Another, and my last, nerf Templar thread

ThePhantomThorn

So. Here’s why there op. And everything this time not just jabs.

1. Jabs.
2. A gap closer that stuns.
3. Extended ritual
4. BURNING LIGHT
5. Snares

So. Explanation.
1. The damage is huge. (A result of a few thing I now realise, 1. Direct damage scaling as of dragonhold 2. Channel time reduced in elsweyr 3. People building higher damage in this patch) And has so many additional effects. But, mostly because of no. 4
2. Imagine if ambush stunned. Or crit rush.
3. The healing is that of healing springs, is a huge area, stacks, and purges 5. 5 effects from you.
4. This takes jabs to a whole new level. Jabs on its own is a little annoying, but with burning light...
5. and if that wasn’t enough, a massive 30% snare on everyone, and a 40% on jabs.

This will be my last nerf Templar thread this patch. I have nothing else to say.

juhislihis19

Maybe remove the snare from Jabs and tone down Crescent Sweep a bit. Make Defile more accessible so healing in general won't be so outrageous.

No need for the nerf hammer. And I play Stamplar.

Iskiab

The main difference between the last couple patches and this patch is NMA and how people are building.

With dots nerfed and healing being left as is a lot of people stayed overly tanky and were a little slow to adapt. Now people are building more for damage and I like it!

Even between a couple months ago and now I’m seeing a big difference in BGs. A lot of those tanky builds had no pressure so we’re basicly waiting to die, now it feels like people are fighting back.

OP has outlined Templar’s strength, but there are weaknesses too. I don’t think it’s OP, Magsorcs and stamwardens are rough opponents. I’d say make a magplar yourself and you’ll see.

JinxxND

The only things that needs a nerf is the snare on the ritual, there is no reason a huge aoe should be snaring everyone passively, it is strong enough with everything else it does with the purifies/heals etc. and living dark, idk why the combat team ever bother putting this one in the game and it seems to be one of the poorly thought out skills in that it snares the person attacking you, all snares/roots need to be activated thru targeting someone not this passive nonsense.

Other then those things I think the class is in a good spot and doesn't need much in terms of buffs or nerfs.

Joinovikova

ThePhantomThorn wrote: »

So. Here’s why there op. And everything this time not just jabs.

1. Jabs.
2. A gap closer that stuns.
3. Extended ritual
4. BURNING LIGHT
5. Snares

So. Explanation.
1. The damage is huge. (A result of a few thing I now realise, 1. Direct damage scaling as of dragonhold 2. Channel time reduced in elsweyr 3. People building higher damage in this patch) And has so many additional effects. But, mostly because of no. 4
2. Imagine if ambush stunned. Or crit rush.
3. The healing is that of healing springs, is a huge area, stacks, and purges 5. 5 effects from you.
4. This takes jabs to a whole new level. Jabs on its own is a little annoying, but with burning light...
5. and if that wasn’t enough, a massive 30% snare on everyone, and a 40% on jabs.

This will be my last nerf Templar thread this patch. I have nothing else to say.

Only jabs need slight nerf to not be so much stronger then any other ability, rest skills are okay. But new patch is near ZOS promise to balanced skills hopefully they will make it based on match no based on forum jabs one button spammers protectors.so pray for make templar more balanced.

Xvorg

ThePhantomThorn wrote: »

So. Here’s why there op. And everything this time not just jabs.

1. Jabs.
2. A gap closer that stuns.
3. Extended ritual
4. BURNING LIGHT
5. Snares

So. Explanation.
1. The damage is huge. (A result of a few thing I now realise, 1. Direct damage scaling as of dragonhold 2. Channel time reduced in elsweyr 3. People building higher damage in this patch) And has so many additional effects. But, mostly because of no. 4
2. Imagine if ambush stunned. Or crit rush.
3. The healing is that of healing springs, is a huge area, stacks, and purges 5. 5 effects from you.
4. This takes jabs to a whole new level. Jabs on its own is a little annoying, but with burning light...
5. and if that wasn’t enough, a massive 30% snare on everyone, and a 40% on jabs.

This will be my last nerf Templar thread this patch. I have nothing else to say.

Instead aking for nerf to templars, ask for buffs to mageblades.

1. Sap tank should be viable again
2. grim focus should give minor berserk again
3. Veiled strike should at least give minor breach. If you prefer a stackable penetration mechanic, perfect
4. Siph sttack should be reworked as they used to be.
5. Give minor magicka steal to base cripple and change degeneration into old Malefic wreath
6. Get rid of cast time on ultis... Maybe a 1 sec cast time on shade to compensate

Xvorg

JinxxND wrote: »

The only things that needs a nerf is the snare on the ritual, there is no reason a huge aoe should be snaring everyone passively, it is strong enough with everything else it does with the purifies/heals etc. and living dark, idk why the combat team ever bother putting this one in the game and it seems to be one of the poorly thought out skills in that it snares the person attacking you, all snares/roots need to be activated thru targeting someone not this passive nonsense.

Other then those things I think the class is in a good spot and doesn't need much in terms of buffs or nerfs.

Why not?

The class is great at zoning, that's one of its identities since Wrobel gave us the speech of the house.

Crixus8000

People really need to learn the difference between strong and op. Templar is an amazing class right now, but I would rather see some other classes get buffed rather than just nerfing templar.

Iskiab

Crixus8000 wrote: »

People really need to learn the difference between strong and op. Templar is an amazing class right now, but I would rather see some other classes get buffed rather than just nerfing templar.

Agreed, I think Warden = DK = Templar = Sorc atm. What sucks are NBs and they need to keep tweaking Necro.

Vyvrhel

Maybe try to play a templar, then after you will feel an urge to post something like "this is my list of stamblade skills that need nerf" consider using these skills and tactics against templars.

Casul

Burning light is the only thing that feels off to me anymore. From what I understand no class has free passive damage anymore. The only exception was sorcerer with implosion. And that got changed last year.

TheBonesXXX

You could argue that jabs is overloaded by this new philosophy, but nerfs?

ThePhantomThorn

Vyvrhel wrote: »

Maybe try to play a templar, then after you will feel an urge to post something like "this is my list of stamblade skills that need nerf" consider using these skills and tactics against templars.

I used to play a little stamplar up to and through scale. In bgs I would hit a dizzy, jabs x2 and my potl would kill them. My healing was insane, and unless I was fighting a team of good players, I would never die. Nb especially died instantly.

Xvorg wrote: »

ThePhantomThorn wrote: »

So. Here’s why there op. And everything this time not just jabs.

1. Jabs.
2. A gap closer that stuns.
3. Extended ritual
4. BURNING LIGHT
5. Snares

So. Explanation.
1. The damage is huge. (A result of a few thing I now realise, 1. Direct damage scaling as of dragonhold 2. Channel time reduced in elsweyr 3. People building higher damage in this patch) And has so many additional effects. But, mostly because of no. 4
2. Imagine if ambush stunned. Or crit rush.
3. The healing is that of healing springs, is a huge area, stacks, and purges 5. 5 effects from you.
4. This takes jabs to a whole new level. Jabs on its own is a little annoying, but with burning light...
5. and if that wasn’t enough, a massive 30% snare on everyone, and a 40% on jabs.

This will be my last nerf Templar thread this patch. I have nothing else to say.

Instead aking for nerf to templars, ask for buffs to mageblades.

1. Sap tank should be viable again
2. grim focus should give minor berserk again
3. Veiled strike should at least give minor breach. If you prefer a stackable penetration mechanic, perfect
4. Siph sttack should be reworked as they used to be.
5. Give minor magicka steal to base cripple and change degeneration into old Malefic wreath
6. Get rid of cast time on ultis... Maybe a 1 sec cast time on shade to compensate

I have a buff nb thread.


But anyways, I’ll just put it like this. Templar never annoyed me before scale. The heal spammers were a pain but that was just one playstyle.
Imo players shouldn’t have a spammable that has so many additional effects, a gapcloser that stuns(it is ridiculous. If ambush stunned people would complain. And it has off balance.)
Extended has too many things. It has a huge heal, AND a purge, AND a snare, AND a synergy. Like imo, take off the snare and stop it stacking and maybe drop the healing a little and it would be good.
Burning light. Free damage. It’s like a proc set you don’t even have to wear.
And the snares are too much. A magdk can snare you a lot, but it has to hit you. Templar is just stand in the vicinity of my existence and you have a 30%, attack me and a 60% and I hit you and that’s a 40%.
Perma snared.

JinxxND

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

The only things that needs a nerf is the snare on the ritual, there is no reason a huge aoe should be snaring everyone passively, it is strong enough with everything else it does with the purifies/heals etc. and living dark, idk why the combat team ever bother putting this one in the game and it seems to be one of the poorly thought out skills in that it snares the person attacking you, all snares/roots need to be activated thru targeting someone not this passive nonsense.

Other then those things I think the class is in a good spot and doesn't need much in terms of buffs or nerfs.

Why not?

The class is great at zoning, that's one of its identities since Wrobel gave us the speech of the house.

The ritual already passively heals and purifies negative affects and has the option for damage on top of everything, you already create a "zone" for your team with those effects with either morph, the passive snare on the biggest aoe in the game is ridiculous on top of creating performance issues with fps drops and lag. You have more then enough zoning tools with gravity crushes, the ritual with it's passives heals, purify, ranged cc's, jabs snare, defensive ult that provides major protection for you and heals for everyone in it's aoe without a cast time etc.

Fighting a team with a magplar rn is dumb cause not only are you snared just trying to engage them because of the ritual that is healing the entire team and can purge all negative effects (which also applies to stamplars) then you light attack only to be snared even harder for trying to fight them cause living dark. Terrible design the skill was fine when it was eclipse as a unique cc that would punish people for not breaking it.

Xvorg

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

The only things that needs a nerf is the snare on the ritual, there is no reason a huge aoe should be snaring everyone passively, it is strong enough with everything else it does with the purifies/heals etc. and living dark, idk why the combat team ever bother putting this one in the game and it seems to be one of the poorly thought out skills in that it snares the person attacking you, all snares/roots need to be activated thru targeting someone not this passive nonsense.

Other then those things I think the class is in a good spot and doesn't need much in terms of buffs or nerfs.

Why not?

The class is great at zoning, that's one of its identities since Wrobel gave us the speech of the house.

The ritual already passively heals and purifies negative affects and has the option for damage on top of everything, you already create a "zone" for your team with those effects with either morph, the passive snare on the biggest aoe in the game is ridiculous on top of creating performance issues with fps drops and lag. You have more then enough zoning tools with gravity crushes, the ritual with it's passives heals, purify, ranged cc's, jabs snare, defensive ult that provides major protection for you and heals for everyone in it's aoe without a cast time etc.

Fighting a team with a magplar rn is dumb cause not only are you snared just trying to engage them because of the ritual that is healing the entire team and can purge all negative effects (which also applies to stamplars) then you light attack only to be snared even harder for trying to fight them cause living dark. Terrible design the skill was fine when it was eclipse as a unique cc that would punish people for not breaking it.

You know, there's a skill called "inevitable detonation" in the assault skill line, that explodes upon purges. Want to really *** off the templar and his group? Just tell you group to use it. One guy using i doesn't make much difference, but 3 or 4 can wreck.

Sure, it has a cast time, and that could be improved, but as long as the team stacks on ritual, they are gonna just dmg themselves

Oh, and the skill can be spammed if the stay in the "house", and has no limit, so you can just put it at least in 3 objectives before it explodes.

JinxxND

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

The only things that needs a nerf is the snare on the ritual, there is no reason a huge aoe should be snaring everyone passively, it is strong enough with everything else it does with the purifies/heals etc. and living dark, idk why the combat team ever bother putting this one in the game and it seems to be one of the poorly thought out skills in that it snares the person attacking you, all snares/roots need to be activated thru targeting someone not this passive nonsense.

Other then those things I think the class is in a good spot and doesn't need much in terms of buffs or nerfs.

Why not?

The class is great at zoning, that's one of its identities since Wrobel gave us the speech of the house.

The ritual already passively heals and purifies negative affects and has the option for damage on top of everything, you already create a "zone" for your team with those effects with either morph, the passive snare on the biggest aoe in the game is ridiculous on top of creating performance issues with fps drops and lag. You have more then enough zoning tools with gravity crushes, the ritual with it's passives heals, purify, ranged cc's, jabs snare, defensive ult that provides major protection for you and heals for everyone in it's aoe without a cast time etc.

Fighting a team with a magplar rn is dumb cause not only are you snared just trying to engage them because of the ritual that is healing the entire team and can purge all negative effects (which also applies to stamplars) then you light attack only to be snared even harder for trying to fight them cause living dark. Terrible design the skill was fine when it was eclipse as a unique cc that would punish people for not breaking it.

You know, there's a skill called "inevitable detonation" in the assault skill line, that explodes upon purges. Want to really *** off the templar and his group? Just tell you group to use it. One guy using i doesn't make much difference, but 3 or 4 can wreck.

Sure, it has a cast time, and that could be improved, but as long as the team stacks on ritual, they are gonna just dmg themselves

Oh, and the skill can be spammed if the stay in the "house", and has no limit, so you can just put it at least in 3 objectives before it explodes.

This is all irrelevant has nothing to do with the snare on ritual and how overloaded that skill is and why it leads to performance issues. The snare needs to get removed. Everything else is fine on the skill and both morphs. That and living dark needs to be looked at, it has been nothing but trouble since it was implemented last patch with the skill audit when it would auto root people for attacking the user with living dark when it was a good cc before it was changed. Auto snaring isn't much better.

Iskiab

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

The only things that needs a nerf is the snare on the ritual, there is no reason a huge aoe should be snaring everyone passively, it is strong enough with everything else it does with the purifies/heals etc. and living dark, idk why the combat team ever bother putting this one in the game and it seems to be one of the poorly thought out skills in that it snares the person attacking you, all snares/roots need to be activated thru targeting someone not this passive nonsense.

Other then those things I think the class is in a good spot and doesn't need much in terms of buffs or nerfs.

Why not?

The class is great at zoning, that's one of its identities since Wrobel gave us the speech of the house.

The ritual already passively heals and purifies negative affects and has the option for damage on top of everything, you already create a "zone" for your team with those effects with either morph, the passive snare on the biggest aoe in the game is ridiculous on top of creating performance issues with fps drops and lag. You have more then enough zoning tools with gravity crushes, the ritual with it's passives heals, purify, ranged cc's, jabs snare, defensive ult that provides major protection for you and heals for everyone in it's aoe without a cast time etc.

Fighting a team with a magplar rn is dumb cause not only are you snared just trying to engage them because of the ritual that is healing the entire team and can purge all negative effects (which also applies to stamplars) then you light attack only to be snared even harder for trying to fight them cause living dark. Terrible design the skill was fine when it was eclipse as a unique cc that would punish people for not breaking it.

You know, there's a skill called "inevitable detonation" in the assault skill line, that explodes upon purges. Want to really *** off the templar and his group? Just tell you group to use it. One guy using i doesn't make much difference, but 3 or 4 can wreck.

Sure, it has a cast time, and that could be improved, but as long as the team stacks on ritual, they are gonna just dmg themselves

Oh, and the skill can be spammed if the stay in the "house", and has no limit, so you can just put it at least in 3 objectives before it explodes.

Yea, inevitable detonation is good... when it works. They should change the tooltip to say 50% chance of doing anything and a 4 second cast time. This skill being busted is one of the big reasons ball groups are so dominant right now.

Sanguinor2

JinxxND wrote: »

Terrible design the skill was fine when it was eclipse as a unique cc that would punish people for not breaking it.

Eclipse previous Iteration was garbage because it did Nothing against anyone that knew how cc Breaking worked.

UppGRAYxDD

Lmao 😂 😆 🤣... NBs complaining about Templars... ohhh how the tables have turnt. Has anyone ever mentioned to OP that the skills to become immune to the “overpowered death snares” are literally baked into the NB class,or accessible via shuffle, or via psijic skill line? Or did everyone just save time and patience by simply stating “L2P”? If you really wanna nerf something, how about purge from the support skill line? Nothing like watching ball groups heal for 7-11k nonstop...

Xvorg

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

The only things that needs a nerf is the snare on the ritual, there is no reason a huge aoe should be snaring everyone passively, it is strong enough with everything else it does with the purifies/heals etc. and living dark, idk why the combat team ever bother putting this one in the game and it seems to be one of the poorly thought out skills in that it snares the person attacking you, all snares/roots need to be activated thru targeting someone not this passive nonsense.

Other then those things I think the class is in a good spot and doesn't need much in terms of buffs or nerfs.

Why not?

The class is great at zoning, that's one of its identities since Wrobel gave us the speech of the house.

The ritual already passively heals and purifies negative affects and has the option for damage on top of everything, you already create a "zone" for your team with those effects with either morph, the passive snare on the biggest aoe in the game is ridiculous on top of creating performance issues with fps drops and lag. You have more then enough zoning tools with gravity crushes, the ritual with it's passives heals, purify, ranged cc's, jabs snare, defensive ult that provides major protection for you and heals for everyone in it's aoe without a cast time etc.

Fighting a team with a magplar rn is dumb cause not only are you snared just trying to engage them because of the ritual that is healing the entire team and can purge all negative effects (which also applies to stamplars) then you light attack only to be snared even harder for trying to fight them cause living dark. Terrible design the skill was fine when it was eclipse as a unique cc that would punish people for not breaking it.

You know, there's a skill called "inevitable detonation" in the assault skill line, that explodes upon purges. Want to really *** off the templar and his group? Just tell you group to use it. One guy using i doesn't make much difference, but 3 or 4 can wreck.

Sure, it has a cast time, and that could be improved, but as long as the team stacks on ritual, they are gonna just dmg themselves

Oh, and the skill can be spammed if the stay in the "house", and has no limit, so you can just put it at least in 3 objectives before it explodes.

This is all irrelevant has nothing to do with the snare on ritual and how overloaded that skill is and why it leads to performance issues. The snare needs to get removed. Everything else is fine on the skill and both morphs. That and living dark needs to be looked at, it has been nothing but trouble since it was implemented last patch with the skill audit when it would auto root people for attacking the user with living dark when it was a good cc before it was changed. Auto snaring isn't much better.

Nothing to do?

Ok, do you really think skills have no counter?

Whenever there's a guy complaining about cloak, don't we recommend to slot a counter?

This is the same, if a skill is strong, then its counter is also strong. If you think deto is not quite strong, then ask for a buff to the skill (at the risk of sorcs using it in their combos).

What cannot be acceptable is to label a skill as OP and never try its natural counters

Xvorg

Iskiab wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

The only things that needs a nerf is the snare on the ritual, there is no reason a huge aoe should be snaring everyone passively, it is strong enough with everything else it does with the purifies/heals etc. and living dark, idk why the combat team ever bother putting this one in the game and it seems to be one of the poorly thought out skills in that it snares the person attacking you, all snares/roots need to be activated thru targeting someone not this passive nonsense.

Other then those things I think the class is in a good spot and doesn't need much in terms of buffs or nerfs.

Why not?

The class is great at zoning, that's one of its identities since Wrobel gave us the speech of the house.

The ritual already passively heals and purifies negative affects and has the option for damage on top of everything, you already create a "zone" for your team with those effects with either morph, the passive snare on the biggest aoe in the game is ridiculous on top of creating performance issues with fps drops and lag. You have more then enough zoning tools with gravity crushes, the ritual with it's passives heals, purify, ranged cc's, jabs snare, defensive ult that provides major protection for you and heals for everyone in it's aoe without a cast time etc.

Fighting a team with a magplar rn is dumb cause not only are you snared just trying to engage them because of the ritual that is healing the entire team and can purge all negative effects (which also applies to stamplars) then you light attack only to be snared even harder for trying to fight them cause living dark. Terrible design the skill was fine when it was eclipse as a unique cc that would punish people for not breaking it.

You know, there's a skill called "inevitable detonation" in the assault skill line, that explodes upon purges. Want to really *** off the templar and his group? Just tell you group to use it. One guy using i doesn't make much difference, but 3 or 4 can wreck.

Sure, it has a cast time, and that could be improved, but as long as the team stacks on ritual, they are gonna just dmg themselves

Oh, and the skill can be spammed if the stay in the "house", and has no limit, so you can just put it at least in 3 objectives before it explodes.

Yea, inevitable detonation is good... when it works. They should change the tooltip to say 50% chance of doing anything and a 4 second cast time. This skill being busted is one of the big reasons ball groups are so dominant right now.

Don't get me wrong, it needs a buff, at least a cast time reduction even if it keeps the 4 sec counter. But I highly doubt ZoS is gonna buff skills that are not used unless they stumble upon them. They think a skill is fine as long as there are no complains about it (which is what happened with molten whip for the las 4 years)

JinxxND

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

The only things that needs a nerf is the snare on the ritual, there is no reason a huge aoe should be snaring everyone passively, it is strong enough with everything else it does with the purifies/heals etc. and living dark, idk why the combat team ever bother putting this one in the game and it seems to be one of the poorly thought out skills in that it snares the person attacking you, all snares/roots need to be activated thru targeting someone not this passive nonsense.

Other then those things I think the class is in a good spot and doesn't need much in terms of buffs or nerfs.

Why not?

The class is great at zoning, that's one of its identities since Wrobel gave us the speech of the house.

The ritual already passively heals and purifies negative affects and has the option for damage on top of everything, you already create a "zone" for your team with those effects with either morph, the passive snare on the biggest aoe in the game is ridiculous on top of creating performance issues with fps drops and lag. You have more then enough zoning tools with gravity crushes, the ritual with it's passives heals, purify, ranged cc's, jabs snare, defensive ult that provides major protection for you and heals for everyone in it's aoe without a cast time etc.

Fighting a team with a magplar rn is dumb cause not only are you snared just trying to engage them because of the ritual that is healing the entire team and can purge all negative effects (which also applies to stamplars) then you light attack only to be snared even harder for trying to fight them cause living dark. Terrible design the skill was fine when it was eclipse as a unique cc that would punish people for not breaking it.

You know, there's a skill called "inevitable detonation" in the assault skill line, that explodes upon purges. Want to really *** off the templar and his group? Just tell you group to use it. One guy using i doesn't make much difference, but 3 or 4 can wreck.

Sure, it has a cast time, and that could be improved, but as long as the team stacks on ritual, they are gonna just dmg themselves

Oh, and the skill can be spammed if the stay in the "house", and has no limit, so you can just put it at least in 3 objectives before it explodes.

This is all irrelevant has nothing to do with the snare on ritual and how overloaded that skill is and why it leads to performance issues. The snare needs to get removed. Everything else is fine on the skill and both morphs. That and living dark needs to be looked at, it has been nothing but trouble since it was implemented last patch with the skill audit when it would auto root people for attacking the user with living dark when it was a good cc before it was changed. Auto snaring isn't much better.

Nothing to do?

Ok, do you really think skills have no counter?

Whenever there's a guy complaining about cloak, don't we recommend to slot a counter?

This is the same, if a skill is strong, then its counter is also strong. If you think deto is not quite strong, then ask for a buff to the skill (at the risk of sorcs using it in their combos).

What cannot be acceptable is to label a skill as OP and never try its natural counters

Slotting inevitable detonation cause you think that's a counter to the skill that purifies makes what point? It has nothing todo with a large aoe snare on ritual that already heals and cleanses negative effects. I'm not even sure what point your trying to make to compare a zerg busting skill to a healing aoe that purifies and snares everything.

It needs the snare removed. Simple as that. The heal on both are fine and the purify is what Templar are known for so that's good but there is no need for that ability to have a snare on top of all that. Also inevitable detonation does nothing to counter that skill that cleanses negative effects.

Xvorg

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

The only things that needs a nerf is the snare on the ritual, there is no reason a huge aoe should be snaring everyone passively, it is strong enough with everything else it does with the purifies/heals etc. and living dark, idk why the combat team ever bother putting this one in the game and it seems to be one of the poorly thought out skills in that it snares the person attacking you, all snares/roots need to be activated thru targeting someone not this passive nonsense.

Other then those things I think the class is in a good spot and doesn't need much in terms of buffs or nerfs.

Why not?

The class is great at zoning, that's one of its identities since Wrobel gave us the speech of the house.

The ritual already passively heals and purifies negative affects and has the option for damage on top of everything, you already create a "zone" for your team with those effects with either morph, the passive snare on the biggest aoe in the game is ridiculous on top of creating performance issues with fps drops and lag. You have more then enough zoning tools with gravity crushes, the ritual with it's passives heals, purify, ranged cc's, jabs snare, defensive ult that provides major protection for you and heals for everyone in it's aoe without a cast time etc.

Fighting a team with a magplar rn is dumb cause not only are you snared just trying to engage them because of the ritual that is healing the entire team and can purge all negative effects (which also applies to stamplars) then you light attack only to be snared even harder for trying to fight them cause living dark. Terrible design the skill was fine when it was eclipse as a unique cc that would punish people for not breaking it.

You know, there's a skill called "inevitable detonation" in the assault skill line, that explodes upon purges. Want to really *** off the templar and his group? Just tell you group to use it. One guy using i doesn't make much difference, but 3 or 4 can wreck.

Sure, it has a cast time, and that could be improved, but as long as the team stacks on ritual, they are gonna just dmg themselves

Oh, and the skill can be spammed if the stay in the "house", and has no limit, so you can just put it at least in 3 objectives before it explodes.

This is all irrelevant has nothing to do with the snare on ritual and how overloaded that skill is and why it leads to performance issues. The snare needs to get removed. Everything else is fine on the skill and both morphs. That and living dark needs to be looked at, it has been nothing but trouble since it was implemented last patch with the skill audit when it would auto root people for attacking the user with living dark when it was a good cc before it was changed. Auto snaring isn't much better.

Nothing to do?

Ok, do you really think skills have no counter?

Whenever there's a guy complaining about cloak, don't we recommend to slot a counter?

This is the same, if a skill is strong, then its counter is also strong. If you think deto is not quite strong, then ask for a buff to the skill (at the risk of sorcs using it in their combos).

What cannot be acceptable is to label a skill as OP and never try its natural counters

Slotting inevitable detonation cause you think that's a counter to the skill that purifies makes what point? It has nothing todo with a large aoe snare on ritual that already heals and cleanses negative effects. I'm not even sure what point your trying to make to compare a zerg busting skill to a healing aoe that purifies and snares everything.

It needs the snare removed. Simple as that. The heal on both are fine and the purify is what Templar are known for so that's good but there is no need for that ability to have a snare on top of all that. Also inevitable detonation does nothing to counter that skill that cleanses negative effects.

Snares are countered through range or not?

If you are going melee against a templar you must be prepared to be snared. Is like going melee against a DK hoping he's not goig to CC you.

In any case, drop the snare on templar side, but give them something to be a threat on melee. Otherwise you are nerfing the class for the sole sake of nerfing it. What about major expedition on solar barrage, or give them back the stun on shards?

Regarding Deto. How is that it does nothing? You know, the bomb instead of being purged, explodes. If you apply the bomb again, and the templar purge sit, it explodes again. Inevitabily, there's a point in which the templar will have to juggle his magicka/health

JinxxND

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

Terrible design the skill was fine when it was eclipse as a unique cc that would punish people for not breaking it.

Eclipse previous Iteration was garbage because it did Nothing against anyone that knew how cc Breaking worked.

It literally caused bad players to kill themselves if they didn't cc break or when they tried to go for the kill at low hp and if they did cc break it acted as any other cc in the game should causing people to cc break and burn stam burning a gcd breaking free.

JinxxND

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

JinxxND wrote: »

The only things that needs a nerf is the snare on the ritual, there is no reason a huge aoe should be snaring everyone passively, it is strong enough with everything else it does with the purifies/heals etc. and living dark, idk why the combat team ever bother putting this one in the game and it seems to be one of the poorly thought out skills in that it snares the person attacking you, all snares/roots need to be activated thru targeting someone not this passive nonsense.

Other then those things I think the class is in a good spot and doesn't need much in terms of buffs or nerfs.

Why not?

The class is great at zoning, that's one of its identities since Wrobel gave us the speech of the house.

The ritual already passively heals and purifies negative affects and has the option for damage on top of everything, you already create a "zone" for your team with those effects with either morph, the passive snare on the biggest aoe in the game is ridiculous on top of creating performance issues with fps drops and lag. You have more then enough zoning tools with gravity crushes, the ritual with it's passives heals, purify, ranged cc's, jabs snare, defensive ult that provides major protection for you and heals for everyone in it's aoe without a cast time etc.

Fighting a team with a magplar rn is dumb cause not only are you snared just trying to engage them because of the ritual that is healing the entire team and can purge all negative effects (which also applies to stamplars) then you light attack only to be snared even harder for trying to fight them cause living dark. Terrible design the skill was fine when it was eclipse as a unique cc that would punish people for not breaking it.

You know, there's a skill called "inevitable detonation" in the assault skill line, that explodes upon purges. Want to really *** off the templar and his group? Just tell you group to use it. One guy using i doesn't make much difference, but 3 or 4 can wreck.

Sure, it has a cast time, and that could be improved, but as long as the team stacks on ritual, they are gonna just dmg themselves

Oh, and the skill can be spammed if the stay in the "house", and has no limit, so you can just put it at least in 3 objectives before it explodes.

This is all irrelevant has nothing to do with the snare on ritual and how overloaded that skill is and why it leads to performance issues. The snare needs to get removed. Everything else is fine on the skill and both morphs. That and living dark needs to be looked at, it has been nothing but trouble since it was implemented last patch with the skill audit when it would auto root people for attacking the user with living dark when it was a good cc before it was changed. Auto snaring isn't much better.

Nothing to do?

Ok, do you really think skills have no counter?

Whenever there's a guy complaining about cloak, don't we recommend to slot a counter?

This is the same, if a skill is strong, then its counter is also strong. If you think deto is not quite strong, then ask for a buff to the skill (at the risk of sorcs using it in their combos).

What cannot be acceptable is to label a skill as OP and never try its natural counters

Slotting inevitable detonation cause you think that's a counter to the skill that purifies makes what point? It has nothing todo with a large aoe snare on ritual that already heals and cleanses negative effects. I'm not even sure what point your trying to make to compare a zerg busting skill to a healing aoe that purifies and snares everything.

It needs the snare removed. Simple as that. The heal on both are fine and the purify is what Templar are known for so that's good but there is no need for that ability to have a snare on top of all that. Also inevitable detonation does nothing to counter that skill that cleanses negative effects.

Snares are countered through range or not?

If you are going melee against a templar you must be prepared to be snared. Is like going melee against a DK hoping he's not goig to CC you.

In any case, drop the snare on templar side, but give them something to be a threat on melee. Otherwise you are nerfing the class for the sole sake of nerfing it. What about major expedition on solar barrage, or give them back the stun on shards?

Regarding Deto. How is that it does nothing? You know, the bomb instead of being purged, explodes. If you apply the bomb again, and the templar purge sit, it explodes again. Inevitabily, there's a point in which the templar will have to juggle his magicka/health

Okay I think we are going into the L2P department now, no snares are not countered by range they are countered by snare removal, taking the snare off ritual isn't nerfing the class the class I think everyone knows and is in agreement that it is in a great spot all around, taking the snare off an ability that already heals and cleanses also has the option of damage on the biggest aoe in the entire game isn't going to hurt the class. The ability is already overloaded in what it does which is fine but having a snare on something that you don't even have to aim and it lingers in the area is ridiculous, every other snares in the game you have to aim or target an area. Talking about melee as a magplar not only are you snared by the jabs your also snared by living dark on top of fighting in the ritual which also snares. It is still a threat in melee.

Jabs snares but you have to aim it which is fine, rending slashes single target snare that you have to aim fine, caltrops aoe that is literally sole purpose to snare that once again you have to aim fine aoe is also smaller the ritual, ritual biggest aoe in the game that you don't have to aim also heals everyone in it and allows them to purify also snares everyone that enter and lingers even if you pop snare removal not okay not even close to balanced or fine

Iskiab

I think the thinking behind the snare was some classes were faster than others, some got speed buffs and some got snares.

It’s a bit outdated these days, every class has access to expedition and some can snare better than others. I kite better on my templar then magblade.

Sanguinor2

JinxxND wrote: »

It literally caused bad players to kill themselves if they didn't cc break or when they tried to go for the kill at low hp and if they did cc break it acted as any other cc in the game should causing people to cc break and burn stam burning a gcd breaking free.

Exactly. But it did Nothing against anyone that knew cc Breaking eclipse was a Thing, which happen to be those Players you actually needed a cc against. CC that actually causes your enemy to loose Control of their character until broken gives a burst opportunity where no block or burst heal or dodge is Happening to counter your burst. Eclipse didnt give that.

TheBonesXXX

Overloaded is overloaded, either ZOS is thorough in their decisions to balance or they're not.

EtTuBrutus

It's just funny it's suddenly overloaded

Iskiab

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

It's just funny it's suddenly overloaded

Are everyone who’s saying it’s overloaded a NB? As a NB, everything looks overloaded.

ThePhantomThorn

Iskiab wrote: »

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

It's just funny it's suddenly overloaded

Are everyone who’s saying it’s overloaded a NB? As a NB, everything looks overloaded.

sad but true. played magsorc again today.
omg. feels like.. as if bow got a 500% damage buff