New Vamp Ult opinion thread

merpins · May 2020

So those of you that are playing vampire, what do you think of the new vampire ult? For me, it feels a bit underwhelming. That's not to say that the old ultimate was good, I don't think it was, but the 20 second duration of the new ultimate feels very short. Much longer and it might end up too powerful, but the long animation to activate the skill (which uses up about 2 seconds of the duration) and at the end of the ult (2 seconds of dps downtime, 4 seconds altogether) makes it feel a bit useless to me. Extra stats are good, and the heal to full is great along with the healing attacks. The stage 5 vampire thing would be great but it the skill doesn't really last long enough to make it great, whereas the other morph does decent damage over 20 seconds compared to some other ults. I just don't really know how to feel, it seems decent but also not really great at the same time. Thoughts?

Ildun · May 2020

I just don't get the point of Perfect Scion, just offer no drawback doesn't seems like that useful for me.

merpins · May 2020

Ildun wrote: »

I just don't get the point of Perfect Scion, just offer no drawback doesn't seems like that useful for me.

Especially with how short the duration is, it makes it just seem moot. I agree with ya. I'd say increase the duration or give it some kind of boost to damage or something.

VoidCommander · May 2020

MovesLikeJaguar wrote: »

So those of you that are playing vampire, what do you think of the new vampire ult? For me, it feels a bit underwhelming. That's not to say that the old ultimate was good, I don't think it was, but the 20 second duration of the new ultimate feels very short. Much longer and it might end up too powerful, but the long animation to activate the skill (which uses up about 2 seconds of the duration) and at the end of the ult (2 seconds of dps downtime, 4 seconds altogether) makes it feel a bit useless to me. Extra stats are good, and the heal to full is great along with the healing attacks. The stage 5 vampire thing would be great but it the skill doesn't really last long enough to make it great, whereas the other morph does decent damage over 20 seconds compared to some other ults. I just don't really know how to feel, it seems decent but also not really great at the same time. Thoughts?

Finally. Thank god someone else noticed it besides me. You heard it here folks, the vampire’s 20 second transformation is in fact only 16 seconds effectively, eating up FOUR seconds for transforming.

This is actually why we know this ability isn’t a Re-skin of bone goliath, because bone Goliath lets you cancel the transform animation by activating a skill, whereas the vamp ult forces you to endure the entire roleplay experience of transformation both in, and out.

Noxavian · May 2020

MovesLikeJaguar wrote: »

So those of you that are playing vampire, what do you think of the new vampire ult? For me, it feels a bit underwhelming. That's not to say that the old ultimate was good, I don't think it was, but the 20 second duration of the new ultimate feels very short. Much longer and it might end up too powerful, but the long animation to activate the skill (which uses up about 2 seconds of the duration) and at the end of the ult (2 seconds of dps downtime, 4 seconds altogether) makes it feel a bit useless to me. Extra stats are good, and the heal to full is great along with the healing attacks. The stage 5 vampire thing would be great but it the skill doesn't really last long enough to make it great, whereas the other morph does decent damage over 20 seconds compared to some other ults. I just don't really know how to feel, it seems decent but also not really great at the same time. Thoughts?

It feels like absolute ***.

One of the morphs is a pointless debuff remover and the other is just the version of the ult, but weaker. To top it off the effects of the ultimate are just re-distributed values of the bone goliath ult with " x ray vision" randomly thrown on.

Furthermore: why are we using weapons when we have CLAWS. CLAWS THE SIZE OF DAGGERS.

It isn't unique at all and deserves to be completely re-designed, blood scion visuals and all.

merpins · May 2020

Noxavian wrote: »

One of the morphs is a pointless debuff remover and the other is just the version of the ult, but weaker. To top it off the effects of the ultimate are just re-distributed values of the bone goliath ult with " x ray vision" randomly thrown on.

Furthermore: why are we using weapons when we have CLAWS. CLAWS THE SIZE OF DAGGERS.

It isn't unique at all and deserves to be completely re-designed, blood scion visuals and all.

The values are similar to Bone Goliath, though we know it's not a reskin of that skill since you can't cancel the animation (so you lose 4 seconds of the 20 second ultimate, effectively making it a 16 second ultimate).
Weapons makes sense since you have shields, staves, or bows, but I'd love to see a reskin for players that attack using any melee weapon.
I like the design (though outdated as it is since it's based on the vampires from the Dawnguard DLC of Skyrim), but I just find it to be underwhelming. The morph where it removes the downsides of stage 4 vamp is good, but I think increasing the duration significantly on that would make it worth it to some extent, and definitely overall lowering the ult cost (since no one plays a stage 4 vampire in the first place, and even then it's too expensive for what you get). Damage increase or something to spells could make sense what with vampires having unique spells generally, or some such buff, but as it sits, I don't think it's worth it IMO.

Thannazzar · May 2020

Won't ever be slotting it, based on both visuals and utility. Far better ults out there in the game.

Mortiis13 · May 2020

It's nice for overland role play, to feel like a mighty bulky daedra...

preevious · May 2020

It's not so bad if you use grounds dots.

1) lay the dots
2) transform, the dots gets a damage boost (10k max stat = 1k spell/weapon dmg), also get health and sustain
3) wreck stuff with spammable, rotate as usual.
4) de-transform.

There's something to do, with that ultimate. Will take some time to master, though.

Spectral_Force · May 2020

Guess I'll just reiterate what I've been saying in the PTS forum.
1) Duration is... decent, I guess, though it could be longer. What hurts it most is the 2-second transformation to Scion and 1-1.5-second transformation time from Scion, both of which effectively stun you. This cuts the effective duration by around 18-20%.
2) The ulti cost is way too high. IIRC, even at Stage 4 the ultimate will cost more than Bone Goliath. That's because the cost of Blood Scion (as well as all other abilities) was initially balanced around 10/20/30/40%(I think?) cost reduction before it got changed to 6/10/16/24%.
3) Perfect Scion is a joke. The choice between Blood and Perfect wasn't as obvious before as it is now due to much higher penalties at higher Vampire stages. Now that those penalties are much more tame (thank God for that), the need to take Perfect Scion is simply not there anymore.
4) It's an uglier, wingless Vampire Lord.

Opalblade · May 2020

Won't even slot it. I didn't want to be a "special" vampire, much less a downgraded version of vampire lord.

merpins · May 2020

Spectral_Force wrote: »

Guess I'll just reiterate what I've been saying in the PTS forum.
1) Duration is... decent, I guess, though it could be longer. What hurts it most is the 2-second transformation to Scion and 1-1.5-second transformation time from Scion, both of which effectively stun you. This cuts the effective duration by around 18-20%.
2) The ulti cost is way too high. IIRC, even at Stage 4 the ultimate will cost more than Bone Goliath. That's because the cost of Blood Scion (as well as all other abilities) was initially balanced around 10/20/30/40%(I think?) cost reduction before it got changed to 6/10/16/24%.
3) Perfect Scion is a joke. The choice between Blood and Perfect wasn't as obvious before as it is now due to much higher penalties at higher Vampire stages. Now that those penalties are much more tame (thank God for that), the need to take Perfect Scion is simply not there anymore.
4) It's an uglier, wingless Vampire Lord.

agreed

GeorgeYung · May 2020

I guess if they remove the transformation time it will be viable.

I'd say it would be great if Perfect Scion would remove the negative side effects of your abilities as well?
Like you can get healed by other players when you are in Mist form, negates the increasing health drain of Blood Frency, just pay the base price ?

I think in that scenario the ultimate would offer a lot more value, and it should based on the cost

Nephthys · May 2020

It is horrible ugly. Nothing like a vampire. More like a deformed gargoyle escaped from a nuclear disaster plant.

BohnT2 · May 2020

It's a bad ultimate in almost every aspect:
For PvE it deals not enough damage and it's uptime is pitiful, not even mentioning the other disadvantages it puts out on top of that.

For pvp it is strong in terms of extra pressure but it won't be used often because it's again very expensive and comes with a huge downtime for a class with ult gen of ~4ult/s it takes about 80 seconds to generate the needed ult at stage 1 if you start from 0 ult.
This is incredibly long in pvp terms, you can call it an eternity.
What makes it worse compared to other ults while you're transformed you don't generate any ultimate, this however is crucial as getting kills in pvp grants ultimate and helps to make expensive ult useable.

For a warden popping northern storm for 200ult, the next storm is much easier to get, getting 2 kills means 40 additional ult which are 20 of the ultimates cost, if you count in the 4 ult/s the warden has already 72 ultimate again meaning under normal conditions the next storm will be ready in about 32 seconds.

This can be translated to all other ultimates which let you accumulate ultimate during their duration (which is a good thing)

I see the issue the devs want to combat with this concept for bone colossus and blood scion that people can't sit in those forms infinitely and have a huge advantage as dying in either form is really hard.
However the result is that those ults see almost no useage as other options are simply much better both offensive and defensive wise.

There's no point in terms of opportunity cost to be invincible for 20 seconds when the enemy only has a burst window of 3 seconds and you can survive those 3 seconds by other means much cheaper.
On the other side you don't need exceptional offence when you can kill the enemy in the first 8 seconds of your ultimate.

This is of course simplified but can be used as a concept to describe the issue.

Perfected scion has been a waste of potential ever since it was announced, the downtime is so huge that you have no drawbacks only for a fraction of the fight.
There is no point wasting your ultimate to get access to some mediocre passives and cost reduction on maybe 2 skills you'll actually use when all other skills still cost 12% more for the majority of time.

The whole skill line needs to be better fleshed out and the ultimate reflects the issues of it.

I won't even talk about the appearance which looks like someone went full Ash Ketchum on STDs.

Chrysa1is · May 2020

I really like it. I really like laughing at everyone's rubber vampire mode🤣🤣

Josira · May 2020

I like to call it
"Daedric Clown Mode"
where you stand big and goofy while honking your daedric clown nose while people in pvp run away from you due to your lack of ability to apply pressure.

Mechanically its stupid. and appearance wise,its also stupid.
Lazy even. no not even. it is just lazy.
Lets not forget the animation for their spamable is you slapping them with your weapon.
you can get away with that animation when its for a damage over time ability,like DK's. but when its the main ability,the main spamable.you cant.
I dont get it. Necromancer's had an amazing animation for their spamable. it was short,sweet, synced with weaving well and had combo animations/alternating animations! like I would of thought that would of set the standard for future spamable animations.
But it didnt.
Did they spend all the animation budget on the feeding animations or the antiquities system?
Was the budget about 2$ after that?
We know they are fully capable of adding in new animations and effects,quite easily even.
We see it all the time even
New Emotes,New Memento's.
Ugh. Its not like its ever going to be touched on again. We are stuck with this terrible skill line
Who knows. maybe they would introduce some mythic item to make Vampires have a gap closer or not look *** goofy or some bootleg solution.
Maybe the escaped clown of a creative director gets fired.
Damn now I want someone to put clown music over that vid. Where he says "Blood Frenzy ticks all the boxes of what it means to be a vampire" then two quick clown honks at the end.