Necromancer needs a tanking/aggroing undead summon

Noxavian

thadjarvis wrote: »

Noxavian wrote: »

Grasp is an extremely useless skill.

Also the fact that necromancers make good tanks is quite frankly disgusting.

They should be support dps with summons and debuffs. Not tanks or healers. But I'd give them a pass on tanking if the healer option wasn't viable. Also if they replace grasp and the stupid looking scythe ability.

That's an RP opinion and there's no right or wrong there. Alternative way of looking at it are Necro as controllers that benefit from things dying (see their passives in detail). Other MMO's have CC focused roles but in ESO it's the tank with a little bit on the healer sometimes. Scythe is a symbol of the angle of death; ESO necro hits an enemy with it and draws life from target to self; makes sense to me I guess? As healers they are transferring death to their allies to kill maybe?

Everyone has a different idea, but if open-minded and creative one can create one's own story of ESO's necro as as far as it's skillset they seem consistently themed (maybe not what I or someone else envisioned but themed nonetheless).

Nope, not an RP opinion. The necromancers we fight in lore and in GAME are not like the class at all. Class reps agree that the class doesn't represent the fantasy of the necromancer we are shown in game. It just doesn't.

That's a fact, not an opinion.

As for everyone having a "different idea", that is also just flat out wrong. The people that WANTED a necromancer class, wanted one that is like the necromancers we fight in game. They wanted to summon minions, curse people, cause diseases. The idea of what a necromancer is in Elder Scrolls is already established. Therefore there's no room for people thinking "differently" in terms of ideas for the necromancer. You either want a Elder Scrolls necromancer or you don't. As mentioned, we already know how they're supposed to function as a class as displayed countless times by NPCs in this game and other ES games.

Necromancers have never ever been healers in Elder Scrolls. Scythes HAVE NEVER EVER been used as weapons by anyone or anything in Elder Scrolls. Especially necromancers. So the idea of conjuring a spectral farming tool is very weird. And "transferring death to their allies" literally makes no sense in terms of healing. A necromancer. Is not. A healer. NOW if they were taking life away from enemies and dispersing it among their allies, that would be neat and a cool way of making a "necro healer".

And no, the class is NOT consistently themed. If you genuinely think this, please go take a look at literally any trash necromancer mob in the entire game. They can summon undead, buff them, play in the back and debuff the player.

StormeReigns

Noxavian wrote: »

thadjarvis wrote: »

Noxavian wrote: »

Grasp is an extremely useless skill.

Also the fact that necromancers make good tanks is quite frankly disgusting.

They should be support dps with summons and debuffs. Not tanks or healers. But I'd give them a pass on tanking if the healer option wasn't viable. Also if they replace grasp and the stupid looking scythe ability.

That's an RP opinion and there's no right or wrong there. Alternative way of looking at it are Necro as controllers that benefit from things dying (see their passives in detail). Other MMO's have CC focused roles but in ESO it's the tank with a little bit on the healer sometimes. Scythe is a symbol of the angle of death; ESO necro hits an enemy with it and draws life from target to self; makes sense to me I guess? As healers they are transferring death to their allies to kill maybe?

Everyone has a different idea, but if open-minded and creative one can create one's own story of ESO's necro as as far as it's skillset they seem consistently themed (maybe not what I or someone else envisioned but themed nonetheless).

Nope, not an RP opinion. The necromancers we fight in lore and in GAME are not like the class at all. Class reps agree that the class doesn't represent the fantasy of the necromancer we are shown in game. It just doesn't.

That's a fact, not an opinion.

As for everyone having a "different idea", that is also just flat out wrong. The people that WANTED a necromancer class, wanted one that is like the necromancers we fight in game. They wanted to summon minions, curse people, cause diseases. The idea of what a necromancer is in Elder Scrolls is already established. Therefore there's no room for people thinking "differently" in terms of ideas for the necromancer. You either want a Elder Scrolls necromancer or you don't. As mentioned, we already know how they're supposed to function as a class as displayed countless times by NPCs in this game and other ES games.

Necromancers have never ever been healers in Elder Scrolls. Scythes HAVE NEVER EVER been used as weapons by anyone or anything in Elder Scrolls. Especially necromancers. So the idea of conjuring a spectral farming tool is very weird. And "transferring death to their allies" literally makes no sense in terms of healing. A necromancer. Is not. A healer. NOW if they were taking life away from enemies and dispersing it among their allies, that would be neat and a cool way of making a "necro healer".

And no, the class is NOT consistently themed. If you genuinely think this, please go take a look at literally any trash necromancer mob in the entire game. They can summon undead, buff them, play in the back and debuff the player.

Instead of complaining about how it doesn't fit within your head canon cause of past games and doesnt match that of the in game exp/loot pinatas (mobs/npcs).

Try building on what we already have to what you feel the community would like while keeping it functional in an MMO environment and not what you would like personally. Build from ideas of others, break down others ideas to build what might seems more logical in game play and thematics.

Parroting "nuhuh! This isnt necro, that's not necro, I know necro! Believe it!" Isnt doing you justice really.

thadjarvis

I where you're coming from and it's absolutely a fair point @Noxavian

I've just always looked at ESO as an MMO that prioritizes something like revenue > gameplay mechanics > graphics /cosmetics > performance > lore as that's how I believe the owners, ZoS, view it.

They knowingly took a risk making a class different than ESO NPC's and TES single player Necromancers and called it "Necromancer" as it's nice marketing (top priority over lowest). I would think they were aware of the deviations at conception.

Some were needed such as every class must be able to have a some competence to tank, heal, stam dd, and mag dd per their general guidelines, and a corpse mechanics instead of raising dead enemies to fit usability in content without lots of small enemies dying (noted that that is indeed super fun in TES single player).

Agree that things like not having a blue fist skill (like UG boss for example) were a missed opportunities that they could tweak, but removing all healing just doesn't jive well with ESO generally as it would cut the class out of much of PvP, solo PvE, and half the roles of group PvE. Basically only PvE DD in semi-capable PUGs or pre-made groups. That would likely not be worth much relatively from a ongoing revenue perspective.

I'm a little hesitant of a Necro half or total re-design as it's almost been a year with some core skills still wonky. An additional 1 year re-design phase and a year+ live phase of a new necro would be my best case expectation; how many years left does the game have?

Guess I prefer to have fun gaming in ESO with picking out class and role combos I enjoy playing. As of now I enjoy at least one role on each class even, so there's reason enough to play (and pay). Players that narrow in on one class/one role are very exposed to experience significant disappointment as even if it’s liked now, it’ll change (in any updating MMO)

Noxavian

StormeReigns wrote: »

Noxavian wrote: »

thadjarvis wrote: »

Noxavian wrote: »

Grasp is an extremely useless skill.

Also the fact that necromancers make good tanks is quite frankly disgusting.

They should be support dps with summons and debuffs. Not tanks or healers. But I'd give them a pass on tanking if the healer option wasn't viable. Also if they replace grasp and the stupid looking scythe ability.

That's an RP opinion and there's no right or wrong there. Alternative way of looking at it are Necro as controllers that benefit from things dying (see their passives in detail). Other MMO's have CC focused roles but in ESO it's the tank with a little bit on the healer sometimes. Scythe is a symbol of the angle of death; ESO necro hits an enemy with it and draws life from target to self; makes sense to me I guess? As healers they are transferring death to their allies to kill maybe?

Everyone has a different idea, but if open-minded and creative one can create one's own story of ESO's necro as as far as it's skillset they seem consistently themed (maybe not what I or someone else envisioned but themed nonetheless).

Nope, not an RP opinion. The necromancers we fight in lore and in GAME are not like the class at all. Class reps agree that the class doesn't represent the fantasy of the necromancer we are shown in game. It just doesn't.

That's a fact, not an opinion.

As for everyone having a "different idea", that is also just flat out wrong. The people that WANTED a necromancer class, wanted one that is like the necromancers we fight in game. They wanted to summon minions, curse people, cause diseases. The idea of what a necromancer is in Elder Scrolls is already established. Therefore there's no room for people thinking "differently" in terms of ideas for the necromancer. You either want a Elder Scrolls necromancer or you don't. As mentioned, we already know how they're supposed to function as a class as displayed countless times by NPCs in this game and other ES games.

Necromancers have never ever been healers in Elder Scrolls. Scythes HAVE NEVER EVER been used as weapons by anyone or anything in Elder Scrolls. Especially necromancers. So the idea of conjuring a spectral farming tool is very weird. And "transferring death to their allies" literally makes no sense in terms of healing. A necromancer. Is not. A healer. NOW if they were taking life away from enemies and dispersing it among their allies, that would be neat and a cool way of making a "necro healer".

And no, the class is NOT consistently themed. If you genuinely think this, please go take a look at literally any trash necromancer mob in the entire game. They can summon undead, buff them, play in the back and debuff the player.

Instead of complaining about how it doesn't fit within your head canon cause of past games and doesnt match that of the in game exp/loot pinatas (mobs/npcs).

Try building on what we already have to what you feel the community would like while keeping it functional in an MMO environment and not what you would like personally. Build from ideas of others, break down others ideas to build what might seems more logical in game play and thematics.

Parroting "nuhuh! This isnt necro, that's not necro, I know necro! Believe it!" Isnt doing you justice really.

It's not my head canon, though. You must of missed the part where I literally stated Im taking what a necromancer is in THIS game.

And if Im complaining about my headcanon then that means all of the necromancer class reps that agree the class doesn't fit the fantasy and what we've been shown is a necromancer at all must be projecting their "head canon" too, huh?

And the **community** over all would like a Necromancer that functions like a necromancer. Look at this thread. Look at other necromancer threads. People *want* necromancer to be at least given more summons and a viable pet play style, as that was expected by default when we heard a necromancer class was being added.

You're very foolish and ignorant to assume I'm simply speaking for my own desires, on a thread asking for more summons that isn't even posted by me nonetheless.

And if we're building on the "ideas of others", then how about all of those ideas on this thread and many other threads that people have offered in order to make Necromancers fit the GAME THEY'RE ALREADY IN?

You act like I created this thread and no one else on this entire forum wants Necromancer to be better in-line with the fantasy of an Elder Scrolls necromancer.

Get real with yourself.

Bradyfjord

Taunts are not part of any class' skills. And not all classes are equal in each role. That said, in my opinion, necro seems to fill support/dps or support/heals more than anything else.

Noxavian

thadjarvis wrote: »

I where you're coming from and it's absolutely a fair point @Noxavian

I've just always looked at ESO as an MMO that prioritizes something like revenue > gameplay mechanics > graphics /cosmetics > performance > lore as that's how I believe the owners, ZoS, view it.

They knowingly took a risk making a class different than ESO NPC's and TES single player Necromancers and called it "Necromancer" as it's nice marketing (top priority over lowest). I would think they were aware of the deviations at conception.

Some were needed such as every class must be able to have a some competence to tank, heal, stam dd, and mag dd per their general guidelines, and a corpse mechanics instead of raising dead enemies to fit usability in content without lots of small enemies dying (noted that that is indeed super fun in TES single player).

Agree that things like not having a blue fist skill (like UG boss for example) were a missed opportunities that they could tweak, but removing all healing just doesn't jive well with ESO generally as it would cut the class out of much of PvP, solo PvE, and half the roles of group PvE. Basically only PvE DD in semi-capable PUGs or pre-made groups. That would likely not be worth much relatively from a ongoing revenue perspective.

I'm a little hesitant of a Necro half or total re-design as it's almost been a year with some core skills still wonky. An additional 1 year re-design phase and a year+ live phase of a new necro would be my best case expectation; how many years left does the game have?

Guess I prefer to have fun gaming in ESO with picking out class and role combos I enjoy playing. As of now I enjoy at least one role on each class even, so there's reason enough to play (and pay). Players that narrow in on one class/one role are very exposed to experience significant disappointment as even if it’s liked now, it’ll change (in any updating MMO)

I get what you mean. I suppose let me clarify. I'm not against necromancers being healers, but the way they went about it is so bad.

A necromancer healer shouldn't just be able to give life as if they're using restoration magic. A necro healer should be able to take health/vitality from enemies and maybe even their own minions and give it to their allies. So all healing, as much as I'd like it to be, wouldn't be completely removed.

I'm fine with the whole tank/dmg/heal concept for necromancer, but the current execution of it is so wack and doesn't fit too well with the necro theme. I think they should primarily be debuffer support DPS, but the ability to tank and heal is also fine too. If they do it in such a way that fits, you know?

It just irks me that the description of the class talks about being a master of death and raising undead hordes when in reality you don't do or feel like it at all. Would 1 more melee summon option make me feel like Im raising hordes of undead? Probably not. but it'd let me live a bit closer to that fantasy, which is what I think a lot of people that are dissatisfied with the class want. They just want to be able to live out the Necro fantasy as best as they can.

idk

Noxavian wrote: »

thadjarvis wrote: »

I do find necro tanking super-duper fun honestly. I often use them for ultimates in trials: rez is real nice for early progging, coloss is real nice if short on necros, and Goliath rarely used but it's a solid emergency ultimate. They have useful alternatives to Warhorn/Barrier along with a magma essentially. The ultimate generation is pretty insane in trash, dungeons, OL, and Arena's.

The only big downside as a tank I feel is the burst heal requirement to be in melee range but Guardian+Tether+Stam shield does get the job done when stuck at range. They have more self-HoT option than all save NB, but necro is cheaper to maintain than NB. Really awesome synergy skills for all content. Grasp unfortunately is not all that useful; I tried it in lots of stuff. If that changed I don't think many if any would miss it.

If a pet that doesn't actually taunt but can be controlled is a goal for some, (it's not necro) but you can at least get what you want functionally with Maw of Infernal monster helmet set on any class for the time-being.

Grasp is an extremely useless skill.

Also the fact that necromancers make good tanks is quite frankly disgusting.

They should be support dps with summons and debuffs. Not tanks or healers. But I'd give them a pass on tanking if the healer option wasn't viable. Also if they replace grasp and the stupid looking scythe ability.

Zos has stated before they intend all classes to be able to tank and heal with some being able to fit certain roles better than others. So regardless of the notions we have about any class or how similar NPCs play out every class will be able to tank and heal.

StormeReigns

Noxavian wrote: »

StormeReigns wrote: »

Noxavian wrote: »

thadjarvis wrote: »

Noxavian wrote: »

Grasp is an extremely useless skill.

Also the fact that necromancers make good tanks is quite frankly disgusting.

They should be support dps with summons and debuffs. Not tanks or healers. But I'd give them a pass on tanking if the healer option wasn't viable. Also if they replace grasp and the stupid looking scythe ability.

That's an RP opinion and there's no right or wrong there. Alternative way of looking at it are Necro as controllers that benefit from things dying (see their passives in detail). Other MMO's have CC focused roles but in ESO it's the tank with a little bit on the healer sometimes. Scythe is a symbol of the angle of death; ESO necro hits an enemy with it and draws life from target to self; makes sense to me I guess? As healers they are transferring death to their allies to kill maybe?

Everyone has a different idea, but if open-minded and creative one can create one's own story of ESO's necro as as far as it's skillset they seem consistently themed (maybe not what I or someone else envisioned but themed nonetheless).

Nope, not an RP opinion. The necromancers we fight in lore and in GAME are not like the class at all. Class reps agree that the class doesn't represent the fantasy of the necromancer we are shown in game. It just doesn't.

That's a fact, not an opinion.

As for everyone having a "different idea", that is also just flat out wrong. The people that WANTED a necromancer class, wanted one that is like the necromancers we fight in game. They wanted to summon minions, curse people, cause diseases. The idea of what a necromancer is in Elder Scrolls is already established. Therefore there's no room for people thinking "differently" in terms of ideas for the necromancer. You either want a Elder Scrolls necromancer or you don't. As mentioned, we already know how they're supposed to function as a class as displayed countless times by NPCs in this game and other ES games.

Necromancers have never ever been healers in Elder Scrolls. Scythes HAVE NEVER EVER been used as weapons by anyone or anything in Elder Scrolls. Especially necromancers. So the idea of conjuring a spectral farming tool is very weird. And "transferring death to their allies" literally makes no sense in terms of healing. A necromancer. Is not. A healer. NOW if they were taking life away from enemies and dispersing it among their allies, that would be neat and a cool way of making a "necro healer".

And no, the class is NOT consistently themed. If you genuinely think this, please go take a look at literally any trash necromancer mob in the entire game. They can summon undead, buff them, play in the back and debuff the player.

Instead of complaining about how it doesn't fit within your head canon cause of past games and doesnt match that of the in game exp/loot pinatas (mobs/npcs).

Try building on what we already have to what you feel the community would like while keeping it functional in an MMO environment and not what you would like personally. Build from ideas of others, break down others ideas to build what might seems more logical in game play and thematics.

Parroting "nuhuh! This isnt necro, that's not necro, I know necro! Believe it!" Isnt doing you justice really.

It's not my head canon, though. You must of missed the part where I literally stated Im taking what a necromancer is in THIS game.

And if Im complaining about my headcanon then that means all of the necromancer class reps that agree the class doesn't fit the fantasy and what we've been shown is a necromancer at all must be projecting their "head canon" too, huh?

And the **community** over all would like a Necromancer that functions like a necromancer. Look at this thread. Look at other necromancer threads. People *want* necromancer to be at least given more summons and a viable pet play style, as that was expected by default when we heard a necromancer class was being added.

You're very foolish and ignorant to assume I'm simply speaking for my own desires, on a thread asking for more summons that isn't even posted by me nonetheless.

And if we're building on the "ideas of others", then how about all of those ideas on this thread and many other threads that people have offered in order to make Necromancers fit the GAME THEY'RE ALREADY IN?

You act like I created this thread and no one else on this entire forum wants Necromancer to be better in-line with the fantasy of an Elder Scrolls necromancer.

Get real with yourself.

Not seeing any ideas in that ramble. Just more "I'm right, any thing not me saying it is wrong, I know necro! Believe it!"

I am all for making Necro, look and feel like Necromancer; that feels thematically, playstyle and within the realm of TES's lore.

Good or bad, if you want change, parroting "this isn't necro!" over and over isn't the direction. Suggestions, building, breaking down, building up again, criticizing others and try to make their ideas feel more natural to the game.
See this, I have always been a firm believer about this, due to (in my opinion) matches to what we already have experienced in game, and should be within the game.

StormeReigns wrote: »

rager82b14_ESO wrote: »

I want a zombie pet that can hold aggro. That is fun. That is necro. This...i dont know what this is.

Don't need a primary "tank" pet. As well if anything dealing with Zombies, they should be utility baked into a passive.

Like, attach Zombies to Rapid Rot.
While in combat every 2.5 seconds while in combat - spawn a shambling zombie that quickly lurches towards your target. The zombies rapidly decayed leaving behind a foul desecrated trail in a 8x6 area dealing X% damage for 3seconds to all in the area of decay.

Juhasow wrote: »

Tanking pet would be too strong in certain PvE scenarios and would reduce the role of tanks. That is why sorc' no longer have pet that can hold an aggro. Having pet that can hold an aggro is a mediocre improvement for a tank but very high improvement for DD especially in solo and 4 man content.

Don't need a pet to hold aggro or to taunt to be a tanking pet.

Skeleton soldier: Mediocre Melee dps (1H only)
Preforms basic melee attacks every 2.5 seconds

Morph 1: Skeleton Knight (Tank support + SnB)
Takes 10% of the damage to you and is transferred to the SK.
Will occasionally provide its master with minor protection for 12 seconds
(Can only happen once every 20.5 seconds)
Preforms both Heavy and Light melee attacks every 2 seconds

Morph 2: Skeleton Warrior (2H Dps)
Instead of transferring damage that you take to the Warrior, it will now retaliate striking with cleave hitting all nearby enemies with in 7 meters when ever you take damage. (can only happen once every 4.5 seconds)
Preforms both Heavy and Light melee attacks every 2 seconds

Also, if Mender/Mage(Archer) as well Soldier (if it ever did happen) should be, permanent, only through passives upgrades should make it "Pseudo Permanent" (i.e: longer duration, but not following everywhere all the time)
No ranks = 16 seconds
1st rank = 90 seconds
2nd rank = 180 seconds
Allow this to happen through Undead Confederate passive.

Mender would now instead of taking the 10% damage redirection, should have an increased 15% chance to preform an AoE healing spell, placed on the Intensive morph, and increase duration to 16 seconds. While Guardian morph should have a 15% chance to provide HoT along with it's ST healing.

Pestilence / Frost Colossus when activated, should explode all unused corpses with in 5 meters of the colossus; dealing 3% extra damage per corpse (unused) based on the morph.

And lastly, Grasp (both morphs, Ghostly and Empowering) should be baked into Last Grasp passive. Reduce the immobilize to 2 seconds, and the empowerment to 10% for 2.5 seconds. including, it trigger when ever you land a critical hit, with weapon or class ability, allowing it to trigger once every 3 seconds.

Just my opinion on it though.

I always throw out these ideas so that others can look it over, provide scrutiny, criticism break it down, build it up, steal parts for their ideas, etc - or - give their examples that may be more realistic with in the game that allows me to check and possibly change my opinion on it.

thadjarvis

Noxavian wrote: »

A necromancer healer shouldn't just be able to give life as if they're using restoration magic. A necro healer should be able to take health/vitality from enemies and maybe even their own minions and give it to their allies. So all healing, as much as I'd like it to be, wouldn't be completely removed.

They seem pretty close to your idea as stated though instead of out of enemies and minions it's dead (corpes) and minions

• Render Flesh is exactly converting vitality to heal an ally
• Life and Death does partly break your idea but it is empowered by taking power from the dead
• Spirit Guardian is mechanically a transfer of damage from self/ally to minion. That is equivalent to a health transfer from minion to self/ally. It also does heal until it has no health (dies)
• Tether sucks the health out of the dead and transfers to self/allies
• Reanimate is as necro as it can get

I think they should primarily be debuffer support DPS

They are the most valuable DPS debuffer in ESO.

Would 1 more melee summon option make me feel like Im raising hordes of undead?

I think they choose siphon over another DPS minion and made blastbones short lived so that the skills don't all behave the same.

I saw somewhere mentioned having multiple 180second minion spawns. In ESO that is effectively a full on pet. So it would either need to be scaled down to such a low damage that it would not be worth slotting at all or consume two slots like all the other mostly permanent pets. We already have a 4 slot pet class and all the limitations that come with that. Not really sure what ESO gains by adding another one.

Noxavian

thadjarvis wrote: »

Noxavian wrote: »

A necromancer healer shouldn't just be able to give life as if they're using restoration magic. A necro healer should be able to take health/vitality from enemies and maybe even their own minions and give it to their allies. So all healing, as much as I'd like it to be, wouldn't be completely removed.

They seem pretty close to your idea as stated though instead of out of enemies and minions it's dead (corpes) and minions

• Render Flesh is exactly converting vitality to heal an ally
• Life and Death does partly break your idea but it is empowered by taking power from the dead
• Spirit Guardian is mechanically a transfer of damage from self/ally to minion. That is equivalent to a health transfer from minion to self/ally. It also does heal until it has no health (dies)
• Tether sucks the health out of the dead and transfers to self/allies
• Reanimate is as necro as it can get

I think they should primarily be debuffer support DPS

They are the most valuable DPS debuffer in ESO.

Would 1 more melee summon option make me feel like Im raising hordes of undead?

I think they choose siphon over another DPS minion and made blastbones short lived so that the skills don't all behave the same.

I saw somewhere mentioned having multiple 180second minion spawns. In ESO that is effectively a full on pet. So it would either need to be scaled down to such a low damage that it would not be worth slotting at all or consume two slots like all the other mostly permanent pets. We already have a 4 slot pet class and all the limitations that come with that. Not really sure what ESO gains by adding another one.

Honestly all I want is to just be able to summon a zombie or skeleton warrior. That's it. That's all I need to feel fulfilled as a necromancer.

Though if they want to rework grasp to work more like that Elden Hallow boss, I wouldn't be opposed. The one where if you stand in the circle where skeletal hands are reaching out you'll get dragged into the ground for a few seconds.

Then after the duration 2-3 skeletal flayers crawl out and start attacking.

Noxavian

StormeReigns wrote: »

Noxavian wrote: »

StormeReigns wrote: »

Noxavian wrote: »

thadjarvis wrote: »

Noxavian wrote: »

Grasp is an extremely useless skill.

Also the fact that necromancers make good tanks is quite frankly disgusting.

They should be support dps with summons and debuffs. Not tanks or healers. But I'd give them a pass on tanking if the healer option wasn't viable. Also if they replace grasp and the stupid looking scythe ability.

That's an RP opinion and there's no right or wrong there. Alternative way of looking at it are Necro as controllers that benefit from things dying (see their passives in detail). Other MMO's have CC focused roles but in ESO it's the tank with a little bit on the healer sometimes. Scythe is a symbol of the angle of death; ESO necro hits an enemy with it and draws life from target to self; makes sense to me I guess? As healers they are transferring death to their allies to kill maybe?

Everyone has a different idea, but if open-minded and creative one can create one's own story of ESO's necro as as far as it's skillset they seem consistently themed (maybe not what I or someone else envisioned but themed nonetheless).

Nope, not an RP opinion. The necromancers we fight in lore and in GAME are not like the class at all. Class reps agree that the class doesn't represent the fantasy of the necromancer we are shown in game. It just doesn't.

That's a fact, not an opinion.

As for everyone having a "different idea", that is also just flat out wrong. The people that WANTED a necromancer class, wanted one that is like the necromancers we fight in game. They wanted to summon minions, curse people, cause diseases. The idea of what a necromancer is in Elder Scrolls is already established. Therefore there's no room for people thinking "differently" in terms of ideas for the necromancer. You either want a Elder Scrolls necromancer or you don't. As mentioned, we already know how they're supposed to function as a class as displayed countless times by NPCs in this game and other ES games.

Necromancers have never ever been healers in Elder Scrolls. Scythes HAVE NEVER EVER been used as weapons by anyone or anything in Elder Scrolls. Especially necromancers. So the idea of conjuring a spectral farming tool is very weird. And "transferring death to their allies" literally makes no sense in terms of healing. A necromancer. Is not. A healer. NOW if they were taking life away from enemies and dispersing it among their allies, that would be neat and a cool way of making a "necro healer".

And no, the class is NOT consistently themed. If you genuinely think this, please go take a look at literally any trash necromancer mob in the entire game. They can summon undead, buff them, play in the back and debuff the player.

Instead of complaining about how it doesn't fit within your head canon cause of past games and doesnt match that of the in game exp/loot pinatas (mobs/npcs).

Try building on what we already have to what you feel the community would like while keeping it functional in an MMO environment and not what you would like personally. Build from ideas of others, break down others ideas to build what might seems more logical in game play and thematics.

Parroting "nuhuh! This isnt necro, that's not necro, I know necro! Believe it!" Isnt doing you justice really.

It's not my head canon, though. You must of missed the part where I literally stated Im taking what a necromancer is in THIS game.

And if Im complaining about my headcanon then that means all of the necromancer class reps that agree the class doesn't fit the fantasy and what we've been shown is a necromancer at all must be projecting their "head canon" too, huh?

And the **community** over all would like a Necromancer that functions like a necromancer. Look at this thread. Look at other necromancer threads. People *want* necromancer to be at least given more summons and a viable pet play style, as that was expected by default when we heard a necromancer class was being added.

You're very foolish and ignorant to assume I'm simply speaking for my own desires, on a thread asking for more summons that isn't even posted by me nonetheless.

And if we're building on the "ideas of others", then how about all of those ideas on this thread and many other threads that people have offered in order to make Necromancers fit the GAME THEY'RE ALREADY IN?

You act like I created this thread and no one else on this entire forum wants Necromancer to be better in-line with the fantasy of an Elder Scrolls necromancer.

Get real with yourself.

Not seeing any ideas in that ramble. Just more "I'm right, any thing not me saying it is wrong, I know necro! Believe it!"

I am all for making Necro, look and feel like Necromancer; that feels thematically, playstyle and within the realm of TES's lore.

Good or bad, if you want change, parroting "this isn't necro!" over and over isn't the direction. Suggestions, building, breaking down, building up again, criticizing others and try to make their ideas feel more natural to the game.
See this, I have always been a firm believer about this, due to (in my opinion) matches to what we already have experienced in game, and should be within the game.

StormeReigns wrote: »

rager82b14_ESO wrote: »

I want a zombie pet that can hold aggro. That is fun. That is necro. This...i dont know what this is.

Don't need a primary "tank" pet. As well if anything dealing with Zombies, they should be utility baked into a passive.

Like, attach Zombies to Rapid Rot.
While in combat every 2.5 seconds while in combat - spawn a shambling zombie that quickly lurches towards your target. The zombies rapidly decayed leaving behind a foul desecrated trail in a 8x6 area dealing X% damage for 3seconds to all in the area of decay.

Juhasow wrote: »

Tanking pet would be too strong in certain PvE scenarios and would reduce the role of tanks. That is why sorc' no longer have pet that can hold an aggro. Having pet that can hold an aggro is a mediocre improvement for a tank but very high improvement for DD especially in solo and 4 man content.

Don't need a pet to hold aggro or to taunt to be a tanking pet.

Skeleton soldier: Mediocre Melee dps (1H only)
Preforms basic melee attacks every 2.5 seconds

Morph 1: Skeleton Knight (Tank support + SnB)
Takes 10% of the damage to you and is transferred to the SK.
Will occasionally provide its master with minor protection for 12 seconds
(Can only happen once every 20.5 seconds)
Preforms both Heavy and Light melee attacks every 2 seconds

Morph 2: Skeleton Warrior (2H Dps)
Instead of transferring damage that you take to the Warrior, it will now retaliate striking with cleave hitting all nearby enemies with in 7 meters when ever you take damage. (can only happen once every 4.5 seconds)
Preforms both Heavy and Light melee attacks every 2 seconds

Also, if Mender/Mage(Archer) as well Soldier (if it ever did happen) should be, permanent, only through passives upgrades should make it "Pseudo Permanent" (i.e: longer duration, but not following everywhere all the time)
No ranks = 16 seconds
1st rank = 90 seconds
2nd rank = 180 seconds
Allow this to happen through Undead Confederate passive.

Mender would now instead of taking the 10% damage redirection, should have an increased 15% chance to preform an AoE healing spell, placed on the Intensive morph, and increase duration to 16 seconds. While Guardian morph should have a 15% chance to provide HoT along with it's ST healing.

Pestilence / Frost Colossus when activated, should explode all unused corpses with in 5 meters of the colossus; dealing 3% extra damage per corpse (unused) based on the morph.

And lastly, Grasp (both morphs, Ghostly and Empowering) should be baked into Last Grasp passive. Reduce the immobilize to 2 seconds, and the empowerment to 10% for 2.5 seconds. including, it trigger when ever you land a critical hit, with weapon or class ability, allowing it to trigger once every 3 seconds.

Just my opinion on it though.

I always throw out these ideas so that others can look it over, provide scrutiny, criticism break it down, build it up, steal parts for their ideas, etc - or - give their examples that may be more realistic with in the game that allows me to check and possibly change my opinion on it.

I get what you're saying.

I'll try to be less-so, then.

I will say I do very much like your idea you quoted, I remember reading it when it was originally posted. It's quite possibly the best compromise for a necro fix that wouldn't require reworking a bunch of stuff. A skeleton knight ability and a zombie passive? That would be so sick. And it'd maybe be the first step to making class passives a bit more impactful than just stats.

I think we're both wanting the same thing here.

Wifeaggro13

Ryskim wrote: »

Let's face it, with almost no snares or roots for enemies we can't be tanking all the time. We need to have at least 1 tanking pet to do the thing while we nuke away.

Life is very easy for Sorcerers with Encase very early in the game and the permanent Unstable Clannfear, so we Necromancers should be the best of the best at summoning undead and I really think Stalking Blastbones should be a 16-20 seconds tanking pet instead of the buggy pseudo-missile skill that it is now.

Note that I'm not asking for a permanent pet (even though I would love that to happen), but a pet that draws aggro/hate from enemies. That is the pure essence of a necromancer: summon the dead to to his bidding — yes, also tanking — while he nukes from the distance.

Lastly, why not give a resummon ability to the Skeletal Mage (just like it happens with the Unstable Clannfear)?

Really at the end of the day zos cares nothing for group dynamic anyhow . The whole design is now just a dps meta. Once your realitively geared and spec'd. Your gonna blast through 95% of 4 man content and all of the overland . Trials are still needing a hybrid utility tank and some sort of hybrid dps heal. But at this point zos is is happy with selling you the regurgitated solo content

Rex-Umbra

Yaaas