Extreme Pop Difference Still

ArchMikem

ZOS went and got rid of the 7 Day and made it a 30 just like the other now. Only difference is Faction Lock. Kaal is locked, Laat is not. You all claim Faction Lock sucks and shouldn't be a thing. But even now, Laat is barren but Kaal is Pop locked and probably has a queue.

So explain. I was expecting a mass exodus so you all can finally enjoy your 30 day faction swapping selves. That obviously hasnt happened.

[Edit to remove bait]

idk

People go where the PvP is as it’s always been. Changing campaigns on a guess is a risk.

Zos knew exactly what they were doing when the made the only unlocked campaign 7 days then gave the game a 30 day unlocked after everyone ans their guilds were settled in.

redspecter23

There is one rule that is above all others. Players will go where there are fights. That will drive people to the most populated server. This situation only feeds itself. Unless there is a mass exodus of players to another server, the greater population is far too attractive to give up.

Players would rather wait in a 20 minute queue to play in a potentially laggy environment with multiple disconnects over the course of the night than to to a campaign that would be nothing but PvDoor all night.

The question that needs to be asked is, how do you encourage players to move to what could quite possibly be a much healthier campaign in great enough numbers to keep it healthy without just making it the new "place to be" and causing the pop in other campaigns to crash as a result.

Juhasow

ArchMikem wrote: »

ZOS went and got rid of the 7 Day and made it a 30 just like the other now. Only difference is Faction Lock. Kaal is locked, Laat is not. You all claim Faction Lock sucks and shouldn't be a thing. But even now, Laat is barren but Kaal is Pop locked and probably has a queue.

So explain. I was expecting a mass exodus so you all can finally enjoy your 30 day faction swapping selves. That obviously hasnt happened.

I can almost guarantee You that if they would change Kaal to non faction locked and made Laat faction locked 30 day then laat would be empty. Most of the people dont care about faction lock they just want to play where others are playing already so delay between release of Kaal and Laat and the fact one is on the top of a queue and second is on the bottom of it is clear adventage Kaal had and reason why it's populated when Laat is not. There is not enough groups interrested in PvP to populate them both. People wont join the Laat even if they're number 100 in queue for Kaal because most of the PvPers dont like to start the fights and run in smaller groups. They like to follow zergs and since there are no zergs on Laat (because most of them either preffers faction lock or simply dont want to risk Pvdooring) so they preffer already populated campaign.

VaranisArano

Everyone who wants a populated no-faction-lock campaign isn't willing to swap en masse to make it populated. Because its harder than it looks.

You've got to have people swap en masse and to all three sides, or else you wind up with what happened whenever my guild went from the 30 day to 7 day campaign: we steamrolled the regulars with very little competition on our level. It wasn't fun for Shor players and honestly it wasn't much fun for us so we'd quickly head back to Vivec if no other guilds swapped from Vivec to fight us on Shor. Without more or less equal competition on all sides, the guilds and PUGs who do the majority of the fighting in Cyrodiil won't stick around.

The real problem is how to get players, guilds, and PUGs to swap. As a general rule of thumb, PVPers work together about as well as a herd of cats even within the same faction. Convincing different faction guilds to swap with the uncertain hope of competitive play if everyone goes along with it...unlikely. Certainly more difficult than just "Oh, my guild wanted no-faction lock, so we'll swap."

The flip side is that, barring massive and unprecedented coordination from the remaining PVPers who want no-faction lock, someone has to be the first to swap or the campaign will always be low-pop. It seems no one wants to be first.

(The same calculus applies if the situations were reversed and ZOS had made the faction-lock campaign the new one.)

Royaji

This again? We've been through this...

The purists (on either side) are a minority. Majority of the players does not care either way. As Juhasow says, swap the lock around and it won't change which campaign is populated.

With the current state of PvP there just isn't enough players to populate two campaigns. And people would rather play on a campaing they do not prefer than on a dead one.

It's not rocket science.

Heimpai

You can go play pve if you want, I'll stick with pvp..Not everyone gets to play during NA prime

Yes it sucks but I'd obviously choose laggy faction lock over fighting guards

geonsocal

maybe with the next pvp event (whenever that may be) it'll help give laat a boost in popularity...

no way to really tell for sure, but, seems as though there's probably only around 1,000 or so fairly "regular" cyrodiil pvp players per platform/server...

I know there are a ton of issues preventing it, but - time to merge and cross-platform cyrodiil?

MajBludd

@geonsocal could they even accomplish cross platform?
It would be cool if they did but how would that impact console players that cant use addons?

Asardes

30 days open is just to get in, get 25K+ AP, get your geode 1 month later

geonsocal

@MajBludd ...honestly, I don't think zos could cross-platform the game...

besides for all the other technical obstacles - PC versus console probably wouldn't be such a fair fight...

like you mentioned, because of all the addons (and, a macro or two) being used by some of the PC gamers it wouldn't be an equal playing field...

but, it would be nice for the consoles to merge...

heck, if zos could simply merge the EU and NA servers from each platform that would help...

my confidence in zos' technical capabilities though isn't so great...

shoot, I'm still waiting the day I don't have to run from keep to keep all the time...

ArchMikem

geonsocal wrote: »

@MajBludd ...honestly, I don't think zos could cross-platform the game...

besides for all the other technical obstacles - PC versus console probably wouldn't be such a fair fight...

like you mentioned, because of all the addons (and, a macro or two) being used by some of the PC gamers it wouldn't be an equal playing field...

but, it would be nice for the consoles to merge...

heck, if zos could simply merge the EU and NA servers from each platform that would help...

my confidence in zos' technical capabilities though isn't so great...

shoot, I'm still waiting the day I don't have to run from keep to keep all the time...

Making NA and EU players connect to the same server would increase latency for everyone though. It'd be better if Xbox and PS4 NA could crossplay at least.

notvenousdrake

Just replace Kaal with laat and bring yolnahkriin back simple 🤷‍♂️

MajBludd

@notvenousdrake why would they get rid of Kaal? It seems most people want to play there.

The other server you mentioned, laat, is pretty much dead. Why would they replace the currently most populated server with one that is dead?

notvenousdrake

Kaal and laat are both 30 days one with one without lock I was saying replace the former with the latter and bring yolnahkriin in so we had a no lock 30 day with a 7 day, although it’s my wish to see again it’s pointless to hope anything will be done

MajBludd

Do they even still have a 7 day, other than under 50? If not, I can see how some would want this as they dont have as much time to put into the 30 day.

As far as playing an no faction lock server. Why not move to what is available now instead of trying to make everyone play how you want?

Faction lock or no faction lock, idc. As I know ppl have several accts and they can switch to whatever faction they want, when they want.

They gave the no faction lock advocates a server to play on . They chose not to move to that server after being given exactly what they wanted.
So, that tells me they want to make everyone play how they want or they'd have moved to the server that they asked for.

To me it makes a lot of sense. If you have a server full of faction swappers, who are they going to fight, each other? If that's the case why do they need to faction swap?

It boils down to this, they cant farm pugs how they want or jump to the winning side like they did in the main cp server before it was faction locked.

So, you have 2 options, play non faction locked or get another acct.

Freakin_Hytte

I'm quite honestly super [snip] annoyed over this. How many threads about people [snip] about campaign lock haven't we seen? Its obviously the reason they took away the 7 day and that sucks.

I always played in the 7 day, the community were small enough to recognize and basically get to know the other players playstyle in other factions. But at the same time the fights could be awesome and intense around the circle without a lagfest. Which we must have now because kaal is the only choice for ps4 and the other ones are completely dead.

I really do despise the whining [snip] for forcing me and my friends to go to the laggy [snip] show called kaal and not even play on the unlocked campaign now that zos actually gave it to them.

Edit for profanity.

ThePedge

Freakin_Hytte wrote: »

I'm quite honestly super [snip] annoyed over this. How many threads about people [snip] about campaign lock haven't we seen? Its obviously the reason they took away the 7 day and that sucks.

I always played in the 7 day, the community were small enough to recognize and basically get to know the other players playstyle in other factions. But at the same time the fights could be awesome and intense around the circle without a lagfest. Which we must have now because kaal is the only choice for ps4 and the other ones are completely dead.

I really do despise the whining [snip] for forcing me and my friends to go to the laggy [snip] show called kaal and not even play on the unlocked campaign now that zos actually gave it to them.

Edit for profanity.

Because no one wanted a separate unlocked campaign, it was bound to fail. It's as empty as the 7-Day.

GhostofDatthaw

Changing a servers name won't bring back the thousands of PvP players that quit

mague

Royaji wrote: »

This again? We've been through this...

The purists (on either side) are a minority. Majority of the players does not care either way. As Juhasow says, swap the lock around and it won't change which campaign is populated.

With the current state of PvP there just isn't enough players to populate two campaigns. And people would rather play on a campaing they do not prefer than on a dead one.

It's not rocket science.

But i am not their hostage. Hence, just like others, i dont play Cyrodiil, hence the campaign is empty.

Mr_Walker

Went into Laat on my red the other night (OCE time) to collect a treasure map, saw red had the hammer, thought I'd follow along and maybe find a fight, get some AP as a bonus, you know how it is, the hammer attracts... everybody, right! Some small scale action coming up, you beauty!

3 keeps later (red triangle keeps), our zerg was... a massive 3 people, and we saw a grand total of one yellow, who put up a disinterested defense (he sniped at us a couple of times and then ran away).

So, why do people who enjoy PvP go to Kaal? Hmmmm... a question to ponder!

ArchMikem

Mr_Walker wrote: »

Went into Laat on my red the other night (OCE time) to collect a treasure map, saw red had the hammer, thought I'd follow along and maybe find a fight, get some AP as a bonus, you know how it is, the hammer attracts... everybody, right! Some small scale action coming up, you beauty!

3 keeps later (red triangle keeps), our zerg was... a massive 3 people, and we saw a grand total of one yellow, who put up a disinterested defense (he sniped at us a couple of times and then ran away).

So, why do people who enjoy PvP go to Kaal? Hmmmm... a question to ponder!

Your server sounds a lot worse than mine. Whenever the Hammer spawns there's always at least a group of a dozen following it, and it's usually the Emperor's group.

And again, it's so very easy. Instead of just taking the easy solution by going to Kaal which only compounds the issue with both campaigns, people in Kaal need to go back to Laat. Divide the population. Instead of one completely empty Campaign and one with a ton of lag and a queue in the hundreds, you'll have two Campaigns that will always have at least a bar or two per faction. Honestly, with two CP enabled 30 day Campaigns now, ZOS shouldn't allow us to pick our own Campaign. The game should force us into the Campaign with the least player count at the time, divvying up the playerbase for us, cause obviously we can't do it ourselves.

technohic

ArchMikem wrote: »

Mr_Walker wrote: »

Went into Laat on my red the other night (OCE time) to collect a treasure map, saw red had the hammer, thought I'd follow along and maybe find a fight, get some AP as a bonus, you know how it is, the hammer attracts... everybody, right! Some small scale action coming up, you beauty!

3 keeps later (red triangle keeps), our zerg was... a massive 3 people, and we saw a grand total of one yellow, who put up a disinterested defense (he sniped at us a couple of times and then ran away).

So, why do people who enjoy PvP go to Kaal? Hmmmm... a question to ponder!

Your server sounds a lot worse than mine. Whenever the Hammer spawns there's always at least a group of a dozen following it, and it's usually the Emperor's group.

And again, it's so very easy. Instead of just taking the easy solution by going to Kaal which only compounds the issue with both campaigns, people in Kaal need to go back to Laat. Divide the population. Instead of one completely empty Campaign and one with a ton of lag and a queue in the hundreds, you'll have two Campaigns that will always have at least a bar or two per faction. Honestly, with two CP enabled 30 day Campaigns now, ZOS shouldn't allow us to pick our own Campaign. The game should force us into the Campaign with the least player count at the time, divvying up the playerbase for us, cause obviously we can't do it ourselves.

So.why have RVR if it's going to be so diluted, it's a PvDoor ? They need to fix their game. Large scale is a game identity they have a good market share of. Reducing it or not fixing it will wind up being a loss once someone else offers a decent alternative

MajBludd

Pvp today = a group pvdooring the map as fast as possible before any real resistance appears. Then log off and let the next faction do the same.