The Ability Audit

Vanthras79

I am glad ZOS has finally decided to look into over achieving and under achieving abilities and try to bring them back into balance. I like the changes so far seen in the patch notes (Honestly i was tired of seeing the pet sorc be the standard, as I play a sorc w/p pets). I think it is good to have standards across the field as it comes to abilities, so that they may be easier to reign in if they are under preforming or over preforming. Thank you ZOS for your time in doing this audit!

-Vanthras

What do you guys think of the audit so far? Any ideas on what the team should look into?

Salvas_Aren

Into the accounting whether you got your pay check for this posting.

Vanthras79

Salvas_Aren wrote: »

Into the accounting whether you got your pay check for this posting.

No I am just a fanboy, my admiration is pro bono

Starlock

My concern with the adjustments they are making is that it is difficult to do balance adjustments while taking into consideration the full spectrum of gameplay styles. The performance of an ability depends largely on the player behind the controller. What are their gameplay goals? What do they care about? How do they play the game? And add to that the inevitable wrench of connectivity issues since this is an online game? It's not easy to sort out.

phuein

As a non-minmaxer generally, I agree that it's good to see such meaningful changes. Some can be adjusted to accommodate more players, but otherwise it's good.

Vanthras79

Starlock wrote: »

My concern with the adjustments they are making is that it is difficult to do balance adjustments while taking into consideration the full spectrum of gameplay styles. The performance of an ability depends largely on the player behind the controller. What are their gameplay goals? What do they care about? How do they play the game? And add to that the inevitable wrench of connectivity issues since this is an online game? It's not easy to sort out.

I always wondered about the play as you want style, but then I remind myself that Meta-based-enforcers are in almost any pug group. So I do play as I want, within reason.

Vanthras79

phuein wrote: »

As a non-minmaxer generally, I agree that it's good to see such meaningful changes. Some can be adjusted to accommodate more players, but otherwise it's good.

And that adjustment means oversight, and that's a great thing!

Starlock

Vanthras79 wrote: »

Starlock wrote: »

My concern with the adjustments they are making is that it is difficult to do balance adjustments while taking into consideration the full spectrum of gameplay styles. The performance of an ability depends largely on the player behind the controller. What are their gameplay goals? What do they care about? How do they play the game? And add to that the inevitable wrench of connectivity issues since this is an online game? It's not easy to sort out.

I always wondered about the play as you want style, but then I remind myself that Meta-based-enforcers are in almost any pug group. So I do play as I want, within reason.

I do too. I first and foremost create characters and design around a personality and theme. From there, I aim to make something that works okay for me soloing world bosses and doing 4-person dungeons to a reasonable standard.

I look at the changes coming down this next patch cycle - particularly the significant reduction in AoE damaging abilities - and have concerns that it is going to cut more deeply for players who don't power game. I know that when I solo world bosses, my AoE damaging abilities are essential. They let me keep doing some damage while staying on a necessary defensive to survive the onslaught. I think I'll still be able to do it, but boy... it's going to be a lot more tedious especially on my characters who aren't already built as dd/tank hybrids. Perhaps that is intentional? I don't know.

rotaugen454

Devs: “Hmm, people are clearing vet DLC dungeons with these abilities. Better nerf them!”

Seraphayel

Salvas_Aren wrote: »

Into the accounting whether you got your pay check for this posting.

How dare you having a positive opinion about the upcoming patch... scandalous.

Donny_Vito

At this point in the games life-cycle, I feel it's too late to be doing overhauling (to this extent).

We've become accustomed in what we expect from the game and it's classes, yet they are basically changing a majority of the skills for each of the respective classes. I mean, why? I can see the need to tweak certain classes and skills to bring them in line, but a complete overhaul for all of them? Was the combat equality (for a lack of a better term) that horrific that we needed to change them all. Just seems like a gut-shot response from ZoS in which they felt they needed to overhaul the whole system.

idk

Starlock wrote: »

My concern with the adjustments they are making is that it is difficult to do balance adjustments while taking into consideration the full spectrum of gameplay styles. The performance of an ability depends largely on the player behind the controller. What are their gameplay goals? What do they care about? How do they play the game? And add to that the inevitable wrench of connectivity issues since this is an online game? It's not easy to sort out.

You speak to two different aspects of gameplay here.

For the spectrum of gameplay styles, theoretically Zos has considered the full spectrum when the worked to "codify their vision for the game" "codify their vision for the game" "codify their vision for the game". At least they should have taken all that into consideration but we will not know until this process is complete.

As to the performance of a skill largely depending on the player behind the controller. That can be said for most MMORPGs. Some players are just better than others. It is amplified more in ESO but that is beyond the ability itself as weaving light attacks and more play a role.

luen79rwb17_ESO

Yeah people always seem to be fine with changes because they don't like / use the setups that are getting screwed... Pretty good logic there *rolls eyes*

essi2

Other than the Orbs being limited to 1 active, the changes seem fine.

MehrunesFlagon

idk wrote: »

Starlock wrote: »

My concern with the adjustments they are making is that it is difficult to do balance adjustments while taking into consideration the full spectrum of gameplay styles. The performance of an ability depends largely on the player behind the controller. What are their gameplay goals? What do they care about? How do they play the game? And add to that the inevitable wrench of connectivity issues since this is an online game? It's not easy to sort out.

You speak to two different aspects of gameplay here.

For the spectrum of gameplay styles, theoretically Zos has considered the full spectrum when the worked to "codify their vision for the game" "codify their vision for the game" "codify their vision for the game". At least they should have taken all that into consideration but we will not know until this process is complete.

As to the performance of a skill largely depending on the player behind the controller. That can be said for most MMORPGs. Some players are just better than others. It is amplified more in ESO but that is beyond the ability itself as weaving light attacks and more play a role.

If it's their vision perhaps they should be blinded.

mairwen85

MehrunesFlagon wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Starlock wrote: »

My concern with the adjustments they are making is that it is difficult to do balance adjustments while taking into consideration the full spectrum of gameplay styles. The performance of an ability depends largely on the player behind the controller. What are their gameplay goals? What do they care about? How do they play the game? And add to that the inevitable wrench of connectivity issues since this is an online game? It's not easy to sort out.

You speak to two different aspects of gameplay here.

For the spectrum of gameplay styles, theoretically Zos has considered the full spectrum when the worked to "codify their vision for the game" "codify their vision for the game" "codify their vision for the game". At least they should have taken all that into consideration but we will not know until this process is complete.

As to the performance of a skill largely depending on the player behind the controller. That can be said for most MMORPGs. Some players are just better than others. It is amplified more in ESO but that is beyond the ability itself as weaving light attacks and more play a role.

If it's their vision perhaps they should be blinded.

I've seen codification of design vision that made me want to claw my eyes out.

siddique

How is it that there is this sudden surge of "fanbois" as soon as weekend finished? I'm beginning to suspect zos offices remain closed on weekends.

ezio45

Vanthras79 wrote: »

I am glad ZOS has finally decided to look into over achieving and under achieving abilities and try to bring them back into balance. I like the changes so far seen in the patch notes (Honestly i was tired of seeing the pet sorc be the standard, as I play a sorc w/p pets). I think it is good to have standards across the field as it comes to abilities, so that they may be easier to reign in if they are under preforming or over preforming. Thank you ZOS for your time in doing this audit!

-Vanthras

What do you guys think of the audit so far? Any ideas on what the team should look into?

you know non pet got hit just as hard right? Liquid lighting and ele wall are a massive part of non pets rotation. Pet sorc also has a larger shield then non pet, meaning that while yes, pet sorc is technically getting a bigger nerf to shields than non pet but non pet is still going to have an even smaller shield then they had already by a decent chunk. Non pet is also going to hurt more from the sustain tweaks as they already cant sustain, opposed to pet, which literally, no exaggerating involved, has infinite sustain......

as for what i think of the audit? I cant say on this forum because ill get banned.... again....

RaptorRodeoGod

I'm kind of excited for the Bow, Dual Wield, and 2 Handed changes. Maybe PvE StamDPS will be able to use DW or 2H backbars now.

alainjbrennanb16_ESO

agreed with op about time but the dps increase at mo has nothing to do with skills its light attacks, that should not be the highest dps you do 20-25%

GlorphNoldorin

Performance at an all time low in multiple platforms and servers.
Dozens of bugs that "since they do not affect the majority of players....will not be addressed"
Communication that is bare to non existent.
More and more crown store stuff which should help QOL but is just a cash rort
Devs that have never been able to clear....hence understand their dlc hm's
No clear stated vision and direction for the game.....as usual we have to wait for some future communication to find out
(why is it ok to finally have a clear vision for the game after 5 years....wtf have the devs been doing until now?)

Yet another patch that is sharply dividing the player base.

Its fine, dps will work stuff out, tanks will be ok, healers........not so sure for harder content

But for me it is getting so tiresome. PVP is not playable anymore, PVE is so hard for difficult content with latency and performance. The few things I have yet to complete in the game I really wonder if it will be possible given the healer changes as they stand.

The flower pickers, traders, crafters and questers will have no problems but I doubt the shrinking end game community will be enjoying any population growth