Since CP cap is stagnant...what about item set level increase?

xiZeroPointix

With all of the balance changes and CP lock out, do you foresee item set levels being increased? I have thought this ever since One Tamriel dropped. What are your thoughts?

Emma_Overload

Item level cap should have matched CP cap ages ago. This would solve so many problems because it would be a constant reminder to noobs and casuals that CP cap is the REAL max level, not CP160.

Nestor

In a game where everything is scaled to the Item Cap, increasing the Item Cap would serve no purpose.

The people who would be left, not many.mind you, would scramble around to replace the gear and end up doing the same damage in the same amount of time with the same number of hits as they do now.

Katahdin

Same response as the other thread

NOT interested

Emma_Overload

Nestor wrote: »

In a game where everything is scaled to the Item Cap, increasing the Item Cap would serve no purpose.

The people who would be left, not many.mind you, would scramble around to replace the gear and end up doing the same damage in the same amount of time with the same number of hits as they do now.

Maybe what they could do is make the item cap the same number as the max cap (CP810?), but just re-map all existing items to the new cap. So CP160 gear would become CP810 gear, etc.

xiZeroPointix

Right I didn’t mean to consolidate 2 threads, but at this point it seems as though the entire games experience system is worth nothing now to the entire player base. If we are locked out of actually utilizing the amount of CP that a player has accumulated, what is the purpose of XP now? The purpose of dungeon daily extra XP gains? XP potions and scrolls all mean nothing once a player reaches cap. There is no reason to gain XP at this point. I believe that with all of the balance changes that are happening, item set level will be increased along with the stats that the sets provide. Increasing item set level will do something @Nestor. Apparently we aren’t thinking about how the item sets scale with increased levels. It doesn’t seem like much on paper, but with skill, class, and cp modifiers will result in a significant increase in damage and power. The purpose of the balance changes is to bring everything in line, opening the doors to improve overall character power whilst keeping large power creep under control. Look at the difference between item set level CP110 and compare to CP160. There is quite a difference here. Increasing the cap to even CP170 will breath life back into the game and all of the meta chasers will rush back to game to farm this new more powerful version of beloved item sets. I would in a heart beat if I knew I could. All I am saying is with the current CP lock out, how are we as veteran players going to feel a greater level of progression once XP means nothing? Item set progression that’s how. Once you reach 810cp you unlock CP170 gear and the gear that drops or is crafted for you will now be CP170 and only tradable to players at 810cp. It gives the max CP players a since of accomplishment and the time spent in game will be worth while.

Nestor

Since all the mobs will also Scale to what ever Cap, it does not matter what numbers will be flying around. If it takes 30 seconds of a perfect rotation to kill a boss at CP160 Cap, it will take 30 seconds at CP810 Cap. So what has changed? Just the need to go out and chase down the exact same gear everyone is wearing right now. All so we can have the same fights for the same duration.

This game does not level content. It scales it.

hakan

No, i hope it never happens. I like this system where we feel like there is no levels. Im pretty competitive but never liked level systems at all. Thats why im here.

Emma_Overload

Nestor wrote: »

Since all the mobs will also Scale to what ever Cap, it does not matter what numbers will be flying around. If it takes 30 seconds of a perfect rotation to kill a boss at CP160 Cap, it will take 30 seconds at CP810 Cap. So what has changed? Just the need to go out and chase down the exact same gear everyone is wearing right now. All so we can have the same fights for the same duration.

This game does not level content. It scales it.

Did you read my post? I'm saying that you wouldn't have to re-grind gear if they just mapped the current gear tiers up to CP810. Everyone could keep their gear as is. What would change is that that capped gear would now match the true level cap, at least until they decided to raise the CP cap.

Don't underestimate the positive effect this would have. Players would be forced to level all the way to CP810 if they wanted the best gear. The percentage of the player population who are fully leveled would rise. I suspect there would also be renewed pressure on ZOS to make leveling to CP810 much, much quicker. Finally, all the lazy players who complain about CP because they can't be bothered to grind (like everyone else did) will have a lot less to complain about. Then we will see the CP system evaluated in a fair light at last.

AcadianPaladin

How many folks spend loads of time and effort farming level 48 gear? That is how it would feel if the gear cap was a moving target. One reason folks are willing to put in the grind for cp160 gear is because they know it is a permanent invest that they will not outgrow. I should think many would quit the game rather than be condemned to farming very hard to get gear every few cp.

Dagoth_Rac

Higher level gear is problematic with the way that game auto-scales all monsters to CP160. If they came out with CP200 gear, would all the monsters need to auto-level to CP200? Would new players need to be buffed to CP200-ish stats instead of CP160-ish stats? Would CP200 gear against CP200 monsters be no different than CP160 gear against CP160 monsters? It opens a whole can of worms that I think the developers want to avoid.

I highly doubt ZOS is opposed to the concept of us grinding for new gear. This is not a game opposed to artificial grinds! I think we are just lucky that raising the gear cap introduces a lot of development and design problems that would require ZOS to spend time and money solving.

WrathOfInnos

I’m all for slow vertical progression, but this would be terrible. Nobody wants to farm all their gear sets again, it is already a never ending gear grind for some pieces.

MashmalloMan

Wow, I've never heard of a worse idea then this before. Please go play another mmo before you make this 1 awful to play with awful suggestions. Lets say our gear scales to max CP. What happens when CP raises? All your gear becomes redundant.

You know how bank storage is bad? Well I guess this fixes that since you'll be tossing all your gear anytime the cap raises.

You would want to take some of the best design philosophies ZOS has used on this game and trash it just so you can get a sense of vertical progression? What about this idea helps the new player experience? How would having gear that you can find for cp 160-809 effect the current market. Do we really need more trash in the game?

BLEH.

IronWooshu

AcadianPaladin wrote: »

How many folks spend loads of time and effort farming level 48 gear? That is how it would feel if the gear cap was a moving target. One reason folks are willing to put in the grind for cp160 gear is because they know it is a permanent invest that they will not outgrow. I should think many would quit the game rather than be condemned to farming very hard to get gear every few cp.

As if WOW and so many other games didn't survive by making the gear scale up.. lazy ass player base in ESO. You're happy about a stagnant end game. SMH

Drako_Ei

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

Since all the mobs will also Scale to what ever Cap, it does not matter what numbers will be flying around. If it takes 30 seconds of a perfect rotation to kill a boss at CP160 Cap, it will take 30 seconds at CP810 Cap. So what has changed? Just the need to go out and chase down the exact same gear everyone is wearing right now. All so we can have the same fights for the same duration.

This game does not level content. It scales it.

Did you read my post? I'm saying that you wouldn't have to re-grind gear if they just mapped the current gear tiers up to CP810. Everyone could keep their gear as is. What would change is that that capped gear would now match the true level cap, at least until they decided to raise the CP cap.

Don't underestimate the positive effect this would have. Players would be forced to level all the way to CP810 if they wanted the best gear. The percentage of the player population who are fully leveled would rise. I suspect there would also be renewed pressure on ZOS to make leveling to CP810 much, much quicker. Finally, all the lazy players who complain about CP because they can't be bothered to grind (like everyone else did) will have a lot less to complain about. Then we will see the CP system evaluated in a fair light at last.

The population would leave the game before reaching the cap.

And what happens if i already farmed perfect gear, but im cp 809, and they implement this? Will the gear that i already farmed go to waste?

Opalblade

If I wanted to spend all of my free time grinding, I'd get a second job. There's a reason I play ESO and not WOW.

Imryll

No, thank you. Folks who didn't have to wait till CP 810 to get max level gear want new players to have to deal with obsolescent gear for 810 CP levels? Having your current weapon do a little less damage each time you level 1-CP 160 constitutes aggravation enough.

And why would ZOS want to encourage grinding--as opposed to leveling naturally by doing the things you enjoy in game? ESO is a game not a job.

Banana

Hell no.

AzurasCry

I have played FF14, DDOn, BDO and many other MMOs with vertical progression that always seem to increase the level cap constantly. They work fine in their games with their game philosophy, but they too have their share of issues. In those games usually old contents do not provide current level gear, so they are left dead as move into new contents. ESO can mitigate that because ESO has a vertical and horizontal progression (this is where sets come into play). Sets allow the old contents to be sought after even when the level cap goes up, as long as the level cap of the set follows the trend.
However, do I support ESO to have an infinite level grind for higher level gear? NO.
If you generalize ESO to be like any other MMO, then why play ESO? Just go play the other game that does the same thing. There’s more...
ESO scales enemies and low level characters to pretty much max level. Which means, there is little value to actually continue grinding for higher gear and levels because they will always out grow up. Worse of all, there is no reason to invest into anything because today, they maybe useful, tomorrow they are useless. The way, others games mitigate this issue is by having level caps increase every large sum periods of time (like the annual launch of expansion). They also bind the levels to these expansions, which means you have to buy the expansions to progress. This is good money for the games, so they continue to follow this method when proven successful. ESO used to increase levels periodically as well in the past. But it didn’t make the game necessarily livelier than having a stagnant vertical progression because people would still pretty much grind of sets which had effective use most of the time. In other words, they’d grind the same thing that they are grinding now. The only difference is that they have to constantly do it to keep up with the rising gear level. This is more so a chore and tidious and even mind numbing after a while. This also prevents the player from actually doing other contents like pvp and such because you have a disadvantage. Either they will continue to grind endlessly for better gear and only build one setup because making various or test build to gold is just a waste of resources because they won’t be useful in the near future. Or they will rely on the auto stat scaling system like some people in Cyrodill.
There are other benefits and negatives of increasing the gear level as well.
In the end, I rather not grind of the same gear again and again just to throw away, unless I want to get duplicates. And don’t forget the gear drop chance can be very low. For instance, it took me 3 years to drop a fire maelstrom staff, imagine I just got it just to throw away because the gear score is not good enough anymore. And no, it’s not because I couldn’t beat the content that it took 3 years, it just wouldn’t drop one.

dazee

xiZeroPointix wrote: »

With all of the balance changes and CP lock out, do you foresee item set levels being increased? I have thought this ever since One Tamriel dropped. What are your thoughts?

This is an even worse idea than removing CP. while progression must exist in some form, this amount of change would undo everything ESO does differently/better from other mmos- which already do the stock MMO thing far better than ESO ever will, so let ESO shine where it actually does.

People should not have to grind to replace their gear every update in ESO. theres ways to give players things to do in this game which dont exist in others.

Faulgor

Only thing they could do is add another item grade above legendary. I wouldn't hate that.

Septimus_Magna

I really dont want to farm vMA, vet dungeons and trials again so no thank you!

vesselwiththepestle

Having to farm everything again -> I leave game.

ThePedge

Gear cap should be 50.

AcadianPaladin

IronWooshu wrote: »

AcadianPaladin wrote: »

How many folks spend loads of time and effort farming level 48 gear? That is how it would feel if the gear cap was a moving target. One reason folks are willing to put in the grind for cp160 gear is because they know it is a permanent invest that they will not outgrow. I should think many would quit the game rather than be condemned to farming very hard to get gear every few cp.

As if WOW and so many other games didn't survive by making the gear scale up.. lazy ass player base in ESO. You're happy about a stagnant end game. SMH

I much prefer a 'stagnent' end game to one that insists on a foundation of ever-shifting sands. Skills keep changing via buff/nerf for example but the game is no more nor less balanced for the changes. There is so much fun stuff to do in the game; I want a stable game so I can focus on doing things in game I enjoy rather than worrying about endlessly farming gear and adjusting to worthless skill changes.

Zer0_CooL

Gear cap increase? Hell would brake loose if people woul have to farm all their sets again. Now that i think about it, the rant on the forum alone might be worth it.

Agalloch

New tier of gear ( All CP 160 gear can be upgraded to CP 300 or something like this using some tokens found in ALL the normal and VET dungeons .

( Example : To fully upgrade all the gear we wear 10 normal dungeon runs or 5 VET dungeons runs should provide all the necessary tokens)

A gear token system is very useful for the players who can't become elitists .

Every normal trial should provide some gear tokens. These tokens can be used to buy perfected gear. Example : 30 tokens for a piece of armor and 50 tokens for a weapon.


English is not my native language.

wsmith97ub17_ESO

Not a chance.

Moonsorrow

NO. Please just no.

No one wanna re-grind their rare drop weapons especially. It would not be fun at all, it would not make or anyone i know play more - but combined with many lame changes during the last year (big changes up and down) it would actually most likely make many just play less, or give up and look for another game.

When one has account(s) full of different characters with hundreds of gears with rare drops that has spent ages to get and transmute - no one wanna start it all over because own gear is suddenly indirectly nerfed to be obsolete compared to the new max lvl (say cp 200 if that was the new gear max lvl as an example).

So please just NO.

They will be reworking CP at some point as they have said, hopefully we will then again have some sort of feeling of progression (without too much of power creep).

Luede

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

In a game where everything is scaled to the Item Cap, increasing the Item Cap would serve no purpose.

The people who would be left, not many.mind you, would scramble around to replace the gear and end up doing the same damage in the same amount of time with the same number of hits as they do now.

Maybe what they could do is make the item cap the same number as the max cap (CP810?), but just re-map all existing items to the new cap. So CP160 gear would become CP810 gear, etc.

different numbers, same effect. whats ur point?

Joinovikova

xiZeroPointix wrote: »

With all of the balance changes and CP lock out, do you foresee item set levels being increased? I have thought this ever since One Tamriel dropped. What are your thoughts?

No reason cp from items should be completely removed to make game more fruendly to new players