A light attack nerf is yet another direct nerf to PVP Magblades. Change my mind.

Langeston

First off, yes I know there are exceptions to every rule — that said, Magblades rely on light attacks for damage in PVP likely more than any other class. Don't believe me? Start paying attention to your death recaps (that is, if a weak-*** magblade ever manages to kill you.) Other classes/builds are able to get away with simply spamming their [considerably stronger] abilities — magblades have no such luxury. If this change goes live, (78% nerf???) magblades will go from already being unquestionably the weakest PVP class in the game to being completely unplayable.
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snoozy

yes, and just as i was leveling one

Fur_like_snow

It’s okay wear new Kena and get 20% cost reduction on purge and time stop. Don’t forget to bring your friends!

pma_pacifier

Wrong.

It should be more playable and require less skill. You should have more playstyle diversity and not over-rely on this mechanic. There are many other ways to play magblades.

Please read the purpose of the change again.

"While we believe it’s good to have a skill gap that promotes mastery, we also believe the gap as it currently exists is too wide, and that many players aren’t finding satisfaction in the climb. Additionally, we believe the over-reliance on a specific mechanic (light attack weaving) leaves less room for playstyle diversity, including lower-APM options. This is particularly evident in veteran content and PvP. Finally, the concept of using light attacks for damage and heavy attacks for restore is, quite simply, unintuitive – especially for less experienced players."

Caelc

hey, if sustain isnt an issue, it means you can dual wield daggers on your magblade and get full damage.

fiender66

I tried a mag blade on PTS, with the last swap between LA and HA. @Langeston rest assured that, if this is what we will see on live too, the magblade will be a sort of magplar, only a bit less aggressive. With the siphoning skills his/her might will be really great. Ah, and a tad less fun

daemonor

sauce please? this is deeply concerning

Langeston

daemonor wrote: »

sauce please? this is deeply concerning

Added source link to OP.

fiender66 wrote: »

I tried a mag blade on PTS, with the last swap between LA and HA. @Langeston rest assured that, if this is what we will see on live too, the magblade will be a sort of magplar, only a bit less aggressive. With the siphoning skills his/her might will be really great. Ah, and a tad less fun

Can you elaborate please? (Especially the magplar bit.) I'm on PTS right now & I am not liking it.

Maxx7410

Is anyone going to think about the magic sorcerers!!!!

SosRuvaak

zenimax doesnt care, thats the thing.

mocap

daemonor wrote: »

sauce please? this is deeply concerning

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/517545/pts-patch-notes-testing-ideas-for-light-heavy-attacks-in-combat

Langeston

Maxx7410 wrote: »

Is anyone going to think about the magic sorcerers!!!!

Am I correct in assuming this is sarcasm? Since this change also increases the damage heavy attacks do, it's a buff to magsorc HA builds. As if they needed it.

iCaliban

Hey langeston. This nerf is honestly going to have major impacts across the board that will be hard to forsee

Overall its a massive dps nerf to all mag classes in pvp while being mostly a buff to stamina (they have better heavies and need the sustain) while mag is heavily reliant on LA damage to build burst and mag has the ability to reliably land LA in PvP

Mr_Walker

Stupid across the board, not just magblades. Performance is so bad in Cyrodiil half of most folk are light attacking because skills don't fire. So WTF are we going to do.

Just another dumb decision, in a conga line of dumb decisions.

FIX THE DAMN GAME.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

It's nerf to all skilled play. Every class I play in PVP is dependent on light attack damage because I weave almost every skill I fire. Is a ranged mageblade is going to feel it more than some? Perhaps, but no more than say a ranged sorc.

This is honestly the most disturbing thing I have seen in a long time. The game is in F'ing shambles, and they are talking about messing with core mechanics on a massive scale. STOP IT ZOS, just stop it already. We are already at the point where some of the best DPS is basically the simplest rotation in the game. Has anyone played stamplar this patch? Reminds me of the old heavy attack mag sorc metas (which it's looking like we might be going back to). You could teach a gibbon to pull 90k on a dummy this patch.

susmitds

ZOS has officially lost their minds.

Edit 1: I was wrong. ZOS knows exactly what they are doing.

daemonor

Ok. Waterfeck. This game felt unique and fast paced and all that jazz just cause you had to press your auto attacks manualy and weaving them with spells on point every second all day everyday was actually rewarding.

Hello lighting staff molten armaments mag dk?

P.S. theyre making 3 light attacks in a row actually a thing that gets rewarded....

Moonsorrow

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

It's nerf to all skilled play. Every class I play in PVP is dependent on light attack damage because I weave almost every skill I fire. Is a ranged mageblade is going to feel it more than some? Perhaps, but no more than say a ranged sorc.

This is honestly the most disturbing thing I have seen in a long time. The game is in F'ing shambles, and they are talking about messing with core mechanics on a massive scale. STOP IT ZOS, just stop it already. We are already at the point where some of the best DPS is basically the simplest rotation in the game. Has anyone played stamplar this patch? Reminds me of the old heavy attack mag sorc metas (which it's looking like we might be going back to). You could teach a gibbon to pull 90k on a dummy this patch.

This so much.

Why are they changing all the things we as players like? Just to make few vocal people happy who like to play by just holding the left mouse button down?

I just.. cannot understand what is happening to this game lately.

When my ESO+ ends, it will not be renewed anymore until this madness stops. Why would i pay for a game that stops being the game that i loved? Not gonna buy Greymoor also if it will become HeavyMore chapter that keeps on dumbing down the gameplay to not even on a casual level but to a level that an untrained monkey could do Vet Trials with one paw while holding banana on the other.

I mean.. seriously what is going on??

Langeston

iCaliban wrote: »

Hey langeston. This nerf is honestly going to have major impacts across the board that will be hard to forsee

Overall its a massive dps nerf to all mag classes in pvp while being mostly a buff to stamina (they have better heavies and need the sustain) while mag is heavily reliant on LA damage to build burst and mag has the ability to reliably land LA in PvP

You may be right, I'm only speaking from my own personal experience. My death recaps from Sorcs generally consist of Streak/Curse/Frags/Wrath — rarely any LAs. Magplars are basically Purifying Light/Toppling Charge/Sweeps/Burning Light — pretty much never any LAs. DKs are basically Leap & a**loads of flame damage, at which point I'm already dead bc stage 4 vampirism — they don't have time to LA. Wardens do sometimes LA from range, but they mostly just have to stand within 10m of me with their absurd uptime of Permafrost/Northern Storm, and Necros are basically just running around trying to 1-shot me with their broken Graveyard synergy.

The only magicka class I see LAs from consistently are magblades, and that's because a) our sustained damage is complete garbage without them and b) our burst damage is inextricably linked to them. Light attacks are the only way I have any hope of out-damaging other classes' healing, and even then that's impossible in many cases.

As I said in the beginning of my original post, there are exceptions to every rule, and being that you are an exceptional player you are likely an exception to this one. But I don't see this change negatively affecting jabs spammers in the least, nor any other player that relies solely on their [overpowered by magblade standards] class abilities without LAs. I have to make it a point to LA weave just so I can hope to beat inferior players with superior toolkits, and now I may not even be able to use that to my advantage.

As it stands, I'm on the PTS right now trying to make heavy attack weaving work, and it isn't looking very pretty for my playstyle.

fiender66

Langeston wrote: »

daemonor wrote: »

sauce please? this is deeply concerning

Added source link to OP.

fiender66 wrote: »

I tried a mag blade on PTS, with the last swap between LA and HA. @Langeston rest assured that, if this is what we will see on live too, the magblade will be a sort of magplar, only a bit less aggressive. With the siphoning skills his/her might will be really great. Ah, and a tad less fun

Can you elaborate please? (Especially the magplar bit.) I'm on PTS right now & I am not liking it.

Yep. Strong sustain and spamming one or two skills (punctures for play, arc for NB). Mobility less important, as well as timing. This was my first, indeed a bit hurried impression. I have to test it again (what I hope to do presently)

Confirmed. I'm currently on PTS with a magplar. Dungeon bosses (at least the not so difficult ones) go down like delve bosses. And spamming puncture and LA is enough for some WB. I doubt that my NB can do it this way (I'll test, OFC). New players shall be pleased

dcam86b14_ESO

you need to calm down and re read their comments about how they need this info and feedback bc you know that's what a PTS is for.

This happens every time a new patch is introduced and then I see most of you playing the game anyway.

geez

Iskiab

It's a change, IDK how it'll play out.

One nice thing on PTS is they're making all weapons scale with your highest stats, then melee weapons will return stamina and staves magicka. That's something magblades have been asking for, for a long time.

Maybe 2H magblade brawlers or gankers will be a thing? It's hard to tell.

BaiterOfZergs

Just when I started to play my magblade again, light attack is very essential to magblades dps. Another change to cater to inexperienced players.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Moonsorrow wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

It's nerf to all skilled play. Every class I play in PVP is dependent on light attack damage because I weave almost every skill I fire. Is a ranged mageblade is going to feel it more than some? Perhaps, but no more than say a ranged sorc.

This is honestly the most disturbing thing I have seen in a long time. The game is in F'ing shambles, and they are talking about messing with core mechanics on a massive scale. STOP IT ZOS, just stop it already. We are already at the point where some of the best DPS is basically the simplest rotation in the game. Has anyone played stamplar this patch? Reminds me of the old heavy attack mag sorc metas (which it's looking like we might be going back to). You could teach a gibbon to pull 90k on a dummy this patch.

This so much.

Why are they changing all the things we as players like? Just to make few vocal people happy who like to play by just holding the left mouse button down?

I just.. cannot understand what is happening to this game lately.

When my ESO+ ends, it will not be renewed anymore until this madness stops. Why would i pay for a game that stops being the game that i loved? Not gonna buy Greymoor also if it will become HeavyMore chapter that keeps on dumbing down the gameplay to not even on a casual level but to a level that an untrained monkey could do Vet Trials with one paw while holding banana on the other.

I mean.. seriously what is going on??

The craziest part of all of this is that we have been here before. There was a period in this game where max DPS was basically a mag sorc that simply did 4 skills and 2 heavy attacks. We have been to the other end of the spectrum where it was basically, play a fully dynamic nightblade with a very unforgiving rotation or GTFO. I get that both extremes are bad, but we are currently much closer to the former than the later, and this change is going away from center.

In PVE: Our 2 meta DPS classes are currently: 1. A mag DK with elfbane so all their DOTs last approximately 24 hours (super easy to manage), or 2. A Stamplar that spams jabs with 3-4 other skills thrown in from time to time.

High DPS is currently almost as easy as it's ever been. I have been playing Stamplar for like a week. I am already within 2-3% of the parses on Liko's page. I don't say that to brag (there is nothing to be proud of here), but to point out how close the gap already is. The day there is no difference is the day the floor has officially met the ceiling, in other words, it means the building has completely collapsed. Now I might not be sitting on the floor, but I am also not at the apex of damage.

In PVP: Well, I haven't seen a Light attack fire as planned in PVP for at least a month, so maybe nothing there. It might be a huge buff for anyone that back bars a resto staff. As far as I can tell, a resto staff HA is almost lag proof.

Langeston

fiender66 wrote: »

Langeston wrote: »

daemonor wrote: »

sauce please? this is deeply concerning

Added source link to OP.

fiender66 wrote: »

I tried a mag blade on PTS, with the last swap between LA and HA. @Langeston rest assured that, if this is what we will see on live too, the magblade will be a sort of magplar, only a bit less aggressive. With the siphoning skills his/her might will be really great. Ah, and a tad less fun

Can you elaborate please? (Especially the magplar bit.) I'm on PTS right now & I am not liking it.

Yep. Strong sustain and spamming one or two skills (punctures for play, arc for NB). Mobility less important, as well as timing. This was my first, indeed a bit hurried impression. I have to test it again (what I hope to do presently)

Confirmed. I'm currently on PTS with a magplar. Dungeon bosses (at least the not so difficult ones) go down like delve bosses. And spamming puncture and LA is enough for some WB. I doubt that my NB can do it this way (I'll test, OFC). New players shall be pleased

I'm sorry, but what does "arc for NB" mean?

brandonv516

Should be used to mechanics doing a 180 in this game but I really don't want this change.

Feels stupid doing more than 1 light attack in between skills. The whole reason I don't like Kena.

CleymenZero

Caelc wrote: »

hey, if sustain isnt an issue, it means you can dual wield daggers on your magblade and get full damage.

How would sustain not be an issue if he recovers stam with his DW LAs?

LuxLunae

Langeston wrote: »

First off, yes I know there are exceptions to every rule — that said, Magblades rely on light attacks for damage in PVP likely more than any other class. Don't believe me? Start paying attention to your death recaps (that is, if a weak-*** magblade ever manages to kill you.) Other classes/builds are able to get away with simply spamming their [considerably stronger] abilities — magblades have no such luxury. If this change goes live, (78% nerf???) magblades will go from already being unquestionably the weakest PVP class in the game to being completely unplayable.
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You might be a trash race...trust me I know...I was redguard...

Templar redguard is an utter trash combo. For some reason when I take the set and put it on NB or DK I play much better...

It could be however I am so fed up with templar that I have outgrown it's use...DK is that Top Teir stuff...Only a fool would be a stamplar over a stam dk.

CleymenZero

Langeston wrote: »

Maxx7410 wrote: »

Is anyone going to think about the magic sorcerers!!!!

Am I correct in assuming this is sarcasm? Since this change also increases the damage heavy attacks do, it's a buff to magsorc HA builds. As if they needed it.

You don't play magsorc it seems. Haven't played or fought a heavy attack sorc in PvP in... Ever?

You rely on cfrag so you want as many chances as possible to proc it and spamming abilities (read light attack weaving abilities for now) is pretty important and if you weave properly, your light attacks are as important as they are on nightblade.

The only thing that makes light attacks more important for Nbs is the fact that you need them to proc your bow but in both cases, you light attacks weave. I don't know how you don't get that?

To put it another way, missing your weaves on NB is more penalizing than in sorc because abilities proc cfrags whereas LAs proc the bow but IN BOTH CASES, you miss out on a lot of pressure if you don't weave properly. Do you understand?

Langeston

CleymenZero wrote: »

Caelc wrote: »

hey, if sustain isnt an issue, it means you can dual wield daggers on your magblade and get full damage.

How would sustain not be an issue if he recovers stam with his DW LAs?

You also won't get "full damage" with melee weapons on a mag toon in CP.

Langeston

CleymenZero wrote: »

Langeston wrote: »

Maxx7410 wrote: »

Is anyone going to think about the magic sorcerers!!!!

Am I correct in assuming this is sarcasm? Since this change also increases the damage heavy attacks do, it's a buff to magsorc HA builds. As if they needed it.

You don't play magsorc it seems. Haven't played or fought a heavy attack sorc in PvP in... Ever?

You rely on cfrag so you want as many chances as possible to proc it and spamming abilities (read light attack weaving abilities for now) is pretty important and if you weave properly, your light attacks are as important as they are on nightblade.

The only thing that makes light attacks more important for Nbs is the fact that you need them to proc your bow but in both cases, you light attacks weave. I don't know how you don't get that?

To put it another way, missing your weaves on NB is more penalizing than in sorc because abilities proc cfrags whereas LAs proc the bow but IN BOTH CASES, you miss out on a lot of pressure if you don't weave properly. Do you understand?

I have both a sorc and a magblade. The sorc's abilities do vastly more damage and are infinitely easier to land, thus the need to make the deficit up with LAs on the magblade. (Although if you're weaving on the sorc too, that deficit is insurmountable.) Do you understand?