Mythic Items - Really worth losing 5+5+2 Bonus ?

Rackiera

Considering these are the 'endgame' grind I cannot see any pieces that would be good enough to move from the 5+5+2 formula, the speed ring maybe for farming but even then it's minimal in my opinion.

Considering you can only equip 1 item anyway I would suggest that a way to make these worthwhile would be to also give them +1 to a chosen set, so for example 4 Julianos + 1 mythic still gives
the 5 piece bonus.

Just a suggestion, and as always it's a personal opinion, just wouldn't trade my 5+5+2 bonus for any of the items as they are now.

zvavi

PvP? Diversity. PvE? Not in optimized groups.

Sindrik8x

I think these were made to pair with monster set, maelstrom/master/asylum/etc weapons, and another 5 pc. It actually works out perfectly if you go:

Monster x 2
Maelstrom/Master/Asylum x 2 (Staff, Bow, Greatsword, DW combo, etc.)
Mythic
5 pc

Probably the way to get the most of everything. Put all your gas in the monster, weapons and mythic, put all your sustain/some gas in second set. Just my thoughts. I agree, not worth doing if you're going to run two 5 pc sets front/back.

Ectheliontnacil

Well many popular PvP sets were nerfed. And that 25% dmg ring looks pretty nice if you ask me, especially if you have low crit.

MartiniDaniels

Thrassian stranglers in theory can be used for organized raids... by those who don't wipe

technohic

It depends on your build and what item. The 25% damage buff for example on my builds generally means I can no longer get berserk from the fighters guild ability because I can't crit along with the losing either a 5 piece or monster set. But then in CP, you can take CP out of crit and add it to other damage. Still; you are going for more consistent damage at the expense of bursts.

It's actually an interesting tradeoff and not cut and dry. So far; I commend them on that.

Sindrik8x

I feel like the ring with Slimecraw would be kind of nice. But the 1 pc is a non-bo unfortunately.

That 8% + 25% though...

Danksta

That's why the nerfed a lot of the monster sets.

raasdal

Sindrik8x wrote: »

I think these were made to pair with monster set, maelstrom/master/asylum/etc weapons, and another 5 pc. It actually works out perfectly if you go:

Monster x 2
Maelstrom/Master/Asylum x 2 (Staff, Bow, Greatsword, DW combo, etc.)
Mythic
5 pc

Probably the way to get the most of everything. Put all your gas in the monster, weapons and mythic, put all your sustain/some gas in second set. Just my thoughts. I agree, not worth doing if you're going to run two 5 pc sets front/back.

Huh? That does not work at all, and will leave you naked on two spots.

TwiceBornStar

In case you're wearing a monster helm, a weapon set, a five piece set and a jewelry set, you could swap out a ring or a necklace for a mythic item and still keep the stamina bonus of the agility set for example. Whatever your preferences, you can definitely come up with other combinations than 5+5+2.

I like options, options are good!

Sindrik8x

Did my math wrong Rass. Thanks for the catch. Early morning, all nighter.

Agree with Twice Born tho'.

AmoralOne

It will be certain play styles running these items.. I am thinking of putting the band on my MagSorc. Since I am not running Chudan, but instead running the armor skill I have the free space to move things around.

5x Bright-Throat
5x Crafty Alfiq
1x Domi / Replaced with Band
1x Stonekeeper

I will take away the Domi shoulder move the 1 crafy from the ring to the shoulder, and wham blam

1x Malacaths

Starlock

Of course it's worth it to some players for some characters. Depends on your gameplay goals and priorities, which is hardly homogenous across the entire player base.

The real question is if players can be bothered to get them, especially since some of the mythic items will require players to make additional DLC purchases to complete. That's all kind of $&*'d up and not okay.

Vaoh

Pretty sure Thrassian Stranglers will become BiS in PvE.

They give 150 Spell Damage per kill (up to 20 stacks). Even though with 8 DPS in a trial you won’t get many killing blows, a single stack is 16% stronger than your average Spell Damage set bonus. The downside of taking a tiny bit more damage taken (with few stacks active) is nothing compared to the damage you gain.

If you are running 2x Spell Critical monster set pieces, it’s much stronger to run Thrassian Stranglers. At least in some trials it’ll be a clear BiS for more experienced groups. At least that’s how it looks to me on paper... too early to tell.

Mortiis13

Huh? U can still go 5 / 5 /1 monster /1 mythic if any of the 2/2 monster set effect doesn't care u or u find the mythic effect simply better.

Or players that can't do vet content for whatever reason, they can grind atleast a mythic and buy the monster shoulder.

Personally none of the mythic would let me change monster set and backbar Arena for pve, beside the speed ring to farm things.
In pvp for my max magicka/penetration toon malacath would be great or the speed ring cause lack of mobility.

VoidCommander

This is coming from someone who actually tested these items on pts:

Band of Brutality: Useful in pvp to bypass players with HEAVY crit resistance. Actually useless in pve as having minimum crit chance and crit damage will still far out perform band of malacath, and that isn’t including losing a 5th piece bonus.

Thrassian Stranglers: The hardest content I would expect players to run this is in non-dlc vet dungeons. Any boss mechanic that does an undodgeable attack against the group that deals at least half your health in damage will render the set useless. Even if you can guarantee a roll dodge from all threats, do mechanics perfectly, and get the final kill on 20 enemies AS SOON AS POSSIBLE, you would still be competing with up to 7 other dps for those 20 kills. You can say that you’ll keep your stacks low to mitigate the risk, but you need to make up for losing a monster set, so unless you have at least 8 stacks, you are in the hole damage wise. Again, I don’t see this set being used in serious content, especially things requiring no deaths.

Bloodlord’s embrace: This will be a set for “perma block” magicka tanks who use ice staves. With all block cost reduction, a magicka tank can effectively hold block as long as they want, while bypassing the halted recovery due to this mythic item. Many will criticize the effectiveness of this type of magicka tank and I believe it will simply be due to a severe lack of experience with a pure magicka style tank because it hasn’t been viable until now.

The speedster set is a unique speed buff. Useful for any and all applications where speed is required/desired.

I did not test the tank recovery set as I was more interested in Bloodlord’s embrace, but if I had to guess; the recovery it provides is pretty unimpressive.

ZeroXFF

If you give up an arena weapon (so works well for some PvP builds and PvE tank/healer builds), you can go like this:

2p monster
3p body/jewelry + 2p weapon front bar set
4p body/jewelry + 2p weapon back bar set
1p body/jewelry mythic item

Sensible build example off the top of my head right now... An Argonian NB tank with:
2p Tremorscale
3+2p front Galenwe
4+2p back Tormentor (yes, 6 pieces on back bar)
1p Bloodlord's Embrace

Then you slot Lotus Fan on back bar to proc Tormentor for an AoE taunt and to get the 3.6k resistances (Argonian NBs would be way below cap without this set bonus, so it works well here), then swap to front bar. Set bonuses on front bar:
2p monster
5p front bar set
5p back bar set due to the 5p bonus carrying over and 4p already slotted on front bar
1p mythic item

So this way while on front bar you'd end up with an additional effect at no cost. This of course only works with some specific sets, but the point is, builds that don't sacrifice anything by slotting a mythic item do exist.

Deloth_Vyrr

I was mostly disappointed how bad band of brutality is for PVE. Even if you build for pure damage with no crit, pull all your CP out of crit damage, etc the band is a massive DPS loss. If mythic items had their own slot the band of brutality would still be a big DPS loss in PVE, the fact that it also breaks a set bonus makes it downright atrocious

Firstmep

Yu can still run 5-5-2 and a unique piece if you run sets that can be activated on 1 bar, clever alch sthun balorgh and p2w ring ezpz.

Sealish

Since you can still wear a monster helm OR shoulder while wearing a mythic piece, you can still think of it as going 5-5-2... just that the 2pc bonus of the monster set is being swapped out for the mythic bonus instead. A lot of the Mythic bonuses are of comparable strength to the second bonus from a monster set.

Josira

I wanted to try my luck at a no shield magic sorc
(As I still have ptsd from...well..you know damn well. still do when I get up against one of the 'good' sorc players)
Idea was 5p overwelming surge,5 piece wyrd tree,2piece grothdar and of course,the band of brutality

front bar is 5piece overwhelming surge,4 piece wyrd tree
back bar is 5 piece wyrd tree,4 piece overwhelming.
front bar is sword and shield,defensive offensive.
Back bar is heals.
target gets up close and gets hit by 3 player based aoe's(grothdar,sorc shocky ouchy body,overwhelming) or 4 if I use swarming scion Clown Mode.
player goes away? bait them with heavy resto's,curses and shards

wait for ultimate to build up,
wait for them to wail on me for a bit
then pop swarming daedric clown form

the problem being is "do I slot bound armor for reasonable max magic,or do I use that spot for winged twilight heals?"
as my damage bar only has that slot free
and having to double bar pets is
oof owie im too used to magic necromancer

another problem is lack of cc's..I normally play solo but..I used to play with my boyfriend when you where able to do so in battlegrounds,and in cyrodill,while not grouped up,(yes this is a fancy way of saying I zerg without being in a group shush dont act like you dont do it either),I tend to follow whoever around,and of course,everyone runs cc's meaning that as long as you have someone else there on your side,they often do the cc's.


and of course,getting the mythic item may be a no go with how grindy it is. so...
may just have to go to the backup "shock and ball torture" build: 5piece overwhelming,5piece mad tinkerer 2 piece grothdar

YandereGirlfriend

In non-CP, Malacath's is going to be BiS for tons of builds.

Before the patch, you already had to stack hard into Critical Damage to make Crit-based builds work but now with the 20% baseline resistance, Critical Damage builds are all but dead.

So the Crit-Damage nullification is basically not a real penalty, which leaves only the question of monster set vs. Malacath's, which is likely to be decided universally in favor of Malacath's for damage builds, as no monster set is giving you anywhere near that sort of raw (and sustained) damage.

Stacking exclusively Weapon/Spell damage and Penetration was already the meta but ZOS has basically codified it in this patch.

Josira

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

In non-CP, Malacath's is going to be BiS for tons of builds.

Before the patch, you already had to stack hard into Critical Damage to make Crit-based builds work but now with the 20% baseline resistance, Critical Damage builds are all but dead.

So the Crit-Damage nullification is basically not a real penalty, which leaves only the question of monster set vs. Malacath's, which is likely to be decided universally in favor of Malacath's for damage builds, as no monster set is giving you anywhere near that sort of raw (and sustained) damage.

Stacking exclusively Weapon/Spell damage and Penetration was already the meta but ZOS has basically codified it in this patch.

here is the thing though,if everyone decides to run malacaths,eventually people may stop using impen altogether
or at least drop a lot of it for say,divines



which means you can do the galactic brain decision of running a crit build
because by then malacath's has become the 'meta' in a lot of people's minds,meaning that people would stop running a lot of inpen for other traits and oh dear god its a cycle of 'non crit builds are meta'
'crit builds are meta'
'non crit builds are meta'
oh no
ohhh noo
if a few popular people run critbuilds after a malacath meta
then
it would be the crit build meta
then someone would slot a lot of impen and malacaths
and then malacath meta
then people would stop slotting a lot of impen during this meta because 'everyone is running malacaths why bother'
then
crit build meta
then

I think I had too much caffiene and not enough sleep
help

Dracane

Deloth_Vyrr wrote: »

I was mostly disappointed how bad band of brutality is for PVE. Even if you build for pure damage with no crit, pull all your CP out of crit damage, etc the band is a massive DPS loss. If mythic items had their own slot the band of brutality would still be a big DPS loss in PVE, the fact that it also breaks a set bonus makes it downright atrocious

And they are atrocious. People are merely overreacting.
They see 25% damage and think it is overpowered, without minding how little of these 25% is actually left after all multipliers.

gatekeeper13

Dracane wrote: »

Deloth_Vyrr wrote: »

I was mostly disappointed how bad band of brutality is for PVE. Even if you build for pure damage with no crit, pull all your CP out of crit damage, etc the band is a massive DPS loss. If mythic items had their own slot the band of brutality would still be a big DPS loss in PVE, the fact that it also breaks a set bonus makes it downright atrocious

And they are atrocious. People are merely overreacting.
They see 25% damage and think it is overpowered, without minding how little of these 25% is actually left after all multipliers.

This.

Chilly-McFreeze

Josira wrote: »

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

In non-CP, Malacath's is going to be BiS for tons of builds.

Before the patch, you already had to stack hard into Critical Damage to make Crit-based builds work but now with the 20% baseline resistance, Critical Damage builds are all but dead.

So the Crit-Damage nullification is basically not a real penalty, which leaves only the question of monster set vs. Malacath's, which is likely to be decided universally in favor of Malacath's for damage builds, as no monster set is giving you anywhere near that sort of raw (and sustained) damage.

Stacking exclusively Weapon/Spell damage and Penetration was already the meta but ZOS has basically codified it in this patch.

here is the thing though,if everyone decides to run malacaths,eventually people may stop using impen altogether
or at least drop a lot of it for say,divines



which means you can do the galactic brain decision of running a crit build
because by then malacath's has become the 'meta' in a lot of people's minds,meaning that people would stop running a lot of inpen for other traits and oh dear god its a cycle of 'non crit builds are meta'
'crit builds are meta'
'non crit builds are meta'
oh no
ohhh noo
if a few popular people run critbuilds after a malacath meta
then
it would be the crit build meta
then someone would slot a lot of impen and malacaths
and then malacath meta
then people would stop slotting a lot of impen during this meta because 'everyone is running malacaths why bother'
then
crit build meta
then

I think I had too much caffiene and not enough sleep
help

People won't stop running any impen as not everyone will have mala's. Maybe they swap out 2-3 pieces for well fitted etc. but in the end your crits will still deal less damage thanks to baseline crit resist.

Josira

Yeah your probably right
Rest in Piece my Magicka Necromancer
Only way he could deal damage in pvp was with Crits and Caulruns Legacy

rexagamemnon

depends, if you don't like the 5th bonus of a 5piece set or the 2nd bonus from monster masks, you could use the mythic items to trade that final bonus, but so far I don't see much in the mythic items that would benefit be. most the mythic stuff is suited for pvp, I mostly pve. the only thing probably good for pve is thrassian stranglers, but you run the risk of becoming a giant glass canon, its too risky in my opinion.

MEBengalsFan2001

Sindrik8x wrote: »

I feel like the ring with Slimecraw would be kind of nice. But the 1 pc is a non-bo unfortunately.

That 8% + 25% though...

In PVP I can see that, but in PVE the healer should be providing the slime claw buff.

Stx

The mythic items are fantastic for pretty much every area of the game outside min/max endgame pve.

Almost all of them will be used in pvp. The speed ring is obviously useful for farming. The chest will be useful for tanks.

A number of them will be useful in solo builds.

I am mostly excited about using the torc and the snow treaders on a werewolf build in pvp.

joseayalac

I'm super certain that Malacath's Band is BiS for my Stam DK BG build.