The ghost town

r34lian

Even after making dlc available for free it still failed proves how dumb design of content it was.
From telvar to district to sewer it was just one bad design.
What's worse was absence of MMR or skills rating than imposing loss of telvar this method was bound to be failure.
You can't simply put players of every skill rating and expect the lower to perform ,it's like matching up a bronze skill player against a grandmaster where the latter will always win and then people complain of zergs
Surely this could work in cyrodil because how huge of map also people don't lose ap from dying no matter to what skill level but here?
Another worst aspect making it a pvpve.
This is gankers galore or push people towards more of scummy gamplay.
People would say it's risk vs reward but the amount of reward acquired isn't enough worth that grivenece or risk.
Another major issue lack of alliance content , there is simply nothing to do besides capturing districts also lack of transition way shrine which makes navigation slow
Also not to mention the dlc was way blant and add to that forcing grivenece gamplay in the name of risk and reward was a major reason for failure of this dlc , just hope we don't get this kind of dumb design in future.

Wtf had typo and no one saw it

FierceSam

I suspect the reason they made the Imperial City DLC free recently was to see what demand, if any, there was for additional PvP environments. I’d imagine the demand will be low. So, ultimately they won’t be developing more content like this.

My experience is it has little or no value as a solo questing environment, and ZOS have been unable to develop an adequate, working group questing system that is beyond ‘capture the flag’ mechanics. I think its sole value is in providing an XvXvX conflict space.

However, here the adaptation/learning curve is very high and very steep and ZOS provides no simple ways to help new PvP players or groups adjust. Things like having an inventory size large enough to allow my character to have both a PvE and a PvP set up (because they will be different) and have space for loot and stuff, making it easy to switch between PvE and PvP gearsets, allowing me to easily swap skill setups (they’ll need to be different too), assign CP (yup won’t be the same). All these act as major roadblocks to players even wanting to do PvP, much less actually doing it and progressing.

The fact for ZOS is that PvP may be desirable, it may have a very dedicated playerbase, but it doesn’t bring in any money.

JamieAubrey

IC is and will always be empty except on event days, not really a reason to go there these days and if you do you will be ganked from NBs anyway

Kel

This sounds like a PC perspective.
I can tell you on PS4, IC is always fairly busy, and it's a zerg heaven for the most part.

I see solo players who are known (at least on our platform) who'll talk all kinds of trash on "zerglings", and yet in IC are running in 25 man zergs and bagging solo players. (The attitude of players in this game is so weird....but that's a different topic)

IC is busy on PS4. Solo play and ganking still happens, but never (or, not as easily I should say) at prime time when zergs are roaming and fighting.

I also disagree PvP doesn't bring in money...
PvP players are the ones to most likely buy skyshards and skill lines, since they spend thier time in Cyrodiil/IC/Battlegrounds, and don't want to leave that environment to grind PvE for anything...
Not to mention costumes, mounts, motifs, and clown crates. What good is killing if you're not looking cool while doing it? I see more apex mounts in Cyrodiil than I do in PvE overland.
PvP brings a ton of money in. Saying it doesn't is simply a myth.

Edit: I'm not claiming that PvP players spend more....only Zos knows that. But they DO spend money. The number of times in my own group guys have said "F-it" and just bought a skill line is very very high.

Michae

I don't mind losing Tel Var but gaining them takes forever. I'm mostly a solo player and my guildies aren't interested in IC anyway. Grouping up with random people in IC doesn't work as they scatter around most of the time, it only really worked during the events.

Cirantille

I dont mix my PvP with PvE.
Bad idea.
If I am questing, it needs to be in peace.

wild_kmacdb16_ESO

Bottom line is: If you don’t enjoy ganking or being ganked, why bother?

Asardes

Schroedinger's IC: Empty but you still get ganked and zerged down from time to time

TBois

I went in there on solo my stam sorc and had some fun Sunday night. I ran into other solo players as well as small and large groups.

Keep in mind that the IC was supposed to be a reward for a faction tied into cyrodiil pvp, similar to DAOC's Darkness Falls. It is just another pvp system that was never fully implemented the way the initial development team that work on it wanted, along with the original design of the Justice System.

Also as far as pvp not bringing in money, it's because they chased away their pvp playerbase with largely unaddressed *** performance for 5 years. Campaigns had a larger population cap at launch and players could pop lock multiple campaigns. Ultimately zos squandered the opportunity for this to be the pvp game they advertised for launch, the DAOC successor.

Qbiken

Who could´ve known that making the DLC free and make it easier to access wouldn´t increase the population..........
Ohh ye, literally anyone with half a brain, because outside of tel-var there´s no reason to go there. Only reason I go there these days is because I found out there´s a costume I can get through doing daily quests (similar to gladiator proofs)

Asardes wrote: »

Schroedinger's IC: Empty but you still get ganked and zerged down from time to time

Lmao xD

Asardes

I only go once per character, for the sky shards and the skill point for the main quest.

Emmagoldman

IC is one the best designed zones. It lacks reward besides fillling up on alchemy which is lucrative.

The devs shouldnt look at ic as a dlc. Its an alternative game mode and should be added to every patch (as cyro). It should be end game in mind. If neglected, it will be ignored. Players will get bored of the same map for 4 years.

There's been a million ideas added but its really up to zos to implement or put resources into it.

On rewards:
Id love to see gold vendor visit. The amount of dlcs and sets added is massive. Really ZOS, we can afford to double the rate of golden and allow the use of telvar.

Add furniture option and recipes unique to the zone.

Offer jewelery mats

Add additional sets or revisit the ones there.

Add to the map! Can we keep going down in the sewers? Add new systems of game play and design that can tie into a territory design and emp system.

Tons of options, but it needs some love!

VaranisArano

I really enjoyed the Imperial City quest, but aside from events and rarely wanting a tel var item, I mostly stick to Cyrodiil.

Imperial City, oddly enough, seems to be the only PVP zone that actually works in any sense with low pop. Low pop IC features gankers, duelers, and Tel Var farmers, which makes for decent ultra-small scale or solo PVP if that's the playstyle you like. Its just that there arent too many players for whom that's their preferred playstyle. In comparison, both Cyrodiil and BGs turn into an uncompetitive mess at low population.

TBois

I was happy to see they added the storage boxes for your home as a tel var reward. That's the only reason I need tel var, to keep me from buying it with crowns.

FierceSam

Kel wrote: »

This sounds like a PC perspective.

I also disagree PvP doesn't bring in money...
PvP players are the ones to most likely buy skyshards and skill lines, since they spend thier time in Cyrodiil/IC/Battlegrounds, and don't want to leave that environment to grind PvE for anything...
Not to mention costumes, mounts, motifs, and clown crates. What good is killing if you're not looking cool while doing it? I see more apex mounts in Cyrodiil than I do in PvE overland.
PvP brings a ton of money in. Saying it doesn't is simply a myth.

Edit: I'm not claiming that PvP players spend more....only Zos knows that. But they DO spend money. The number of times in my own group guys have said "F-it" and just bought a skill line is very very high.

I agree that PvP players spend money just as PvE players do. However, it struck me that PvP content itself brings in no additional income to ZOS at the moment. Cyrodiil and BGs are base game, while Imperial City is free. There is no paid for PvP content in the game. So while there is plenty of endgame PvE content that ZOS is producing that is bringing in money, PvP content isn't.

Now, I'm not sure that is particularly relevant in terms of the future of PvP. It may be that ZOS sees PvP as a vital part of the base game. It may be that once they have sorted out the Activity Finder, they intend to put a load of effort into developing DLC BGs and other PvP content. But right now, PvP by itself is not a money earner for them.

gatekeeper13

I remember having a good amount of Telvar stones, which I mostly gathered from daily rewards of many months if I remember correctly. I decided to give IC a try and do some of its pve content, mainly to gather more telvar and spent it on merchants. I wasnt wearing pvp traits or sets, since my build was purely a pve one. Guess what? While I was fighting some trash mobs, a guy jumped from nowhere and killed me in seconds, taking all my Tel Var stones. It was the last time I entered IC. Never been there after that.

You seriously cant mix pve with pvp and expect it to be a success. No wonder this dlc is such a big failure, even as a free one.

BlueRaven

IC had a really great storyline which I have completed now on two characters. (This was before the redesign.) But I am not a pvp player and under the current design I have no desire to go back.

It’s a shame because it is an interesting zone, with some fun Easter eggs. But as long as it stays a pvp zone I won’t be going back.

Ohtimbar

been spendin’ most our lives livin’ in a ganksters paradise

Asardes

Ohtimbar wrote: »

been spendin’ most our lives livin’ in a ganksters paradise

[Dies and drops 50K TV to a stalking NB]

Kel

FierceSam wrote: »

Kel wrote: »

This sounds like a PC perspective.

I also disagree PvP doesn't bring in money...
PvP players are the ones to most likely buy skyshards and skill lines, since they spend thier time in Cyrodiil/IC/Battlegrounds, and don't want to leave that environment to grind PvE for anything...
Not to mention costumes, mounts, motifs, and clown crates. What good is killing if you're not looking cool while doing it? I see more apex mounts in Cyrodiil than I do in PvE overland.
PvP brings a ton of money in. Saying it doesn't is simply a myth.

Edit: I'm not claiming that PvP players spend more....only Zos knows that. But they DO spend money. The number of times in my own group guys have said "F-it" and just bought a skill line is very very high.

I agree that PvP players spend money just as PvE players do. However, it struck me that PvP content itself brings in no additional income to ZOS at the moment. Cyrodiil and BGs are base game, while Imperial City is free. There is no paid for PvP content in the game. So while there is plenty of endgame PvE content that ZOS is producing that is bringing in money, PvP content isn't.

Now, I'm not sure that is particularly relevant in terms of the future of PvP. It may be that ZOS sees PvP as a vital part of the base game. It may be that once they have sorted out the Activity Finder, they intend to put a load of effort into developing DLC BGs and other PvP content. But right now, PvP by itself is not a money earner for them.

Fair enough.

I can agree content wise, PvP doesn't bring much.
And while I would love somemore PvP dedicated DLC, I think sadly the population is mostly moving on. It's definitely dwindling if a highly requested campaign (unlocked factions) can't fill.
While there's not much to compare to, I do think you're right...as far as a straight content drop, I don't think a PvP DLC would do well.

Finedaible

They gave it away because IC dlc was deemed a failure. It was probably worth injecting that small bit of free dlc to entice new players into playing ESO. It's all about hooking people in with offers of free stuff. People always want free stuff, even if it is poop.

Finedaible

Scamp spawns in AD branch of the sewers have been bugged af for how many years now?

karekiz

Kel wrote: »

I also disagree PvP doesn't bring in money...

This I disagree with. I mean every section brings in money, but the amount of money is what counts. If PvP focused game play options brought in a ton of money, we wouldn't be seeing PvE DLC's, we would be seeing PvP.

Saying that I would like a PvP DLC though, and yes this was supposed to be Darkness Falls ESO DAoC 2. However, GW2 said the exact same thing. Multiple games have tried to be DAOC 2, but fell of their face. I think DAoC realm wars honestly had a upper hand since it was a big "first". Most of the news games are going to end up "Well its good, but I miss X" - "Well its good, but its not as smooth as Y MMO".

Nobody cared if you lagged in older MMO's. Everybody lagged and you didn't have a choice. Now its a bigger deal breaker.

Kel

karekiz wrote: »

Kel wrote: »

I also disagree PvP doesn't bring in money...

This I disagree with. I mean every section brings in money, but the amount of money is what counts. If PvP focused game play options brought in a ton of money, we wouldn't be seeing PvE DLC's, we would be seeing PvP.

Saying that I would like a PvP DLC though, and yes this was supposed to be Darkness Falls ESO DAoC 2. However, GW2 said the exact same thing. Multiple games have tried to be DAOC 2, but fell of their face. I think DAoC realm wars honestly had a upper hand since it was a big "first". Most of the news games are going to end up "Well its good, but I miss X" - "Well its good, but its not as smooth as Y MMO".

Nobody cared if you lagged in older MMO's. Everybody lagged and you didn't have a choice. Now its a bigger deal breaker.

Read my follow up....

Kel wrote: »

FierceSam wrote: »

Kel wrote: »

This sounds like a PC perspective.

I also disagree PvP doesn't bring in money...
PvP players are the ones to most likely buy skyshards and skill lines, since they spend thier time in Cyrodiil/IC/Battlegrounds, and don't want to leave that environment to grind PvE for anything...
Not to mention costumes, mounts, motifs, and clown crates. What good is killing if you're not looking cool while doing it? I see more apex mounts in Cyrodiil than I do in PvE overland.
PvP brings a ton of money in. Saying it doesn't is simply a myth.

Edit: I'm not claiming that PvP players spend more....only Zos knows that. But they DO spend money. The number of times in my own group guys have said "F-it" and just bought a skill line is very very high.

I agree that PvP players spend money just as PvE players do. However, it struck me that PvP content itself brings in no additional income to ZOS at the moment. Cyrodiil and BGs are base game, while Imperial City is free. There is no paid for PvP content in the game. So while there is plenty of endgame PvE content that ZOS is producing that is bringing in money, PvP content isn't.

Now, I'm not sure that is particularly relevant in terms of the future of PvP. It may be that ZOS sees PvP as a vital part of the base game. It may be that once they have sorted out the Activity Finder, they intend to put a load of effort into developing DLC BGs and other PvP content. But right now, PvP by itself is not a money earner for them.

Fair enough.

I can agree content wise, PvP doesn't bring much.
And while I would love somemore PvP dedicated DLC, I think sadly the population is mostly moving on. It's definitely dwindling if a highly requested campaign (unlocked factions) can't fill.
While there's not much to compare to, I do think you're right...as far as a straight content drop, I don't think a PvP DLC would do well.

AlnilamE

karekiz wrote: »

Kel wrote: »

I also disagree PvP doesn't bring in money...

This I disagree with. I mean every section brings in money, but the amount of money is what counts. If PvP focused game play options brought in a ton of money, we wouldn't be seeing PvE DLC's, we would be seeing PvP.

Saying that I would like a PvP DLC though, and yes this was supposed to be Darkness Falls ESO DAoC 2. However, GW2 said the exact same thing. Multiple games have tried to be DAOC 2, but fell of their face. I think DAoC realm wars honestly had a upper hand since it was a big "first". Most of the news games are going to end up "Well its good, but I miss X" - "Well its good, but its not as smooth as Y MMO".

Nobody cared if you lagged in older MMO's. Everybody lagged and you didn't have a choice. Now its a bigger deal breaker.

The thing is, PvP players don't exist in a vacuum. The PvPers I know buy houses, have houses outfitted with all the Mundus stones and buy the Chapters/subscribe.

They play because of PvP, but they do other stuff as well, and that means they spend money. and as others mentioned, I'm sure some do spend money on the skyshards/skill lines as well.

AhPook_Is_Here

I was pretty hyped about IC before it came out because I thought it was going to be like darkness falls from daoc, or WHO land of the dead, when they changed their design concept I really lost interest and never purchased the DLC, I went in one time on the beta and it was OK but there was nothing to it that you couldn't get in Cyrodiil and Cyrodiil was more fun because there wasn't a bunch of trash mobs everywhere. The dungeons I didn't care about either, so there was nothing for them to sell me, it wasn't a conscious boycott, there just was no value proposal for me.

Agalloch

It' s not a Ghost Town on PC-EU , especially at peak hours.

Every time I enter IC I see plenty of people.

IC is one of the best content created in ESO . i'D like another zone like this but more bigger...and maybe with other objectives..or I'd like to see IC improved.

Until this dreaams will come true I hope for performance improvements and an working group finder,

English is not my native language.