Housing feedback

AefionBloodclaw

I just learned that Elara Northwind has quit ESO and one of the reasons was ZoS' disgusting behaviour towards the Housing community, constantly ignoring and not even acknowledging feedback and refusing to listen at all. You people actually make me really angry at times and this is no exception, you should be ashamed that one of the most prominent and amazing people in the housing community has decided to quit, with one of her reasons being this. Pathetic, well don't be surprised if you lose a lot of support and money as a result, it's not surprising that you've already lost hundreds of subscribers recently because of your poor quality service and attitude towards your players 😡

Tigerseye

That's a shame.

Sad to see her go, she seems very nice.

Hopefully, things will improve, soon.

They appear to have put a dev on this sub-forum, recently.

So far, they only seem to have been congratulating people on their builds, but it's possible it's part of an attempt to listen to us more, from now on.

AefionBloodclaw

Well, having just finished the Southern Elsweyr zone I'm not happy to report that ZoS have again made it harder to acquire furnishings: in order for you to unlock the achievement furnisher (which was never locked before) you have to grind through dumb dailies, which many players don't want to do. This hurts the housing in the game. But since ZoS don't listen to their player community its not surprising at all.

Tigerseye

AefionBloodclaw wrote: »

Well, having just finished the Southern Elsweyr zone I'm not happy to report that ZoS have again made it harder to acquire furnishings: in order for you to unlock the achievement furnisher (which was never locked before) you have to grind through dumb dailies, which many players don't want to do. This hurts the housing in the game. But since ZoS don't listen to their player community its not surprising at all.

Yeah, I know.

To be fair, it's not as grindy as it may at first seem, but I agree that it is an interesting choice to force people to do dailies, when they just want to furnish.

Of course, the more content you do in these zones, the more of the style mats you get, so there is that, at least.

StabbityDoom

I'm sorry to hear her go What specifically was her concern (there are plenty to choose from, just wondering which one she felt wasn't communicated/helped to the point she quit - the straw that broke the Elara's back, if you will).

Tigerseye

StabbityDoom wrote: »

I'm sorry to hear her go What specifically was her concern (there are plenty to choose from, just wondering which one she felt wasn't communicated/helped to the point she quit - the straw that broke the Elara's back, if you will).

She was saying she was threatened, at one point.

She didn't think they would actually do anything, in real life, but she didn't think (what with that and everything else) it was worth carrying on.

No idea who threatened her, or why, obviously.

There are people who don't like the housing community, because they think housing misdirects attention away from the parts of the game they like and/or they don't think people should be paying real money into a game that has performance issues.

Some don't realise that almost all furnishings are attainable in-game - so, they may look at furnished houses and think people are pouring far more money into housing than they actually are.

I mean, it still must be a good source of income for ZOS, but it isn't as much as they think.

So, maybe it was because of that?

Or maybe it was something else entirely?

anadandy

That's really sad to hear - I loved her videos, she was always so positive and genuinely enthusiastic.

Tigerseye

anadandy wrote: »

That's really sad to hear - I loved her videos, she was always so positive and genuinely enthusiastic.

Yeah, she seems very nice.

TheImperfect

There was a theft in a guild she was a member of during the guild Bank issues. Some gold went missing. I don't know a lot about it but it was one of the reasons she left.

Jaraal

I don't really have anything to add, I'm just here for the gossip, speculation, and second hand rumors!

Tigerseye

mrsrobot wrote: »

There was a theft in a guild she was a member of during the guild Bank issues. Some gold went missing. I don't know a lot about it but it was one of the reasons she left.

So, you're saying she was given permission to withdraw gold and then withdrew some, without asking?

In which case, it's not technically theft, is it?

They could have just asked her why she withdrew it and asked her to repay it, when she could.

I have never been given permission to withdraw gold, despite being given a fairly high level rank in one guild I'm in, so it's kind of odd to give someone gold withdrawal permission and then accuse them of theft.

Personally, I would always ask before I withdrew gold, even if I could, or (more likely) I would not do it at all, but I think I'm unusual in that way.

I think lots of people would assume it was OK to use it as a loan, at least, without asking.

That is why most guilds don't allow anyone except the leader(s) to withdraw gold.

Tigerseye

Having cast my mind back, I think I have now realised exactly where, when and how it probably happened, because I think I was there at the time and saw someone asking if people had Elsweyr furnishing plans they could stick on the guild store, for them to buy...

So, they were willing to share the gold with other members of the guild, at least, rather than just finding the cheapest plans on other guild stores.

Whether it was theft, or just wishful thinking, that if they acted fast and ZOS didn't ask for the gold back (especially if it had already been spent!), it didn't really matter, I think is somewhat debatable.

After all, that extra gold didn't really belong to the guilds, either and we don't know whether the intention was to just use it as a loan, or not.

If this person hadn't ever withdrawn gold without asking, before the guild trader multiple bid refund issue happened, despite being able to if they had wanted to, it would strongly suggest wishful thinking, to me.

Not saying it's right, but it's not like intentional theft of the guild's legitimate gold reserves.

When ZOS did take the extra gold back, this person should obviously have offered to repay it to the guild (gradually, if necessary), though.

...and even if ZOS hadn't done so, this person would still have technically owed it; as it would have been the guild's windfall, not theirs.

As long as they offered to do so, even fairly slowly, there was no real reason for threats.

Even now, this could probably be sorted out, if there was good will (and patience) on both sides.

Elara_Northwind

Awwww, thank you very much for the sweet comments It was a difficult decision and had many contributing factors both to do with ZOS and the game itself (It's very true that player feedback is rarely, if ever acknowledged, not just for housing aspects either, and it makes me wonder what the point of us giving up so much of our time to give ZOS our feedback on the PTS actually is!) and also certain individuals in the game, and the guild bank theft most certainly threw a log onto the fire!

It was my own small guild that the gold was stolen from, everybody had access to the bank as we used it as a place to put furnishings and plans we didn't need so that others may use them, but the gold was only accessible by myself and a small handful of others, and it had been saved up by everybody for a guild hall that we planned to build together. People were contributing small amounts each week, whatever they could spare, others would donate large one off amounts! The fact that it was a group effort made the theft so much worse, as well as the fact that only the people I trusted and deemed good friends had access to it.

I didn't notice until it was too late that the gold was gone, I had no reason to check up on it, and one day I went to deposit some gold into the bank and it was pretty much empty. Because I didn't notice immediately, it never showed up in the guild history, which I feel should probably last more than 5 days for situations such as this! I contacted ZOS who would not tell me who took it, and the person never owned up to it but we are pretty certain we know who did it anyway, as who we suspect to be the same person also cleared out the gold and any valuables from our NA branch and then left the guild, which somebody did notice before it was too late and they even admitted to it and didn't seem to think they had done anything wrong because I had passed guild leadership to somebody else who they didn't personally like! But nothing ever came of it even after knowing who took it.

This is the same person who essentially started to stalk and harass me when I told them I wasn't interested in being more than just friends... I suppose the lesson learned is that you can't always trust the people in the game who have been your friends for years and who you never thought would be capable of such a thing... So many people just ended up showing their true colours and not being who I thought they were, but that individual was the worst of them and genuinely ruined my enjoyment of the game in the end with constant harassment not only towards myself but to others who were close to me.

I feel like there should be more repercussions for people who behave in this way in the game, as I am genuinely concerned about this person still playing the game and being able to harass other people as obsessively! He is a sociopath who I am petty sure was behind my computer being hacked as I don't know who else would want to hack into my discord, right after I removed him from it. I became paranoid and no longer have my headset plugged in, cover up my webcam and literally get paranoid about him breaking into my house sometimes, which is ridiculous I know, but people in a game should not cause you to feel this way. He shouldn't be around other humans and still is doing things now to try and get to me, such as trying to get my videos taken down for ridiculous reasons. It's scary that there are people like this out there, and I urge everybody to be extra careful about who your friends are in the game! Not everybody is who they seem to be.

Tigerseye

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

Awwww, thank you very much for the sweet comments It was a difficult decision and had many contributing factors both to do with ZOS and the game itself (It's very true that player feedback is rarely, if ever acknowledged, not just for housing aspects either, and it makes me wonder what the point of us giving up so much of our time to give ZOS our feedback on the PTS actually is!) and also certain individuals in the game, and the guild bank theft most certainly threw a log onto the fire!

It was my own small guild that the gold was stolen from, everybody had access to the bank as we used it as a place to put furnishings and plans we didn't need so that others may use them, but the gold was only accessible by myself and a small handful of others, and it had been saved up by everybody for a guild hall that we planned to build together. People were contributing small amounts each week, whatever they could spare, others would donate large one off amounts! The fact that it was a group effort made the theft so much worse, as well as the fact that only the people I trusted and deemed good friends had access to it.

I didn't notice until it was too late that the gold was gone, I had no reason to check up on it, and one day I went to deposit some gold into the bank and it was pretty much empty. Because I didn't notice immediately, it never showed up in the guild history, which I feel should probably last more than 5 days for situations such as this! I contacted ZOS who would not tell me who took it, and the person never owned up to it but we are pretty certain we know who did it anyway, as who we suspect to be the same person also cleared out the gold and any valuables from our NA branch and then left the guild, which somebody did notice before it was too late and they even admitted to it and didn't seem to think they had done anything wrong because I had passed guild leadership to somebody else who they didn't personally like! But nothing ever came of it even after knowing who took it.

This is the same person who essentially started to stalk and harass me when I told them I wasn't interested in being more than just friends... I suppose the lesson learned is that you can't always trust the people in the game who have been your friends for years and who you never thought would be capable of such a thing... So many people just ended up showing their true colours and not being who I thought they were, but that individual was the worst of them and genuinely ruined my enjoyment of the game in the end with constant harassment not only towards myself but to others who were close to me.

I feel like there should be more repercussions for people who behave in this way in the game, as I am genuinely concerned about this person still playing the game and being able to harass other people as obsessively! He is a sociopath who I am petty sure was behind my computer being hacked as I don't know who else would want to hack into my discord, right after I removed him from it. I became paranoid and no longer have my headset plugged in, cover up my webcam and literally get paranoid about him breaking into my house sometimes, which is ridiculous I know, but people in a game should not cause you to feel this way. He shouldn't be around other humans and still is doing things now to try and get to me, such as trying to get my videos taken down for ridiculous reasons. It's scary that there are people like this out there, and I urge everybody to be extra careful about who your friends are in the game! Not everybody is who they seem to be.

Thanks for responding and clarifying things.

You shouldn't feel forced to leave because of someone like this.

ZOS should look into it and if necessary (which it looks like it would be) do something about it.

I appreciate they can't look into every minor disagreement, but it seems as though this went way beyond that.

Can we take it you told ZOS all about this, already?

SantieClaws

Or if the gods fail to act can you take it to the police?

Keep a note of everything. Dates and times etc. What seems insignificant at the time may build up enough of an overall picture to be useful.

This one has friends who have suffered in a similar way - one of whom had to pretend to leave her country in order to shake off her stalker. In the end he was jailed for an attack on a former partner.

It should not have to be you though who changes what you do, how you live. This one would carry on as always but this one is stubborn as a mule and prone to chasing burglars with curtain poles and the like …

Yours with paws
Santie Claws

Elara_Northwind

Tigerseye wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

Awwww, thank you very much for the sweet comments It was a difficult decision and had many contributing factors both to do with ZOS and the game itself (It's very true that player feedback is rarely, if ever acknowledged, not just for housing aspects either, and it makes me wonder what the point of us giving up so much of our time to give ZOS our feedback on the PTS actually is!) and also certain individuals in the game, and the guild bank theft most certainly threw a log onto the fire!

It was my own small guild that the gold was stolen from, everybody had access to the bank as we used it as a place to put furnishings and plans we didn't need so that others may use them, but the gold was only accessible by myself and a small handful of others, and it had been saved up by everybody for a guild hall that we planned to build together. People were contributing small amounts each week, whatever they could spare, others would donate large one off amounts! The fact that it was a group effort made the theft so much worse, as well as the fact that only the people I trusted and deemed good friends had access to it.

I didn't notice until it was too late that the gold was gone, I had no reason to check up on it, and one day I went to deposit some gold into the bank and it was pretty much empty. Because I didn't notice immediately, it never showed up in the guild history, which I feel should probably last more than 5 days for situations such as this! I contacted ZOS who would not tell me who took it, and the person never owned up to it but we are pretty certain we know who did it anyway, as who we suspect to be the same person also cleared out the gold and any valuables from our NA branch and then left the guild, which somebody did notice before it was too late and they even admitted to it and didn't seem to think they had done anything wrong because I had passed guild leadership to somebody else who they didn't personally like! But nothing ever came of it even after knowing who took it.

This is the same person who essentially started to stalk and harass me when I told them I wasn't interested in being more than just friends... I suppose the lesson learned is that you can't always trust the people in the game who have been your friends for years and who you never thought would be capable of such a thing... So many people just ended up showing their true colours and not being who I thought they were, but that individual was the worst of them and genuinely ruined my enjoyment of the game in the end with constant harassment not only towards myself but to others who were close to me.

I feel like there should be more repercussions for people who behave in this way in the game, as I am genuinely concerned about this person still playing the game and being able to harass other people as obsessively! He is a sociopath who I am petty sure was behind my computer being hacked as I don't know who else would want to hack into my discord, right after I removed him from it. I became paranoid and no longer have my headset plugged in, cover up my webcam and literally get paranoid about him breaking into my house sometimes, which is ridiculous I know, but people in a game should not cause you to feel this way. He shouldn't be around other humans and still is doing things now to try and get to me, such as trying to get my videos taken down for ridiculous reasons. It's scary that there are people like this out there, and I urge everybody to be extra careful about who your friends are in the game! Not everybody is who they seem to be.

Thanks for responding and clarifying things.

You shouldn't feel forced to leave because of someone like this.

ZOS should look into it and if necessary (which it looks like it would be) do something about it.

I appreciate they can't look into every minor disagreement, but it seems as though this went way beyond that.

Can we take it you told ZOS all about this, already?

I did briefly tell ZOS about it, but not the whole story because there is so much to it and much of it I can't actually prove. I have a few screenshots but not many, so it is my word against his essentially, although I suppose I do have people who can back me up who were around at the time and know exactly what happened, a couple of which received threats themselves, so perhaps I will gather what information I do have and send it to ZOS this weekend, if only to stop this happening to somebody else!

Tigerseye

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

Tigerseye wrote: »

Elara_Northwind wrote: »

Awwww, thank you very much for the sweet comments It was a difficult decision and had many contributing factors both to do with ZOS and the game itself (It's very true that player feedback is rarely, if ever acknowledged, not just for housing aspects either, and it makes me wonder what the point of us giving up so much of our time to give ZOS our feedback on the PTS actually is!) and also certain individuals in the game, and the guild bank theft most certainly threw a log onto the fire!

It was my own small guild that the gold was stolen from, everybody had access to the bank as we used it as a place to put furnishings and plans we didn't need so that others may use them, but the gold was only accessible by myself and a small handful of others, and it had been saved up by everybody for a guild hall that we planned to build together. People were contributing small amounts each week, whatever they could spare, others would donate large one off amounts! The fact that it was a group effort made the theft so much worse, as well as the fact that only the people I trusted and deemed good friends had access to it.

I didn't notice until it was too late that the gold was gone, I had no reason to check up on it, and one day I went to deposit some gold into the bank and it was pretty much empty. Because I didn't notice immediately, it never showed up in the guild history, which I feel should probably last more than 5 days for situations such as this! I contacted ZOS who would not tell me who took it, and the person never owned up to it but we are pretty certain we know who did it anyway, as who we suspect to be the same person also cleared out the gold and any valuables from our NA branch and then left the guild, which somebody did notice before it was too late and they even admitted to it and didn't seem to think they had done anything wrong because I had passed guild leadership to somebody else who they didn't personally like! But nothing ever came of it even after knowing who took it.

This is the same person who essentially started to stalk and harass me when I told them I wasn't interested in being more than just friends... I suppose the lesson learned is that you can't always trust the people in the game who have been your friends for years and who you never thought would be capable of such a thing... So many people just ended up showing their true colours and not being who I thought they were, but that individual was the worst of them and genuinely ruined my enjoyment of the game in the end with constant harassment not only towards myself but to others who were close to me.

I feel like there should be more repercussions for people who behave in this way in the game, as I am genuinely concerned about this person still playing the game and being able to harass other people as obsessively! He is a sociopath who I am petty sure was behind my computer being hacked as I don't know who else would want to hack into my discord, right after I removed him from it. I became paranoid and no longer have my headset plugged in, cover up my webcam and literally get paranoid about him breaking into my house sometimes, which is ridiculous I know, but people in a game should not cause you to feel this way. He shouldn't be around other humans and still is doing things now to try and get to me, such as trying to get my videos taken down for ridiculous reasons. It's scary that there are people like this out there, and I urge everybody to be extra careful about who your friends are in the game! Not everybody is who they seem to be.

Thanks for responding and clarifying things.

You shouldn't feel forced to leave because of someone like this.

ZOS should look into it and if necessary (which it looks like it would be) do something about it.

I appreciate they can't look into every minor disagreement, but it seems as though this went way beyond that.

Can we take it you told ZOS all about this, already?

I did briefly tell ZOS about it, but not the whole story because there is so much to it and much of it I can't actually prove. I have a few screenshots but not many, so it is my word against his essentially, although I suppose I do have people who can back me up who were around at the time and know exactly what happened, a couple of which received threats themselves, so perhaps I will gather what information I do have and send it to ZOS this weekend, if only to stop this happening to somebody else!

Yes, I think that would be a good idea.

Alinhbo_Tyaka

No one should have to put up with harassment of any type. I would suggest discussing it with the police. Even though they might not be able to do anything right away they should be able to tell you how to put things together or of other actions you might be able to take. If nothing else comes of it you will be on record of having reported it in the event others come forward to report this person as well.

Edit:
One other thing comes to mind. I agree with you about logs and histories needing to be longer than 5 days. If nothing else there should be a way for a player to archive the logs. Since ZOS would likely be concerned about tampering there are ways they could tag the files to recognize that they have been modified since creation.

TheImperfect

Tigerseye wrote: »

mrsrobot wrote: »

There was a theft in a guild she was a member of during the guild Bank issues. Some gold went missing. I don't know a lot about it but it was one of the reasons she left.

So, you're saying she was given permission to withdraw gold and then withdrew some, without asking?

In which case, it's not technically theft, is it?

They could have just asked her why she withdrew it and asked her to repay it, when she could.

I have never been given permission to withdraw gold, despite being given a fairly high level rank in one guild I'm in, so it's kind of odd to give someone gold withdrawal permission and then accuse them of theft.

Personally, I would always ask before I withdrew gold, even if I could, or (more likely) I would not do it at all, but I think I'm unusual in that way.

I think lots of people would assume it was OK to use it as a loan, at least, without asking.

That is why most guilds don't allow anyone except the leader(s) to withdraw gold.

That's not what happened.
I don't know exactly what happened but based off one message I exchanged I think the guilds records were missing for the period and some gold just disappeared. I don't think Elara was blamed at all and I certainly don't think she took it and nobody knew where the gold went. It might even have been nobody's doing and a glitch as there were problems at the time. Nobody admitted taking the gold.

Tigerseye

mrsrobot wrote: »

Tigerseye wrote: »

mrsrobot wrote: »

There was a theft in a guild she was a member of during the guild Bank issues. Some gold went missing. I don't know a lot about it but it was one of the reasons she left.

So, you're saying she was given permission to withdraw gold and then withdrew some, without asking?

In which case, it's not technically theft, is it?

They could have just asked her why she withdrew it and asked her to repay it, when she could.

I have never been given permission to withdraw gold, despite being given a fairly high level rank in one guild I'm in, so it's kind of odd to give someone gold withdrawal permission and then accuse them of theft.

Personally, I would always ask before I withdrew gold, even if I could, or (more likely) I would not do it at all, but I think I'm unusual in that way.

I think lots of people would assume it was OK to use it as a loan, at least, without asking.

That is why most guilds don't allow anyone except the leader(s) to withdraw gold.

That's not what happened.
I don't know exactly what happened but based off one message I exchanged I think the guilds records were missing for the period and some gold just disappeared. I don't think Elara was blamed at all and I certainly don't think she took it and nobody knew where the gold went. It might even have been nobody's doing and a glitch as there were problems at the time. Nobody admitted taking the gold.

No, I know.

She came on here and clarified what happened.

On the night of that whole multi-bidder launch debacle, someone did come on the guild chat of another housing guild and ask for people to list all their Elsweyr housing plans on the guild trader, so they could buy them.

This did suggest to me, especially in hindsight, a possible windfall of some kind for that person, but it could have been totally unrelated.

Also, I can't even be 100% sure who the person was, as I wasn't really in taking notes mode, at the time.

To be totally honest, I'm not that bothered what people (in general), with their own guild banks, may have tried to do, due to a monumental error on ZOS's behalf...

If other players' gold had been the target, I would have been far more concerned, but it wasn't.

Jayne_Doe

@Elara_Northwind Ugh! That someone had the nerve to steal from a guild bank (two even) is bad enough. But that this same person has been harassing you to the point of you leaving this game and the wonderful housing community is just appalling.

Please know that you have our support and that we wish you all the best. You've definitely been a true inspiration to the housing community, and we're sorry that you've had to distance yourself from something you obviously love. I know others share the hope that one day you'll feel able to return.

kind_hero

@Elara_Northwind
I am sorry to read that such things happened in this game and to you.

But I want to say this. Don't quit the game, because it brought you everything else, the things that mattered to you. Your passion, your friends, the people you met and their creations which you enjoyed. These are still there. The community will support you and give you many more exciting moments if you allow it to be again part of your life. Don't let this abuse shape your life to a point where you can't enjoy the things you love. ESO is about fun and enjoying having fun with your friends, and I don't think anybody could really take this from you.

TheImperfect

@Elara_Northwind Apologies if my posting was misunderstood and especially if this caused you any stress. I hope you are having fun on your break, you have been missed on here.