issues will be experienced by anyone who doesn't participate in competitive PvE or PvP - and that's almost certainly the overwhelming majority.

As for the whole monetisation issue, that's really very much in the eye of the beholder. Do I like crown crates? No, so I don't buy them. Do I resent the fact that some people do like them and buy them? No. Funding a game is important, and choice is a good thing when it comes to having different ways of contributing to a game. Unfortunately there will always be those who think that "Free to Play" should mean just that, or that having bought a game they are entitled to have the developers work on it and add to it for ever and a day without having to spend another penny on it - they've bought it already, right?

From the MMORPG point of view, I think the genre is in a good place right now, there's a fantastic range of decent quality games to choose from and if one doesn't appeal because of performance or monetisation concerns then there are plenty of others to switch to. However, so far as ESO is concerned the population numbers would suggest that it's in a particularly good place right now, but not everyone will agree, because not everyone approaches a game in the same way. Critics need to remember that, and acknowledge that their experience isn't automatically the same experience that everyone else will have.

omegatay_ESO

That is why I stopped paying full price for a game several years ago. I wait, and pay 20 or less for it. By then, hopefully, bugs have been addressed, and if the game sucks, no real loss.
IF I pay full price, it will most likely be from CD Project Red only.

Donny_Vito

What else do you expect from a game that you can play for free with no expiration? They have to chase profits. Every high quality FTP game I've come across has to focus on it's private store (i.e. Crown Store) to offset the cost of giving away the game and/or not charging a monthly fee. Bring back the subscription model. Yes you'll have a lower player-base, but if they aren't going to improve the servers to accommodate for all these people playing for free then a lower player-base is the next best option. Not everyone deserves a trophy for free, or at least that's my opinion.

Kiralyn2000

gatekeeper13 wrote: »

It's the year of the Last of Us 2. That says it all about the gaming industry in 2020.

I've no idea whether this is a positive statement, or a negative one.

I certainly don't put much weight into the crazed internet whining of the rage brigade (the Metacritic bombers, the reddit crowd, the "ZOMG SJW" gamergate morons), so that part of TLoU2 feedback doesn't mean anything.

Tandor wrote: »

All good points. Also, players who have particular issues with a game shouldn't assume that everyone else has issues with that game, or accuse other players of accepting poor quality, when the truth is that there are plenty of players who really don't have such issues.

This. The "vocal internet" (both positive and negative) is a pretty terrible representation of the actual average player.
(I know I was definitely surprised when Bioware put out those final Mass Effect statistics, and after years of the internet gushing about how Jen Hale's FemShep was awesome/amazing/etc, why would anyone play dull MaleShep.... 80% of players played the dude.)

Destai

Elsonso wrote: »

Lazarus_Rising wrote: »

Its a cycle. When gaming companies get bigger and bigger they reach a point where economics/finance is more important. Regardless these companies give the possibility to give rise other companies like Larian Studios or CDPR and others which deliver quality content. But it is mostly the fate of becoming really big that money becomes a priority.

The studios might say that this is caused, in part, by players demanding the latest technologies, which cost more to develop and rework. They might argue that they need this just to stand out in the field so people buy the game.

Even looking in here, we find that ESO is dead if they don't rebase the game for the PS5. We find people talking about how graphics and animations are not good enough. I routinely talk about how they skimp on content (locked doors, etc). These can be expensive demands to meet, which require money, and there you have your circle.

I am not blaming gamers, but the situation is more complicated than what is quietly attributed to "greed".

As for game companies "censoring" what players are saying, I find that to be largely a one-sided perspective. I have seen some of these "censored" comments around here, and yes, even though I agree with what is driving the comment, they really aren't contributing anything. Some of them might be making things worse. Just because people are frustrated about customer service, performance, patches, or changes, does not mean they just get to do or say whatever they want here on the forum. Naturally, those who take it too far will think they are being "censored" for what they believe, not how they are expressing it.

Of course, this applies to both sides of the situation. ZOS moderators are also people, and they can also get into a situation where they want to take action, but should not be. Hopefully, ZOS has rules, procedures, and processes to guide them in that.

I'm sorry, I refuse to feel sorry for the moderators. The toxicity would be cut down so much if the community managers were more active. People aren't asking for miracles here, just better communication. It's not like people are going to be less critical of the game because a link or post got removed. In fact, that's what contributing to the toxicity the most I'd say. They're so concerned about threads going downhill and talk about posts being constructive - so long as it means they don't change their policies or TOS or release schedules. No, not that. Not actually addressing the things that need fixing.

Destai

Donny_Vito wrote: »

What else do you expect from a game that you can play for free with no expiration? They have to chase profits. Every high quality FTP game I've come across has to focus on it's private store (i.e. Crown Store) to offset the cost of giving away the game and/or not charging a monthly fee. Bring back the subscription model. Yes you'll have a lower player-base, but if they aren't going to improve the servers to accommodate for all these people playing for free then a lower player-base is the next best option. Not everyone deserves a trophy for free, or at least that's my opinion.

God, I miss the subscription days. So much less noise.

Aloha

"Erh... Do you know that ESO was just created for waiting TES VI ? " /Kappa

"False story, bro'"

"Yep, but it is becoming true, now."

StamPlar_1976

ItsJustHashtag wrote: »

StamPlar_1976 wrote: »

YstradClud wrote: »

Can't really put all the blame on developers when gamers are like.

Pretty much. Not to mention the players who accept and defend the lowest common denominator when it comes to game quality and engaging content. That will get on the forums and shoot down any negative feedback about the game.

Shoot, ZOS actively does that through moderations.

That too lol.

Dark_Lord_Kuro

LuxLunae wrote: »

2020 might be one of gamings/internets dark moments. It was the moment companies cared more about profit than crafting good entertainment.

Look at TLoU 2 for example, sony is trying to quiet everybody about how they feel about the game. Censorship if you will. Thinking that doing so will save their bottom line. Instead of telling us

" You know what, we hear you. We understand your frustrations with the game and we PROMISE that we will do better next time. This type of criticism shows how invested you are into the game and it's characters. Although we still respect what our staff did with the game and support their creative freedom, we also understand it did not meet your standards of storytelling."

However, it is because of this that companies throw out broken games. They said "wait, the customers didn't like this game and now we probably are going to have to take a loss. Now let's toss out an unfinished game to them see if they bite, and try to shape it into what they want. (FO76 is a GREAT example)"

However, that is also not the solution.

Now I realize this but when a dev/testers/player representatives leaks something from your game, it means that there is a huge disconnect with their players. When that concern is ignored, you purposely release a bad game. Never let somebody fully have control of what the game is.

The thing is, the solution is hard to find. Companies that want to maximize profits will always make mostly bad games or destroy an IP doing so.

Companies that want to tell a great story and give great gameplay but asks for a respectable amount will do well and make enough for 1-2 new game releases every successful release. However WHEN THEY MISS THE MARK (Which happens no matter what. No company has been on point every time) , THEY HAVE A CHANCE OF CLOSING THEIR DOORS FOREVER. Then people will say "man that company made some good games..."

Then there are companies who become the heroes of the medium. Tesla, CDPR, etc. CDPR can make good games and tell great stories because they are trying to go against the grain of what gaming is today. They are still like that company above but their added idea of going against monetization schemes have propped them up into a status where even if they do release a bad game, we would still support them. We know that they would learn from their experience because it has been show that they have.

I remember playing a witcher 3 DLC and they incorporated a bug as the "BEST SECURITY SYSTEM!!" They made a joke at themselves from a bug that was in the early game.

Companies should know if you have great gameplay but your story is crap, we will support it. If your story is the best but your gameplay is not that great, we will support it. If you can do both we will support it and then spread the word like wildfire.
However when you prioritize monetization over any of those, we wont support you.

You can keep your company afloat through those monetization practices, but you lose your games lose its souls in the process. At that point you should just make cheap mobile games...OH WAIT....

Gaming should be like it was back in the day. Give me a finished product and sell DLC to expand the story if needed. DO NOT PLAN FOR DLC by making it and ripping it out of the game. Then try to sell it to us later.

Always be honest about your motives.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TR3Vdo5etCQ

I think 2020 is one of the worse recent year overall not just gaming with all that is happening in the world

gatekeeper13

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

I've no idea whether this is a positive statement, or a negative one.

I certainly don't put much weight into the crazed internet whining of the rage brigade (the Metacritic bombers, the reddit crowd, the "ZOMG SJW" gamergate morons), so that part of TLoU2 feedback doesn't mean anything.

It's a negative statement. A year where trash like Last of Us 2 is bashed by the community but glorified by critics because Sony paid them millions in advertising. According to critics, it must be the best game ever made. LOL.

You can believe what you want and choose what will mean sth to you and what won't. I value the community's opinion. TLOU2 negative reaction is unanimous and they are right to react like that. Just reading that mess of a plot is enough.

ZOS_GregoryV

.Greetings all,

After review, we have decided it best to close this thread due to Conspiracy Theories and Misinformation. This is a violation of our rules and is stated follows:

Conspiracy Theories and Misinformation: We do not tolerate the deliberate and malicious spreading of false info or conspiracy theories about ZeniMax Online Studios, its game(s), or its employees. This does not include honest mistakes; rather, this rule pertains to those who go out of their way to spread harmful or malicious rumors about ZeniMax Online Studios and its employees, or The Elder Scrolls Online.

If there may be any questions in regards to the rules, please feel free to review them here.

Thank you for your understanding,
-Greg-