‘Veterans’ need to calm down

proteinexe

Here comes the bashing.

Honestly, how are you like this? You’re so quick to jump at Developers throats without even giving what they have a chance.

I came back to ESO from a 3 month break to help 3 brand new players.
Seeing them play is SO refreshing and rewarding. I’m helping them, giving them small hints of advice, watching them quest and be enthusiastic about the game. One wants to focus on PvP while the other PvE, they feel like my ESO babies.. then I come to forum and see this. [snip]

[snip]

[snip]

and honestly, i’ve read every bashing thread so if you’re gonna rinse and repeat the same material in the comments then i’ll reply with a

[Edit for bait.]

Rikumaru

[snip] The game is completely broken after the last patch where the devs are actively trying to work against the skilled playerbase and now they hit us up with a PTS where the intent behind the changes is to nerf skilled players further and you wonder why people are quick to complain? Not to mention the years and years of homogenising and nerfing classes down to the point where they have lost almost all of their identity.

[Edit for bait.]

InaMoonlight

^ Yes.

proteinexe

Rikumaru wrote: »

Nice bait, but ill bite for you. The game is completely broken after the last patch where the devs are actively trying to work against the skilled playerbase and now they hit us up with a PTS where the intent behind the changes is to nerf skilled players further and you wonder why people are quick to complain? Not to mention the years and years of homogenising and nerfing classes down to the point where they have lost almost all of their identity.

Kynetik

@Rikumaru is right on the money

Alienoutlaw

as a 4yr "veteran" of the game (both console & PC) i have seen the game change a lot, not always for the better but the changes being tested at the mo on PTS are going to be good overall for the game, it will help those players who cant (for whatever reason) get to grips with A/C or simply choose not to do it, the HUGE gap between the min/max DPS will close dramatically and put new players on an equal or almost level playing ground, those that suffer from huge lag due to country location will no longer get melted in PvP because someone fires off 5 skills before they can react, i'm not saying it will cure everything but these new ideas will certainly help, and i am all for it.

LordSarevok

Man you are so right OP! How dare these "veterans" who have been with the game from the beginning, spent hundreds, if not thousands of dollars supporting this game and devs, be upset! The audacity of them! I mean it's not like they helped keep the lights on for your 3 month break, and funded the game for the new people to enjoy by playing and supporting it...

proteinexe

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

as a 4yr "veteran" of the game (both console & PC) i have seen the game change a lot, not always for the better but the changes being tested at the mo on PTS are going to be good overall for the game, it will help those players who cant (for whatever reason) get to grips with A/C or simply choose not to do it, the HUGE gap between the min/max DPS will close dramatically and put new players on an equal or almost level playing ground, those that suffer from huge lag due to country location will no longer get melted in PvP because someone fires off 5 skills before they can react, i'm not saying it will cure everything but these new ideas will certainly help, and i am all for it.

Hello? Someone with some logic and reason in this [snip]

Hop on my boat of hope good sir before the [snip] pull you to the depths

[Edit for bait.]

proteinexe

LordSarevok wrote: »

Man you are so right OP! How dare these "veterans" who have been with the game from the beginning, spent hundreds, if not thousands of dollars supporting this game and devs, be upset! The audacity of them! I mean it's not like they helped keep the lights on for your 3 month break, and funded the game for the new people to enjoy by playing and supporting it...

Sanctum74

Love when people whine in threads complaining about people whining, lol hypocrite much?

Alienoutlaw

Rikumaru wrote: »

[snip] The game is completely broken after the last patch where the devs are actively trying to work against the skilled playerbase and now they hit us up with a PTS where the intent behind the changes is to nerf skilled players further and you wonder why people are quick to complain? Not to mention the years and years of homogenising and nerfing classes down to the point where they have lost almost all of their identity.

[Edit for bait.]

if players are truly that skilled they will rise above and continue to be skilled, i remember when the "end game" content dps was 40k and we managed just fine to complete things, we dont need 80-100k dps requirements to complete things nor should we expect new players to.

proteinexe

Sanctum74 wrote: »

Love when people whine in threads complaining about people whining, lol hypocrite much?

Touché - for this, you get a

GeorgeBlack

I like how some of them used to say iduring other changes "l2p, the good will adapt, the scrubs will keep being scrubs"

Well I say now: accept the changes or git gud.

I like the fact that normal atks might gain functions.

SeaGtGruff

LordSarevok wrote: »

I mean it's not like they helped keep the lights on for your 3 month break, and funded the game for the new people to enjoy by playing and supporting it...

Which ones are they, the ones who've posted ad nauseum about how they've cancelled their ESO+ subscriptions and who've tried to encourage others to do the same?

MusCanus

proteinexe wrote: »

"Happy as a pig in ***" has never been so literal.

Zotami

InaMoonlight wrote: »

^ Yes.

Time to go play D2 again.

proteinexe

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

LordSarevok wrote: »

I mean it's not like they helped keep the lights on for your 3 month break, and funded the game for the new people to enjoy by playing and supporting it...

Which ones are they, the ones who've posted ad nauseum about how they've cancelled their ESO+ subscriptions and who've tried to encourage others to do the same?

Just wanna say, I didnt cancel my membership. Also @SeaGtGruff spot on. These jokers out here tryna start an unsub chain cos they didnt get their own way which is shared by 4% of the playerbase. Everyone out here complaining for something.

proteinexe

Zotami wrote: »

InaMoonlight wrote: »

^ Yes.

Time to go play D2 again.

Dry game imo, PvP is stale and PvE is point and click adventure

zvavi

ShawnLaRock

Pessimism for it’s own sake, is never the answer - but even at my own skill / interest / intent - I respect the Vets, and even if I haven’t quite got to that level yet (only 2+ years)... can clearly understand the math, and subsequent effects all of these changes have.

I am watching a super-sweaty stream ATM about the new sustain changes on the PTS... and it makes me worried for the homogenization of this game that I love so much.

Light Attack Tenacity, anyone!?! Ugh. :$

S.

HalvarIronfist

proteinexe wrote: »

Here comes the bashing.

Honestly, how are you like this? You’re so quick to jump at Developers throats without even giving what they have a chance.

I came back to ESO from a 3 month break to help 3 brand new players.
Seeing them play is SO refreshing and rewarding. I’m helping them, giving them small hints of advice, watching them quest and be enthusiastic about the game. One wants to focus on PvP while the other PvE, they feel like my ESO babies.. then I come to forum and see this. It can be summed up as; sour salty veterans who have no more compassion or enthusiasm for the game yet come and bash on the forums.

Maybe it is time for a change, maybe the depressing pessimistic veterans need to find another game and let these new enthusiastic players take over.

I know you’ve been treated badly (loosely) but for *** sake, if you’ve come on here to get your fix of bashing the devs, then get lost zzz

and honestly, i’ve read every bashing thread so if you’re gonna rinse and repeat the same material in the comments then i’ll reply with a

ESO is a nicer community when it comes to the terms of Developer feedback, (Out of many games I've been invested into.)

But, honestly? The type of changes we've been seeing with this combat team are profoundly idiotic. For example; lets remind everyone of the DOT meta. Everything "had" to be buffed, according to ZOS. As if nobody told them this would be overperforming, they suddenly figured that out by the next patch, and then first nerfed DOTS BELOW what they were ORIGINALLY at before the FIRST PATCH.

The sledgehammer approach the combat team is currently taking towards features, Ridiculous nerfing and buffing of things by exorbitant levels simply as wanton experiments that they don't conduct in private, but rather quickly force through PTS and force onto live (Seemingly REGARDLESS of player feedback on quite a few occasions.)

The rest of the game, I have two major quips with. The lack of communication in the form of decisions. So to say, (Using a hypothetical) ZOS wants to delete everyone's gold and start over with a new sort of currency. What would players expect as a explanation? Something completely devoid of any rationality and a major lack of foresight.

(For an example, think about multibidding. I never met a soul that supported it, including myself as a medium sized trade guild GM) We warned ZOS it wasn't a good idea, and as far as I'm concerned, its still pretty stupid. Small and medium guilds are the most heavily effected, as we can almost be pushed away by any larger guilds if they fail to acquire the main spots they wanted. Or for the gold troubles that happened afterwards with duped gold on PC-EU, and some on PC-NA.

Or, for one more example; think about the recent solo queue change to battlegrounds. Pushing a change like this has come with consequences from the playerbase I doubt ZOS even valued to take into account. I personally played anywhere from solo up to a full premade, and you know what? It's pretty disappointing that a few people crying about being beat by organized groups (Huh, how unexpected.) was able to ruin many other players experiences and ability to play with their friends and guild. Granted this an MMO, I don't see why if this queue was REQUIRED, that there weren't group queues added.


I love ESO, I play it constantly. I want the best for the game both as a player, and as a GM so that my guilds can continue to do well. But I've had plenty of discussions with people who quit playing due to stupid changes to combat, or to the game in general that they didn't like.

Now, I look at the purposed light attack changes and I'm absolutely baffled. What the hell? I don't care about this, I want the game to perform better, I want combat to not feel clunky and homogenized. I want improvements. Not wanton sledgehammer attacks to random game features because it seems like theres a clear lack of direction. (Especially with the combat team, IMO).

Sure; people will word this argument differently, or even more rudely towards the devs, but that is the jist of it as far as I'm concerned.

InaMoonlight

Rikumaru wrote: »

Nice bait, but ill bite for you. The game is completely broken after the last patch where the devs are actively trying to work against the skilled playerbase and now they hit us up with a PTS where the intent behind the changes is to nerf skilled players further and you wonder why people are quick to complain? Not to mention the years and years of homogenising and nerfing classes down to the point where they have lost almost all of their identity.

Sanctum74 wrote: »

Love when people whine in threads complaining about people whining, lol hypocrite much?

Especially when people think they're whining about people whining about people whining in the forums. Instead of considering this is not a not-use-razor you're paying for but a game in rapid and eternal growth.

Want a done game? Toodles.

Want a rapidly growing, ever expanding, pulsing life-beat game, support it and help it get there.

This is not Ludo you're paying for. This is evolution, in good and bad.

Starlock

proteinexe wrote: »

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

as a 4yr "veteran" of the game (both console & PC) i have seen the game change a lot, not always for the better but the changes being tested at the mo on PTS are going to be good overall for the game, it will help those players who cant (for whatever reason) get to grips with A/C or simply choose not to do it, the HUGE gap between the min/max DPS will close dramatically and put new players on an equal or almost level playing ground, those that suffer from huge lag due to country location will no longer get melted in PvP because someone fires off 5 skills before they can react, i'm not saying it will cure everything but these new ideas will certainly help, and i am all for it.

Hello? Someone with some logic and reason in this sea of salt?

Hop on my boat of hope good sir before the pessimists pull you to the depths

Got room for one more?



In seriousness, though, I'll levy criticism at the publisher and developer on certain issues. Game mechanics rarely fall on that list for me because frankly, the combat isn't why I play this game in the first place. It's decent, but it often stands in the way of my creativity rather than facilitating it - especially when I want to continue to be creative *and* also do certain types of content. I find an acceptable meeting point between those two desires, but it has meant writing off participating in certain game activities because of the DPS chasms that exist in this game currently. Whether or not the changes mean I won't have to write those activities off anymore remains to be seen. I'm not that interested in competitive gaming as a general rule anyway these days, but... well... if these changes made PvP less stupid in terms of disparities I would actually find it pretty fun.

scottii

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

as a 4yr "veteran" of the game (both console & PC) i have seen the game change a lot, not always for the better but the changes being tested at the mo on PTS are going to be good overall for the game, it will help those players who cant (for whatever reason) get to grips with A/C or simply choose not to do it, the HUGE gap between the min/max DPS will close dramatically and put new players on an equal or almost level playing ground, those that suffer from huge lag due to country location will no longer get melted in PvP because someone fires off 5 skills before they can react, i'm not saying it will cure everything but these new ideas will certainly help, and i am all for it.

i guess everyone deserves a participation trophy. let's cater to a system where there is little difference between a skilled players and someone new to the game.

that's not how games are supposed to function towards "endgame" content. i get being open to a new play style, but some of the mechanics will eliminate the need for resource sustain as a whole.

an example of "easy combat" is guild war 1. within one week a new player could go from start to endgame content. if combat becomes too easy, your players base will decrease drastically. if anything, veteran player feedback should be highly considered as necessary for a target baseline.

for now, the priority should be to fix issues that have remained for also a year, along with the new issues introduced n the recent patch.

InaMoonlight

Zotami wrote: »

InaMoonlight wrote: »

^ Yes.

Time to go play D2 again.

Never, Don't know about ya'll. But I'm home, and home is home is home, even if the roof leaks a little once in a while - out with the bucket, and try to help patch it!

Lab3360

LordSarevok wrote: »

Man you are so right OP! How dare these "veterans" who have been with the game from the beginning, spent hundreds, if not thousands of dollars supporting this game and devs, be upset! The audacity of them! I mean it's not like they helped keep the lights on for your 3 month break, and funded the game for the new people to enjoy by playing and supporting it...

Ikr?!

Total crock of horsesht!!
I said the light attack change made years ago was a bad idea.

Now, you want to go back after years people have put into light attack build weaving?

You people there at Zos have no clue what you're doing.

I told you so

Kalante

proteinexe wrote: »

Here comes the bashing.

Honestly, how are you like this? You’re so quick to jump at Developers throats without even giving what they have a chance.

I came back to ESO from a 3 month break to help 3 brand new players.
Seeing them play is SO refreshing and rewarding. I’m helping them, giving them small hints of advice, watching them quest and be enthusiastic about the game. One wants to focus on PvP while the other PvE, they feel like my ESO babies.. then I come to forum and see this. It can be summed up as; sour salty veterans who have no more compassion or enthusiasm for the game yet come and bash on the forums.

Maybe it is time for a change, maybe the depressing pessimistic veterans need to find another game and let these new enthusiastic players take over.

I know you’ve been treated badly (loosely) but for *** sake, if you’ve come on here to get your fix of bashing the devs, then get lost zzz

and honestly, i’ve read every bashing thread so if you’re gonna rinse and repeat the same material in the comments then i’ll reply with a

So how is one of your eso babies doing in pvp? Can they cast any skills or is still light attacking and getting one shotted? otherswise he/she is gonna come to the forums and QQ about how they need to nerf good players like zos is doing right now.

Erelah

LordSarevok wrote: »

Man you are so right OP! How dare these "veterans" who have been with the game from the beginning, spent hundreds, if not thousands of dollars supporting this game and devs, be upset! The audacity of them! I mean it's not like they helped keep the lights on for your 3 month break, and funded the game for the new people to enjoy by playing and supporting it...

I played the game since the start. LA weaving is not difficult. I can pull decent combat numbers, hold my own in PVP as well as vet dungeons and trails. That said I like playing with my family members. They aren't great in PVE on vet are fodder for PVP and this will make it more fun for them. That will make it more fun us to run content that they would not be able to compete.

This game is not dark souls online, never was, and never will be. Allowing more players to be able to complete the content will hopefully mean more fun dungeons with great story lines (as more people will purchase them). Also to be fair if someone wants to talk about being a skilled player then the skill is being able to play through the mechanics vs DPS checks being the only way through. I will admit it the 1000th time playing a dungeon has made me want to burn through everything rather than play it as well.

proteinexe

Kalante wrote: »

So how is one of your eso babies doing in pvp? Can they cast any skills or is still light attacking and getting one shotted? otherswise he/she is gonna come to the forums and QQ about how they need to nerf good players like zos is doing right now.

He’s doing great. He enjoys using combos and learning how his skills can help others.

InaMoonlight

Nothing is static. And if this game ever fixed all bugs paying with no more "risky updates" MOST of us would be gone, even those busy practicing being an entitled brat in the middle of a pandemic. Even when it wasnt there, HELLO!? You did sign up for a frequently updated, living being of a game, worts and all nuh?

But when the evolution doesn't change in your specific favor, or reacts differently on each server, or the game got more popular than expected. You want a DONE polished product?

That will NEVER happen in a game that actually grows, lives. Want a done product - there's plenty!

And somehow doubt waving your lil bundle around, screaming at devs, or demanding ANYTHING is gonna make them want to change the game in your favor.

"WE have corona epidemic, we want an event, more exp, and free access to crown store cause now we have to play it more, and you're ofc immune to corona other ripple effect, GIVE US IT ALL.... oh and hope you survive btw"

WE WANT FIX NOW - please do kill your entire family,yourself and business, cause...


We're all quarantined, or risking it!! Even them! You might be bored at home, and an entitled little old brat that thinks you buy a done product (did you read anythiiiiiiing along the way), but they're in it too! CHILL YO PANTS!

proteinexe

InaMoonlight wrote: »

^ Yes.
Never, Don't know about ya'll. But I'm home, and home is home is home, even if the roof leaks a little once in a while - out with the bucket, and try to help patch it!

I respect this. Understanding of the situation but sticking with it and not outwardly whining.