6mill vs 21mill dummy

Maxdevil

Anyone know about how much dps you can get with the 21mill dummy vs the 6mill for example: if You are 40k on the 6mill what would be the equivalent parse on the 21mill?

MinnesotaKid

I believe the general consensus is around 30k

FakeFox

The builds that where at 50-60k in previous patches on the 6mil are now at 90-100k on the 21mil, so i'd say something between 40-50k increase, but it's hard to tell with nobody doing 6mil anymore.

Jarrods32

Unless u have combat metrics it would be hard to compare .. but on a 3mil doing 36k dps it's like 66k on 21m atro .. but so many variables and possible mistakes in parse ..

Nestor

Do these dummies have different resistances?

MartiniDaniels

Tbh, I think trial dummy is good only to compare builds and to save pots while mechanically training/warming up.

Your sustain and buffs in reality are far worse from trial dummy, with exception of some stationary bosses AND ideal support rotations.
In my guilds everybody is confused with trial dummy numbers and dps requirements are still requested from 6m dummy parses.

satanio

Nestor wrote: »

Do these dummies have different resistances?

Iron atro - 5850 resistances
Skellys - like normal dungeon mobs?

FakeFox

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Your sustain and buffs in reality are far worse from trial dummy, with exception of some stationary bosses AND ideal support rotations.

Well, sustain is often better in actual fights as they are usually significantly shorter or have damage pauses that can be used to fill up resources again.

SaucyMcSauceface

A rotation that does about 41k, self buffed without fracture on the 6 mil does about 80k on the trial dummy. I was testing a new build the other day, so I can say that those numbers are accurate about 2 days ago.

SaucyMcSauceface

Nestor wrote: »

Do these dummies have different resistances?

the iron atro has all of the debuffs already applied, so iit ends up in the 5k resist range, the 6mil dummies have 18.2k resistance.

SirAndy

The trial dummy is only good for parsing, wait for it, trial rotations. The buffs/debuffs do not not reflect any other game situation.
So if you aren't running trials with a somewhat serious group, those numbers mean nothing to you or your build.

There's 3 basic categories when it comes to training (yes, that's really what they are) dummies.

- Use the 3/6 mil *solo* (and by solo i mean just you with nobody else around) to measure your solo dps in an environment where you don't have to deal with any mechanics like blocking/dodging/healing/shielding/moving out of red etc. Use this to practice your rotation.
- Use the 3/6 mil in a group and have your group mates apply buffs/debuffs to measure your group dps. Environmental restrictions are the same as above
- Use the raid dummy to measure your trial dps. Environmental restrictions are the same as above

Those parses are not interchangeable. A trial parse gives little information about how you are going to perform solo and vice versa.

And finally, if you really want to know if your build is going to work in-game, you have to run actual content.
For solo, solo some dungeons and see how it goes. For group, run some dungeons with a group and see how it goes. For trial, run some trials with a group and see how it goes.

The dummies will only get you so far, the real test will be where you have to pay attention to your environment and your (hopefully perfect by now) rotation needs to be substituted with blocking/dodging/healing/shielding/moving out of red ...

MartiniDaniels

FakeFox wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Your sustain and buffs in reality are far worse from trial dummy, with exception of some stationary bosses AND ideal support rotations.

Well, sustain is often better in actual fights as they are usually significantly shorter or have damage pauses that can be used to fill up resources again.

In farm runs, when everything works like clock - yes. In progression runs... no, it's always a mess going on here and there and sustain is very stretched in comparison to trial dummy where you are basically fluctuating in 50-80% of resources until execute stage.

SaucyMcSauceface wrote: »

A rotation that does about 41k, self buffed without fracture on the 6 mil does about 80k on the trial dummy. I was testing a new build the other day, so I can say that those numbers are accurate about 2 days ago.

It's interesting, because while doing 40k at 6M, I roughly do 60k at trial one and in my groups everyone is more or less within 40k self-buffed dps and with comparable 11-14 dps% in trials, but at trial dummy parses vary wildly. Curious what might be the reason for this.

zvavi

Multiplied by 1.6 from people's experience, depends on how much of the debuffs you provided

itsfatbass

1.6-1.8 multiplied.

Emma_Overload

SirAndy wrote: »

The trial dummy is only good for parsing, wait for it, trial rotations. The buffs/debuffs do not not reflect any other game situation.
So if you aren't running trials with a somewhat serious group, those numbers mean nothing to you or your build.

There's 3 basic categories when it comes to training (yes, that's really what they are) dummies.

- Use the 3/6 mil *solo* (and by solo i mean just you with nobody else around) to measure your solo dps in an environment where you don't have to deal with any mechanics like blocking/dodging/healing/shielding/moving out of red etc. Use this to practice your rotation.
- Use the 3/6 mil in a group and have your group mates apply buffs/debuffs to measure your group dps. Environmental restrictions are the same as above
- Use the raid dummy to measure your trial dps. Environmental restrictions are the same as above

Those parses are not interchangeable. A trial parse gives little information about how you are going to perform solo and vice versa.

And finally, if you really want to know if your build is going to work in-game, you have to run actual content.
For solo, solo some dungeons and see how it goes. For group, run some dungeons with a group and see how it goes. For trial, run some trials with a group and see how it goes.

The dummies will only get you so far, the real test will be where you have to pay attention to your environment and your (hopefully perfect by now) rotation needs to be substituted with blocking/dodging/healing/shielding/moving out of red ...

While all of that is undoubtedly true... come on man, let's be real! I can't even remember the last time I saw a streamer or even some random guy on the forums quote a parse that WASN'T obtained with the Iron Atro. Nobody wants to mention an honest 60K parse when everyone is throwing around 90K parses as the bare minimum.

It seems really funny to me that DPS has been inflated by 50% overnight, because there was a time when forum know-it-alls would SCOLD you just for using Lover mundus or something like that, LOL. Doesn't it seem strange that no one is complaining about the Iron Atro? I was sure when it came out that there would be uproar on the forums, calling it "pay-2-parse" or whatever, but until this thread, there hasn't been a peep. I guess everyone likes big numbers!

itsfatbass

Emma_Overload wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

The trial dummy is only good for parsing, wait for it, trial rotations. The buffs/debuffs do not not reflect any other game situation.
So if you aren't running trials with a somewhat serious group, those numbers mean nothing to you or your build.

There's 3 basic categories when it comes to training (yes, that's really what they are) dummies.

- Use the 3/6 mil *solo* (and by solo i mean just you with nobody else around) to measure your solo dps in an environment where you don't have to deal with any mechanics like blocking/dodging/healing/shielding/moving out of red etc. Use this to practice your rotation.
- Use the 3/6 mil in a group and have your group mates apply buffs/debuffs to measure your group dps. Environmental restrictions are the same as above
- Use the raid dummy to measure your trial dps. Environmental restrictions are the same as above

Those parses are not interchangeable. A trial parse gives little information about how you are going to perform solo and vice versa.

And finally, if you really want to know if your build is going to work in-game, you have to run actual content.
For solo, solo some dungeons and see how it goes. For group, run some dungeons with a group and see how it goes. For trial, run some trials with a group and see how it goes.

The dummies will only get you so far, the real test will be where you have to pay attention to your environment and your (hopefully perfect by now) rotation needs to be substituted with blocking/dodging/healing/shielding/moving out of red ...

While all of that is undoubtedly true... come on man, let's be real! I can't even remember the last time I saw a streamer or even some random guy on the forums quote a parse that WASN'T obtained with the Iron Atro. Nobody wants to mention an honest 60K parse when everyone is throwing around 90K parses as the bare minimum.

It seems really funny to me that DPS has been inflated by 50% overnight, because there was a time when forum know-it-alls would SCOLD you just for using Lover mundus or something like that, LOL. Doesn't it seem strange that no one is complaining about the Iron Atro? I was sure when it came out that there would be uproar on the forums, calling it "pay-2-parse" or whatever, but until this thread, there hasn't been a peep. I guess everyone likes big numbers!

Thats not at all why the Iron Atro is used. Previously with the 6 mill self buffed dummy, you would have wild variances due to the differences in self buffs available to each class. Now that there is a dummy that provides ALL buffs, it levels the variances between classes and allows a MUCH clearer picture of the differences in dps between classes and the skill of the player. Your argument is completely irrelevant to why Iron Atro dummy is now used.

SirAndy

Emma_Overload wrote: »

While all of that is undoubtedly true... come on man, let's be real! I can't even remember the last time I saw a streamer or even some random guy on the forums quote a parse that WASN'T obtained with the Iron Atro. Nobody wants to mention an honest 60K parse when everyone is throwing around 90K parses as the bare minimum.

It seems really funny to me that DPS has been inflated by 50% overnight, because there was a time when forum know-it-alls would SCOLD you just for using Lover mundus or something like that, LOL. Doesn't it seem strange that no one is complaining about the Iron Atro? I was sure when it came out that there would be uproar on the forums, calling it "pay-2-parse" or whatever, but until this thread, there hasn't been a peep. I guess everyone likes big numbers!

I agree, the epeen is strong in many ...

Royaji

Emma_Overload wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

The trial dummy is only good for parsing, wait for it, trial rotations. The buffs/debuffs do not not reflect any other game situation.
So if you aren't running trials with a somewhat serious group, those numbers mean nothing to you or your build.

There's 3 basic categories when it comes to training (yes, that's really what they are) dummies.

- Use the 3/6 mil *solo* (and by solo i mean just you with nobody else around) to measure your solo dps in an environment where you don't have to deal with any mechanics like blocking/dodging/healing/shielding/moving out of red etc. Use this to practice your rotation.
- Use the 3/6 mil in a group and have your group mates apply buffs/debuffs to measure your group dps. Environmental restrictions are the same as above
- Use the raid dummy to measure your trial dps. Environmental restrictions are the same as above

Those parses are not interchangeable. A trial parse gives little information about how you are going to perform solo and vice versa.

And finally, if you really want to know if your build is going to work in-game, you have to run actual content.
For solo, solo some dungeons and see how it goes. For group, run some dungeons with a group and see how it goes. For trial, run some trials with a group and see how it goes.

The dummies will only get you so far, the real test will be where you have to pay attention to your environment and your (hopefully perfect by now) rotation needs to be substituted with blocking/dodging/healing/shielding/moving out of red ...

While all of that is undoubtedly true... come on man, let's be real! I can't even remember the last time I saw a streamer or even some random guy on the forums quote a parse that WASN'T obtained with the Iron Atro. Nobody wants to mention an honest 60K parse when everyone is throwing around 90K parses as the bare minimum.

It seems really funny to me that DPS has been inflated by 50% overnight, because there was a time when forum know-it-alls would SCOLD you just for using Lover mundus or something like that, LOL. Doesn't it seem strange that no one is complaining about the Iron Atro? I was sure when it came out that there would be uproar on the forums, calling it "pay-2-parse" or whatever, but until this thread, there hasn't been a peep. I guess everyone likes big numbers!

Mostly because Iron Atro works very well when you actually want to compare something. It puts everyone under exact same conditions. You don't need to argue about self-applied/healer applied ele drain, penetration numbers and so on. Everyone is able to parse under the most optimal conditons.

SirAndy

Royaji wrote: »

Mostly because Iron Atro works very well when you actually want to compare something. It puts everyone under exact same conditions. You don't need to argue about self-applied/healer applied ele drain, penetration numbers and so on. Everyone is able to parse under the most optimal conditons.

As long as you don't join my 4 player dungeon group claiming that you can actually pull 100k all by yourself.

Ah who am i kidding, of course you will ...

Royaji

SirAndy wrote: »

Royaji wrote: »

Mostly because Iron Atro works very well when you actually want to compare something. It puts everyone under exact same conditions. You don't need to argue about self-applied/healer applied ele drain, penetration numbers and so on. Everyone is able to parse under the most optimal conditons.

As long as you don't join my 4 player dungeon group claiming that you can actually pull 100k all by yourself.

Ah who am i kidding, of course you will ...

Don't worry. I won't. I dont even touch 4 mans these days.

And honestly I'm a tank, so I really can't pull 100k. Although I absolutely can be picky with my groups, you know.

validifyedneb18_ESO

Emma_Overload wrote: »

SirAndy wrote: »

The trial dummy is only good for parsing, wait for it, trial rotations. The buffs/debuffs do not not reflect any other game situation.
So if you aren't running trials with a somewhat serious group, those numbers mean nothing to you or your build.

There's 3 basic categories when it comes to training (yes, that's really what they are) dummies.

- Use the 3/6 mil *solo* (and by solo i mean just you with nobody else around) to measure your solo dps in an environment where you don't have to deal with any mechanics like blocking/dodging/healing/shielding/moving out of red etc. Use this to practice your rotation.
- Use the 3/6 mil in a group and have your group mates apply buffs/debuffs to measure your group dps. Environmental restrictions are the same as above
- Use the raid dummy to measure your trial dps. Environmental restrictions are the same as above

Those parses are not interchangeable. A trial parse gives little information about how you are going to perform solo and vice versa.

And finally, if you really want to know if your build is going to work in-game, you have to run actual content.
For solo, solo some dungeons and see how it goes. For group, run some dungeons with a group and see how it goes. For trial, run some trials with a group and see how it goes.

The dummies will only get you so far, the real test will be where you have to pay attention to your environment and your (hopefully perfect by now) rotation needs to be substituted with blocking/dodging/healing/shielding/moving out of red ...

While all of that is undoubtedly true... come on man, let's be real! I can't even remember the last time I saw a streamer or even some random guy on the forums quote a parse that WASN'T obtained with the Iron Atro. Nobody wants to mention an honest 60K parse when everyone is throwing around 90K parses as the bare minimum.

It seems really funny to me that DPS has been inflated by 50% overnight, because there was a time when forum know-it-alls would SCOLD you just for using Lover mundus or something like that, LOL. Doesn't it seem strange that no one is complaining about the Iron Atro? I was sure when it came out that there would be uproar on the forums, calling it "pay-2-parse" or whatever, but until this thread, there hasn't been a peep. I guess everyone likes big numbers!

Somewhat agree, would rather have a 6mill with major fracture/breach.

However people 'cheated' with the old parses with healers anyway. I seem to remember alcast once not only used a healer for a parse once (which isnt entirely wrong) but then after doing 58k said in the video title it was a 61k+ build because the healer did 3k dps themselves to regen mana!

Maxdevil

SaucyMcSauceface wrote: »

A rotation that does about 41k, self buffed without fracture on the 6 mil does about 80k on the trial dummy. I was testing a new build the other day, so I can say that those numbers are accurate about 2 days ago.

For myself I’m doing 45k on a 6mill self buffed and 65k on a 21mill, it’s more a 20k more for me lol

validifyedneb18_ESO

Maxdevil wrote: »

SaucyMcSauceface wrote: »

A rotation that does about 41k, self buffed without fracture on the 6 mil does about 80k on the trial dummy. I was testing a new build the other day, so I can say that those numbers are accurate about 2 days ago.

For myself I’m doing 45k on a 6mill self buffed and 65k on a 21mill, it’s more a 20k more for me lol

Depends on how many buffs you provide yourself naturally in your rotation. For me its 42/72k. Nightblades and other classes with fracture or breach are probably the main ones who will see less of a difference.

cmvet

So simple answer, SUSTAIN. If you can't sustain your resources on the 25mil raid dummy, then your dps will vary greatly and generally be significantly lower. If you have great sustain then you can almost double your dps compared to a 6mil dummy that provides no buffs.

WickidMexican

I still feel like the iron atro doesnt have major breach/fracture. When i look at likos cm after vid i swear i dont see it on the debuffs/buffs tabs

Nestor

WickidMexican wrote: »

I still feel like the iron atro doesnt have major breach/fracture. When i look at likos cm after vid i swear i dont see it on the debuffs/buffs tabs

@WickidMexican

It might be the base dummy is configured with the resistances in question rather than having the debuff applied. This way it would be less calculations so less lag. That would explain why you dont see the Debuffs and Buffs

WickidMexican

Possibly. Who knows oh well.