Unkillable PvP characters who still do high damage

DelosTheta

I have given PvP and honest try, and sometimes I enjoy it, but today ...

I was in a battle at Bleaker's outpost with three UNKILLABLE Pact members. At one point three of us were trying to kill just one of them. We never got to below 50% health on her. That's THREE people. In turn, I got killed three times.

Don't answer this with L2P. Don't answer this with let me see your build. Other people have asked the question, how are some people both DPS and tanky at the same time. I can see I'm doing damage, but somehow, they apparently have enough resources to continuously heal themselves the entire time, while attacking full time. That makes no sense. They're called resources, and resources are traditionally limited.

Oh, once her two buddies showed up, a full assault by four people and some siege weapons still couldn't get them below 80% health.

I guess the best siege engine turns out to be banging your head against a wall, eh?

DelosTheta

And it wasn't lag, before that old blame magnet turns up.

Casul

What class were they, what class were you?

DelosTheta

I think she was a DK, and I was a DK. I was completely unable to petrify her. Two others from my side were Necromancer, and ... don't know the other, could have been Hong Kong Phooie for all that I could tell. But the Necromancer's pet spook at least healed me.

WreckfulAbandon

Because numbers should always win out regardless of what they're doing, amirite?

technohic

Well if we cant ask about builds, then what do you expect to be told here? Need more details on whats going on as far as loadouts and abilities. I mean; could you recognize what abilities they were using since you both are DKs?

grkkll

Normal or cp? I guess on normal distribution can make a difference....but not that much
I'm pretty new to pvp, been playing for 4 weeks or so at level 250, always on non cp. I've often wondered how what appear to be elite players can do this and all I can come up with is their system performance. They seem to be able to get 4 killing shots in while I can get 2 if I'm lucky. I hope to get out of the zergling rut eventually

HankTwo

DelosTheta wrote: »

Don't answer this with let me see your build.

DelosTheta wrote: »

Env_t wrote: »

@DelosTheta
L2P, casual

Asking a question as part of learning, and if you went to so much trouble to make an answer to this post, it could at least have been a useful one.

Well, this is a bit of a contradiction. Build plays a big role in how players perform in PvP. If you are asking because you want to learn and improve, why exclude that?

On topic, I don't really get why people have such issues with this. So you weren't able to 3v1 kill someone and lost the 4v3 afterwards. Why not simply accept that those players might:
a) be far better than you and your allies in this fight (skill still plays a huge role in this game)
and/or
b) have far better builds (and by that I don't even mean some secret mumbo jumbo set combination. Most veteran PvPers can easily defeat newer players with a simple max stat build, even when to a degree outnumbered. From what I've seen newbies often have pretty horrible builds. There is nothing wrong with that per se, but they shouldn't expect to kill any serious PvPer with it)

Big advantage of the eso system is that you can create well rounded builds and playstyles where you can have decent damage, self healing, sustain and tankyness in one (but not without sacrifices! A well rounded build will never have the damage of a glass cannon bomber for example). This enables good solo and small scale gameplay, which would otherwise be impossible. Why not try to create one such build yourself and be one of those "unkillable PvP characters who still do high damage"? Because, you know, what for you right now looks like unkillable and high damage, will look to a veteran PvPer just like decent tankyness and decent damage. It's seriously nothing special, but it will require time and dedication to get to that level.

Rikumaru

A: They are good players.
B: They have better builds than you.

It would be a terrible game if all it took to win was to bring more players than the enemy.

TheFM

Oh you think its bad now, wait till our light attacks hit like a wet noodle and all tank builds get buffed with absurd heavy attacks.

Thats what we have to look forward to.

CompM4s

Cant help if you wont share build

PizzaCat82

Rikumaru wrote: »

A: They are good players.
B: They have better builds than you.

It would be a terrible game if all it took to win was to bring more players than the enemy.

It is a terrible game because you need a zerg to kill players like this.

Most people in Cyro who aren't 1337 PVPers with XxXxXx_SNIPERKILLSHOT_XxXxXxXxXx gamer tags are looking for groups so they don't have to run into this mess every 5 minutes.

ZarkingFrued

DelosTheta wrote: »

I have given PvP and honest try, and sometimes I enjoy it, but today ...

I was in a battle at Bleaker's outpost with three UNKILLABLE Pact members. At one point three of us were trying to kill just one of them. We never got to below 50% health on her. That's THREE people. In turn, I got killed three times.

Don't answer this with L2P. Don't answer this with let me see your build. Other people have asked the question, how are some people both DPS and tanky at the same time. I can see I'm doing damage, but somehow, they apparently have enough resources to continuously heal themselves the entire time, while attacking full time. That makes no sense. They're called resources, and resources are traditionally limited.

Oh, once her two buddies showed up, a full assault by four people and some siege weapons still couldn't get them below 80% health.

I guess the best siege engine turns out to be banging your head against a wall, eh?

Do you think you should be able to kill players who have pvped 40 hours a week for 6 years when your claim is "I've given PvP and honest try"? It's obvious you don't want to know why they could do this, you stated don't ask about your build, don't suggest L2p, don't say anything other than they are cheating somehow. If you know how to manage resources, build for a balanced pvp experience, and combo you can do this. It's easy. But you gotta understand the game, and PvP to do it. That takes years for most people. Not just understand, literally know each aspect of PvP to the point where you know what is gonna come next, and exactly how long you can extend yourself before you have to go back to healing yourself and dealing with the incoming assault.

ZarkingFrued

Here is my question, why did attempt to kill one player with 3? Why did you keep coming back? I don't attack people that are already engaged in combat, I don't think that's fair. Yet I'm constantly verbally assaulted by people who are mad that I killed them and their friends who were clearly playing unfairly by outnumbering me. It's not my fault I enjoy ESO PvP, and know how to use my skills in combination with terrain and other players bad decisions to win fights where I get attacked by multiple players at once. Bottom line, if you're attacking one player with multiple, you shouldn't claim they were the ones being unfair.

Casul

DK is very high healing. Perhaps you should build some anti healing. The necromancer should have major from blastbones assuming they are stamina. Minor would be beneficial as well as maybe borrowed time for the healing absorption.

Kadoin

DelosTheta wrote: »

I have given PvP and honest try, and sometimes I enjoy it, but today ...

I was in a battle at Bleaker's outpost with three UNKILLABLE Pact members. At one point three of us were trying to kill just one of them. We never got to below 50% health on her. That's THREE people. In turn, I got killed three times.

Don't answer this with L2P. Don't answer this with let me see your build. Other people have asked the question, how are some people both DPS and tanky at the same time. I can see I'm doing damage, but somehow, they apparently have enough resources to continuously heal themselves the entire time, while attacking full time. That makes no sense. They're called resources, and resources are traditionally limited.

Oh, once her two buddies showed up, a full assault by four people and some siege weapons still couldn't get them below 80% health.

I guess the best siege engine turns out to be banging your head against a wall, eh?

Sorry, it wasn't me! The secret is the block button, passive damage reduction, and HoTs (healing is tied to damage).

The other secret is knowing when to light + heavy combo on people to do over 15k damage instantly without an ult. Timing immobolize, snares, and off-balance has and always will given a huge edge when outnumbered.

What you saw was a player not dying, but what I the player was doing was simply observing you until you have an opening and then you die. It's that simple. If you build your build in a way that you can be strong when 100 percent defensive, and strong when 100 percent offensive and have the skill to use it, it will always be strong. Though once you have the skill to do that, your performance in PvP becomes set agnostic. It won't really matter what you use unless you are facing a zerg.

Also, it's not a good idea to gang up on a lady! Looks like you learned that the hard way...

PizzaCat82

Duel DKs and see what they're using to be as tanky. Eventually you'll be able to handle 3-4 people.

Maybe the devs will bring back casual pvp and having groups matter more.. Until then the only way is to zerg. (and crash the servers)

ZarkingFrued

Now if you really are interested in learning how to be that good? Don't try to use setups for tankiness, this lowers your damage output. You should deal with incoming damage through healing and proper movement.
Walk through templar channels, kite out melee builds, stay on top of ranged players, get behind something when you're standing in front of 3 people. Pop vigor or a shield BEFORE you start a combo, not in response to damage you've just been dealt. Burst heals are for that, HOTs and shields are for preventing damage. Most importantly, build for the PvP situation. High crit resist because crits destroy you otherwise, past that you need the damage to put players down for good. Anyone can heal up extremely fast now, so you can't kill someone by chunking away at them. You have to attack with a purpose, you have to burst them down fast enough that they're not going to just heal right back up. That means consider what using 3 different skills in a row will do to a player rather than just spamming skills with no purpose. Time blastbones to hit exactly the same time your Ulti does for example. This gives you a reason to use an execute after as that double burst just lowered them to a lower health threshold. I can assure you that it's entirely possible to kill those players, but if you are not as consistent as they are with your rotation of skills, they will win in the end. They don't get caught up in a fight, they remain consistent. Record the fights, and look back with an open mind on your errors. You will find you forgot to rebuff, or when your health dropped you had plenty of time to heal, but you simply forgot to as you were attempting to deal damage at that time. I do it all the time.

Iskiab

Kadoin wrote: »

DelosTheta wrote: »

I have given PvP and honest try, and sometimes I enjoy it, but today ...

I was in a battle at Bleaker's outpost with three UNKILLABLE Pact members. At one point three of us were trying to kill just one of them. We never got to below 50% health on her. That's THREE people. In turn, I got killed three times.

Don't answer this with L2P. Don't answer this with let me see your build. Other people have asked the question, how are some people both DPS and tanky at the same time. I can see I'm doing damage, but somehow, they apparently have enough resources to continuously heal themselves the entire time, while attacking full time. That makes no sense. They're called resources, and resources are traditionally limited.

Oh, once her two buddies showed up, a full assault by four people and some siege weapons still couldn't get them below 80% health.

I guess the best siege engine turns out to be banging your head against a wall, eh?

Sorry, it wasn't me! The secret is the block button, passive damage reduction, and HoTs (healing is tied to damage).

The other secret is knowing when to light + heavy combo on people to do over 15k damage instantly without an ult. Timing immobolize, snares, and off-balance has and always will given a huge edge when outnumbered.

What you saw was a player not dying, but what I the player was doing was simply observing you until you have an opening and then you die. It's that simple. If you build your build in a way that you can be strong when 100 percent defensive, and strong when 100 percent offensive and have the skill to use it, it will always be strong. Though once you have the skill to do that, your performance in PvP becomes set agnostic. It won't really matter what you use unless you are facing a zerg.

Also, it's not a good idea to gang up on a lady! Looks like you learned that the hard way...

This is a good answer for why stuff like this is so common. Most players make a series of bad choices in their builds so they can ‘kill someone’ until they’re almost free AP. No defense, low health, terrible healing.

Above average pvpers in cyrodiil use S&B back bar and are overly defensive. Your average player doesn’t play defensive or heal themselves enough, to the point where playing tanky is easy mode to farm average players.

The best players aren’t tanky at all, they play normal builds that give them enough defense to survive and good offense because they have their burst combo down. They farm the S&B types.

That’s ESO pvp in a nutshell.

ArchMikem

Offensive weapon front bar, Sword & Shield defensive back bar. I don't know the specific builds but that's always the bar layout and they always tank and out heal everything done to them, then bar swap, turn around and burst their attackers like nothing.

This is why I snipe and crystal frags from range. Once they decide to do the turn around and charge part of their routine I'm out.

Fur_like_snow

This happens everyday in PvP so don’t sweat it. Think of Cyrodiil/BGs as just a fun little extra part of the game. Keep your chin up champ.

Scarkii

Was it Avaira?

Sergykid

that's normal in CP pvp. No CP pvp still has its unkillable tanks with high damage, but it's by far not as awful as in CP pvp

xXMeowMeowXx

You need to give more info but it sounds to me that you are not that experienced yet in ESO PvP. That’s not a bad thing if you don’t give up. It just means you have more to learn.

That way you can understand how to put together decent builds and more importantly be able to play them efficiently. You will find that you will always have flex spots and through playing against other players the things you can improve.

I understand you are frustrated but I have played since beta and have not left game in all that time. Many players have played this long in PvP, as well. Some players continue to learn and progress while others do not. You have to adapt and keep learning for this game, no matter how great you are.

Also, If you rage while playing or get nervous, you’re going to make mistakes.

It really comes down to the most important thing, which is are you having fun....? That is all that really matters in the end.

If so, is it enough for you to stop blaming your experience on others and take the initiative to become a better player....or not

That choice is up to you if you want to invest the time and effort.

If you were on a DK I don’t see you in a position to complain. They are a really good class in PvP rn and fun to play.

Best of luck

And no one is unkillable in PvP that does good damage.

Even with the exception of **Cal but he can’t kill anyone and is the kind of players that we need {non-toxic}.

ZOS_Volpe

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Icy_Waffles

Rikumaru wrote: »

A: They are good players.
B: They have better builds than you.

It would be a terrible game if all it took to win was to bring more players than the enemy.

This. Lol my goodness. Not wanting to post your build?

Stebarnz

Ye ive had many many messages of people who dont know anything about this game accusing me of scripts and hacks and cheat engine.

Just learn things about the game you play, its really not that hard.

Current state of game however lag, desyncs, skill delays and bugs are the killer.

Grymmoire

Think it is difficult to kill one Dk, try two that use Guard and rotate Take Flight ha ha.

Dusk_Coven

PizzaCat82 wrote: »

Rikumaru wrote: »

A: They are good players.
B: They have better builds than you.

It would be a terrible game if all it took to win was to bring more players than the enemy.

It is a terrible game because you need a zerg to kill players like this.

Most people in Cyro who aren't 1337 PVPers with XxXxXx_SNIPERKILLSHOT_XxXxXxXxXx gamer tags are looking for groups so they don't have to run into this mess every 5 minutes.

Why is anyone surprised by this? It is an inevitable result of a game that allows freeform builds and a wide range of skill and gear options, none of which can be easily managed because you have different PvP environments.
Brought to you by short-sighted devs who just add a PvP option into their game without an actual plan for PvP management. Hell, they're still trying to nail down combat, much less combat in a specific mode.

LeHarrt91

I know the reason that some people are unkillable for me is because my skills do not work.

scottii

ez answer. small group builds. i run them all the time with my crew. the reason why it's a struggle is mainly because there players who are not fine-tuned for pvp. pvp is completely different from pve, and you'll be surprised how many people do not know this. going back to the pvp event a few weeks ago, this is quite obvious. at the time, i could two shot most players. two dizzy swings would seal the deal. on the contrary, many pvp players who go into pve, may struggle. just think of it as a way of diversity that separate the two different game modes. it's something very nice to have as each has a learning curve.

i'm not saying my build god mode, as it has it's counter. all builds do. just thinking of these players you mentioned, i know exactly what would counter them. leap into a harmony gravity crush would do them in. keep in mind, these players are most likely communicating in comes against a zerg of players who are just typing to each other and not coordinating.