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stam sorc class spammable
rabidmyers
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will stam sorc ever get a class spammable? it's the only class without one now and this really needs to be addressed
#helpstamsorc
#helpstamsorc
at a place nobody knows
7
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Hotdog_23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I know bound armament is not a spammable but it is a good buff for a stam sorc and you can get it off a lot between light attacks and rotations or in PVP even. But I agree a true spammable would be nice.4 -
FierceSam✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭My feeling is that ZOS don’t really understand stamina builds in the way they do magicka ones.
This is particularly true with class skills, most of which (all of which if you’re a Warden) are magicka based (although there are some stam morphs). I think the original conception was that mag characters would use class skills supplemented by the odd staff skill, while stam ones would use the weapon skills and might occasionally use a class skill for shields. It’s why the vast majority of stam builds are essentially the same irrespective of class.
I think they began to be a bit more imaginative with the Necro (but again you have the issue that skills start out as magicka and have to be morphed to stamina), but there is still a long way to go.
My main is a stam Sorc, which means his spammables have always been weapon skills. Which doesn’t really contribute to either my Power Fantasy or Play Style in terms of a unique class identity.
So, yes, a class spammable would be “very juicy”.3 -
ShadowKyuubi✭✭✭✭You mean like the stamDK spammable? I stopped asking for a stamsorc spammable when that came out.9
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Kahnak✭✭✭✭✭My feeling is that ZOS don’t really understand stamina builds in the way they do magicka ones.
This is particularly true with class skills, most of which (all of which if you’re a Warden) are magicka based (although there are some stam morphs). I think the original conception was that mag characters would use class skills supplemented by the odd staff skill, while stam ones would use the weapon skills and might occasionally use a class skill for shields. It’s why the vast majority of stam builds are essentially the same irrespective of class.
I think they began to be a bit more imaginative with the Necro (but again you have the issue that skills start out as magicka and have to be morphed to stamina), but there is still a long way to go.
My main is a stam Sorc, which means his spammables have always been weapon skills. Which doesn’t really contribute to either my Power Fantasy or Play Style in terms of a unique class identity.
So, yes, a class spammable would be “very juicy”.
Well, aside from the fact that Magicka Sorcs don't have a spammable either, ZOS understands and have put more effort into Stam setups from the very beginning. When the game came out, serious Magicka setups didn't even exist. They've only recently leveled the playing field as far as DPS potential, as Magicka setups even a year ago were nowhere near Stam in terms of DPS potential. Until Summerset Magicka builds didn't even have the ability to equip two 5 piece sets with a monster helm because a staff is considered a 2H weapon. I would agree that they should add a class spammable to Sorc, but the idea that they understand Magicka setups more than Stam is a little backward even just looking at the history of the game.
"This is particularly true with class skills, most of which (all of which if you’re a Warden) are magicka based (although there are some stam morphs). I think the original conception was that mag characters would use class skills supplemented by the odd staff skill, while stam ones would use the weapon skills and might occasionally use a class skill for shields. It’s why the vast majority of stam builds are essentially the same irrespective of class."
Almost every buff in the game is a Magicka ability and that is almost universal with every class. Warden abilities, particularly the Animal Companion abilities, all have a Stamina morph as well as a Magicka morph. Magicka Warden and Stamina Warden play almost identically in terms of the class abilities that they use in PVE. The only real divergence are the weapon abilities, but the rotation is pretty much the same.Edited by Kahnak on December 7, 2019 1:50PMTombstone Reads: "Forgot to get good"0 -
ShadowKyuubi✭✭✭✭My feeling is that ZOS don’t really understand stamina builds in the way they do magicka ones.
This is particularly true with class skills, most of which (all of which if you’re a Warden) are magicka based (although there are some stam morphs). I think the original conception was that mag characters would use class skills supplemented by the odd staff skill, while stam ones would use the weapon skills and might occasionally use a class skill for shields. It’s why the vast majority of stam builds are essentially the same irrespective of class.
I think they began to be a bit more imaginative with the Necro (but again you have the issue that skills start out as magicka and have to be morphed to stamina), but there is still a long way to go.
My main is a stam Sorc, which means his spammables have always been weapon skills. Which doesn’t really contribute to either my Power Fantasy or Play Style in terms of a unique class identity.
So, yes, a class spammable would be “very juicy”.
Well, aside from the fact that Magicka Sorcs don't have a spammable either, ZOS understands and have put more effort into Stam setups from the very beginning. When the game came out, serious Magicka setups didn't even exist. They've only recently leveled the playing field as far as DPS potential, as Magicka setups even a year ago were nowhere near Stam in terms of DPS potential. Until Summerset Magicka builds didn't even have the ability to equip two 5 piece sets with a monster helm because a staff is considered a 2H weapon. I would agree that they should add a class spammable to Sorc, but the idea that they understand Magicka setups more than Stam is a little backward even just looking at the history of the game.
"This is particularly true with class skills, most of which (all of which if you’re a Warden) are magicka based (although there are some stam morphs). I think the original conception was that mag characters would use class skills supplemented by the odd staff skill, while stam ones would use the weapon skills and might occasionally use a class skill for shields. It’s why the vast majority of stam builds are essentially the same irrespective of class."
Almost every buff in the game is a Magicka ability and that is almost universal with every class. Warden abilities, particularly the Animal Companion abilities, all have a Stamina morph as well as a Magicka morph. Magicka Warden and Stamina Warden play almost identically in terms of the class abilities that they use in PVE. The only real divergence are the weapon abilities, but the rotation is pretty much the same.
I mean, some of what you say is true. Magicka have always been behind stamina classes in DPS, just it isn't nearly as bad as you make it out to be. Yes, the release of summerset help Magicka toons get a pretty decent damage bonus, but a lot of it was from the buffs made to light attacks. Sure the 5-piece bonuses help, but how many really good 5 pieces were out then? Magicka toons started doing significantly more damage with their light attacks. So much so, that if it isn't your number one damage dealer, then you're doing it wrong. And don't even think about disregarding the Dual-Sword, Moondancer, Beamplar...that is the stuff of legends
Now sure, Magicka Sorc don't have a spammable either, until execute (tell me you've never spammed endless fury during execute). They do have access to more abilities and passives than stamsorcs. This debate about stamsorc/stamDK spammable isn't about actually wanting a spammable. It is about wanting to actually feel like we are part of our class. We want to have something more that links us to being a sorcerer, without having to go into magicka. People say spammable the most, because it is the skill you use most often, hence why you think it is part of your identity. And they're is some truth to that, but at the root of it, we just want to feel like we belong in that class and only being able to use 3 or 4 skills, doesn't make you feel that way.Edited by ShadowKyuubi on December 7, 2019 1:00PM0 -
max_only✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Dark Deal lol#FiteForYourRite Bosmer = Stealth
#OppositeResourceSiphoningAttacks
|| CP 1000+ || PC/NA || GUILDS: LWH; IA; CH; XA
""All gods' creatures (you lot) are equal when covered in A1 sauce"" -- Old Bosmeri Wisdom2 -
Kahnak✭✭✭✭✭ShadowKyuubi wrote: »My feeling is that ZOS don’t really understand stamina builds in the way they do magicka ones.
This is particularly true with class skills, most of which (all of which if you’re a Warden) are magicka based (although there are some stam morphs). I think the original conception was that mag characters would use class skills supplemented by the odd staff skill, while stam ones would use the weapon skills and might occasionally use a class skill for shields. It’s why the vast majority of stam builds are essentially the same irrespective of class.
I think they began to be a bit more imaginative with the Necro (but again you have the issue that skills start out as magicka and have to be morphed to stamina), but there is still a long way to go.
My main is a stam Sorc, which means his spammables have always been weapon skills. Which doesn’t really contribute to either my Power Fantasy or Play Style in terms of a unique class identity.
So, yes, a class spammable would be “very juicy”.
Well, aside from the fact that Magicka Sorcs don't have a spammable either, ZOS understands and have put more effort into Stam setups from the very beginning. When the game came out, serious Magicka setups didn't even exist. They've only recently leveled the playing field as far as DPS potential, as Magicka setups even a year ago were nowhere near Stam in terms of DPS potential. Until Summerset Magicka builds didn't even have the ability to equip two 5 piece sets with a monster helm because a staff is considered a 2H weapon. I would agree that they should add a class spammable to Sorc, but the idea that they understand Magicka setups more than Stam is a little backward even just looking at the history of the game.
"This is particularly true with class skills, most of which (all of which if you’re a Warden) are magicka based (although there are some stam morphs). I think the original conception was that mag characters would use class skills supplemented by the odd staff skill, while stam ones would use the weapon skills and might occasionally use a class skill for shields. It’s why the vast majority of stam builds are essentially the same irrespective of class."
Almost every buff in the game is a Magicka ability and that is almost universal with every class. Warden abilities, particularly the Animal Companion abilities, all have a Stamina morph as well as a Magicka morph. Magicka Warden and Stamina Warden play almost identically in terms of the class abilities that they use in PVE. The only real divergence are the weapon abilities, but the rotation is pretty much the same.
I mean, some of what you say is true. Magicka have always been behind stamina classes in DPS, just it isn't nearly as bad as you make it out to be. Yes, the release of summerset help Magicka toons get a pretty decent damage bonus, but a lot of it was from the buffs made to light attacks. Sure the 5-piece bonuses help, but how many really good 5 pieces were out then? Magicka toons started doing significantly more damage with their light attacks. So much so, that if it isn't your number one damage dealer, then you're doing it wrong. And don't even think about disregarding the Dual-Sword, Moondancer, Beamplar...that is the stuff of legends
Now sure, Magicka Sorc don't have a spammable either, until execute (tell me you've never spammed endless fury during execute). They do have access to more abilities and passives than stamsorcs. This debate about stamsorc/stamDK spammable isn't about actually wanting a spammable. It is about wanting to actually feel like we are part of our class. We want to have something more that links us to being a sorcerer, without having to go into magicka. People say spammable the most, because it is the skill you use most often, hence why you think it is part of your identity. And they're is some truth to that, but at the root of it, we just want to feel like we belong in that class and only being able to use 3 or 4 skills, doesn't make you feel that way.
"I mean, some of what you say is true. Magicka have always been behind stamina classes in DPS, just it isn't nearly as bad as you make it out to be."
All of what was said is demonstrable fact - it's not up for debate. There is not any opinion or speculation there.
"Yes, the release of summerset help Magicka toons get a pretty decent damage bonus, but a lot of it was from the buffs made to light attacks."
Ok, but the buffs to light attacks were universal to both Stam and Magicka, so I'm not sure what point you're making here. If light attack damage was increased for both Stam and Magicka then the 'pretty decent damage bonus' IS the direct result of a second 5 piece set.
"Sure the 5-piece bonuses help, but how many really good 5 pieces were out then?"
Considering the meta sets Relequen and Siroria were released with Summerset, that means THE BEST 5 piece sets in the game were made available when the change was made. If you're seriously making a case that there isn't much of a difference between one 5 piece set vs two 5 piece sets, you're either being disingenuous or you haven't been playing the game for very long. That's just ludicrous. There is a substantial difference and there are plenty of sets that could be paired together successfully even before CR was released.
"Now sure, Magicka Sorc don't have a spammable either, until execute (tell me you've never spammed endless fury during execute)."
A spammable is a spammable and an execute is an execute. They don't function in the same way simply because you use the abilities frequently. Spamming Breath of Life to heal doesn't make Breath of Life a spammable.
"This debate about stamsorc/stamDK spammable isn't about actually wanting a spammable. It is about wanting to actually feel like we are part of our class. We want to have something more that links us to being a sorcerer, without having to go into magicka. People say spammable the most, because it is the skill you use most often, hence why you think it is part of your identity. And they're is some truth to that, but at the root of it, we just want to feel like we belong in that class and only being able to use 3 or 4 skills, doesn't make you feel that way.["
It's not really a debate - I think most people are on board with both more class identity and classes having their own unique spammable. I've never heard anyone say "I can't wait to play these weapon skill lines". People say spammable the most because Sorcs are missing a spammable and now they are the only class without a class spammable.Tombstone Reads: "Forgot to get good"0 -
Ragnarock41✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭ShadowKyuubi wrote: »You mean like the stamDK spammable? I stopped asking for a stamsorc spammable when that came out.
Careful what you wish for
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TBois✭✭✭✭✭
✭I've been really feeling some strong class identity with this setup for pvp.
https://youtu.be/3IaBTq5elfE
It's 2h/vMA Frost Staff using Overload's unique ability to be able to be weaved with another ultimate, in this case onslaught. In PvE I run a similar gear setup with vMA Lightning or Inferno Staff. I get 74k dps on iron atronach with imperfect relequen, briarheart, velidreth, vMA Inferno. So it can run vet DLC dungeons and trials, and I should be able to pull higher dps with perfect relequen and perfect lokkestiz.
I'm ok with stam sorcs not having a class spammable, but i wouldn't argue against zos giving us one either. I've been playing stam sorcs since we still had soft capped stats and before classes had stam morphs. So I've been through good times and bad. At the end of the day I love it's playstyle, and as long as they dont take away its mobility and passive heals I'll still be playing stam sorc in the future.Edited by TBois on December 7, 2019 3:05PMPC/NA
T-Bois (Stam Sorc since 1.4) - AD
An Unsettling Snowball (Templar) - AD
Bosquecito (Stam Sorc) - DC
Peti-T-Bois (Stamden) - AD0 -
Valykc✭✭✭✭✭They found just change something like crystal blast and make it a wind gust of some sort... Make it proc when using an ability that costs stamina with the exception of roll dodge/break free/block/bash, call it something fancy like that Pokémon move “Razor Wind” or whatever it was called lol. Give it some extra perk like stuns off balanced enemies or something interesting for both PvE and PvP and boom ezpz
I can see it already “Slash your weapon through the air causing a tempest gust to strike you enemy causing X damage and applying major fracture/breach for X seconds”
POWER FANTASYYYYYYEdited by Valykc on December 7, 2019 5:04PM1 -
Royaji✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭They found just change something like crystal blast and make it a wind gust of some sort... Make it proc when using an ability that costs stamina with the exception of roll dodge/break free/block/bash, call it something fancy like that Pokémon move “Razor Wind” or whatever it was called lol. Give it some extra perk like stuns off balanced enemies or something interesting for both PvE and PvP and boom ezpz
I can see it already “Slash your weapon through the air causing a tempest gust to strike you enemy causing X damage and applying major fracture/breach for X seconds”
POWER FANTASYYYYYY
So taking Spectral Bow from nightblades was not enough... Now sorcs want to take their Surprise Attack too? And the old un-nerfed one at that. You guys are just asking for those "nerf sorc" threads at this point.1 -
Valykc✭✭✭✭✭They found just change something like crystal blast and make it a wind gust of some sort... Make it proc when using an ability that costs stamina with the exception of roll dodge/break free/block/bash, call it something fancy like that Pokémon move “Razor Wind” or whatever it was called lol. Give it some extra perk like stuns off balanced enemies or something interesting for both PvE and PvP and boom ezpz
I can see it already “Slash your weapon through the air causing a tempest gust to strike you enemy causing X damage and applying major fracture/breach for X seconds”
POWER FANTASYYYYYY
So taking Spectral Bow from nightblades was not enough... Now sorcs want to take their Surprise Attack too? And the old un-nerfed one at that. You guys are just asking for those "nerf sorc" threads at this point.
@Royaji
You know what, hurricane should turn stam sorcs invisible because wind is invisible
...so therefor stam sorcs should have a cloak too..
...that also does damage...
MORE POWER FANTASYYYYYY!!!!!Edited by Valykc on December 7, 2019 6:50PM1 -
Royaji✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭They found just change something like crystal blast and make it a wind gust of some sort... Make it proc when using an ability that costs stamina with the exception of roll dodge/break free/block/bash, call it something fancy like that Pokémon move “Razor Wind” or whatever it was called lol. Give it some extra perk like stuns off balanced enemies or something interesting for both PvE and PvP and boom ezpz
I can see it already “Slash your weapon through the air causing a tempest gust to strike you enemy causing X damage and applying major fracture/breach for X seconds”
POWER FANTASYYYYYY
So taking Spectral Bow from nightblades was not enough... Now sorcs want to take their Surprise Attack too? And the old un-nerfed one at that. You guys are just asking for those "nerf sorc" threads at this point.
You know what, hurricane should turn us invisible because wind is invisible so therefor stam sorcs should have a cloak too.. that also does damage...
MORE POWER FANTASYYYYYY!!!!!
Oh. Now you are talking about something I can get behind.1 -
Valykc✭✭✭✭✭They found just change something like crystal blast and make it a wind gust of some sort... Make it proc when using an ability that costs stamina with the exception of roll dodge/break free/block/bash, call it something fancy like that Pokémon move “Razor Wind” or whatever it was called lol. Give it some extra perk like stuns off balanced enemies or something interesting for both PvE and PvP and boom ezpz
I can see it already “Slash your weapon through the air causing a tempest gust to strike you enemy causing X damage and applying major fracture/breach for X seconds”
POWER FANTASYYYYYY
So taking Spectral Bow from nightblades was not enough... Now sorcs want to take their Surprise Attack too? And the old un-nerfed one at that. You guys are just asking for those "nerf sorc" threads at this point.
You know what, hurricane should turn us invisible because wind is invisible so therefor stam sorcs should have a cloak too.. that also does damage...
MORE POWER FANTASYYYYYY!!!!!
Oh. Now you are talking about something I can get behind.
@Royaji 😂0 -
susmitds✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Sorcerer has no spammables. Magsorc does not have a class spammable, how do you think stamsorc will get one?0 -
max_only✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Sorcerer has no spammables. Magsorc does not have a class spammable, how do you think stamsorc will get one?
Execute lightning? Mages wrath or whatever? I see people spamming that all the time#FiteForYourRite Bosmer = Stealth
#OppositeResourceSiphoningAttacks
|| CP 1000+ || PC/NA || GUILDS: LWH; IA; CH; XA
""All gods' creatures (you lot) are equal when covered in A1 sauce"" -- Old Bosmeri Wisdom0 -
Lady_Linux✭✭✭✭✭Nerf Sorc you say?I simply must protest. There are no Penguin avatars for me to use in the forums.
BTW, I use arch too0 -
TheShadowScout✭✭✭✭✭
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Yeah, that is pretty much how I believe the general idea went.I think the original conception was that mag characters would use class skills supplemented by the odd staff skill, while stam ones would use the weapon skills and might occasionally use a class skill...
Magica characters - the "mages" of tamriel, firing off a wide arsenal of spells and using their magic staves to cast destruction or restoration magic...
Stamina characters - the "warriors" and "rogues" of tamriel, using mainly weapons tho occasionally some mystic ability they picked up somewhere...
I'd say its working as intended, and the stamsorcs should look to their weapons for a spammable. I know mine does...
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