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Greymoor magden. Possible cheese inside

OBJnoob
OBJnoob
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Okay so... maybe this is just terrible, maybe this is going to be so good that everybody haaaates me. I really hope it’s the latter. I’m really a no cp cyrodil player for the record but let’s say this is my attempt at a grahtwood dueling build.

Dark elf magden
Lover mundus stone
5h 2L but could do 5 1 1 no problem it’s all craftable
Stuhns favor back bar, torugs pact front bar, band of malacath, Valkyn skoria

I’m backbarring screaming cliff racer for off balance. With a frost staff for the record, but maybe sword n shield instead? Nirnhoned. Otherwise just a buff bar. Weapon damage enchant that sadly I know doesn’t benefit from torugs.

Running bugs and entropy on front bar, infused torugs. Probably a frost enchant for both good damage and extremely frequent minor maim I hope.

I mean that’s basically it. You get it. Haven’t 100 percent figured out how I’m gonna heal yet or what food I’m gonna use.

Large pieces reinforced small light pieces crit Impen.

Gonna tryyy to heal with lotus, trellis, and arctic blast. Shouldn’t be too awful if I get my cp right. Obviously I plan on weaving light attacks.

75 points in thaumaturge. Just for fun let’s say I skew the defensive side of things in favor of not getting dizzy swinged to death. And I kinda crutch on shimmering shield against mag classes.

Oh yea. Lastly, my band of malacath is infused and my two torugs jewelry are protective. Almost went triune but didnt.

Whatcha think? Good? Bad? Cancerous so you don’t care? And yes I’m probably going to run the bear in duels. And I know that might not be legal in tourneys. But it’s only really because I don’t have a masters staff, and I’m not sure yet how much control I’ll have over cc’ing with arctic blast and off balance. So I don’t want to run my ice comet. Even though I really really do.

  • wheem_ESO
    wheem_ESO
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    I don't duel, and haven't played Magicka Warden in a little over a year now, but why would you use Entropy? The Blue Betty will provide you with Major Sorcery, some magicka regen, and cleansing...and it even auto-cleanses these days. Entropy is actually a really bad ability, which should only be used by those classes who don't have any other way to get Major Sorcery. While it can help proc Skoria, I don't think that it's remotely worth it for that role alone.

    For that matter, I probably wouldn't run Skoria on a Magicka Warden unless I was going for one of the proc-set Ice builds that some people like to run. Even then, Entropy isn't worthwhile since you'll be getting the procs from ground AOE and possibly Fetcher Infection.
  • Lughlongarm
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    The suggested setup seems very sub-optimal.

    1)Stuhns favor is not a back a back bar set. Even if successfully proced from the back bar(which I doubt), you are reducing the potential up-time by swapping to and attacking from front bar.

    2) torugs pact is not a front bar set. You start to get any value from torugs pact when the set applies to both bars(both weapon's enchants). Also, torugs pact probably works better on high crit damage builds, as damage glyphs can crit. What do you get from torugs pact front bar on this setup? like extra 1k damage every 1.8 sec?(best case scenario? )

    Okiesh set like "Ice Furnace" gives 1.6 k every sec(best case scenario) and its AOE. Ice Furnace got something like X3 proc damage potential over the extra glyph damage on torugs pact.

    Stuhns+ malacath+ Valkyn skoria+ another proc set - is something that can work, in theory. I don't think cliff racer alone is reliable enough of a source for off-balance(especially as dueling build).

    And BTW, a malacath porc damage setup for dueling, will probably be heavy armor based with resto staff back bar(especially if you can make Stuhns to work for you.)
  • Alienoutlaw
    Alienoutlaw
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    personally if your looking to stack pen, i would run stuhns, spinners 1pc Valkyn skoria, 1pc Kra'gh and stack spell erosion with gold gear you should have a flat 23k spell pen with stuhns proc'd that goes up to around 29-30k
  • Alienoutlaw
    Alienoutlaw
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    not perfect i know but gives you some idea
    Screenshot-20200619-113102.png
  • OBJnoob
    OBJnoob
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    Oh wow. No good huh? I’m gonna try it anyway I’m not sure exactly what makes it garbage. I could see it being garbage in cyrodiil due to a lack of mobility and an over reliance on tanking. But against 1 person I’d think it’d be okay?

    Anyway I’m gonna ask some questions again just to make sure I understand. Cuz I like to think I’m good at this game but there are some weird little tidbits of knowledge you can only pick up from asking players. And the wording is very important.

    @wheem_ESO im not using the major sorcery morph of entropy I’m using the morph that heals you every 2 seconds. Anyway I’m not sure if people realize that wardens do 10% more magic damage as well as frost damage. Most of their skills are magic damage actually, or at least half, and certainly if you’re not a frost tank. Long story short entropy tooltip is virtually the same as bugs for me. Now it obviously don’t have some of the bonuses... but I’m not sure why one skill can be considered amazing and the other gets no respect whatsoever. What ground based aoes are you talking about? I’m not using any. Not sure an occasional immobilize is really worth it when I’m sure any duelist will walk out of the tiny frost patch immediately.

    @Lughlongarm 1) why isn’t stuhns a backbar set? It’s totally a backbar set. I should probably put cliff racer on my other bar though so they’re already off balance and then use a dot on my backbar to actually proc it immediately and reliably. Either way... my best hot needs to be recast every 10 seconds, off balance lasts 7 seconds, and I can proc stuhns whenever I want for 10 seconds at a time. And bar swap and keep it. Unless the game decided to write the description wrong compared to the wording of every other set and no the stuhns bonus doesn’t carry over. But it should. I bet it does. And I bet ima be barswapping at least every 10 seconds.
    2) I agree that torugs is probably a suboptimal front bar set. I had no idea weapon enchants can crit though can anyone confirm this? I feel like that doesn’t make sense at all. I do disagree that torugs will only provide an extra 1 or 2k a second though I feel like I have a looooot off percentage based damage modifiers on both “him” and me, nice penetration for heavy armor, 60% damage increase and frequency of a glyph that... also benefits from that penetration and percentage modifiers. I feel like saying my glyph damage is going to hit players for... 3k... is pretty realistic. I hope it’s on the low side. So maybe that makes you absolutely right. But if I got 3 dots running constantly... blahblahblsh. If I’m doing 5k damage a second or more and relying on valkyn skoria and constant light attacks... while he’s being chased around by my bear. I find it hard to believe I won’t be doing more than 5k damage a second. And I’m not sure why that is so unimpressive. This is a duel build. Not a cyrodiil build. I feel like pressure sustain and dots are more important than you think and burst damage is slightly less important than you think. 5k damage a second from effortless dps while a fairly tanky and sustainable magden jumps around like an idiot? How many seconds until that’s a problem?
    3) I am heavy armor. I do think resto is probably a good idea. I’m glad you think the gear choices minus torugs is decent overall. I’m not sure why cliff racer is any less reliable than anything else for off balance. It does it every time. They gotta be further than 7m away? Lol that’s definately the plan.

    @Alienoutlaw stuhns and spinners would slap for sure. Your 7k spell damage is absurd and impressive to me. Your resistances make me never ever want to try it. You’re a bomber aren’t you? I’m not.
  • OBJnoob
    OBJnoob
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    Also just to be clear I don’t have much interest in taking an unkillable x build into grahtwood and pretending to duel cuz the pugs still die, the pros can’t kill me either, and yay nobody clipped me today so I must be the best. I hate so much when you’re dueling somebody and you can see them just turtle over and over and make the duel last 10 minutes and both of you blow all your potions because in the end they want you to know it was a tie. When I’m in a tie I force my offensive windows to be larger and larger until either they die or I overextend and I die. Because I’m not dueling for my ego and this game everyone else wants to play is so boring and overly dramatic for me sometimes.
  • wheem_ESO
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    OBJnoob wrote: »
    @wheem_ESO im not using the major sorcery morph of entropy I’m using the morph that heals you every 2 seconds. Anyway I’m not sure if people realize that wardens do 10% more magic damage as well as frost damage. Most of their skills are magic damage actually, or at least half, and certainly if you’re not a frost tank. Long story short entropy tooltip is virtually the same as bugs for me. Now it obviously don’t have some of the bonuses... but I’m not sure why one skill can be considered amazing and the other gets no respect whatsoever. What ground based aoes are you talking about? I’m not using any. Not sure an occasional immobilize is really worth it when I’m sure any duelist will walk out of the tiny frost patch immediately.
    Even if your tooltip ends up being 100% identical between Structured Entropy and Deep Fissure, the latter is vastly superior. If it took 12 seconds for Deep Fissure to do the same amount of damage that it does now, while also being cleansable, no one would use it. And while Structured Entropy does have a HOT component, as best as I can recall it was incredibly weak even before the Greymoor nerfs to healing.

    The ground AOE's I'm referring to are Wall of Elements (Frost) and Winter's Revenge. A charged Ice Staff + Frost Enchants add up to a really ridiculous amount of rooting on anyone who isn't a Nord (though Nord's won't be rooted, since they're immune to the Chilled status effect). I never used a Charged staff myself, since it felt like cheesey nerf-bait, but you can still get pretty solid results with something like Infused (which can proc from the back bar with ground-based weapon-line abilities). Even just a front bar Frost Enchant can cause a fair amount of rooting if you're hitting someone in your wall.

    Combining Wall of Frost, Winter's Revenge, and Fetcher Infection (which got buffed since I last played Mag Warden) with things like the Winterborn set and Skoria will add up to a lot of scoreboard damage in a Battleground, and it's actually fairly significant pressure with some decent - but somewhat RNG based - burst as well. I didn't play the proc set builds myself (other than using Skoria on rare occasion), but I know that they can definitely work.

    'Course, if you're looking primarily for a dueling build, I'd honestly look at some class other than a Magicka Warden - especially if you expect the Bear to be something that's "banned." Deep Fissure is extremely telegraphed and predictable, and if you're up against someone that's really good at avoiding or blocking it, your damage output is really going to suffer.
  • katorga
    katorga
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    not perfect i know but gives you some idea
    Screenshot-20200619-113102.png

    Gotta ask, how did you get 7K spell damage and 37K mag on that sorc?
  • OBJnoob
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    Deep fissure? Yes I’m using deep fissure. By bugs I meant uh... swarm or whatever it’s called. That’s probably my fault. I normally play stam characters I call one bugs I call the other beetles.

    I know the hot component of entropy sucks but again it tooltips the same as swarm and sucking or not another chance to proc major mending on my warden self is fine enough for me. The other morph is crap, as you said. The tooltip is the saaame.

    I just don’t think any dueler is going to stand in my wall of elements. Seriously, you think that’s viable? And you do realize I AM using an infused frost enchant right? Infused by torugs.

    Yes it’s a dueling build. Only a dueling build. For when I beat someone in a fair fight but they take the time to message me and tell me I’m trash and want me to come duel them in grahtwood cuz they’re gonna 500balorghs ulti dump me off rip and be like hawwwhawwwhawww. I’m not going to enter a tourney. I’m not going to care if they call me cheesy cuz I already beat them once in no cp cyrodiil that’s why we’re heeere.

    That being said? That’s a pretty high standard to have for a pvp character. And if it’s not good enough it’s not good enough. I’ve run into some magwardens in the past that we’re just “whoa” in a duel. I think they were probably imbue weapon, masters staff destructive touch spamming. And I might not end up being quite that good. But I think it’s a very similar smelling cheese even being as different as it is. Super easy rotation... constant light attack based pressure... built in tankiness... let your stupid gear do the work for you.

    -shrug- I’m probably not as resistant to change as you think I am. But hey, I’ve already got the gear crafted, I’m gonna try it out. And I’m gonna report back to you with honest findings. I’ll even clip it if you want.
  • Kaysha
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    I played torug+winterborn as an alt char and I have to say, that it was fun and it works. Ice furnace is probably better than winterborn.
  • Alienoutlaw
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    katorga wrote: »
    not perfect i know but gives you some idea
    Screenshot-20200619-113102.png

    Gotta ask, how did you get 7K spell damage and 37K mag on that sorc?

    run bound aegis front bar and spell damage comes from Thrassian Stranglers
  • OBJnoob
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    Does the winterborn proc happen fast enough in duels? Legit question I have no idea. I worry about stuff like that. And about ice furnace... so the proc happens to the original target as well? I always wanted to try that set but wasn’t sure, for dueling, if the proc hit the first target or just the enemies around them. And can anyone say for sure that weapon enchants can proc? Cuz that’s news to me.
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