Suggestion for Deterring Bots

ArchangelIsraphel

trell wrote: »

What currently prevents trolls from filing bot tickets?

Nothing. The difference is, a real person looks at that, sees it for what it is, and does nothing. You never even know you've been reported. While with your system, a player is preemptively inconvenienced, their game disrupted.

dRudE

trell wrote: »

I don't see how this could be abused.

First and foremost, the most obvious form, would be the botters using it on themselves and granting immunity from the very thing that’s supposed to catch them...

Secondly, other players would use it on themselves to get free things? Xp pots I think you said.

Lastly, it would be used to grief other players.

I bet there are many other ways it would be misused too

EvilAutoTech

trell wrote: »

What currently prevents trolls from filing bot tickets?

Nothing. However, it doesn't affect anyone unless and until ZOS does something about those tickets.

ZOS owns everything. They should enforce the rules. The players are just renters. I don't want another renter to try to enforce rules on me. I also don't want to be expected to police other accounts, anymore than I already am.

CASP3R421

i look forward to abusing randoms with this prison circle should it ever be put out

Tandor

trell wrote: »

What currently prevents trolls from filing bot tickets?

The knowledge that it will appear on their account record if they are constantly making false reports, and it will end up with action being taken against their account.

As @SeaGtGruff says, there is an overall anti-bot hysteria or obsession in this game, probably related at least in part to mat traders who see competition around every corner. Personally, in 6 years on PC EU I've come across barely half a dozen obvious bots while also being challenged by a player who thought I was a bot while I was actively fishing. I've only been additionally on the PC NA server for a year or so but haven't seen a single obvious bot there.

The problem with ZOS taking action against bots isn't the lack of reporting or investigation tools, it's the fact that every time they close an account the owner creates another one with replacement bots in the same places and usually with the same or similar names so players assume nothing's happened. That issue has been confirmed by ZOS. The reality in MMOs is that gold sellers (the illegitimate ones) fund bots through accounts and credit cards stolen from their customers. If people stopped buying from them then they'd move on - as they largely have in ESO compared with when the game launched, and compared to other games. Whenever I have dipped into FFXIV, for example, I've immediately been contacted by gold sellers - literally within seconds of logging in. I never have received a single approach from one in ESO. ZOS cracked down heavily in the beginning, and the character deletion limit in particular has had a massive effect on the problem.

If there is a current problem on a particular server then the way for players to address it is by helping ZOS through reporting any bots they see, but it isn't by having the players set up as some kind of vigilante squad. That's a surefire way of killing the game as decent players simply won't stick around to be falsely accused by other players pursuing their own agenda.

idk

trell wrote: »

I don't see how this could be abused. If you pass Meridia's test and you're shown to not be a bot. ?

Pretty simple to abuse it. People will use it on any group they care to even though they are pretty certain they are not bots. That is the definition of abuse.

Lets also remember that Zos could only set a specific number of tests and bot programmers evolve their programing for such simplistic testing. So in the end it harms players unfamiliar with what is happening more than it harms the bots.

It is great to think of ideas but I am sorry to say this one is ill-thought.

jircris11

LoneStar2911 wrote: »

Companies make money off of bots.
They only get rid of some every once in a while to try to appease the rest of the game's community.
Plus, gamers can get something positive out of it, too. Bots keep farmable material prices low.
Those that want to make gold through farming herbs, wood, ore, etc may disagree, though.

Personally, I'm all for getting rid of bots. But there's many sides to it that others may not have considered.

Shows how little you know of botting. Most are stolen accounts. Companies lose miney from them not gain.

Kittytravel

Nestor wrote: »

Bots don't subscribe, the company barely makes squat on them. On Consoles, the accounts generate 0 revenue for the company once past the initial purchase.

I'd kinda be curious to see if this is true personally as I imagine the amount of money they make is directly correlated with how many resources they can hold and they'd have to have quite a bit to make their money. I wouldn't be surprised if bots do subscribe just for craft bag so that they can run for a day or two before having to post anything.

Anyhow as for the suggestion; no. You just report them for botting like you report any other player, there is a help window that will walk you through it. No player should ever be able to interfere with anothers playtime outside of predetermined game zones. (Imperial City for example.)

Iskiab

Just ignore them. As people get more brazen ZoS will do something and do a sweep of bans. It’s the way of the world, and police do the same thing.

Cheaters/criminals usually think they’re smarter then everyone else. As they get away with it they get careless and greedy, then the hammer comes down.

Getting bent out shape about it is wasting your energy.

bmnoble

trell wrote: »

I don't see how this could be abused. If you pass Meridia's test and you're shown to not be a bot. No one can use the spell on you for a month. Also - it can't happen to you during combat or during other critical events. So, a Daedric prince interrupts your mat gathering for 5 minutes and gives you a reward as compensation. Would you prefer a bag of rubedite ore instead of an experience scroll? You even end up where you were last gathering.

Each person will only be given limited casts per day. Five sounded useful. Even if you wanted to troll people two false selections would shut you down. The cool-down can be set to days if necessary.

If once a month Sheogorath plucked you out of your gathering to solve a simple riddle and then gave you a gift would you complain?

You see all those players gathered around Wayshrines in various zones not moving, quite a few have left their characters AFK for a few minutes, what happens when someone uses this spell on them, and your little test has a time limit? They auto fail because they did not notice they were in a test till they came back and get flagged as being a bot, followed by trying to get unbanned for however long it takes.

Now is this spell 5 times per account or character, better be 5 times per account or trolls will have a field day with such a suggestion because if it is per character, someone who has 18 characters would be able to do this to 90 people a day.

And personally I hate puzzles in general, might seem simple to you but what about people who genuinely fail the riddle/puzzle what ever it happens to be?

Ackwalan

Your idea just gets worse and worse. So lets say you get a 1 month immunity after being tested. All the bots just use the "spell" on their fellow bots, solve the quest and then don't worry for a month. They then can add that reward to the gold they are selling. Your idea is terrible, it would solve nothing and would just be an inconvenience to people that play the came.

kargen27

Kittytravel wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

Bots don't subscribe, the company barely makes squat on them. On Consoles, the accounts generate 0 revenue for the company once past the initial purchase.

I'd kinda be curious to see if this is true personally as I imagine the amount of money they make is directly correlated with how many resources they can hold and they'd have to have quite a bit to make their money. I wouldn't be surprised if bots do subscribe just for craft bag so that they can run for a day or two before having to post anything.

Anyhow as for the suggestion; no. You just report them for botting like you report any other player, there is a help window that will walk you through it. No player should ever be able to interfere with anothers playtime outside of predetermined game zones. (Imperial City for example.)

You are thinking small. A bot isn't working alone most the time. Would be easy to run enough accounts to have a guild bank. Not needing to store anything but crafting material they would have plenty of inventory space. At least one account would need to belong to a trading guild. The idea is to earn gold in game and convert that to real world funds. Subscribing cuts into the profits.

idk

bmnoble wrote: »

trell wrote: »

I don't see how this could be abused. If you pass Meridia's test and you're shown to not be a bot. No one can use the spell on you for a month. Also - it can't happen to you during combat or during other critical events. So, a Daedric prince interrupts your mat gathering for 5 minutes and gives you a reward as compensation. Would you prefer a bag of rubedite ore instead of an experience scroll? You even end up where you were last gathering.

Each person will only be given limited casts per day. Five sounded useful. Even if you wanted to troll people two false selections would shut you down. The cool-down can be set to days if necessary.

If once a month Sheogorath plucked you out of your gathering to solve a simple riddle and then gave you a gift would you complain?

You see all those players gathered around Wayshrines in various zones not moving, quite a few have left their characters AFK for a few minutes, what happens when someone uses this spell on them, and your little test has a time limit? They auto fail because they did not notice they were in a test till they came back and get flagged as being a bot, followed by trying to get unbanned for however long it takes.

This is another very good point. I have gone AFK and timed out a number of times over the years.

Family member have a medical emergency while you are playing ESO and ride in the ambulance with them. With OP's idea you could get banned because you chose to help Uncle Charlie when his life depended on it instead of logging out of ESO.

xXMeowMeowXx

They need to fix the game’s performance and add more makeup in the crown store, not the crates.

Nestor

Kittytravel wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

Bots don't subscribe, the company barely makes squat on them. On Consoles, the accounts generate 0 revenue for the company once past the initial purchase.

I'd kinda be curious to see if this is true personally as I imagine the amount of money they make is directly correlated with how many resources they can hold and they'd have to have quite a bit to make their money. I wouldn't be surprised if bots do subscribe just for craft bag so that they can run for a day or two before having to post anything.

Anyhow as for the suggestion; no. You just report them for botting like you report any other player, there is a help window that will walk you through it. No player should ever be able to interfere with anothers playtime outside of predetermined game zones. (Imperial City for example.)

Not talking about the Botters and the money they make, I am talking about ZOS and the money they don't make on a botter.

I have reported bots over and over and over again in the game. For a while there, it was impossible to do so on the PC. Maybe they fixed that. However, the only time ZOS seems to do anything about it is when the forums get noisy about it.

LoneStar2911

jircris11 wrote: »

LoneStar2911 wrote: »

Companies make money off of bots.
They only get rid of some every once in a while to try to appease the rest of the game's community.
Plus, gamers can get something positive out of it, too. Bots keep farmable material prices low.
Those that want to make gold through farming herbs, wood, ore, etc may disagree, though.

Personally, I'm all for getting rid of bots. But there's many sides to it that others may not have considered.

Shows how little you know of botting. Most are stolen accounts. Companies lose miney from them not gain.

Wow, stolen accounts???
You'd think we'd hear a lot more about "stolen accounts" if this was the case. Maybe at least almost as much we hear about bots.
Hmmmm.
I guarantee if they lost more money than they gained from bots, there would be little to no bots.

dazee

LoneStar2911 wrote: »

Companies make money off of bots.
They only get rid of some every once in a while to try to appease the rest of the game's community.
Plus, gamers can get something positive out of it, too. Bots keep farmable material prices low.
Those that want to make gold through farming herbs, wood, ore, etc may disagree, though.

Personally, I'm all for getting rid of bots. But there's many sides to it that others may not have considered.

Zenimax has nothing to gain from bots and a lot to lose. bots lose players, which are customers. if they wanted to keep prices low on farmable materials there are easy ways to do so without actual bots in the game world.

idk

Nestor wrote: »

Kittytravel wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

Bots don't subscribe, the company barely makes squat on them. On Consoles, the accounts generate 0 revenue for the company once past the initial purchase.

I'd kinda be curious to see if this is true personally as I imagine the amount of money they make is directly correlated with how many resources they can hold and they'd have to have quite a bit to make their money. I wouldn't be surprised if bots do subscribe just for craft bag so that they can run for a day or two before having to post anything.

Anyhow as for the suggestion; no. You just report them for botting like you report any other player, there is a help window that will walk you through it. No player should ever be able to interfere with anothers playtime outside of predetermined game zones. (Imperial City for example.)

Not talking about the Botters and the money they make, I am talking about ZOS and the money they don't make on a botter.

I have reported bots over and over and over again in the game. For a while there, it was impossible to do so on the PC. Maybe they fixed that. However, the only time ZOS seems to do anything about it is when the forums get noisy about it.

You are correct on both counts.

Zos makes very little money off the botters In the first weeks of the game I speculated they were hacking the game to create accounts as the game was full price and bots were not only rampant throughout the game but also very obvious. Zos finally pushed to clean them up.

And I have also reported botts. I reported them directly to Gina as I was told to do from players who often talked with Zos. Included video and a couple weeks later they were still in the same place following the same path. I realized then Zos did not care and did not understand how it was bad for the game.

Now that we can sell crowns for gold the matter is worse. Zos creating that means pushes the demand in the gold selling market which in turn pushes botters to do more. Basically Zos is supporting botters and clearly does little to stop them.