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How to fix Stam Sorc

Aedrion
Aedrion
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Now before the 'Stam Sorc is fine'-train leaves the station, let me say this.

Stam Sorc sustain is fine, Stam Sorc defence can be pretty strong but when's the last time you were killed by a stamsorc that didn't use Dizzy -> Onslaught -> Executioner?
Yea, exactly. In BG's with that stupid Azureblight set but aside from that, I'd bet rarely, or never. And that's not only because there's like... five of them, it's also because Stam Sorc offence is really, really weak.

Thankfully, the way to fix Stam Sorc and make it into an actually playable class in PvP is super easy, barely an inconvenience!
Just needs two things.

Air Atronach

I mean, people have been asking for this most obvious of all obvious additions for literally years. I can only assume Zo$ doesn't know how to program it. Basically, one morph of the ultimate becomes a 25 second, stationary Storm Atro that grants major berserk synergy and does some AoE every now and then. The other is a 15 second mobile air atronach that moves and attacks with rapid attacks and whirlwinds and applies fracture or something.

This gives Stam Sorc not only a useful summon to get the Daedric Protection Passive (which the flying daggers also give you for some reason) but it's an actual stamina class ultimate that would add some pressure and a window for actual damage in between the noodle-slap fight.

Crystal Sword


The second pretty obvious one is that one morph of crystal blast becomes stamina. Every stamina ability used has a 35% chance to proc this single target, melee attack that dishes out some actual burst damage, while reducing its cost. And here's the kicker, you don't even need to delete Crystal Blast from the game for this. Just make sure that if you hard cast either of these morphs, you require more resources and a cast time but it deals some nifty but not overpowered AoE damage. Like throwing a blast of crystals or winding up a big cleave-like swing with the sword.

This also lets stamsorc benefit from blood magic - which it can't right now - and allows skilled players to actually try to set-up some decent but hard burst with this. Get 4 flying daggers with armaments, proc a crystal sword. Then fire then off after the other for some good burst. A dodge will fix it, but at least the option is there. EZ.

And that's it, that's literally all it takes. Two changes, the rest may be mediocre but it's fine. Doesn't have a spammable? Okay, whatever, not every class needs one. Can choose Flurry, Dizzying, Shield Bash and trigger the Crystal Sword for a bump in pressure. No execute? No problem, stamina has plenty of them on the weapon skill lines. Three to choose from.

So yea, hire me Zo$. Hell I'll work for free if it means some actually decent changes are made to this half class that needs to rely on proc-sets or silly kill-combo's that work better on any other class.

Wish List but probably OP...

Change Conduit so it grants +10% mag regen and lets a sorcerer use his highest damaging, crit and penetration stats when doing shock damage. That'd instantly make Overload, Fury and some other skills actually viable for Stam Sorc - if costly. Buuuut this is probably OP since even I don't think Fury is a well designed skill. :expressionless:

Now the 'Stam Sorc is fine'-train can leave the station. I think the 'Permafrost is fine'-train track is clear.
  • Kadoin
    Kadoin
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    No.
  • Elwendryll
    Elwendryll
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    So, I've been playing bow/bow in BG, it was not working too bad. With the MMR reset and the solo queue, I got matched with way better people than I've ever had to play against, and it started to show some limitations, skill being a factor, for sure.

    I'm interested about that azureblight build you're talking about :p Full DoTs stamsorcs?
    PC - EU - France - AD
    Main character: Qojikrin - Khajiit Sorcerer Tank/Stamina DD - since March 25, 2015.
    Guildmaster of Oriflamme: Focus on 4 player endgame content.
    Member of Brave Cat Trade, Panda Division and Toadhuggers.

    All 4-man trifectas - TTT, IR, GH
  • Aedrion
    Aedrion
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    Elwendryll wrote: »
    So, I've been playing bow/bow in BG, it was not working too bad. With the MMR reset and the solo queue, I got matched with way better people than I've ever had to play against, and it started to show some limitations, skill being a factor, for sure.

    I'm interested about that azureblight build you're talking about :p Full DoTs stamsorcs?

    Basically yea. It's nothing DK wouldn't do better but it's Hurricane + Deadly Cloak + Caltrops + DB and any other dot you can find, spammed on a whole team AoE. When all blightseeds explode together, paired with the DoT pressure. It can insta-wipe teams.

    Once.

    Then you figure out what the stamsorc is doing and *** him because without that one trick, he hits like a mudcrab.
  • theadriel
    theadriel
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    Elwendryll wrote: »
    So, I've been playing bow/bow in BG, it was not working too bad. With the MMR reset and the solo queue, I got matched with way better people than I've ever had to play against, and it started to show some limitations, skill being a factor, for sure.

    I'm interested about that azureblight build you're talking about :p Full DoTs stamsorcs?

    https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/489719/a-gift-my-last-great-pvp-stam-sorc-dot-build

    You're welcome. :)

    DOTs was nerfed hard though. But I still use a similar updated build on my stamsorc. I use azureblight and seventh legion instead. Its a bit tanky and does decent damage.
    I mainly play BGs though. Just play around with the build. It's pretty fun.
  • StaticWave
    StaticWave
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    Unfortunately people will still say stamsorc is fine xD. There's literally only a handful of good stamsorc mains left on PC NA. Most of them have either moved on to better classes or quit the game. I made a thread about improving BA a few weeks ago but it didn't get a lot of support either. As disappointing as it is, we'll probably not gonna get anything in a while.
  • craybest
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    what i have naver really got about stam sorc, is its class identity. what is it supposed to be? like in fantasy archetype. a mage that doesn't use magic? or what?
  • JobooAGS
    JobooAGS
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    craybest wrote: »
    what i have naver really got about stam sorc, is its class identity. what is it supposed to be? like in fantasy archetype. a mage that doesn't use magic? or what?

    Spell sword
  • Crixus8000
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    I agree, stamsorc needs some form of damage buff. That could come from making armaments a skill like potl, sub assault, blastbones ect to give us some delayed burst or even just give us a decent spammable and a class ult.

    But right now stamsorc isn't in a good spot. It has good sustain and speed, yes, but it really get's dragged down by how bad it's damage is.
  • Aedrion
    Aedrion
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    craybest wrote: »
    what i have naver really got about stam sorc, is its class identity. what is it supposed to be? like in fantasy archetype. a mage that doesn't use magic? or what?

    The theme is wind and storms. You use magic to manifest hurricanes, summon magical weapons... and well, right now, that's it. I'd say it should include a crystal blade and summons that do some actual physical damage.

    It also has no real identity. The passives are mostly geared toward magicka builds or pet builds and the key elements that make a build are only half there. Ball of Lightning and Surge for defence and Dark Deal for sustain.
  • Fur_like_snow
    Fur_like_snow
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    It’s not really stam sorc persay it’s the lack of burst options in the other weapon skill lines. I’d love to use DW over 2H but the loss of single target damage to much to great.
  • StaticWave
    StaticWave
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    craybest wrote: »
    what i have naver really got about stam sorc, is its class identity. what is it supposed to be? like in fantasy archetype. a mage that doesn't use magic? or what?

    It's supposed to be an extremely mobile class that can traverse terrains unreachable by other classes. It's basically a hit and run class but without cloak
  • Aedrion
    Aedrion
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    It’s not really stam sorc persay it’s the lack of burst options in the other weapon skill lines. I’d love to use DW over 2H but the loss of single target damage to much to great.

    Oh no, it's totally stamsorc. The other weapon lines work on Necro, DK, Templar because those classes have damaging skills, burst and pressure. Stamsorc innately has little to no damage skills. Hurricane. And Armaments, which isn't all that great on its own. That's why it needs a good BONK-skill and a decent ult.
  • Crixus8000
    Crixus8000
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    It’s not really stam sorc persay it’s the lack of burst options in the other weapon skill lines. I’d love to use DW over 2H but the loss of single target damage to much to great.

    Well that's the issue though, stamsorc is basically a playable weapon line. All damage comes from weapon skills so when weapon lines have no good spammable or burst options then stamsorcs damage potential is terrible. Some other classes at least have ways to get delayed burst and pressure to help boost damage. Stamsorc has nothing.

    I tested a 6k weapon damage 10k pen 40% crit build on the pts and it was actually depressing how little damage it did to other classes.

  • mav1234
    mav1234
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    Plenty of players are effectively running dw stamsorc. I personally think 2h is superior, but DW is viable as well it seems.

    Not to mention how much Draugurkin is buffing flurry, haha.
  • Kadoin
    Kadoin
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    mav1234 wrote: »
    Plenty of players are effectively running dw stamsorc. I personally think 2h is superior, but DW is viable as well it seems.

    Not to mention how much Draugurkin is buffing flurry, haha.

    I use DW stam sorc myself and don't know what the complaints are about...
  • Crixus8000
    Crixus8000
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    Kadoin wrote: »
    mav1234 wrote: »
    Plenty of players are effectively running dw stamsorc. I personally think 2h is superior, but DW is viable as well it seems.

    Not to mention how much Draugurkin is buffing flurry, haha.

    I use DW stam sorc myself and don't know what the complaints are about...

    Well Yeah I can use it too and kill avarage players. Meet someones who is good, or in a tanky setup and skill doesn't matter because you just won't dish out enough damage.

    I'm a stamsorc, the squishest stamclass in the game, and anytime someone uses dw on me they don't even budge my hp bar.

  • Aedrion
    Aedrion
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    StaticWave wrote: »
    Unfortunately people will still say stamsorc is fine xD. There's literally only a handful of good stamsorc mains left on PC NA. Most of them have either moved on to better classes or quit the game.

    Speaking for PC EU here but I think we have 3-4 ones left, 5 if you include BG's, not counting the free-AP-stamsorcs and not counting myself.

    And even then, when I see them, there's only one I actively avoid, the others are just tanky and annoying and if you tunnelvision, you might get in trouble.

    Every other stamsorc now plays Stamden, StamDK or another game. It doesn't take a genius to see what is strong and what isn't. People migrate towards what works and away from what doesn't. The fact that PC EU is full of templars and has next to no stamsorcs is evidence enough.

    Edited by Aedrion on February 25, 2020 8:49PM
  • FierceSam
    FierceSam
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    I’d like to be able to see the bloody character when it’s using hurricane. It’s so transparent it gets totally lost. It’s like playing with your eyes closed.
  • StaticWave
    StaticWave
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    mav1234 wrote: »
    Plenty of players are effectively running dw stamsorc. I personally think 2h is superior, but DW is viable as well it seems.

    Not to mention how much Draugurkin is buffing flurry, haha.
    Kadoin wrote: »

    I use DW stam sorc myself and don't know what the complaints are about...

    Why use dw on a stamsorc when you can use it on a dk which has venom claw, a very strong class dot that also snares, noxious breath, another dot that also applies major fracture which buffs your dot and direct dmg, and corrosive armor, which makes all your attacks go through resistance. A dw stamsorc is a watered down dw stamdk. You can argue that even dw stamden and stamcro are better than stamsorc, because both have access to an extra class dot, as well as a delayed burst skill.

    Why use 2h on a stamsorc when you can play a stamden or stamcro, which have access to a delayed burst that can help you line up for a massive burst combo, or stamNB who arguably has a better version of BA that can crit for 11k+.

    Why play a pressure build on a stamsorc when you can play stamplar which has insane pressure with jabs and burning light, as well as delayed burst damage from potl

    Stamsorc has the weakest offense out of every class no matter what weapon combo you use, there's no denying it. Just because it works doesn't mean it's good. It's still by far the worst stamina specs in terms of offense because there’s literally nothing offensively worthwhile in their toolkit.

    Playing a stamsorc is like driving a honda civic, whereas playing any other class is like driving a ferrari. Even if you mod the civic it’s not gonna be as good as a modded ferrari.
    Edited by StaticWave on February 25, 2020 11:07PM
  • L_Nici
    L_Nici
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    I play Stamsorc since years, and the main problem of the stamsorc is a reliable attack to actually get a kill. Its always that last bit of damage missing no matter what you do. As Implosion still worked like an execute Stamsorcs had that last damage at least RNG based.
    It has absolutely no offensive class skills, Hurricane is really the only Class abillity that is used by most Stamsorcs, some use bound armaments as well, but they are such a weak attack, that it rarely matters.
    Everything else are the weapon lines and that is just stupid, Stamsorc is average at best since years, it really never was top tier unlike DK (Pre and after Morrowind), Warden (after Morrowind), Templar (Since Elsweyr) and Necro (right now) it never got that last bit of viability like many other classes got over time or had from the start.

    Stamsorc is almost like Stamblade, fun to play but always outclassed.
    Edited by L_Nici on February 25, 2020 10:36PM
    PC|EU
  • StaticWave
    StaticWave
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    L_Nici wrote: »
    I play Stamsorc since years, and the main problem of the stamsorc is a reliable attack to actually get a kill. Its always that last bit of damage missing no matter what you do. As Implosion still worked like an execute Stamsorcs had that last damage at least RNG based.
    It has absolutely no offensive class skills, Hurricane is really the only Class abillity that is used by most Stamsorcs, some use bound armaments as well, but they are such a weak attack, that it rarely matters.
    Everything else are the weapon lines and that is just stupid, Stamsorc is average at best since years, it really never was top tier unlike DK (Pre and after Morrowind), Warden (after Morrowind), Templar (Since Elsweyr) and Necro (right now) it never got that last bit of viability like many other classes got over time or had from the start.

    Stamsorc is almost like Stamblade, fun to play but always outclassed.

    It always aches me when someone tells me they want to hop on their stamsorc after seeing how I play(I stream sometimes). I just tell them to play another class and save themselves the hassle lol
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