Healer logs on combat metrix? (Need healer insight)

Cirantille

Did my first trial healing so I need a little bit advice or insight

1) How do I evaluate healer log?
Time of buffs, debuff in %?
It also shows how much heals I throw on different people.
What criterias to consider to know if you are doing a good job or not?

2) I also saw overhealing. What exactly is this? I assume a definition but I am also hesitant.
How much overhealing is acceptable?
Because I find it hard to say "They'll be okay" when people taking lots of damage.
In dungeons it was rather more chill though.
That is why I felt like I was healing/buffing most of the time and not contributing so much dps.

3) This is the next question, how much dps I need to add in trials? In dungeons I usually add somewhere between 10 to 20k I dont know if that is okay too

4) Also I read people's healing springs hit 7k? I want to know how.
Because mine doesnt show that much
I am using atronach mundus, olorime, sentinel monster set and an irrelavant sustain set (until I get another good healer gear, I just gathered olorime today)

Thanks in advance
Cheers

JanTanhide

Well, I suggest you run encounter log or ESO Logs to evaluate your healing and dps. Here: https://www.esologs.com/


You will always see over healing. If you didn't over heal they would be dead. LOL. Just can't get "enough" healing so we always do continuous healing with HOTS and burst heals. Just how it is so I suggest not being concerned with over healing. Keep em alive!

As for DPS that depends. If you are running a 4 person dungeon then a lot of times you can run a heal or two and the rest is full on DPS as long as the rest of the group knows and are skilled enough to keep themselves alive when you are not on your healing bar. For Trials I usually just go full on healer mode with the only "DPS" I am doing coming from Luminous Shards and Wall of Elements. Everything else on my bars are for buffing the group, debuffing bosses and mobs and healing and defense (shield for instance if needed).

ESO logs is a fantastic tool to self evaluate your build and skills and experience. It is very detailed so you will find a lot of information in it that may be useful to you. Good luck and have fun!

Cirantille

JanTanhide wrote: »

Well, I suggest you run encounter log or ESO Logs to evaluate your healing and dps. Here: https://www.esologs.com/


You will always see over healing. If you didn't over heal they would be dead. LOL. Just can't get "enough" healing so we always do continuous healing with HOTS and burst heals. Just how it is so I suggest not being concerned with over healing. Keep em alive!

As for DPS that depends. If you are running a 4 person dungeon then a lot of times you can run a heal or two and the rest is full on DPS as long as the rest of the group knows and are skilled enough to keep themselves alive when you are not on your healing bar. For Trials I usually just go full on healer mode with the only "DPS" I am doing coming from Luminous Shards and Wall of Elements. Everything else on my bars are for buffing the group, debuffing bosses and mobs and healing and defense (shield for instance if needed).

ESO logs is a fantastic tool to self evaluate your build and skills and experience. It is very detailed so you will find a lot of information in it that may be useful to you. Good luck and have fun!

That is great to know because when it says "overheal" it sounded like I am doing something too much

So it is normal for trials to be different than 4 man dungeons.

Noob question but I do sign up here and log from combat metrix fights?

Iskiab

1. Uptime on elemental drain if you’re running it, uptime on warhorn... Basicly the uptime on any debuffs or buffs you’re doing.
2. Just ignore it, it’s not important
3. In trials I don’t worry about dps
4. I’m not sure what my tooltip is

Cirantille

Iskiab wrote: »

1. Uptime on elemental drain if you’re running it, uptime on warhorn... Basicly the uptime on any debuffs or buffs you’re doing.
2. Just ignore it, it’s not important
3. In trials I don’t worry about dps
4. I’m not sure what my tooltip is

Does the tool tip not show extra spell dmg or crits? Because it seems like a far tooltip 7k heals per tick on healing springs?
If in total (not per second then yeah I can see it can heal for 8k, because it says heals about 1.5k per second now)

Iskiab

Cirantille wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

1. Uptime on elemental drain if you’re running it, uptime on warhorn... Basicly the uptime on any debuffs or buffs you’re doing.
2. Just ignore it, it’s not important
3. In trials I don’t worry about dps
4. I’m not sure what my tooltip is

Does the tool tip not show extra spell dmg or crits? Because it seems like a far tooltip 7k heals per tick on healing springs?
If in total (not per second then yeah I can see it can heal for 8k, because it says heals about 1.5k per second now)

Tooltip is just the unbuffed amount excluding crits. So if someone has a 75% crit healing mod the tooltip can be quite lower. There’s also healing received mods, so for example on a DK in heavy it can add up to a lot, maybe 20% or so?

For a 7k crit the base tooltip amount without raid buffs might only be 3k.

For an example with inexact math:
2k heal self buffed
3k heal raid buffed
5k heal with a crit
7k heal with healing received mods

It all multiplies, that’s why sustain is more important than your tooltip. It’s usually about did you heal rather than for how much.

Cirantille

Iskiab wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

1. Uptime on elemental drain if you’re running it, uptime on warhorn... Basicly the uptime on any debuffs or buffs you’re doing.
2. Just ignore it, it’s not important
3. In trials I don’t worry about dps
4. I’m not sure what my tooltip is

Does the tool tip not show extra spell dmg or crits? Because it seems like a far tooltip 7k heals per tick on healing springs?
If in total (not per second then yeah I can see it can heal for 8k, because it says heals about 1.5k per second now)

Tooltip is just the unbuffed amount excluding crits. So if someone has a 75% crit healing mod the tooltip can be quite lower. There’s also healing received mods, so for example on a DK in heavy it can add up to a lot, maybe 20% or so?

For a 7k crit the base tooltip amount without raid buffs might only be 3k.

For an example with inexact math:
2k heal self buffed
3k heal raid buffed
5k heal with a crit
7k heal with healing received mods

It all multiplies, that’s why sustain is more important than your tooltip. It’s usually about did you heal rather than for how much.

Awesome, great answer, because just I was wondering about if I should sacrifice my recovery for spell damage

I feel better a bit more than 2k recovery maybe in time I can feel better lower

Iskiab

Cirantille wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

1. Uptime on elemental drain if you’re running it, uptime on warhorn... Basicly the uptime on any debuffs or buffs you’re doing.
2. Just ignore it, it’s not important
3. In trials I don’t worry about dps
4. I’m not sure what my tooltip is

Does the tool tip not show extra spell dmg or crits? Because it seems like a far tooltip 7k heals per tick on healing springs?
If in total (not per second then yeah I can see it can heal for 8k, because it says heals about 1.5k per second now)

Tooltip is just the unbuffed amount excluding crits. So if someone has a 75% crit healing mod the tooltip can be quite lower. There’s also healing received mods, so for example on a DK in heavy it can add up to a lot, maybe 20% or so?

For a 7k crit the base tooltip amount without raid buffs might only be 3k.

For an example with inexact math:
2k heal self buffed
3k heal raid buffed
5k heal with a crit
7k heal with healing received mods

It all multiplies, that’s why sustain is more important than your tooltip. It’s usually about did you heal rather than for how much.

Awesome, great answer, because just I was wondering about if I should sacrifice my recovery for spell damage

I feel better a bit more than 2k recovery maybe in time I can feel better lower

I haven’t done vet trials in a while, for specifics I’d see if you can get a pve expert to answer. Back when I did everything you had to spam orbs so needed more sustain.

You can probably get away with less but that would involve experience. Damage comes in predictably in pve so knowing when you can heavy resto, or when you need to, comes with time.

Cirantille

Iskiab wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

1. Uptime on elemental drain if you’re running it, uptime on warhorn... Basicly the uptime on any debuffs or buffs you’re doing.
2. Just ignore it, it’s not important
3. In trials I don’t worry about dps
4. I’m not sure what my tooltip is

Does the tool tip not show extra spell dmg or crits? Because it seems like a far tooltip 7k heals per tick on healing springs?
If in total (not per second then yeah I can see it can heal for 8k, because it says heals about 1.5k per second now)

Tooltip is just the unbuffed amount excluding crits. So if someone has a 75% crit healing mod the tooltip can be quite lower. There’s also healing received mods, so for example on a DK in heavy it can add up to a lot, maybe 20% or so?

For a 7k crit the base tooltip amount without raid buffs might only be 3k.

For an example with inexact math:
2k heal self buffed
3k heal raid buffed
5k heal with a crit
7k heal with healing received mods

It all multiplies, that’s why sustain is more important than your tooltip. It’s usually about did you heal rather than for how much.

Awesome, great answer, because just I was wondering about if I should sacrifice my recovery for spell damage

I feel better a bit more than 2k recovery maybe in time I can feel better lower

I haven’t done vet trials in a while, for specifics I’d see if you can get a pve expert to answer. Back when I did everything you had to spam orbs so needed more sustain.

You can probably get away with less but that would involve experience. Damage comes in predictably in pve so knowing when you can heavy resto, or when you need to, comes with time.

Thank you for all your help, I will stick to more recovery for the time being until I get more pro at it as you suggested

FakeFox

1.) The percentage uptimes are relative to the recorded fight length, however to properly evaluate them you need to set them in relation to actual active fight time. So you take out immunity phases, damage stops, etc. In general uptimes are very important and the best measurement, as you generally can't properly measure healing. HPS and overheal are generally meaningless, if it is enough healing and nobody dies. You can however look deeper into the healing distribution in certain phases, to streamline your healing or spot mistakes should you run into situation you can't properly heal.

2.) Overhealing is the amount of healing you put out over a targets maximum health. In general it is irrelevant and it is pretty normal to have 80%+ overheal just from the offhealing you get from your support. The only situation where overheal can be an indicator for mistakes is if you have massive overhealing on burst heals that have no support function, so breath of live for example, because it can mean that you panic heal too often and waste GCDs and Ressources for example.

3.) As a fullhealer you don't need any. However you will probably have 10k+ anyway from your offensive support skills. For offhealing builds it can be anywhere from 15-50k. Generally speaking it is nice to have additional damage, but it is usually the lowest priority and more of a way to get at least something out of unused slots and time.

4.) Iskiab explained how that works already. But to maybe give some additional context. Healing numbers are for the most part not all that important. However currently trial healers are still hitting very high numbers, because sustain requirements are really low and so running high offensive stats is beneficial. But it is pretty much standard to stack two HOTs per healer, since most classes have two in their basic kit anyway (Springs with Masterrestro and a class ability) and you have quite a lot of offhealing from Combatprayer, Shrooms, Orbs, etc. on top of that, so there are barely situations where you would need a single HOT to do 7k as with multiple healing ticks per second most of that will be overheal anyway.

JanTanhide

You can definitely get away with less recovery now with the change to Orbs and Healing Springs.

I now use Illustrious Healing instead since it is stronger and you cannot "spam" Healing Springs like you use to. Now when you cast Healing Springs/Illustrious Healing it's there for the duration and does not stack with itself. If you cast it before it expires it cancels the previous heal and starts over.

Use to be able to stack it, not anymore so go with the stronger heal and use other skills to add on to the overall healing. I now run about 1800 Magicka regen on my main Healer with two of my Jewelry enchants Spell Damage. Spell damage will increase your heals so if you don't need the recovery go for spell damage.

As for Combat Metrics it is a "One fight" type addon and not at all like ESO Logs. If you haven't installed ESO Logs client and created an account I suggest you do. You will be quite amazed at how much information is there to peruse.

Cirantille

FakeFox wrote: »

1.) The percentage uptimes are relative to the recorded fight length, however to properly evaluate them you need to set them in relation to actual active fight time. So you take out immunity phases, damage stops, etc. In general uptimes are very important and the best measurement, as you generally can't properly measure healing. HPS and overheal are generally meaningless, if it is enough healing and nobody dies. You can however look deeper into the healing distribution in certain phases, to streamline your healing or spot mistakes should you run into situation you can't properly heal.

2.) Overhealing is the amount of healing you put out over a targets maximum health. In general it is irrelevant and it is pretty normal to have 80%+ overheal just from the offhealing you get from your support. The only situation where overheal can be an indicator for mistakes is if you have massive overhealing on burst heals that have no support function, so breath of live for example, because it can mean that you panic heal too often and waste GCDs and Ressources for example.

3.) As a fullhealer you don't need any. However you will probably have 10k+ anyway from your offensive support skills. For offhealing builds it can be anywhere from 15-50k. Generally speaking it is nice to have additional damage, but it is usually the lowest priority and more of a way to get at least something out of unused slots and time.

4.) Iskiab explained how that works already. But to maybe give some additional context. Healing numbers are for the most part not all that important. However currently trial healers are still hitting very high numbers, because sustain requirements are really low and so running high offensive stats is beneficial. But it is pretty much standard to stack two HOTs per healer, since most classes have two in their basic kit anyway (Springs with Masterrestro and a class ability) and you have quite a lot of offhealing from Combatprayer, Shrooms, Orbs, etc. on top of that, so there are barely situations where you would need a single HOT to do 7k as with multiple healing ticks per second most of that will be overheal anyway.

Great! Because my overheal was sitting at 90% but was afraid to speak it out loud

I thought of leaving the burst heal out because when combat prayer there I never needed to use it, or maybe there was no emergency. Still hesitant to leave it, because the build says that I need to keep it. (Matriarch in my case)

Some people suggest thief mundus in their builds but as Iskiab suggested , I will start with more recovery I think. Gathering heals from different sources is not difficult, I was just confused about single tick of healing springs but I guess with high spell dmg and crit it is possible...

Cirantille

JanTanhide wrote: »

You can definitely get away with less recovery now with the change to Orbs and Healing Springs.

I now use Illustrious Healing instead since it is stronger and you cannot "spam" Healing Springs like you use to. Now when you cast Healing Springs/Illustrious Healing it's there for the duration and does not stack with itself. If you cast it before it expires it cancels the previous heal and starts over.

Use to be able to stack it, not anymore so go with the stronger heal and use other skills to add on to the overall healing. I now run about 1800 Magicka regen on my main Healer with two of my Jewelry enchants Spell Damage. Spell damage will increase your heals so if you don't need the recovery go for spell damage.

As for Combat Metrics it is a "One fight" type addon and not at all like ESO Logs. If you haven't installed ESO Logs client and created an account I suggest you do. You will be quite amazed at how much information is there to peruse.

Oh I never even heard of it before you mentioned, so I can replace it now with cmx

FakeFox

Cirantille wrote: »

FakeFox wrote: »

1.) The percentage uptimes are relative to the recorded fight length, however to properly evaluate them you need to set them in relation to actual active fight time. So you take out immunity phases, damage stops, etc. In general uptimes are very important and the best measurement, as you generally can't properly measure healing. HPS and overheal are generally meaningless, if it is enough healing and nobody dies. You can however look deeper into the healing distribution in certain phases, to streamline your healing or spot mistakes should you run into situation you can't properly heal.

2.) Overhealing is the amount of healing you put out over a targets maximum health. In general it is irrelevant and it is pretty normal to have 80%+ overheal just from the offhealing you get from your support. The only situation where overheal can be an indicator for mistakes is if you have massive overhealing on burst heals that have no support function, so breath of live for example, because it can mean that you panic heal too often and waste GCDs and Ressources for example.

3.) As a fullhealer you don't need any. However you will probably have 10k+ anyway from your offensive support skills. For offhealing builds it can be anywhere from 15-50k. Generally speaking it is nice to have additional damage, but it is usually the lowest priority and more of a way to get at least something out of unused slots and time.

4.) Iskiab explained how that works already. But to maybe give some additional context. Healing numbers are for the most part not all that important. However currently trial healers are still hitting very high numbers, because sustain requirements are really low and so running high offensive stats is beneficial. But it is pretty much standard to stack two HOTs per healer, since most classes have two in their basic kit anyway (Springs with Masterrestro and a class ability) and you have quite a lot of offhealing from Combatprayer, Shrooms, Orbs, etc. on top of that, so there are barely situations where you would need a single HOT to do 7k as with multiple healing ticks per second most of that will be overheal anyway.

Great! Because my overheal was sitting at 90% but was afraid to speak it out loud

I thought of leaving the burst heal out because when combat prayer there I never needed to use it, or maybe there was no emergency. Still hesitant to leave it, because the build says that I need to keep it. (Matriarch in my case)

Some people suggest thief mundus in their builds but as Iskiab suggested , I will start with more recovery I think. Gathering heals from different sources is not difficult, I was just confused about single tick of healing springs but I guess with high spell dmg and crit it is possible...

Getting rid of burst heals that have no additional functionality is a great way to streamline youre build and improve as a healer. There are barely situations you can not just solve with a good combat prayer, but it takes practice and situational awareness. I would suggest leaving a burst heal in your kit while trying to use it as little as possible, just to be safe. But just experiment around, even if it will kill a few guys.

FakeFox

On the topic of CMX and EOS-Logs. I am using both to analyse my fights and generally suggest having both. CMX is great for a quick analysis of uptimes and has a combat log that is great for analyzing deaths. ESO-Logs allows for more in depth analysis of healing distribution and more accurate calculation of uptimes since you have precise timelines that help you with setting buff downtimes in relation to combat phases. And you can also look at other players uptimes, shields, selfhealing and resources to evaluate your performance.

Iskiab

FakeFox wrote: »

On the topic of CMX and EOS-Logs. I am using both to analyse my fights and generally suggest having both. CMX is great for a quick analysis of uptimes and has a combat log that is great for analyzing deaths. ESO-Logs allows for more in depth analysis of healing distribution and more accurate calculation of uptimes since you have precise timelines that help you with setting buff downtimes in relation to combat phases. And you can also look at other players uptimes, shields, selfhealing and resources to evaluate your performance.

Yea, watch out for CMX, it’s a little funky with how it calculates healing. I used to run it in cyrodiil and it would usually tell me I was 50-80% of my group’s healing. Considering we had 5 healers for 24 people, I’m pretty sure it overinflates your contribution with how it calculates healing. It’s best use is to track uptimes and procs, stuff like that.

Cirantille

FakeFox wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

FakeFox wrote: »

1.) The percentage uptimes are relative to the recorded fight length, however to properly evaluate them you need to set them in relation to actual active fight time. So you take out immunity phases, damage stops, etc. In general uptimes are very important and the best measurement, as you generally can't properly measure healing. HPS and overheal are generally meaningless, if it is enough healing and nobody dies. You can however look deeper into the healing distribution in certain phases, to streamline your healing or spot mistakes should you run into situation you can't properly heal.

2.) Overhealing is the amount of healing you put out over a targets maximum health. In general it is irrelevant and it is pretty normal to have 80%+ overheal just from the offhealing you get from your support. The only situation where overheal can be an indicator for mistakes is if you have massive overhealing on burst heals that have no support function, so breath of live for example, because it can mean that you panic heal too often and waste GCDs and Ressources for example.

3.) As a fullhealer you don't need any. However you will probably have 10k+ anyway from your offensive support skills. For offhealing builds it can be anywhere from 15-50k. Generally speaking it is nice to have additional damage, but it is usually the lowest priority and more of a way to get at least something out of unused slots and time.

4.) Iskiab explained how that works already. But to maybe give some additional context. Healing numbers are for the most part not all that important. However currently trial healers are still hitting very high numbers, because sustain requirements are really low and so running high offensive stats is beneficial. But it is pretty much standard to stack two HOTs per healer, since most classes have two in their basic kit anyway (Springs with Masterrestro and a class ability) and you have quite a lot of offhealing from Combatprayer, Shrooms, Orbs, etc. on top of that, so there are barely situations where you would need a single HOT to do 7k as with multiple healing ticks per second most of that will be overheal anyway.

Great! Because my overheal was sitting at 90% but was afraid to speak it out loud

I thought of leaving the burst heal out because when combat prayer there I never needed to use it, or maybe there was no emergency. Still hesitant to leave it, because the build says that I need to keep it. (Matriarch in my case)

Some people suggest thief mundus in their builds but as Iskiab suggested , I will start with more recovery I think. Gathering heals from different sources is not difficult, I was just confused about single tick of healing springs but I guess with high spell dmg and crit it is possible...

Getting rid of burst heals that have no additional functionality is a great way to streamline youre build and improve as a healer. There are barely situations you can not just solve with a good combat prayer, but it takes practice and situational awareness. I would suggest leaving a burst heal in your kit while trying to use it as little as possible, just to be safe. But just experiment around, even if it will kill a few guys.

I am glad to hear that the builds can be flexible! Burst heals are expensive, both matriarch and BoL are expensive so it is more intuitive to use combat prayer, I will start to change it when I feel more confident