Sorcerers in urgent need of preemptive nerf because of healing changes.

D3N7157

Today I'd like to point out in detail why magicka sorcerer will be to go class for most FOTM players out there
soon after the new patch with the healing changes will hit live servers. Why is that a bad thing you may ask?
Im here to convince you sorc needs to be nerfed because it's in it current state way too strong compared to what
all the other specs with small exception of dedicated tank builds will become.

Let's get started:

1-Shield stacking
*a fully offensive build magicka sorcerer can now achieve easily 24k shields that inherit all his mitigation including CP and all that on top of already at aleat 20-24k health
providing the given sorcerer with a healthpool worth of a dk tank in PVE. Light armor hields still provide user with substantial amount of magicka return, but lets be honest
with the updated bonus and casttime reduction of Dark Conversion sustaining a sorcerer is not a problem, streak cost reduction improved sustain even more but ill talk about
this issue later. Effectively you can face tank and spam shields with occastional streak against 4-5 players it gets easier if they are of melee variety.

2-Full ranged capability
*the only class right now (except maybe magicka templar with force pulse, but thats a stretch with how good jabs are at the moment...) that is capable of taking down targets
from relative safety distance is sorcerer this favours the class even more now that fighting in melee range is going to become much more dramatic and unforgiving. Sorcs can just
safely utilise their burst and group healing with the best healing skill in a game twilight matriarch healing two targers for whooping 8-10k (crits almost up to 18k if you really stack a
ton of magicka, and that is on two targets remember, even magplar heals cant compete and sorc will be the to go healer in pvp should changes go live)

3-A smal zoo
*Sorcerer can easily become 5 targets instead of one without sacrificing ANYTHING and here is how:
-sorcerer himself
-matriarch
-atronach
-ball of lightning
-engine guardian

a steup like this is not somethingtoo odd to run at all and makes it almost impossible to hit the sorcerer, because hes going to BOL around and kite around his small zoo
really annoying and going to be exploited to the maximum just wait and see

4-Streak/ball of lightning, mobility
One of the strongest point of sorcerer compared to healing based classes/builds streak offers uncomparable levels of mobility at a way too low cost, sustaining this skill
has become too easy, we will see tens if not hundreds of sorcs spamming BoL creating a target absorbing projectiles (ALL projectiles not just magicka projectiles as it
used to be in the past) and granting themselves snare immunity for 2 seconds. Hello? less overloaded skills have been nerfed into oblivion in the past). The recent cost
decrease on this skill made sustaining it with the enormous gap distances you can create to spam Dark Conversion nothing, but simply a joke. This is going to become the
biggest crutch in the game really quickly and honestly vision of pvp where everyone is constantly on the run in scary. Worth mentioning is that sorc armor buff offers solid
4 seconds of major expedition should you want to kite around a rock to relive memories of the past

5-Best healing in the game
Twilight Matriarch a skill qually loved as hated by others, currently it pulls the best numbers of all burst heal skills based on offensive stats (only max magicka in this case same
as the size of the shields i think the heal should scale of spell damage so you cant have both), it also heals two targets at the same time and gets a a copy of your hardened ward
making it a lot harder to kill when not fighting a ton of people than the sorc brigade would like us all to believe... Has a DOT hitting every 2 seconds for substanital amount of damage
thankfully this was nerfed to bearable levels already and most importantly you can kite around it, when fighting 1/2 other players this is really strong, set up the rest of the aforementioned
zoo with that and you can tank a horde of zergers and if you still cant kill them just streak away who needs to die anyway.

I'm not going to get into their offensive capabilities as this is not why people will make the switch, but constant irritation because of getting nuked with gimped heals,
mixed with envy at the soon to be immortal compared to anything else will make FOTM players make the switch and it's not like this hasn't happened before in the past.
Summerset patch comes to mind, and everyone abusing rune cage to the point where it got nerfed into uselessness for a year, followed by the cast time on shields fiasco
that was a result of everyone playing sorc, then everyone complaining on forums that everyone is playing sorc, its going to happen again unless the developers act quickly now.

I'd like to invite everyone to discuss on the topic, please refrain from personal attacks and baiting in my thread.


Something weird happened with the formatting, sorry about that.

Dracane

I find other Sorcerer by very far the easiest class to kill when they have no ball of lightning. Unlike other classes, they can be bursted so easily since they have no meaningful TRUE damage mitigation.

But I will repeat what I have been saying for 4 years or so: Remove shieldstacking already. It is an obnoxious thing that has been going on for way too long. They kept on nerfing individual damage shields and made shield stacking only more essential for sorcerers who do not want to get one shotted.

I find it alright that sorcerer is squishy and easily destroyed. They have good mobility, they do not need 23k+ artificial health on top. I would love to see individual shields being buffed and restored while removing the ability to stack multiple. But besides that, sorcerer or shields in general require no nerfs at all. There have been enough and all they do is cling to shieldstack and ball of lightning. (please do something to ball of lightning... replace its effect with some other defense)

It is good Zenimax finally balances the potency of heals and shields apart from each other, for they are no longer compareable 1:1. Single shields are in a very bad spot already, I feel.

D3N7157

SnB sorcerer with one shield for emergency and block-casting matriarch heal while spamming BoL is not something
all too unrealistic in my opinion. Still going to be the best setup in the game.

Chilly-McFreeze

Dracane wrote: »

But I will repeat what I have been saying for 4 years or so: Remove shieldstacking already. It is an obnoxious thing that has been going on for way too long. They kept on nerfing individual damage shields and made shield stacking only more essential for sorcerers who do not want to get one shotted.

This is a bit too facile for me. What about all those minor shields that are granted by others to me? Do they overwright my bigger own ward? Does my bigger ward prevent me from being buffed/ shielded by others? What about all those tiny wards that come from different sources? What's about hardening enchant, brawler, CP block ward?

And why should you be able to layer heals while I'm not able to layer shields?

Anhedonie

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

D3N7157

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Please read though all my points again, i don't understand how can you say this with a straight face.

Dracane

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

But I will repeat what I have been saying for 4 years or so: Remove shieldstacking already. It is an obnoxious thing that has been going on for way too long. They kept on nerfing individual damage shields and made shield stacking only more essential for sorcerers who do not want to get one shotted.

This is a bit too facile for me. What about all those minor shields that are granted by others to me? Do they overwright my bigger own ward? Does my bigger ward prevent me from being buffed/ shielded by others? What about all those tiny wards that come from different sources? What's about hardening enchant, brawler, CP block ward?

And why should you be able to layer heals while I'm not able to layer shields?

Not those tiny passive wards. Only big ones like conjured ward, annulment and healing ward. I think attempting to cast or receive them while already having one active could simply result in them having no effect.

Luckylancer

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Why? They are relatively buffed with healing changes. Every other class dps will lose their health bar sustain while sorcs will keep theirs (shields). Maybe stams will utilise trollking as it is not nerfed in healing nerf (I think).

Personaly, I will buy sheild breaker to kill shield users. It is not 1 dimentional set after changes.

Beardimus

D3N7157 wrote: »

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Please read though all my points again, i don't understand how can you say this with a straight face.

Because it's true. Nerf sorc is a meme.

And all the nerfs people cry for, what do they achieve. Look how the long list of ward changes work out lol. From glass cannons to just a bit tankier with wards down thus reducing the window.

Sorcs are easy to take down, if you adapt. Same with any class really. Find their weakness.

But nerf sorc requests have been endless on this forum thus are hard to take seriously.

shimm

Nerf sorc (ahem, this has been a meme for at least several years at this point). It should really go much further, though. Make sorcs get experience at half the rate of the other classes (including alliance points) counter balanced by giving them a 5% increase in gold acquisition ... but only at night. Sorcs should also only have access to cosmetic shields, and if a shield is slotted anyway - it results in loss of armor. So using sorc will become a badge of honor - only the best will be able to survive so that when you see a sorc you’ll think, dang... they must be good!

D3N7157

Beardimus wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Please read though all my points again, i don't understand how can you say this with a straight face.

Because it's true. Nerf sorc is a meme.

And all the nerfs people cry for, what do they achieve. Look how the long list of ward changes work out lol. From glass cannons to just a bit tankier with wards down thus reducing the window.

Sorcs are easy to take down, if you adapt. Same with any class really. Find their weakness.

But nerf sorc requests have been endless on this forum thus are hard to take seriously.

please try to kill a good sorcerer 1v1 on a full melee build hes just going to create gaps that you will waste
resources on closing and spamming you from range, i know nerfs are bad but they are necessary this time

Galwylin

Is the goal making all classes unfun to play? I don't main a sorcerer but I have seen classes go from fun to annoying. Sounds like sorcerer might still be fun after the changes while its the others that won't be. I don't believe nerfing another class is a viable solution to what is essentially refusing to find ways of making other classes fun and rewarding without throwing out this so called balance. Which, I might add, has been the main goal of theirs since I started playing years ago.

If you haven't found balance by now then it simply doesn't exist. Or you're extremely bad at your job. They have continually spend time and resources working on balance while other parts of the game at best just remain ignored or worse damaging to the game's health. Now we're going through yet another round that will last x number of months only to be replaced by yet the next "solution".

Its time to face facts. Classes by definition are unbalanced because they aren't the same. Which is something they have toyed with and continue to skirt too close in my opinion. Personally, I think if they find themselves in a position where everyone is forced to one class for PvP it would actually be good for the game. Because at long last they will find balance and we can start improving this game overall.

Chilly-McFreeze

Dracane wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

But I will repeat what I have been saying for 4 years or so: Remove shieldstacking already. It is an obnoxious thing that has been going on for way too long. They kept on nerfing individual damage shields and made shield stacking only more essential for sorcerers who do not want to get one shotted.

This is a bit too facile for me. What about all those minor shields that are granted by others to me? Do they overwright my bigger own ward? Does my bigger ward prevent me from being buffed/ shielded by others? What about all those tiny wards that come from different sources? What's about hardening enchant, brawler, CP block ward?

And why should you be able to layer heals while I'm not able to layer shields?

Not those tiny passive wards. Only big ones like conjured ward, annulment and healing ward. I think attempting to cast or receive them while already having one active could simply result in them having no effect.

Sounds not exactly like what I want to experience. Using few k mag on healing ward, targeting a random warded person and doing absolutely nothing.

And why is it okay to layer a different sources of HoTs?

Iluvrien

D3N7157 wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Please read though all my points again, i don't understand how can you say this with a straight face.

Because it's true. Nerf sorc is a meme.

And all the nerfs people cry for, what do they achieve. Look how the long list of ward changes work out lol. From glass cannons to just a bit tankier with wards down thus reducing the window.

Sorcs are easy to take down, if you adapt. Same with any class really. Find their weakness.

But nerf sorc requests have been endless on this forum thus are hard to take seriously.

please try to kill a good sorcerer 1v1 on a full melee build hes just going to create gaps that you will waste
resources on closing and spamming you from range, i know nerfs are bad but they are necessary this time

Summary of OP: Please nerf all sorcs again because of (debatable) imbalances in PvP.

Response to OP: I only PvE, if you want nerfs in PvP then make them apply to PvP only. If you want nerfs to my character based on pressures that don't even exist in the part of the game I play... then no. Just. No.

D3N7157

Iluvrien wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Please read though all my points again, i don't understand how can you say this with a straight face.

Because it's true. Nerf sorc is a meme.

And all the nerfs people cry for, what do they achieve. Look how the long list of ward changes work out lol. From glass cannons to just a bit tankier with wards down thus reducing the window.

Sorcs are easy to take down, if you adapt. Same with any class really. Find their weakness.

But nerf sorc requests have been endless on this forum thus are hard to take seriously.

please try to kill a good sorcerer 1v1 on a full melee build hes just going to create gaps that you will waste
resources on closing and spamming you from range, i know nerfs are bad but they are necessary this time

Summary of OP: Please nerf all sorcs again because of (debatable) imbalances in PvP.

Response to OP: I only PvE, if you want nerfs in PvP then make them apply to PvP only. If you want nerfs to my character based on pressures that don't even exist in the part of the game I play... then no. Just. No.

How much of the mentioned toolkit you use in pve exactly? Please explain in deatail im curious now

Dracane

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

But I will repeat what I have been saying for 4 years or so: Remove shieldstacking already. It is an obnoxious thing that has been going on for way too long. They kept on nerfing individual damage shields and made shield stacking only more essential for sorcerers who do not want to get one shotted.

This is a bit too facile for me. What about all those minor shields that are granted by others to me? Do they overwright my bigger own ward? Does my bigger ward prevent me from being buffed/ shielded by others? What about all those tiny wards that come from different sources? What's about hardening enchant, brawler, CP block ward?

And why should you be able to layer heals while I'm not able to layer shields?

Not those tiny passive wards. Only big ones like conjured ward, annulment and healing ward. I think attempting to cast or receive them while already having one active could simply result in them having no effect.

Sounds not exactly like what I want to experience. Using few k mag on healing ward, targeting a random warded person and doing absolutely nothing.

And why is it okay to layer a different sources of HoTs?

But shieldstackers are the reason why this class is getting destroyed and rid of options every patch.
Who even likes this playstyle? Shields are extremely expensive and take alot more damage than health thanks to Shattering Blows. Everyone would profit if these strong counters are removed and single shields restored to a proper state.

Removing shieldstacking is a good cost to pay for this.

Chilly-McFreeze

Dracane wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

But I will repeat what I have been saying for 4 years or so: Remove shieldstacking already. It is an obnoxious thing that has been going on for way too long. They kept on nerfing individual damage shields and made shield stacking only more essential for sorcerers who do not want to get one shotted.

This is a bit too facile for me. What about all those minor shields that are granted by others to me? Do they overwright my bigger own ward? Does my bigger ward prevent me from being buffed/ shielded by others? What about all those tiny wards that come from different sources? What's about hardening enchant, brawler, CP block ward?

And why should you be able to layer heals while I'm not able to layer shields?

Not those tiny passive wards. Only big ones like conjured ward, annulment and healing ward. I think attempting to cast or receive them while already having one active could simply result in them having no effect.

Sounds not exactly like what I want to experience. Using few k mag on healing ward, targeting a random warded person and doing absolutely nothing.

And why is it okay to layer a different sources of HoTs?

But shieldstackers are the reason why this class is getting destroyed and rid of options every patch.
Who even likes this playstyle? Shields are extremely expensive and take alot more damage than health thanks to Shattering Blows. Everyone would profit if these strong counters are removed and single shields restored to a proper state.

Removing shieldstacking is a good cost to pay for this.

Fair enough. Then it should be tied to a bigger rebalance of the class kit than just denying shield stacking. But there are enough threads around about that topic.

Edit: Although I doubt it would keep the nerf herders from asking for more nerfs to e.g. pets, fury, bolt escape, conversion etc.

VaranisArano

D3N7157 wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Please read though all my points again, i don't understand how can you say this with a straight face.

Because it's true. Nerf sorc is a meme.

And all the nerfs people cry for, what do they achieve. Look how the long list of ward changes work out lol. From glass cannons to just a bit tankier with wards down thus reducing the window.

Sorcs are easy to take down, if you adapt. Same with any class really. Find their weakness.

But nerf sorc requests have been endless on this forum thus are hard to take seriously.

please try to kill a good sorcerer 1v1 on a full melee build hes just going to create gaps that you will waste
resources on closing and spamming you from range, i know nerfs are bad but they are necessary this time

Summary of OP: Please nerf all sorcs again because of (debatable) imbalances in PvP.

Response to OP: I only PvE, if you want nerfs in PvP then make them apply to PvP only. If you want nerfs to my character based on pressures that don't even exist in the part of the game I play... then no. Just. No.

How much of the mentioned toolkit you use in pve exactly? Please explain in deatail im curious now

Are you suggesting that Sorcs don't use their shield and Twilight Matriarch in PVE? They usually don't play full Zoo the way they do in PVP, but PetSorc is one of the main ways to play Sorc in PVE. I don't see Streak as much outside of resource farmers, but Sorc mains can correct me if I'm wrong.

Probably the most impactful changes would be the shield and Twilight. Its like you say "these let Sorcs survive in Combat vs several players" and then didn't think about their likely function in PVE at all...

Alucardo

Dracane wrote: »

I find other Sorcerer by very far the easiest class to kill

Of course a sorcerer main would start with that line.

The_Lex

There are many “urgent needs” in this game, but the content of your post isn’t one of them.

Dracane

Alucardo wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I find other Sorcerer by very far the easiest class to kill

Of course a sorcerer main would start with that line.

It is true for me. I find most light armor wearers easy to dispose of most of the time.
But I also said that I like that Sorcerers are easy to kill and I hope Sorcerer does not get buffed in any way. I like that I encounter few at the moment and hope it stays that way due to other classes being more attractive or efficient to most people.

Kadoin

D3N7157 wrote: »

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Please read though all my points again, i don't understand how can you say this with a straight face.

It's called disagreeing...

JanTanhide

No more nerfs. Give it a rest already.

Iluvrien

D3N7157 wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Please read though all my points again, i don't understand how can you say this with a straight face.

Because it's true. Nerf sorc is a meme.

And all the nerfs people cry for, what do they achieve. Look how the long list of ward changes work out lol. From glass cannons to just a bit tankier with wards down thus reducing the window.

Sorcs are easy to take down, if you adapt. Same with any class really. Find their weakness.

But nerf sorc requests have been endless on this forum thus are hard to take seriously.

please try to kill a good sorcerer 1v1 on a full melee build hes just going to create gaps that you will waste
resources on closing and spamming you from range, i know nerfs are bad but they are necessary this time

Summary of OP: Please nerf all sorcs again because of (debatable) imbalances in PvP.

Response to OP: I only PvE, if you want nerfs in PvP then make them apply to PvP only. If you want nerfs to my character based on pressures that don't even exist in the part of the game I play... then no. Just. No.

How much of the mentioned toolkit you use in pve exactly? Please explain in deatail im curious now

That isn't the question your OP is posing.

What you are asking is which bits of that toolkit are you intending for other people to give up?

Especially since you don't seem to be aware of which parts are actually used. Which seems odd, as you are literally asking for changes to the play style of other people.

D3N7157

Iluvrien wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Please read though all my points again, i don't understand how can you say this with a straight face.

Because it's true. Nerf sorc is a meme.

And all the nerfs people cry for, what do they achieve. Look how the long list of ward changes work out lol. From glass cannons to just a bit tankier with wards down thus reducing the window.

Sorcs are easy to take down, if you adapt. Same with any class really. Find their weakness.

But nerf sorc requests have been endless on this forum thus are hard to take seriously.

please try to kill a good sorcerer 1v1 on a full melee build hes just going to create gaps that you will waste
resources on closing and spamming you from range, i know nerfs are bad but they are necessary this time

Summary of OP: Please nerf all sorcs again because of (debatable) imbalances in PvP.

Response to OP: I only PvE, if you want nerfs in PvP then make them apply to PvP only. If you want nerfs to my character based on pressures that don't even exist in the part of the game I play... then no. Just. No.

How much of the mentioned toolkit you use in pve exactly? Please explain in deatail im curious now

That isn't the question your OP is posing.

What you are asking is which bits of that toolkit are you intending for other people to give up?

Especially since you don't seem to be aware of which parts are actually used. Which seems odd, as you are literally asking for changes to the play style of other people.

I'm a mag sorc player myself with a rank 50 sorc at that, and to precede accusations that are gonna happen in next half an hour it was not achieved by zerging and took almost 3 years to get I think sorceres have it too good compared to what other classes including ones i play
at the moment will be like soon. Still waiting for you to answer my question though...

Im preparing a thread with nerf suggestions (defile affecting shield size, matriarch scaling from spell dmg only and hitting 1 target, streak cost increase etc...) maybe you have some helpful ideas.

Katlefiya

D3N7157 wrote: »

I'm a mag sorc player myself with a rank 50 sorc at that, and to precede accusations that are gonna happen in next half an hour it was not achieved by zerging and took almost 3 years to get I think sorceres have it too good compared to what other classes including ones i play at the moment will be like soon. Still waiting for you to answer my question though...

You need 3 years and still think sorcs deserve more nerfs?

Iluvrien

D3N7157 wrote: »

Im preparing a thread with nerf suggestions (defile affecting shield size, matriarch scaling from spell dmg only and hitting 1 target, streak cost increase etc...) maybe you have some helpful ideas.

You don't seem to get it. My first post contained my helpful idea.

Don't do this in a way that will affect PvE in any way shape or form.

Or, given some of the responses from what seems to be other PvP players, just don't do it at all.

Universe

Dracane

D3N7157 wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Please read though all my points again, i don't understand how can you say this with a straight face.

Because it's true. Nerf sorc is a meme.

And all the nerfs people cry for, what do they achieve. Look how the long list of ward changes work out lol. From glass cannons to just a bit tankier with wards down thus reducing the window.

Sorcs are easy to take down, if you adapt. Same with any class really. Find their weakness.

But nerf sorc requests have been endless on this forum thus are hard to take seriously.

please try to kill a good sorcerer 1v1 on a full melee build hes just going to create gaps that you will waste
resources on closing and spamming you from range, i know nerfs are bad but they are necessary this time

Summary of OP: Please nerf all sorcs again because of (debatable) imbalances in PvP.

Response to OP: I only PvE, if you want nerfs in PvP then make them apply to PvP only. If you want nerfs to my character based on pressures that don't even exist in the part of the game I play... then no. Just. No.

How much of the mentioned toolkit you use in pve exactly? Please explain in deatail im curious now

That isn't the question your OP is posing.

What you are asking is which bits of that toolkit are you intending for other people to give up?

Especially since you don't seem to be aware of which parts are actually used. Which seems odd, as you are literally asking for changes to the play style of other people.

I'm a mag sorc player myself with a rank 50 sorc at that, and to precede accusations that are gonna happen in next half an hour it was not achieved by zerging and took almost 3 years to get I think sorceres have it too good compared to what other classes including ones i play
at the moment will be like soon. Still waiting for you to answer my question though...

Im preparing a thread with nerf suggestions (defile affecting shield size, matriarch scaling from spell dmg only and hitting 1 target, streak cost increase etc...) maybe you have some helpful ideas.

Is that so? Then why would Warden and Necromancer be meta? Tanking everyone and still insta bursting everyone? The only good thing and the only thing that sorcerer has better than other classes, is bolt escape. And only because the nerfs it received have finally been lifted a bit.

Sorcerer has nothing good or extraordinary left. Everything is okay and fits the class well, but it is not better or even greatly competitive with what other classes have.

Generally I feel that no class can really come close to the pay to win classes when it comes to how well thought out and rounded they are.

zvavi

D3N7157 wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Please read though all my points again, i don't understand how can you say this with a straight face.

Because it's true. Nerf sorc is a meme.

And all the nerfs people cry for, what do they achieve. Look how the long list of ward changes work out lol. From glass cannons to just a bit tankier with wards down thus reducing the window.

Sorcs are easy to take down, if you adapt. Same with any class really. Find their weakness.

But nerf sorc requests have been endless on this forum thus are hard to take seriously.

please try to kill a good sorcerer 1v1 on a full melee build hes just going to create gaps that you will waste
resources on closing and spamming you from range, i know nerfs are bad but they are necessary this time

Summary of OP: Please nerf all sorcs again because of (debatable) imbalances in PvP.

Response to OP: I only PvE, if you want nerfs in PvP then make them apply to PvP only. If you want nerfs to my character based on pressures that don't even exist in the part of the game I play... then no. Just. No.

How much of the mentioned toolkit you use in pve exactly? Please explain in deatail im curious now

I used to use shields on full tank setup in pve.
@CreepyPahuska did so as well. It was fine for my sorc that had 64 in mag that I tanked on occasionally (my first vMoS and vFL challengers are from then) since then...it was nerfed. And nerfed. And nerfed. And I stopped using it.

Chilly-McFreeze

D3N7157 wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

D3N7157 wrote: »

Anhedonie wrote: »

Damage shields were a mistake.

But tbh I don't think sorcs need another nerf. This is becoming a meme at this point.

Please read though all my points again, i don't understand how can you say this with a straight face.

Because it's true. Nerf sorc is a meme.

And all the nerfs people cry for, what do they achieve. Look how the long list of ward changes work out lol. From glass cannons to just a bit tankier with wards down thus reducing the window.

Sorcs are easy to take down, if you adapt. Same with any class really. Find their weakness.

But nerf sorc requests have been endless on this forum thus are hard to take seriously.

please try to kill a good sorcerer 1v1 on a full melee build hes just going to create gaps that you will waste
resources on closing and spamming you from range, i know nerfs are bad but they are necessary this time

Summary of OP: Please nerf all sorcs again because of (debatable) imbalances in PvP.

Response to OP: I only PvE, if you want nerfs in PvP then make them apply to PvP only. If you want nerfs to my character based on pressures that don't even exist in the part of the game I play... then no. Just. No.

How much of the mentioned toolkit you use in pve exactly? Please explain in deatail im curious now

That isn't the question your OP is posing.

What you are asking is which bits of that toolkit are you intending for other people to give up?

Especially since you don't seem to be aware of which parts are actually used. Which seems odd, as you are literally asking for changes to the play style of other people.

Im preparing a thread with nerf suggestions (defile affecting shield size, matriarch scaling from spell dmg only and hitting 1 target, streak cost increase etc...) maybe you have some helpful ideas.

I‘m sure you consider the Effect of your nerf Proposals on stamsorcs and non-pet builds, right?