Max Out Guild Skill lines with Crowns?

MyKillv2.0

Iccotak wrote: »

How do you guys feel about ZOS making it an option for players to Max Out Guild Skill lines with Crowns?
Is it a 'Pay to Win' system?
Convenient for players that have alot of Alts?
Does this make the Base game less relevant?
Personally I'm not sure how I feel about it - I can see the pros and cons though

Discuss below

What you should mean is.... Team "People with Alot of Time to Dump into the Game" argue with Team "People with Alot of Money to Dump into the Game".

Fight!

Malmai

Haha if this aint P2W that i dont know what is? Gives you advantage in PvP and PvE...

VaranisArano

Malmai wrote: »

Haha if this aint P2W that i dont know what is? Gives you advantage in PvP and PvE...

With the exception of below 50 PVP (below the level you would be if you acquired them normally, anyway), it doesn't give you any advantage over those who play the game to get the skills the normal way.

Finedaible

It's selling a solution to a problem they deliberately created. It's scummy, and very low-handed approach to monetization in a game.

Janoy

I agree that this is teetering on the line of over-monetizing the game. BUT, I will be buying that undaunted line on my last 2 toons lol.

dcam86b14_ESO

Why do people keep making these threads just add to the old ones

Muzzick

I bet they'll nerf the skills once they make enough money off it

KerinKor

Iccotak wrote: »

Is it a 'Pay to Win' system?

That's not a serious question, surely, of COURSE it's P2W since your BUYING SKILLS!

kmcaj

I won't be throwing money at it but makes no difference to me if someone does. A free account wide skill line option would have been much better to keep me playing. I am bored of grinding the same skill lines over and over just to get to the content I want to grind. I don't feel like it's skipping the game as the content has been done, too many times. Not going to spend money on worthless stuff when can just buy a new game though.

alanmatillab16_ESO

Not fussed to be honest, I won't be using the system. With the restriction that you need to have completed the skill line on a character first I don't see it as P2W but players are going to argue about that until the Brahmin come home.

They missed a trick though, they should have made it ESO+ only. The tears in here would have been enough to turn the Al'Akir into a swamp

VaranisArano

Finedaible wrote: »

It's selling a solution to a problem they deliberately created. It's scummy, and very low-handed approach to monetization in a game.

I mean, if you call "playing the game on your alt character" a problem, sure.

Grinding the skill points and skill lines is only a "problem" to the players who want to skip playing the game to jump their alt character straight into certain content like end-game PVE or PVP.

Agenericname

VaranisArano wrote: »

Finedaible wrote: »

It's selling a solution to a problem they deliberately created. It's scummy, and very low-handed approach to monetization in a game.

I mean, if you call "playing the game on your alt character" a problem, sure.

Grinding the skill points and skill lines is only a "problem" to the players who want to skip playing the game to jump their alt character straight into certain content like end-game PVE or PVP.

Agree, except for the mount training. That's really nothing more than a time gate and a small gold sink. You can put in some effort playing the game and finish the mage's guild, fighter's guild, alliance war, undaunted, or the psyjic orde line by playing the game. The mount training you're going to wait 20 hours between points.

There's no content or quests involved.

VaranisArano

Agenericname wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Finedaible wrote: »

It's selling a solution to a problem they deliberately created. It's scummy, and very low-handed approach to monetization in a game.

I mean, if you call "playing the game on your alt character" a problem, sure.

Grinding the skill points and skill lines is only a "problem" to the players who want to skip playing the game to jump their alt character straight into certain content like end-game PVE or PVP.

Agree, except for the mount training. That's really nothing more than a time gate and a small gold sink. You can put in some effort playing the game and finish the mage's guild, fighter's guild, alliance war, undaunted, or the psyjic orde line by playing the game. The mount training you're going to wait 20 hours between points.

There's no content or quests involved.

That's a very fair caveat.

Kiralyn2000

Iccotak wrote: »

How do you guys feel about ZOS making it an option for players to Max Out Guild Skill lines with Crowns?

Seems like a total waste of money to me, just like the riding lessons. Wasting your $ to get something that can be easily earned in-game.


As opposed to those actual "pay to win" games, that have things you can only get for real $, that are stronger or more useful than game-acquired items.

Nordic__Knights

I have the belief that their introducing an easy exploit for end game titles and achievements within the PVP system due to level 50 and below campaigns being allowed to get the emperorship title

Nordic__Knights

VaranisArano wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

It is a pay-2-win, especially for lower levels PvP Cyro & BGs. But even at higher levels, when you are grinding Alliance War skill line, it will take a while before you will get what you want. During that "while" it is P2W too.

Simple example:
Newly created character has to grind to unlock new skill lines. By the time you will unlock those (Fighters Guild, Mages Guild, Undaunted) you will probably be at level 50.

Newly created character that will buy new skill lines & skill points will still be at starter level (3 ? ). So if you level up to level 10 (minimum level required for PvP), you can do PvP with access to fully levelled skills & passives, that will give you HUGE advantage over a player who did not paid. Simply because there is no way to get fully levelled skill lines without paying and still be low level.

ZOS should at least make it so you can buy those skill lines, only if you are level 50. Granted, you have to grind those skill lines on other character to max them out, in order to buy them. But, when it comes to low level alts - it is a clear P-2-W imho.

Out of curiosity, do you think its P2W to buy mount speed and stamina?

See, those are pretty essential to doing well in Cyrodiil, and it "ought" to take me 60 days for maxed speed and 60 days for maxed stamina, so "while" those 120 days are going, did I pay to win?

Or did I just "pay to skip the grind?"

We paid for an advantage over the natural system so therefore we paid to win we're all guilty of it

JumpmanLane

I’d definitely buy mages guild and Psijic they are sooo long and boring. Maybe undaunted and enough skyshards just to get the build right.

thermatico

As someone who hates doing dungeons I will buy the undaunted skill faster than the wife can figure out a way to spend it.

Starlock

In a word, it is disgusting. Absolutely disgusting. And it has made me change how I think about this game.

I will never recommend this game to a friend anymore. Unless, of course, they want a good example of unethical monetization models. The game is just so disgusting now. If it had been this way when I started, I never would have played it.

Iccotak

MyKillv2.0 wrote: »

Iccotak wrote: »

How do you guys feel about ZOS making it an option for players to Max Out Guild Skill lines with Crowns?
Is it a 'Pay to Win' system?
Convenient for players that have alot of Alts?
Does this make the Base game less relevant?
Personally I'm not sure how I feel about it - I can see the pros and cons though

Discuss below

What you should mean is.... Team "People with Alot of Time to Dump into the Game" argue with Team "People with Alot of Money to Dump into the Game".

Fight!

Unfadingsilence

Iccotak wrote: »

How do you guys feel about ZOS making it an option for players to Max Out Guild Skill lines with Crowns?
Is it a 'Pay to Win' system?
Convenient for players that have alot of Alts?
Does this make the Base game less relevant?
Personally I'm not sure how I feel about it - I can see the pros and cons though

Discuss below

Not pay to win since NOTHING they are offering will make anyone gitgud. Giving someone extra stats from undaunted wont help there game play "especially since the 6% currently on console is not working for the extra max HP for wearing 5,1,1
And giving someone dawnbreaker and meteor will still not help there game play if they dont understand there class or abilities or CP setup. I could give someone new my account and if they had to play it how its setup with all my toons having EVERYTHING unlocked yes all of my 15 toons having undaunted, fighters guild and mages guild and pvp to rank 10 all unlocked and over the CP cap would. Not even understand what is going on. And it's still not p2w since your not getting OP gear and master weapons from the crown store. So yah I'm all for the change it will definitely help the casual players feel like they are keeping up with players whom play every hour of every day for the last year and a half....

https://youtu.be/Y50I4KI_o9c

Taloros

Unfadingsilence wrote: »

Not pay to win since NOTHING they are offering will make anyone gitgud.

I think that the "pay to win" label doesn't require people to actually win after paying, only that they pay in the expectation to win.

But even if one doesn't see it that way, offering skill lines is "pay to win". Take two equally skilled and experienced players, one who spent money on buying some extra skills (e. g. Caltrops), one who didn't, the former will perform better.

Your post seems to assume that only the most extreme form of pay to win actually is pay to win, i. e. that the greatest idiot can win against the master of all things ESO after paying for a skill line. That goes a bit far imho.

AbysmalGhul

Iccotak wrote: »

How do you guys feel about ZOS making it an option for players to Max Out Guild Skill lines with Crowns?
Is it a 'Pay to Win' system?
Convenient for players that have alot of Alts?
Does this make the Base game less relevant?
Personally I'm not sure how I feel about it - I can see the pros and cons though

Discuss below

I don't think there's anything wrong with it. I'll never purchase it, but more power to anyone else who will.

I don't mind the grind at all.