The world could feel more alive!

craybest

One of the things that I think ESO could really improve upon, is to actually make the world we travel, much more alive, a living and breathing world for us to travel around and explore, instead of mostly flat and boring one. This goes from making towns and villages feel more lively, add more chatting npcs that have actual conversations, that call upon your help, having actual children runjing around, dogs and cats, and even birds walking, flying, etc... now, most cities have few npcs and many of them are standing around, not doing much, it could be much improved

Also, being able to interact more with objects in the world, picking up torches in dungeons to be able to see more or learning some spells to light your way, setting up fires. etc...

It also means having the weather being much more present in game, in here, day and night are pretty well done, but clouds, storms, rain, could be improved a lot! Imagine travelling a creepy foggy forest not knowing what you'll encounter or travelling during a dark, wild thunderstorm and rain or clouds being actually dark, than just a regular grey texture and watching a beautiful red vibrant sunset or even something as simple as wind affecting trees a bit, and listening to the sound of the leaves in the wind.

I know the examples i've shown are from games with excellent graphics, and I don't want this to be confused for better graphics or something like that. I think ESO as great graphics in general for a MMO, it's just to illustrate some things I believe would make the game more interesting and dynamic, and would help make the beautiful world much more alive.

Veinblood1965

I've asked this very thing. There are some zones it rains in but not many and nothing like in other Morphs. The latest expansion was sorely lacking in all aspects of immersion. Too many closed doors, not many extra NPC's other than quest NPC's, hardly a day or night cycle. I can't remember what game it was but one had such a great night setting, large moon, milky way, crickets.

I'm sure it's due to server storage and money limitations the lack of here as this game has so many other features.

iamkeebler

I’ve always wondered where all the children in Tamriel have gone to.

Rake

Make every zone pvp and just wait

StormeReigns

craybest wrote: »

One of the things that I think ESO could really improve upon, is to actually make the world we travel, much more alive, a living and breathing world for us to travel around and explore, instead of mostly flat and boring one. This goes from making towns and villages feel more lively, add more chatting npcs that have actual conversations, that call upon your help, having actual children runjing around, dogs and cats, and even birds walking, flying, etc... now, most cities have few npcs and many of them are standing around, not doing much, it could be much improved

Also, being able to interact more with objects in the world, picking up torches in dungeons to be able to see more or learning some spells to light your way, setting up fires. etc...

It also means having the weather being much more present in game, in here, day and night are pretty well done, but clouds, storms, rain, could be improved a lot! Imagine travelling a creepy foggy forest not knowing what you'll encounter or travelling during a dark, wild thunderstorm and rain or clouds being actually dark, than just a regular grey texture and watching a beautiful red vibrant sunset or even something as simple as wind affecting trees a bit, and listening to the sound of the leaves in the wind.

I know the examples i've shown are from games with excellent graphics, and I don't want this to be confused for better graphics or something like that. I think ESO as great graphics in general for a MMO, it's just to illustrate some things I believe would make the game more interesting and dynamic, and would help make the beautiful world much more alive.

Having a more "lively and active" world would be fantastic, as well you also have to put in part that many (not all, but many) run on console with a terrible ISP and many others are running the game with a PC equivalent to a potato attached to a 9v battery, not including ESO's flip floppy performance issues, were one day it is perfect and all these you mentioned would run beautifully, to just mere hours later feel like being accosted by a sload in the prison shower.

Not saying to give up on the idea, but to keep it ready when the game's performance may, one day be ready to run these ideas with little effort and issues.

Katahdin

Rake wrote: »

Make every zone pvp and just wait

Until there is no one around at all because 90% of the playerbase quit.

craybest

SkerKro wrote: »

craybest wrote: »

One of the things that I think ESO could really improve upon, is to actually make the world we travel, much more alive, a living and breathing world for us to travel around and explore, instead of mostly flat and boring one. This goes from making towns and villages feel more lively, add more chatting npcs that have actual conversations, that call upon your help, having actual children runjing around, dogs and cats, and even birds walking, flying, etc... now, most cities have few npcs and many of them are standing around, not doing much, it could be much improved

Also, being able to interact more with objects in the world, picking up torches in dungeons to be able to see more or learning some spells to light your way, setting up fires. etc...

It also means having the weather being much more present in game, in here, day and night are pretty well done, but clouds, storms, rain, could be improved a lot! Imagine travelling a creepy foggy forest not knowing what you'll encounter or travelling during a dark, wild thunderstorm and rain or clouds being actually dark, than just a regular grey texture and watching a beautiful red vibrant sunset or even something as simple as wind affecting trees a bit, and listening to the sound of the leaves in the wind.

I know the examples i've shown are from games with excellent graphics, and I don't want this to be confused for better graphics or something like that. I think ESO as great graphics in general for a MMO, it's just to illustrate some things I believe would make the game more interesting and dynamic, and would help make the beautiful world much more alive.

Having a more "lively and active" world would be fantastic, as well you also have to put in part that many (not all, but many) run on console with a terrible ISP and many others are running the game with a PC equivalent to a potato attached to a 9v battery, not including ESO's flip floppy performance issues, were one day it is perfect and all these you mentioned would run beautifully, to just mere hours later feel like being accosted by a sload in the prison shower.

Not saying to give up on the idea, but to keep it ready when the game's performance may, one day be ready to run these ideas with little effort and issues.

I perfectly understand, and it's true the devs have to priorize things for better performance. but many of my ideas don't use any more memory than we have currently. having darker storm clouds, isn't more problematic, or having better more vibrant sunsets wouldn't do it either. having kid npcs' wouldn't be any more trouble than adult ones, (not countig the time to actually model them obviously) and we have already many dogs and cat models in game. it's true than other things could impact the game, like stornger rain or storms, but as many things they could potentially have some sort of qality slider, like graphics, shadows, and effects. so other pc's can run them well too.

vivisectvib16_ESO

I always see tons of animals running around. That said, it would be cool if more NPCs had actual routines that changed with the night/day cycle. It's weird to see those same people just standing around doing their thing "24 hours a day."

El_Borracho

I love every one of these ideas. Then I thought of the amount of lag it would probably cause and immediately said no.

iamkeebler

Katahdin wrote: »

Rake wrote: »

Make every zone pvp and just wait

Until there is no one around at all because 90% of the playerbase quit.

*stares at long queues for main Cyrodiil and IC campaigns*.... PvP campaigns still pretty full on PS4 NA, not sure who quit cause it’s not really affecting us, *shrugs*

Eirinin

So...why don't we have kids, pregnant women, toddlers, teens? Everyone is basically 25-80 ish and apparently infertile. Why.

Starlock

There actually are NPC idle conversations and routines if you spend some time to watch them or talk to them. About the same amount that there is in other recent Elder Scrolls games, at any rate. Any sort of graphical overhaul will likely require a new engine and development time the higher ups are unlikely to want to invest in, in spite of having the money to do so.

MattT1988

Rake wrote: »

Make every zone pvp and just wait

Seriously just go away, this joke has been done to death.

RPGplayer13579

Maybe when the game makes the jump to the PS5 and the XBOX??? with a transition to newer servers either in 2020 or 2021, then this can happen.

Araneae6537

@craybest I agree and would love to see those things in ESO, but I wonder how much of it would be possible in an MMORPG? I believe most (all?) of the examples you posted are from single player games which I don’t think have the same limitations.

As for in town, I agree that it makes no sense to see no children and maybe it could be interesting to have the day/night cycle have a greater effect. They did this in Oblivion and Skyrim but this resulted in having to wait around and was only tolerable because you could have that time pass instantly. In ESO, I think you would need to still be able to craft and have some merchants and daily quest givers available (or their night shift counterparts). It could be interesting if sneaking, stealing, etc. were easier at night (or maybe they are — I haven’t experimented enough).

It would be great if there were a greater variety in NPC conversations! As a new player going through Elsweyr, I was thrilled to hear the conversations change as I completed quests, but now, after hearing those two relieved that the monks are no longer chasing butterflies for the bizillionth time... I know it would be a lot of work, considering the many major cities, but it would be nice if there were a greater variety of non-quest-specific conversations different NPCs would have, and some more about the world state in general for those who’ve completed the main area quest line (as an extra reward for those who care about these things).

nafensoriel

craybest wrote: »

/snipsnip

You are forgetting something. ESO is an MMO.
Your screenshots are all single player.

One of these things is not like the other... One of these things has WAY MORE OVERHEAD than the other.

TLDR: you don't get single player graphics with an MMO.

craybest

ErinM31 wrote: »

@craybest I agree and would love to see those things in ESO, but I wonder how much of it would be possible in an MMORPG? I believe most (all?) of the examples you posted are from single player games which I don’t think have the same limitations.

As for in town, I agree that it makes no sense to see no children and maybe it could be interesting to have the day/night cycle have a greater effect. They did this in Oblivion and Skyrim but this resulted in having to wait around and was only tolerable because you could have that time pass instantly. In ESO, I think you would need to still be able to craft and have some merchants and daily quest givers available (or their night shift counterparts). It could be interesting if sneaking, stealing, etc. were easier at night (or maybe they are — I haven’t experimented enough).

It would be great if there were a greater variety in NPC conversations! As a new player going through Elsweyr, I was thrilled to here the conversations change as I completed quests, but now, after hearing those two relieved that the monks are no longer chasing butterflies for the bizillionth time... I know it would be a lot of work, considering the many major cities, but it would be nice if there were a greater variety of non-quest-specific conversations different NPCs would have, and some more about the world state in general for those who’ve completed the main area quest line (as an extra reward for those who care about these things).

many of these are present in FFXIV for example, which is also a MMO, much more detailed weather system(and not client based) Black desert online has lots of npcs in cities, although most of them can't be interacted with. and well, most MMOs have kids, i really don't know why they're banned in here lol.

Tavore1138

iamkeebler wrote: »

Katahdin wrote: »

Rake wrote: »

Make every zone pvp and just wait

Until there is no one around at all because 90% of the playerbase quit.

*stares at long queues for main Cyrodiil and IC campaigns*.... PvP campaigns still pretty full on PS4 NA, not sure who quit cause it’s not really affecting us, *shrugs*

There are 4(?) campaigns each with a pop lock per faction of 300(?) - so if all 4 are locked, and it's not just the CP ones, that is 3,600 players of a claimed 7m+.... assume we count all 4 platforms for 14,400 out of an apparent player base of around 10 million. That's not huge numbers.

Back when the game started it was supporting many more campaigns per server with much higher population caps all pretty active so over time the PvP population has definitely dropped off.

nafensoriel

craybest wrote: »

and well, most MMOs have kids, i really don't know why they're banned in here lol.

Old issue with Elder scrolls games and kids surrounding their killability or not in game.

Its a choice Bethesda made a long time ago and I expect ZOS respects that choice or that it was an attached rider to their use of the elder scrolls universe.

TLDR: Bethesda doesn't want children to be killable. All children in Bethesda games are immortal without mods. Since some of Bethesdas games allow you to wipe out entire villages having unkillable kids would be weird so there simply aren't many kids in Bethesda games.

MasterSpatula

While I agree in principle, my load screens are long enough already.

craybest

nafensoriel wrote: »

craybest wrote: »

and well, most MMOs have kids, i really don't know why they're banned in here lol.

Old issue with Elder scrolls games and kids surrounding their killability or not in game.

Its a choice Bethesda made a long time ago and I expect ZOS respects that choice or that it was an attached rider to their use of the elder scrolls universe.

TLDR: Bethesda doesn't want children to be killable. All children in Bethesda games are immortal without mods. Since some of Bethesdas games allow you to wipe out entire villages having unkillable kids would be weird so there simply aren't many kids in Bethesda games.

i thought it was something like that. but we already have some unkillable npcs in here, i don't see the difference into adding some more. although we should be able to kill them anyway, it's a horrible thing to do, but not more horrible than butchering a while village to the ground if you ask me.

ThePlayer

You can't compare single player games with online games.

craybest

ThePlayer wrote: »

You can't compare single player games with online games.

like i said, all things I've proposed are possible in other MMOs aswell.

Nestor

The big problem is, all those things that make the world feel more alive have a script behind them. That sucks down game performance. I have used mods that increase the NPC and object count in the single player games, and even on a robust gaming machine, it can be a slideshow. Couple that with the online aspect of also sending all that extra info back and forth, not good.

The atmospheric effects of different weather patterns is usually less of a load on the machine.

Kids, they can make those immortal or immune to attacks. Problem is, people would see those so inclined players trying to wail on the kids, and that might cause issues with some other people.

Pheefs

& it only takes twenty responses to arrive at...
"BUT I WANT TO KILL ALL THE CHILDREN!"

there you have it, why we have no children.

MartiniDaniels

Yes, ESO overland is probably one of the worst I ever saw in terms of immersion and feeling alive. Even really old games like Might&Magic 6 had way more fun to play and engaging open world. Reasons why ESO overland so boring is quite obvious:
1. Bad default color gamma. It is really bleak and makes everything looking plain. Thankfully easily solved by re-shade;
2. Lack of difficulty and rewards (with few exception of valuable meta drops) - difficulty questions can be somewhat overriden by personal rules, like run at very low HP (~9-10k) and forbid yourself healing... but this is like playing football with you hands shackled behind you, yeah it's challenge and fun for first 30 minutes, but then you just realize this is not a football anymore, just some strange self-created sort of game;
3. Base zone quests exist like back in time in comparison to main quest... even if you knew about Cadwell silver/gold that system still looks weird and if you don't know about Cadwell silver/gold, all of them just look as some crazy random stories. I really envy players who experienced base zones before One tamriel or whatever was called that update when everything became plain, boring and un-immersive for sake of allowing newbies to visit any zone from the beginning.

BUT - so far from forum you can see that majority of members enjoy current version of overland, so OP best thing you could do is play ESO only for MMO part and for immersive open-world try another games, thankfully there are ton of open world games on the market right now.

Slimebrow

Would haves, could haves that's all you get in terms of immersion....enjoy it :l

LuxLunae

You are comparing graphics of an offline game to an online game... what are u 15 yrs old? Anybody over 17 knows why you can't compare the 2...

come back when you find screens from online MMO games...


seriously W3 which uses hairworks... and other stuff...

craybest

LuxLunae wrote: »

You are comparing graphics of an offline game to an online game... what are u 15 yrs old? Anybody over 17 knows why you can't compare the 2...

come back when you find screens from online MMO games...


seriously W3 which uses hairworks... and other stuff...

if you would read the whole post and the replies before commenting, that'd be great. I specifically said I'm not talking about graphics themselves, all the things I want are in other MMOs too, like FFXIV, GW2, ESO or BDO. the screenshots are purelly illustrative.

Mettaricana

Gimme fog gimme rain gimme heavy rain give me a tropical depression storm

nafensoriel

craybest wrote: »

if you would read the whole post and the replies before commenting, that'd be great. I specifically said I'm not talking about graphics themselves, all the things I want are in other MMOs too, like FFXIV, GW2, ESO or BDO. the screenshots are purelly illustrative.

They really aren't though. Even FF14 and that is built on an engine built to push polys as you wouldn't believe.
The scene density is also way less and the total polygon count is most likely similar.

ESO just spends its resources on other things. You cant make a game do everything. There is always a cost. You cant replicate ESO in BDO with the same fidelity. Nor can you replicate the poly count of models in FF14 in ESO. Different dev teams spent their resources in different places.

Honestly, if you really think its just "upgrade this thing" then you need to go read up on development. No dev company guts their performance for no good reason. ESO has to work on PCs, XBOX, and PS4 and really the latter two actually limit what is possible for PC on their own... and that doesn't even consider the trade-offs ZOS went with to sculpt their product.

None of the MMOs you list could have a world size or object density like ESO without downgrading graphics.. You cant compare games like that.. they are FAR more complex than you hear about on youtube. UE4 is not the answer to all problems(for example).