10% healing recieved is not enough to solve the radiating regeneration stacking issue

evoniee

Yes - Radiating Regeneration needs further adjustment

The skill regeneration and its morphs is a crutch ngl, radiating regen is the most efficient team heal.
3 person casting radiating regen pretty much stronger rapid regen to 3 person with 9 sec duration and more tick (less huge health decrease).
6 person cast 2x radiating regen = 3 stack rapid regen to 6 person for 8 second and more tick.

TLDR:
Rapid regen not optimesed for stacking team heal, the duration and target not gonna work like radiating regen stacking. Radiating regen is arguably most efficient and comfortable team heal.

Sneaky-Snurr

Qbiken wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Czekoludek wrote: »

So healing which required healing staff needs to be reduced but vigor available for all stam builds shouldn't be nerfed? Do we play another game? Last time when i checked pvp stam was pretty much stronger then magicka and you want to shift powet towards stam even further?

I believe it is either ignorance or a tactic to blind the devs. Of course Vigor is a major issue and yes, also magicka builds can have immense self heal. Self heal; that is the issue. Cross healing is another, but self healing together with the damage mitigation we can have right now is the absolute fundamental issue.

It is a priority and then they need to look at cross healing.

Healing isn´t an issue as long as mitigation and max HP can remain reletivily low. A better approach from ZOS instead of going with a 20% healing nerf, would´ve been to adjust the amount of %-based mitigation certain things can offer.

* Sets like impregnable and pariah are severely unbalanced in terms of how much defensive stats they offer. Like, where is my offensive version of impregnable that offers unconditional 30% increased critical damage as a 5 piece? ^^

* Healing can remain strong if HP can remain somwhat low: Me and several others have suggested to add a debuff within battlespirit that adds diminishing returns on all HP above 25k. "For every 5k HP above 25k, it´s effectiveness gets reduced by 50%". I personally would also like to see all heals that scales of max HP to be removed or reworked (ww heal, artic blast/polar wind etc..)
If someone can be brought into execute range (most people can be brought into execute if sitting at around 25k HP, but it will be alot harder if they´re at 35k+), but be allowed to have strong selfhealing, we´ve a much more healthier PvP.

@Qbiken
All due respect, I think Pariah is very much balanced as the armour scaling with health provides a very suitable risk-reward ratio and opportunity cost. Pariah doesn't need any adjustments. Impregnable however almost negates any burst opportunities from critical strikes and certainly offers excellent protection from burst damages.

Agree on your other points though.

D3N7157

Yes - Radiating Regeneration needs further adjustment

Sneaky-Snurr wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Czekoludek wrote: »

So healing which required healing staff needs to be reduced but vigor available for all stam builds shouldn't be nerfed? Do we play another game? Last time when i checked pvp stam was pretty much stronger then magicka and you want to shift powet towards stam even further?

I believe it is either ignorance or a tactic to blind the devs. Of course Vigor is a major issue and yes, also magicka builds can have immense self heal. Self heal; that is the issue. Cross healing is another, but self healing together with the damage mitigation we can have right now is the absolute fundamental issue.

It is a priority and then they need to look at cross healing.

Healing isn´t an issue as long as mitigation and max HP can remain reletivily low. A better approach from ZOS instead of going with a 20% healing nerf, would´ve been to adjust the amount of %-based mitigation certain things can offer.

* Sets like impregnable and pariah are severely unbalanced in terms of how much defensive stats they offer. Like, where is my offensive version of impregnable that offers unconditional 30% increased critical damage as a 5 piece? ^^

* Healing can remain strong if HP can remain somwhat low: Me and several others have suggested to add a debuff within battlespirit that adds diminishing returns on all HP above 25k. "For every 5k HP above 25k, it´s effectiveness gets reduced by 50%". I personally would also like to see all heals that scales of max HP to be removed or reworked (ww heal, artic blast/polar wind etc..)
If someone can be brought into execute range (most people can be brought into execute if sitting at around 25k HP, but it will be alot harder if they´re at 35k+), but be allowed to have strong selfhealing, we´ve a much more healthier PvP.

@Qbiken
All due respect, I think Pariah is very much balanced as the armour scaling with health provides a very suitable risk-reward ratio and opportunity cost. Pariah doesn't need any adjustments. Impregnable however almost negates any burst opportunities from critical strikes and certainly offers excellent protection from burst damages.

Agree on your other points though.

Please stick to the topic of radiating regeneration and HOT stacking mitigation and sets can be discussed elsewhere

Xologamer

No - Radiating Regeneration isn't going to be an issue anymore

Dracane wrote: »

Xologamer wrote: »

it will be increased to 60% reduce which will be a 20% nerf in game which is way way way to much

I am not so good with understanding math besides simple subtraction and summation.
But from 50% to 60% is 10% or not? If you count 10% as double, then would that not mean that 50% reduction would be 100%? Which it is not, otherwise all healing would be 0 in pvp. While in reality it is just 50%, just like 60% will be 60%, not 70%.

its easy : right now we have 50% reduction in cyro - and if u get a reduce of 10% to this 50 we have 40% - if u see it like that u lost 20% heal from 50% to 40%
hope that was understanable

Xologamer

No - Radiating Regeneration isn't going to be an issue anymore

(u lost 1/5 from 50% -> 40% and 1/5 is 20%)

D3N7157

Yes - Radiating Regeneration needs further adjustment

Xologamer wrote: »

(u lost 1/5 from 50% -> 40% and 1/5 is 20%)

You can easily stack mutagens so that even with this 20% decrease big groups won’t notice a big difference same goes for zergs unfortunately this skill was designed to counter the DOT meta we had a while ago, DOTs were over nerfed and now we are left with OP healing skill for zergs. From a 20 man group perspective the change is laughable as they will stack same amount of healing and still get overhealed by a fair margin.
Magicka should be treated same as stamina at the moment - individual tankiness and healing with marginal cross healing availability, it’s much healthier and more balanced for all aspects of the game.

Magicka have access to burst heals that target other players anyway and it’s a better form of healing since you need to actively use you GCDs to heal someone right now it’s spam mutagen 2/3 every 10 sec and keep pushing on braindead kinda gameplay, how can anybody think this is good for the balance of the game is beyond me really.

Endgame pvp players like myself want to play something else than full Magicka harmony raid and still be effective current meta is pushing us towards this one way of playing since it’s overperforming any other gameplay style by a lot, I’m a big fan of days when stamina wardens we’re welcome in raids with spin to win spamming at least you had some variety in what you bring to the raid today, last half a year we all play same boring builds with radiating regen backbar, it works but hell does it get boring.

TequilaFire

No - Radiating Regeneration isn't going to be an issue anymore

D3N7157 wrote: »

Czekoludek wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Thank you for your detailed post Berenhir you explained the exact issues that I am campaigning against in going to link a short clip of me and my friends running a smaller 6 man Magicka group in which we all also stack radiating regeneration because of how powerful it is and it’s definitely the most efficient way to play right now, healing with 6 constantly stacked regens makes it almost impossible to die. People who call bias on this poll either have no idea how raiding works or just don’t want their crutch removed.
https://youtu.be/QbOuO1J7gDY

TBH problem is not regeneration skill but healing overall. They buffed all sources of healing in Scalebreaker so it could match up the increased dot damage but didn't nerf it when dots got the nerfhammer. So now we have pvp full of immortal characters. Nerfing only rapid would put mag in disadvantage compared to stams

Issue is when you don’t have a harmony group up and you still want to kill zergs with a group of 3-6 players if you encounter a big zerg let’s say 20+ people and even just half of them is using mutagen it’s going to be hard to burst anybody down while getting swarmed only way is to wait for full ult push, the stam players have almost zero cross healing at the moment they aren’t the problem, Magicka is the problem. Having a guaranteed rapid regen as a self heal only and nerfing radiating regen to the ground wouldn’t put Magicka at disadvantage it would put zergs at disadvantage

Sorry to break this to everybody Magicka cross healing is out of control.

Ever heard of negate?
It is your friend and just as important to have in a group as a healer.
But why use counter measures when you can just ask for nerfs.

D3N7157

Yes - Radiating Regeneration needs further adjustment

TequilaFire wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Czekoludek wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Thank you for your detailed post Berenhir you explained the exact issues that I am campaigning against in going to link a short clip of me and my friends running a smaller 6 man Magicka group in which we all also stack radiating regeneration because of how powerful it is and it’s definitely the most efficient way to play right now, healing with 6 constantly stacked regens makes it almost impossible to die. People who call bias on this poll either have no idea how raiding works or just don’t want their crutch removed.
https://youtu.be/QbOuO1J7gDY

TBH problem is not regeneration skill but healing overall. They buffed all sources of healing in Scalebreaker so it could match up the increased dot damage but didn't nerf it when dots got the nerfhammer. So now we have pvp full of immortal characters. Nerfing only rapid would put mag in disadvantage compared to stams

Issue is when you don’t have a harmony group up and you still want to kill zergs with a group of 3-6 players if you encounter a big zerg let’s say 20+ people and even just half of them is using mutagen it’s going to be hard to burst anybody down while getting swarmed only way is to wait for full ult push, the stam players have almost zero cross healing at the moment they aren’t the problem, Magicka is the problem. Having a guaranteed rapid regen as a self heal only and nerfing radiating regen to the ground wouldn’t put Magicka at disadvantage it would put zergs at disadvantage

Sorry to break this to everybody Magicka cross healing is out of control.

Ever heard of negate?
It is your friend and just as important to have in a group as a healer.
But why use counter measures when you can just ask for nerfs.

Please check your facts when you have 6 mutagens stacked and get in a negate they will still continue healing
they arent aoe abilities and dont get cleaned by a negate.

Kadoin

No - Radiating Regeneration isn't going to be an issue anymore

D3N7157 wrote: »

Another clip same issue this time half the group size and only thing keeping us going is the overpowered radiating regen stacking

https://youtu.be/T-PL5Gu0YTs

Yes, its radiating being stacked and not the numerous damage reduction buffs on you + your use of other skills that heal, movement speed, rolling and blocking, and crutch add-ons helping you know what to do and when.

But keep pretending that healing is the issue, and radiating is the only issue, when you can clearly see the damage you take is barely anything in the first place. If your hp bar went to 1/2 and boosted back up instantly you would have a point, but it doesn't because you have enough damage reduction and movement speed to avoid damage to make the damage you are taking not matter before you even heal.

Also, "all media is a production." Familiar with that phrase? That means you can selectively show whatever you want and ignore any other time your narrative is false. Showing a clip of you winning with raid buffs v. players that did not have raid buffs or complementing builds doesn't prove anything.

HankTwo

Yes - Radiating Regeneration needs further adjustment

Stacking radiating regeneration also seems problematic to me ever since they buffed it. I mean just look at how the skill compares to similar class hots:

- dks cauterize --> only ~ 76% of the healing per second of radiating regen and only heals one person at the time.
- wardens living trellis --> has the potential to have a bit more healing per second than radiating regen, but is single target only and requires constant incoming damage to do so.
- necros braided tether --> only ~ 74% of the healing per second of radiating regen. Yes, its somewhat of an aoe heal but requires a corpse and locks you into line of sight of said corpse.
- sorcs power surge --> even if you activate this constantly on cooldown radiating regen will heal for roughly twice as much.

Last but not least, lets compare it to its direct stamina equivalent:

- echoing vigor --> on a stam/mag mirror build this skill has only ~49% of the healing per second of radiating regen, so it is far, far weaker.

Some of those skills are considered powerful healing spells, yet in any group setting radiating regen simply blows all of them out of the water. The problem really is that there is no down side to running this skill. You get more healing per second than the vast majority of class hots even if you are just on your own, but at the same time you can heal multiple allies in just one GCD.

Imo, instead of just flat out nerfing the healing per second they could go for a different route:
1) Keep the tooltip and the amount of targets for radiating regen the same but restrict this skill to healing allies only, so that it will never target yourself. This would still leave the skill in a strong spot for dedicated healers or mag group builds in general, but at the same time it will create a severe drawback, since the moment you are alone this skill will lose its use. (note: this change would reduce the maximum amount of radiating stacks on a player using radiating in a group by 1 compared to the current version).
1) make rapid regen (and regeneration, the un-morphed skill) a targetted heal (like honour the dead for example), so it becomes easier to use as a self heal.

The other, more boring option would be to flat out nerf radiating regen to bring it more in line with skills like cauterize.

SillyGT

No - Radiating Regeneration isn't going to be an issue anymore

The problem is damage mitigation not healing.

Berenhir

Yes - Radiating Regeneration needs further adjustment

Current PTS buffs Earthgore massively by reducing the cooldown and buffs RR spam significantly by buffing the Maelstrom Resto to proc without cooldown for 500 Magicka per second.

Balorgh also buffed significantly for high spell and weapon damage builds.

And as icing on the cake, organized groups can now ignore snares and roots for the cost of the 2pc of a monster set.