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Let's make >>>> *SOME* <<<< ESO overland dangerous.
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Bix08✭✭✭NayEl_Borracho wrote: »Taleof2Cities wrote: »Why do players want more challenging content ... when they don’t participate in the challenging content that already exists in the game today??
I feel like most of these threads are by players who don't want to play with other people and wish this game was a giant Skyrim
^totally this
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idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NayAnd now, go PUG a few normal randoms (during an event, if you're on NA), and take a look at the substantial amount of people who do like 5-10k dps with their damage dealers. And those are the ones who actually go into dungeons, instead of just doing quest content. Players who don't solo dolmens, who do take their minutes to take down a delve boss, who die to quest bosses. (I watched the Black Kiergo arena in Senchal for a while the other day, with a constant stream of players coming in and playing it. An interesting amount of them died, at least once.)
There's no long term PvE content in this game. And that's really the problem that needs addressing, but until then, opening overland up to vets is gonna go a long way. Overland arguably has the most potential playtime of all PvE content in the game, assuming you'll run out of actual reasons to do group content, and so opening it up will easily carry most players with a similar mindset to me until new content comes in. And I can guarantee I'm not the only one with this mindset, I know of two entire guilds who have a similar opinion to me, just off the top of my head..
It is no different than most major MMORPGs of today time . Considering Zos had added both upper and lower Craglorn veteran zones before they chose to go to the B2P/P2P mixed model your suggestion does not seem to hold true.
MMORPGs longevity tends to be tied to adding new content from easier overland/questing story line to more challenging raids. Being how rare challenging questing is in this genre these days they do not seem to be that important or not considered worth the cost.0 -
jcm2606✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭And now, go PUG a few normal randoms (during an event, if you're on NA), and take a look at the substantial amount of people who do like 5-10k dps with their damage dealers. And those are the ones who actually go into dungeons, instead of just doing quest content. Players who don't solo dolmens, who do take their minutes to take down a delve boss, who die to quest bosses. (I watched the Black Kiergo arena in Senchal for a while the other day, with a constant stream of players coming in and playing it. An interesting amount of them died, at least once.)
There's no long term PvE content in this game. And that's really the problem that needs addressing, but until then, opening overland up to vets is gonna go a long way. Overland arguably has the most potential playtime of all PvE content in the game, assuming you'll run out of actual reasons to do group content, and so opening it up will easily carry most players with a similar mindset to me until new content comes in. And I can guarantee I'm not the only one with this mindset, I know of two entire guilds who have a similar opinion to me, just off the top of my head..
It is no different than most major MMORPGs of today time . Considering Zos had added both upper and lower Craglorn veteran zones before they chose to go to the B2P/P2P mixed model your suggestion does not seem to hold true.
MMORPGs longevity tends to be tied to adding new content from easier overland/questing story line to more challenging raids. Being how rare challenging questing is in this genre these days they do not seem to be that important or not considered worth the cost.
GW2 manages to do it. All DLC and expansion content is for vets, with persistent world events and metas/bosses, which basically gives way more end game content that players can sink time into.
Again, ESO overland is the way it is because of Zenimax. Zenimax knows that casuals by far outweigh committed players, so they've dumbed the game down to appease them. Other's MMO's are able to offer many times what ESO offers for vets, and still somehow seem to be more popular than ESO.0 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NayAnd now, go PUG a few normal randoms (during an event, if you're on NA), and take a look at the substantial amount of people who do like 5-10k dps with their damage dealers. And those are the ones who actually go into dungeons, instead of just doing quest content. Players who don't solo dolmens, who do take their minutes to take down a delve boss, who die to quest bosses. (I watched the Black Kiergo arena in Senchal for a while the other day, with a constant stream of players coming in and playing it. An interesting amount of them died, at least once.)
There's no long term PvE content in this game. And that's really the problem that needs addressing, but until then, opening overland up to vets is gonna go a long way. Overland arguably has the most potential playtime of all PvE content in the game, assuming you'll run out of actual reasons to do group content, and so opening it up will easily carry most players with a similar mindset to me until new content comes in. And I can guarantee I'm not the only one with this mindset, I know of two entire guilds who have a similar opinion to me, just off the top of my head..
It is no different than most major MMORPGs of today time . Considering Zos had added both upper and lower Craglorn veteran zones before they chose to go to the B2P/P2P mixed model your suggestion does not seem to hold true.
MMORPGs longevity tends to be tied to adding new content from easier overland/questing story line to more challenging raids. Being how rare challenging questing is in this genre these days they do not seem to be that important or not considered worth the cost.
GW2 manages to do it. All DLC and expansion content is for vets, with persistent world events and metas/bosses, which basically gives way more end game content that players can sink time into.
Again, ESO overland is the way it is because of Zenimax. Zenimax knows that casuals by far outweigh committed players, so they've dumbed the game down to appease them. Other's MMO's are able to offer many times what ESO offers for vets, and still somehow seem to be more popular than ESO.
GW2 is just one game. I am glad they offer what you are looking for in an MMORPG. I personally think it pales to ESO in many ways but we all have different wants with our gaming. I prefer a good story line for my questing be the focus and look to vet DLC dungeons and vet trials for challenging content.
Obviously ESO is the way it is because of Zenimax. They clearly designed and manage the game just as Blizzard has WoW and Square Enix has FF14. In these cases the chose different paths than GW2. While I am not an expert on the last two, only played a little to see if I would like them, their overland did not seem all that challenging.
It seems to be that way as a business decision since it the three companies make up the lions share of the top 5 MMORPGs. That is what these thread do not seem to understand.
BTW, another tidbit to support my guess that this all comes down to a conscious business decision, ESO was more challenging at launch. Some instanced quests had aspects removed to make them easier, clear indication it was making the quest easier by choice. Less than 60 days into the game (prob less than 30) Zos made veteran zones slightly more challenging. These were vet 1-10 zones. Players balked. Zos reverted the change.
So there is a history to support Zos seems to keep this as their business model and doubt they see GW2 as much of a threat.1 -
daim✭✭✭✭✭You're onto something. I got a better idea though... (comment)Just saying that most of the content should be easy and relaxed as it is currently. Its far more new player friendly especially as its the quest lines where ESO shines in comparison to other mmos.
I would love it if delves would be slightly more difficult than rest of the overland, something on par with most of the public dungeons, and public dungeons should be more group content.
Also a few areas per zone should include more challenging mobs, elite area. I dont know how that would work out but at least i have enjoyed it in wow and lotro back in the days.
But, as said its not easy thing to balance. There is such a huge gap between new players and trial players.""I am that which grips the heart in fright, hearkens night and silences the light." It was written on my sword, long…long ago." ―Ajunta Pall
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jircris11✭✭✭✭✭
✭NayTaleof2Cities wrote: »Why do players want more challenging content ... when they don’t participate in the challenging content that already exists in the game today??
The issue us, when overland was tougher these same people complained that it was to problematic to kill all the mobs while farming lol.IGN: Ki'rah
Khajiit/Vampire
DC/AD faction/NA server.
RPer0 -
Zephard✭✭✭Naymore rewards the higher the difficulty would be perfect.
Why, why, why better rewards...No you need less rewards....your reward would be the harder content. Not stuff to make the harder content easier. So you can come back hear and complain it's all to easy.
I said Nay. Nay, cause I farm and fish, and take time to look at different scenery. Don't want a slug fest just to do those things.Edited by Zephard on November 20, 2019 6:00PM3 -
jircris11✭✭✭✭✭
✭Naymore rewards the higher the difficulty would be perfect.
Why, why, why better rewards...No you need less rewards....your reward would be the harder content. Not stuff to make the harder content easier. So you can come back hear and complain it's all to easy.
I said Nay. Nay, cause I farm and fish, and take time to look at different scenery. Don't want a slug fest just to do those things.
Omg the mythical ingame stroller. Lol nice to see other ppl actually look at the world. I have found some awesome screenshots doing that.IGN: Ki'rah
Khajiit/Vampire
DC/AD faction/NA server.
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Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yaydavid_m_18b16_ESO wrote: »or follow blizzard idea with WoW and make the current xpack lvl locked.
1. it ain't just WoW.
2. it might've worked if ESO leveling is 1 to 50. right now it's 1 - 810. you want to gate by their CP? because hitting 1-50 can be done in a day.August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber0 -
Dusk_Coven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Nay
You don't dodge or block Cliff Racer swoops? Giant smashes? Clannfear leaps? Interrupt trolls? Maybe you don't have to but those newbs at level 3 with 3 skill points probably need to.Which is when mechanics come into play. Add more variety to the AI, make dodging/blocking more mandatory so the repetition is broken up some, etc.
"Hundreds of hours"? Where? Only if you keep grinding it on alts.Yes, eventually you will complete the content, but you easily have hundreds of hours before that happens, and so much more overland content comes every 6 months, at the least.
When a new DLC comes out people finish all the quest content in a few days. All that's left in overland is daily quest grind and gathering.
A STORY boss is meant to be completed by someone doing the story. And even then, in the Dragonhold DLC some people had trouble with one. If you want harder story, ask for INSTANCED story events. Like a dungeon and you choose your difficulty mode. Next you're gonna say every story boss needs to be scaled for CP810 because otherwise it wouldn't be epic. One Tamriel is fundamentally different from most other games that focus on levelling. It unties how you experience the story from your actual level and character development. You may not like that but that is ESO now.A boss that is meant to be potentially cataclysmic, as per the very quest it's a part of, is killed in under 10 seconds by some schmuck. I get it, we killed Molag Bal (with some deus ex machina help, btw), and did other legendary acts, but it shouldn't be that easy!
A world boss is something you apparently don't think exists. Sure, base zones have some easy world bosses but in the expansions and DLCs they aren't the same pushovers. Even some base zone bosses aren't snoozefests, like Bittergreen. But that apparently doesn't exist for people who want harder overland.
Look in appropriate game content for the appropriate challenge. That's the same in every game. They provide you with that but if you insist on looking in easy places for challenges then that's your fault. Every game does all sorts of things differently so it's tricky to compare games and say so-and-so has this why can't we have it here. Devs have to look at the ripple effect for the entire game and their current client base.
Because it's the world map. They need a place to put things together. More stuff = bigger space they have to fill and that they can use. To put world bosses and gathering nodes and other grindy things.1. Then why does overland make up the vast majority of PvE content?
Otherwise you get a string of instances. This is an "open world" game where you can go anywhere you want. That means there has to be a "world" to walk in. And because of their One Tamriel go-anywhere focus, ESO is set up differently from other games with world maps. Games that lock you with levelling benchmark story zones with your expected level based on story progress, and they frequently lock the map too.
No. You want harder? It was way back there when you first started the game and didn't know anything. Before you power levelled at dolmens and got hand-me-down gold sets. Real newbs -- the ones who have to deal with overland -- start at level 3 with white gear and 3 skill points.Dusk_Coven wrote: »How about this instead: A Monster Helm set:
- 1 piece = you stop earning any progress in level or skill line and your CP has no effect
- 2 piece = every tick you lose progress in all your skill lines and your level
Downgrade your toon to a level 3 newb and have your harder overland with 3 skill points to spend and no CP.
Is this a joke?Edited by Dusk_Coven on November 20, 2019 8:54PM0 -
Dusk_Coven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭NaySirLeeMinion wrote: »
I have to agree. I've done this multiple times, and the real eye-opener was when I started over on the EU server with no friends, guilds, gold, or crafting ability. Wearing whatever the dead guy dropped and looking forward to the day you can craft a full white set of Innate Axiom plus Vastarie's (not to mention get into a guild that has those stations but doesn't have a 10K sales req't) is humbling.Jem_Kindheart wrote: »I wonder if these players making threads every. Single. Day. Asking for harder overland / questing have bothered to spend the $10 to buy a new game key with zero cp and start from zero.
As an experiment and out of curiosity, I did exactly that a few weeks ago. Guess what, the content is sufficiently difficult.
Newbs in this situation probably feel excited and happy to progress out of that starting-from-scratch feeling and get immense satisfaction from seeing and feeling the difference each time when they encounter the same mob over and over again.0 -
Zephard✭✭✭Nay
That is you. Sorry you fall asleep in all those beautiful places. To bad they don't get you relaxed like heart-pumping excitement or die gets you. I like the pleasantness of the wilderness, the beauty that was made. Let me enjoy it without the hassle of worry of constantly being distracted from it by such things as mobs that last longer than the sec my wife who is standing beside me takes to kill it. Cause I am a tank, and it takes a lot long than a sec to kill everything.Dusk_Coven wrote: »Not sure the we-want-overland-harder people really know what they are asking for.
At the least, I do. I just want to be able to do overland without falling asleep. Like, actually just think about how overland works in ESO.
Trash mobs generally have around 30k health, while a PvP build (which doesn't build nearly as much into damage as a PvE build) can deal half of that in a single cast of a burst skill. 2 casts, without light attacks, mob drops dead.Dusk_Coven wrote: »That's where your harder content is in pretty much every MMO -- that's where the grind is. Not overland.
1. Then why does overland make up the vast majority of PvE content?
Its for great scenes, the enjoyable being in a different world than this Earth Reality we are all escaping from.
It means there is where the majority of the relaxing casuals pay to hang out in.Dusk_Coven wrote: »How about this instead: A Monster Helm set:
- 1 piece = you stop earning any progress in level or skill line and your CP has no effect
- 2 piece = every tick you lose progress in all your skill lines and your level
Downgrade your toon to a level 3 newb and have your harder overland with 3 skill points to spend and no CP.
Is this a joke?
Nope I don't think that was. I think that was serious. I wouldn't suggest such an extreme amount, but basically its what lots have asked for.....please give me a way to make things in the game seem challenging by making me weaker without me knowing, except for this uh, button that I push while ignoring I pushed it, so suddenly everything is harder.2. it might've worked if ESO leveling is 1 to 50. right now it's 1 - 810. you want to gate by their CP? because hitting 1-50 can be done in a day.
Or 6 months. Depends on the player. Me and my wife took 6 months to reach level 50, and only got through the Morrowind main story line.
Witches festival, we power leveled 3 couples (our characters are treated as couples) to level 50.
That is players choices. We didn't have to power level. We didn't have to give them crafted gear, we didn't have to give them CP points. But we did.
Understand you were saying, no to another person suggestion to follow WoW way of doing things. But it's just the way you say hitting 50 in a day.
We have known a lot of players who hit 810 before they make 4 months on the game. They played a lot of games, a lot of MMO and want to be the end gamer quickly. My wife, this is her first game ever. We took our time. Her favorite activity in the game, fishing and farming. I love fishing, I love traveling around picking flowers, while looking at the landscape.
Yes, there are some awesome screenshots!
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